PDA

View Full Version : Episode II Packaging: First Round Knockout



snakeplkn
10-23-2001, 04:40 PM
I logged on moments ago to witness what I believe what will the beginning of the end for my Star Wars collecting. Ever since POTF2 was introduced, I have been spending my hard earned money to establish a collection once again. I always have opened my figures up and put them out for display in simple dioramas.

I'm not into variants or keeping them case fresh. I just like the fun of Star Wars. Then things started changing ... when Lucas released the Special Editions, I thought they were fun, but all the discussion we've talked about before ... Greedo firing first, Jedi Rocks, something seemed wrong. Still I collected.

Then Episode I, and after initially comparing it to the original on first viewing, I see how flawed the movie really is. Jar Jar? Jake Lloyd? Midicholrians? Still I collected.

Now in the past couple months ... Episode II: Attack of the Clones? How can you people defend George Lucas for such an awful title is beyond me. And I'm sure legions more will defend this new Episode II packaging.

What's worse, the title or the packaging - I can't decide. The light-blue background is something for micro-machines, the lightsaber hands cannot replace either Maul's or Vader's face, and there sure is enough plastic to go around.

And this Obi-Wan figure, I don't know if he's even worth buying. Is he ready to jump on a horse or does he spend the movie bow-legged? What about the karate chop right arm? And the "droid," forget about it.

I guess this means now all the characters from the original trilogy will be subjected to this new packaging. Great job Hasbro, now for the few kids remaining who buy Star Wars, they may end up coming home with BoShek and wonder where he was in Episode II.

Lucas and his Hasbro goons have given me a first round knockout. My anticipation of Episode II has gone down to nil. Sure I'll buy a Jango Fett or some dyanmic figure, but I'm not going to spend money on the Episode II equivalent to Boss Nass.

Things are getting very bad, and how so soon ...

Snake Plissken
"A little human compassion"

Darth Ludicrous
10-23-2001, 05:33 PM
I must agree with you-- I find this figure tremendously dissappointing.

First, the real scan looks promising, but why in the heck didn't Hasbro seize the opportunity, starting with Episode 2, Wave 1, to introduce universal ball joint shoulders and knee joints? Is that too much to ask? This willy nilly approach to articulation makes me nuts. Hasbro's new GI JOE line is going to be composed of 3-3/4 inch figures with that level of articulation. Why doesn't Star Wars warrant the same treatment?

Also, Hasbro's THIRD (carded) Episode 1 Obi-Wan boasted "soft goods", an improvement (from a "playability" standpoint) over the Wave 1 release. So what do they do with Episode 2, Wave 1? Release another plastic robe, non-poseable, unable-to-be-seated figure. Is there any learning curve here AT ALL?

I was really hoping Hasbro would take advantage of Episode 2's release by finally rectifying all their past mistakes with this line. Instead, it seems like they improve some aspects while losing ground in others. And I don't think cost is an issue- I'd give up that droid for a better Obi-Wan.

Fulit
10-23-2001, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by snakeplkn
How can you people defend George Lucas for such an awful title is beyond me.

Hey, hey I'm not defending, I'm ignoring. ;)

evenflow
10-23-2001, 06:17 PM
I agree that I am a bigger fan of green cards, but i still think it is pretty cool.

xboywonder
10-23-2001, 06:42 PM
I have to agree with you.... I walked out of EP 1 defending it, but inside I knew it was a bad film.... I have given up on George Lucas. And my Star Wars collecting has defenetly lost momentum especially since there are many other toy companies and toy lines that give you so much more for less than the $7 price tag. Plus how many times can I pay $7 for a Han Solo that isn't any better than the first.
I think it's just the fact that it is Star Wars and it is hard to let go... So yes I will buy Jango Fett and maybe a couple more interesting characters, but will I go all bananas and buy every figure.... no

bigbarada
10-23-2001, 07:45 PM
Oh goodie, the cycle starts again:

step #1: I hate (insert most recent SW news here)!!!!

step #2: Declare George Lucas has gone insane, lost it, sold out, etc.

step #3: Wait a few weeks to declare that it is "growing on you."

step #4: Declare that you reluctantly accept (insert most recent SW news here).

My thoughts, if you are so disenfranchised with SW then go! No need to hang around and bring everybody else down with your needless whining! It's just a bit of cardboard and a little sculpted piece of plastic, get a grip!!

Personally I love the new cardbacks, especially after six years of headache-inducing green and red starbursts.

As for the figure's articulation, I would drop SWAF collecting in a heartbeat if Hasbro released GI Joe looking figures. Too much articulation ruins the figure, SW has always been about striking the balance between sculpt and articulation. What would be the point of having a good sculpt if it is only to be ruined by too many robotic looking joints?

Although, I do agree about the 'soft-goods' debate. In my mind, the number one reason why vintage figures will always be utmost in my mind when I think of the quintessential SW figures.

Knightstalker
10-23-2001, 08:02 PM
I love the new blue cards.....and its a nice figure as well. Can't wait to see the others.

snakeplkn
10-23-2001, 10:09 PM
Originally posted by bigbarada
Oh goodie, the cycle starts again:

step #1: I hate (insert most recent SW news here)!!!!

step #2: Declare George Lucas has gone insane, lost it, sold out, etc.

step #3: Wait a few weeks to declare that it is "growing on you."

step #4: Declare that you reluctantly accept (insert most recent SW news here).



Barada, I read more posts than actually writing. It does seem that some people follow the steps listed above. More people than not, oddly enough. But I'm not in that category. I have never had anything "grow" on me.

On your comments above,

I was excited about the prospect of Episode II redeeming itself. But Lucas, not me, has killed the anticipation. Attack of the Clones?!? Count Dooku? Baby Boba Fett? Please ... in fact I'm concerned. "I have a bad feeling about this."

George Lucas began losing his grip in 1983 with Return of the Jedi. Though it's my favourite film of the current 4, it has definite weaknesses especially Sy Snootles, Darth Vader referring to all officers as "Commander" and need I say more -- Ewoks.

The Phantom Menace? Still a horrid title as ever. Jar Jar Binks? Still wish Darth Maul had killed him. Anakin? Haley Joel Osment was passed over for Jake Lloyd! These facts won't change, ever.

I don't accept the current state of affairs. Episode I was a disappointment. I bought the VHS on sale, I doubt a couple deleted scenes will make me go out and buy the DVD. And Episode II sounds like a mess. I will walk out of the theater if baby Boba Fett shouts, "Wizards!" or blows up a ship accidentially.

Collecting wise, I have simply stopped buying junk. Shirtless Darth Maul - who cares? Tatooine Jar Jar - what a waste. On the other hand, Queen Amidala Theed Invasion ... now that's worth every penny. If every figure was as good, then maybe Hasbro would be more than the greedy goons they are. Considering only a couple dollars seperates POTJ from McFarlane, what argument does Hasbro have for its high prices?

I have been a Star Wars fan for life. However Lucas has slowly been sapping out the fun from it. That's what this hobby is about, fun. Without it, there's no point.

Snake Plissken
"A little human compassion"

Post Script: Looking at the package once more, this "droid" looks my outdoor cooling fan with the grill and all. Maybe Obi uses it when he's out on the patio during those hot Coruscant summers?

OxsLemure
10-23-2001, 11:36 PM
Upon the next wave of figures they are loosing the force files, just using pictures and will picture on the back of the card all figures in that wave. So that kinda cool looking card will be dumped about 3 or 4 months after it is given to us? Well that is just a little weak.
If Lucas wants EP2 attack of the sith monkeys wants the figures from that movie to have the new big blistered blue packages then by all means..let them stand as EP1 did. Either it will fail or it won't!
I just fear that this will mean there will be the occasional Hey look a droid from one of the original films in a case of bottle fed fett and little han with his cap blaster.
If I didn't know better I would think that lucas hates the fans. He has been bothered with letters and constanly asked Hey..when are you doing the first 3 movies? When are the pre quells comming mr lucas? How about those first 3 films sir? and so on...So he devised the perfect plan. He makes good movies up until he decides to put out EP1...make enough money to live comfortably and buy a new car every day for the rest of 30 lives. Then he releases these horrible acid trip 5 year old written films where a long eared freak is given more screen time the General Zod! Then the fans get winded..they think no..this is just the beggining. It is just a set up..the next 2 will be great..then he lands ATOTC on us..I won't even give it the honor of its own name. Well..the bad names of the movie and characters won't marr it..this one will be better. then when it isn't we will pray that the third will redeem it totaly making everything OK...Then it will be EP3 The force gets all evil and mad at stuff! There will be a touching jar jar sequence, Great actors will be there..you know..they are the ones who are playing the role of that guy sitting there while jake loyd plays a midget juggler with 4 hands and plays the flute through his what loks like a naval but is actually :O
Just hope I am wrong..and sorry for the long winded rant...TRILOGY FOREVER...Chad

sith_killer_99
10-23-2001, 11:50 PM
I like the title "The Phantom Menace".

Everyone wanted Jar-Jar to die!:mad:

Haley Joel Osment is over rated.:o

The EP1 DVD has ALOT MORE than a couple of deleted scenes!:D

McFarlane makes STATUES. Which is pretty much what Theed Invasion Amidala is, a very well done, detailed STATUE. I collect ACTION figures.:o

Hasbro dosen't set the prices at retail stores. Not that I mind finding EP1/POTF figs on clearance for $1.97 or more recently Dagobah Darth Vaders (and other POTJ) for $3.99:D

George has overseen/licensed/and or approved more Star Wars novels, comics and games than I could possibly count. There by SIGNIFICANTLY adding to my enjoyment of the Star Wars UNIVERSE!:p

bigbarada
10-24-2001, 12:24 AM
Originally posted by sith_killer_99
Everyone wanted Jar-Jar to die!:mad:


Speak for yourself, I like Jar Jar.

As for the arguments of a child Boba Fett, is nobody allowed to grow up in Star Wars? They're just supposed to pop into existence fully formed? I for one have never understood the hype over the biggest wimp in the Star Wars universe (remember his death scene in ROTJ? I rest my case.). However, when I saw a young version of him in the Ep2 selects I became very interested in this most overrated of characters. I would think Boba Fett fans would be happy to see a little bit of history to the character; but all I hear is complaining about another kid in the prequels.:rolleyes:

All I'm saying is, if the prequels bother you that much, then don't watch them. Remove them from your version of the Star Wars universe and try to relax. They're just movies, not the second coming of the messiah.

JediTricks
10-24-2001, 02:09 AM
Ok Barada, you've had your say, now be done with it. This obviously isn't a thread for you, so please just move on, I don't see the point in coming back here once you've said your thing - to borrow your words, "if you are so disenfranchised with this thread, then go! No need to hang around and harass everybody else's opinions with your needless whining!" I'm serious, I don't think it's reasonable to smack the same point over and over again while making personal attacks at posters and their opinions, that's unacceptable on EITHER side of this issue. You might see it as whining, but obviously not everybody does, so please keep your rude, angry comments to yourself.


I happen to be at least partially with Snake on this one, I don't like this packaging at all either, and the figure looks fairly mediocre. I dunno if this is a "knockout punch" for me, but it's definitely a kick in the groin.

But IMO the Micro Machines packaging was way more dynamic than this, there was a cohesive flow there with the dark blue/black main theme and the dark blue Obi-Wan in cloak w/ saber.

GNT
10-24-2001, 03:24 AM
Originally posted by bigbarada
step #2: Declare George Lucas has gone insane, lost it, sold out, etc.

He went insane when he decided to have a CCG character named Jar Jar Binks,,his lost the plot totally and sold out,his in it for the money :)

sith_killer_99
10-24-2001, 06:06 AM
Is it true? George Lucas is in it for the money?

NO KIDDING PEOPLE!

People who make movies are always in it for the money, or the glory, fame, SOMETHING!

Nobody says "I want to make a movie and I don't care if it makes money or not."

George has been in it for the money ever since ANH, that is why he worked so hard and tried so many new things. He wanted to make a movie that was GOOD, a movie that could make money so that he could make MORE movies.

I will start to worry when he no longer cares about QUALITY and story content, and simply hopes to cash in on the SW name. This has not happened! I think EP1 had a good story line with subtle underlying layers that we will see more fully developed in later films. As for quality, I don't think anyone here can argue that EP1 was a VERY high quality movie with rich costume designes and incredibly detailed sets, not to mention great actors/actresses.

If he wasn't in it for the money then he couldn't afford to make these films and we would never get to see the story of Star Wars as he envisiones it.

Yes, he wants it to appeal to kids, so we tolerate Ewoks and Gungans realizing that this movie was aimed more for kids, who thought Jar-Jar was a fun character.

But I digress.

Bottom line, I don't care if he's in it for the money, I like the movies.

Wooooof
10-24-2001, 09:46 AM
Uh, am I allowed to post in this thread if I like the Ep2 packaging? Considering the thrashing that some people are getting for expressing differing opinions, I just wanted to be sure. (Geez, and I thought the last forum I came from was bad):rolleyes:

In any case, if you give up collecting Star Wars simply because of the packaging then I really don't know what to say.

Plus, whoever complained up there about Jar Jar upstaging "General Zod;" dude, someome must've really lied to you. I don't think I ever believed that General Zod was going to be in Ep1 simply because Terence Stamp was in the movie.

Anyway, at the risk of being banned from these forums, I will proudly claim that I liked Ep1 and Jar Jar and the AOTC title and the EP2 packaging.....please don't hit me!

bigbarada
10-24-2001, 10:10 AM
Originally posted by Wooooof
Uh, am I allowed to post in this thread if I like the Ep2 packaging? Considering the thrashing that some people are getting for expressing differing opinions, I just wanted to be sure. (Geez, and I thought the last forum I came from was bad):rolleyes:

In any case, if you give up collecting Star Wars simply because of the packaging then I really don't know what to say.

Plus, whoever complained up there about Jar Jar upstaging "General Zod;" dude, someome must've really lied to you. I don't think I ever believed that General Zod was going to be in Ep1 simply because Terence Stamp was in the movie.

Anyway, at the risk of being banned from these forums, I will proudly claim that I liked Ep1 and Jar Jar and the AOTC title and the EP2 packaging.....please don't hit me!

Don't worry about sharing your opinions Wooooof, some of us just get a little over-emotional at times. I understand what you are saying JT, and I will try to play nice from now on. (BTW, could you send a similar message to all the Ep1 haters who constantly haunt the Ep1 threads?):cool:

Lobito
10-24-2001, 09:37 PM
Calm down guys:) Lets B cool:cool: I also dont like the new packaging...:eek: but i will buy it anyway...(but if they start making the figures in a larger scale...like 5" I'll quit collecting of course):eek: The point of the thread was our opinion of the packaging...there's no point on including uncle George here...if there is someone to blame thats me...:confused: huh??? j/k:D ...seriously, if there is someone to blame that would be hasbro. But as i said b4 i will buy it anyway...we are all here BCUZZ we like SW, but i also agree with BB that sometimes the posts in here seem to attack uncle George a little too much.:eek:

Like our Super Moderator JT said...lets keep this discussions on the right track...BTW...check out my latest "Weird Thoghts" post JT...its about Randy Johnson!!:D And i definitely dont have the answer to that one.:eek:

Have fun guys:)

bigbarada
10-24-2001, 11:56 PM
Sometimes I really have to double check to make sure this is a Star Wars fan site I am on. Especially since it seems that only voices of dissention and angry, rude rants against Star Wars, GL, Hasbro, etc. are acceptable here by the staff. If guys like JT and Thrawn just absolutely hate every single little new tidbit of info about Star Wars then why do you work here? I really don't understand the mentality here. And why does someone like me who admanantly defends Star Wars come under attack for rude, angry posts? Are all the rude, angry anti-Star Wars, GL, Hasbro, etc. posts acceptable? Did this become a Star Wars hate site without anyone telling me? If so I've been wasting my time here the last few months.

snakeplkn
10-25-2001, 02:28 AM
Barada, have you been trying to reach 1100 posts or what? Just wondering... ; )

Maybe some of us are just fed up. How would you like your favourite band to start producing a string of horrid albums? Or a television show to "jump the sharK" and sink into oblivion? I'm sure it's happened to you somewhere along the line.

That's what I and a few others feel. Star Wars is falling apart in front of our very eyes. Episode II packaging is just another item in a long list of horrors. However you believe that Jar Jar and Baby Boba Fett make Star Wars stronger than weaker. I'm just curious to know what don't you like about Episode I.

I blame you Barada and all the others that defend Lucas. I blame you because you've sent all these vibes into the air and somehow my girlfriend has received them and thinks the Episode II packaging is better than POTJ.

As from my posts, you know I can't stand the new Episode II. I think the main reason is because if you look at all previous figures, they all had the plastic box off to the side with a picture of the character in opposition. Not so with Episode II.

I told her about the new package, as she somehow endures this hobby and has to listen to my rants. I always ask for Star Wars for gifts, and she obliges, I think I'll finally get Mara Jade for my birthday.

Point being, I showed her the new image and she liked it. Told me that the blue looked better than green, the logo was fine, sticker okay, and just had a new feel to it after all these years. She liked the idea of the droid instead of a force file as she remarked, "Force Files are useless anyway." She said I was overreacting and after all, I have nearly all my figures loose.

In a way I guess she's happy because she thinks I won't be buying as much now. Instead I'll just have to go focus on the vintage - Imperial Shuttle anyone? (just don't tell her)

Snake Plissken
"A little human compassion"

hairless chewie
10-25-2001, 08:17 AM
The package looks cool!!! It showcases what you are buying... the action figure!! The blue card back reminds me of the original series of Topps trading cards back in 1977. Its a universal card that lets Big H use it for any movie. I love the movies and the hobbies that come with it. I take them for what they are.... Toys and movies.:p

OxsLemure
10-25-2001, 09:30 AM
He still should have gotten more lines and screen time than the binks. I am stil a die hard fan of The Star Wars Movies. Just not really of EP1. There were good parts. One of the most amazing saber battles, Lots of cool droids roaming around except the Roger Roger bots. Some fun space battles. The cool sounds and looks of the pod race minus the announcer of course. But then there are all the down sides too. Young darth sorta like jesus? Eventually he will rise up and come free the slaves?? just kinda sad. All the gungans seem like they were droped on thier head as children. Poor qui gon seemed like he was asleep the whole show;)
But this forum is about the new packaging. My complain should ahve stopped at the fact that they intend to change the packaging twice in the next 7 months. I am just worried that the inbetween emperors wrath and the EP2 beginning will turn up like the CTC trilogy figs. most will be easy..2 will be hard and 1 will be super hard and everyone will pay too much for it and then it will show up at TRU for a dollar.
My thougts are just wait and change when EP2 does and then we can complain if it sucks in hand or not:)
Everyone relax. You like It..I don't..such is the nature of man. If everyone liked everythign the same how utterl boring a world would this be?
Chad

JediTricks
10-25-2001, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by bigbarada
Don't worry about sharing your opinions Wooooof, some of us just get a little over-emotional at times. I understand what you are saying JT, and I will try to play nice from now on. (BTW, could you send a similar message to all the Ep1 haters who constantly haunt the Ep1 threads?):cool:


Originally posted by bigbarada
Sometimes I really have to double check to make sure this is a Star Wars fan site I am on. Especially since it seems that only voices of dissention and angry, rude rants against Star Wars, GL, Hasbro, etc. are acceptable here by the staff. If guys like JT and Thrawn just absolutely hate every single little new tidbit of info about Star Wars then why do you work here? I really don't understand the mentality here. And why does someone like me who admanantly defends Star Wars come under attack for rude, angry posts? Are all the rude, angry anti-Star Wars, GL, Hasbro, etc. posts acceptable? Did this become a Star Wars hate site without anyone telling me? If so I've been wasting my time here the last few months.

Are there two bigbarada posters using the same account? What the björk is with these 2 opposing posts from the same day, and they're only one post apart no less?

Let me explain again, if you want to discuss a differing point of view, that's fine so long as you try to respect others' opinions, but don't just start calling others names like "whiners" because they don't agree with you, and don't flame the post over and over.

I am a huge fan of the first 3 Star Wars movies, but that doesn't mean I love every moment just because it came from Lucasfilm. There are some things I like about the prequels, but between the incredibly awful marketing decisions, the abusive treatment that Hasbro and LFL took with the fans, and other prequel-related elements, I'm not 100% thrilled with everything wearing the "Star Wars" brand name. Does that make me not a fan? If you think so, then you are wrong, plain and simple.

JediTricks
10-25-2001, 11:57 AM
BTW, this is what the new packaging reminds me of: spacewarz.jpg (http://www.sirstevesguide.com/vbportal/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=15701)

(A huge thanks to derek for focusing the feeling, and coming up with the name)

Mandalorian Candidat
10-25-2001, 12:08 PM
Thumbs up on the "improved" EP2 packaging! I couldn't express my feelings any better.

BTW, the "Hey kid, don't choke...or sue" tag line on the top corner is a nice crowning touch.

Five stars to JT and derek. :cool:

Jargo
10-25-2001, 03:42 PM
Hmmmmmm, interesting. Veeeery interesting.....

Obviously Lucas is trying to raise pots of cash otherwise there wouldn't have been so many licenses granted for crap episode one merchandise :)

George doesn't really control the toy line cuz that's mostly down to Lucas licensing surely? He has staff that sign and approve these designs for him surely? He's busy making a movie surely?
I agree up to a point that he seems to have lost track somewhat with certain elements. Allowed his judgement to become clouded by sentiment and merchandise driven financing. But he still makes a great movie as far as most of the editing goes and his choice of designs is pretty sharp mostly.

It is unfair to diss Lucas for every little thing you don't like about star wars. Lord knows I've done my fair share of dissing. I'm not going to be hypocritical here, but this new card back is just the product of opinions, lots of them. Hasbro have listened to many voices in forums like these, they've brainstormed at hasbro HQ. They've talked with Lucas licensing and what we have is a result of all those opinions being distilled into a lousy piece of flimsy printed card that comes attached to a toy that's supposed to be ripped off the card and played with while the card hits the garbage bin.
it isn't worth fighting over. The fight should be over whether or not the content of the bubble is worthy of ever being produced in the first place. Is it quality goods or shameless cashing in. Is it good value for money or have we been given a useles piece of junk with the brand name attached.
If you just buy stuff because it has star wars written on the box then you can just buy any knock off goods in flea markets to have your fix. I buy only the things that seem well made. Only the things that interest me for the quality and detail of workmanship.
I open everything as it is intended and even those intended for display in the packaging like the 300th Boba Fett and the exclusives. Because I want to appreciate the quality goods first hand not view them like a museum piece in the packaging.
And speaking of museums, Those who keep them packaged and display them museum style like Philip Wise the webmaster of rebelscum.com, should just accept the new packaging for what it is - just another chapter in the history of the toy line, different, unusual. These same negative comments were bandied around when the POTJ packaging first appeared and it hasn't killed most peoples collecting habit.
I'm not over the moon about this new style but it's just a phase. It'll only be around for a year or so before Hasbro change their mind and their design policy again. Don't sweat it over a piece of card. :D

BTW, I think it's my fault actually, check out the 'what colour should the ep2 cards be' thread... shocking isn't in it... :eek:

bigbarada
10-25-2001, 05:30 PM
Hey, JT how'd you get two quotes to show up in the same post? Sorry about the schizophrenic posting but you caught me at the beginning and end of a REALLY crappy day. (I seem to be having a lot of those recently.) Remember my comment about overemotional? Just keep that in mind for future reference.:)

Oh well, if you really hate it, just remember Hasbro makes it their policy to redesign the cards every year or so to "freshen" the line. Not something Hasbro chooses to do, just something retailers want to keep customers from getting bored with the merchandise. Don't blame Hasbro, blame Wal-Mart and K-Mart and TRU and KB and Target and......

JediCole
10-25-2001, 06:00 PM
I was almost the first to reply to this post. The content reminded me of a similar story regarding the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (the original Mirage Studios comic, that is). I began a lengthy description of that particular instance, then realized, in all fairness to Snake, he has as much right to pan as many of us have to praise. I could go on about my thoughts about his comments, but others have shared or rejected his views, so there is certainly enough said in that regard.

I have mixed feelings about JT's interjections in regard to Big Barada's comments, however. I am certainly glad I did not post my original thoughts, though they recognized Snake's right to his opinion, they would have excercised an equal right on my part to explore my disagreements, as well as agreements.


Originally posted by bigbarada

As for the figure's articulation, I would drop SWAF collecting in a heartbeat if Hasbro released GI Joe looking figures. Too much articulation ruins the figure, SW has always been about striking the balance between sculpt and articulation. What would be the point of having a good sculpt if it is only to be ruined by too many robotic looking joints?



Now here's something I have to agree with wholeheartedly. I will further explain that this does not mean that I love all of the choices Hasbro makes. If this post has shown us anything, it is that so many (not all) people here cannot see beyond stark black and white on issues. You are either for Hasbro or against Hasbro, for Lucas or against Lucas. I think if one reads the full content of many of these posts and not simply zero in on a few key words, one can see that we all have things we love and hate about all aspects of that which is Star Wars.

JediTricks
10-26-2001, 01:42 PM
M.C., glad you dig it, I think it sums up this new packaging quite nicely too. ;) The "hey kid, don't choke" part started running through my brain as soon as I realized I didn't want the Hasbro choke warning, and I immediately thought of an old SNL sketch; the "... or sue" was all me though. ;) I actually cracked up the most when I came up with "Obi-Man" though, it still is making me chuckle. :D


Jargo, I throw out the POTJ packaging after I open my figures, so my views of the new packaging have nothing to do with keeping it. However, I think if the packaging is repulsive to many buyers, then the line will die before we get the figures we want (think of the original '85 POTF). True, I'd prefer to concentrate on the products, but there are other concerns that are affected by this stuff and this packaging really looks that bad to me, so I mentioned it. Does that mean I, and others who agree with me, should be attacked for our viewpoints? No.


Barada, you can have LOTS of quotes in your posts, the quote system can be done manually, you can add the various formatting yourself.

Sorry you had a crappy day, it was a REAL shocker to see such a wide difference of statement between the 2 posts, that kinda shook me. I'm glad we can move past this and discuss the real issue, how the packaging looks... bad. ;) I just had a big issue the other day with the personal stuff about the posters, it wasn't meant to come down on you personally.


Cole, see the previous paragraph about the issue.

As for the "black & white" issue of Hasbro AND the "robotic" joints, I think they proved they can do fantastic articulation with figures like Commtech Stormtrooper where the joints don't look unnatural, yet even there, they didn't put a SIMPLE wrist articulation point in. I prefer neutral poses with tons of articulation myelf, but I also don't like joints that are ugly like Anakin Mechanic or CTC Luke.

ki-adi mundi's bro
10-26-2001, 03:30 PM
i can't believe this! snake-whatever, you should be greeatful for lucas...you buy the stuff, you watch the movie, you collect, you should be grateful!

snakeplkn
10-26-2001, 05:38 PM
If you want idea of what type of cardback I wanted, check out this site:

http://people.ne.mediaone.net/kpaq/cards/original.html

The Episode II packaging would've been right on the money.

I was thinking of a pack-in since force files are worthless and people seem to despise COMMTech. I think the problem with COMMTech is that the majority of the chips, as mentioned earlier, are nothing more than Stephen Hawking doing the voices. COMMTech had no value.

Now if COMMTech had a "duel" feature besides the movie quotes, it could've been more accepted. What would occur is with the reader, you would tell it how many characters involved, say the fight between Darth Maul, Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, 1 vs 2, and then you would use their chips to get a result of who lives and dies.

I wouldn't mind seeing how many Jawas a Tusken Raider could take on. Or Darth Sidious against himself as the elder Emperor.

Then again, how about stopping with extras altogether - force files, COMMTech chips, holograms, and keep the price low?

Snake Plissken
"A little human compassion"

Post Script: Ki, considering the depth of your posts, no wonder you follow Lucas blindly.

JediCole
10-26-2001, 05:59 PM
The real problem with the CommTech chips is that Hasbro appears to have inherited Kenner's poor expertise in electronics. It was shameful to have an Obi-Wan on helium CommTech figure out at the same time as the crystal clear, sound-perfect Simpson's figures, which commanded a lower price! (Granted, Playmates isn't sinking nearly as much of the cost of their figures into the license rights that Hasbro is with theirs.)
The bottom line is that anything beyond the terrible quality of the CommTech chips would have sent the already staggering price of Star Wars figures even higher. If Hasbro has to have an inconsequential pack-in, make it a useful figure stand, much as Playmates (them again?) did with their Star Trek line, from day one! Otherwise, don't waste space with pack-ins no one wants. I'd rather have an extra, QUALITY accessory than something that is of minimal connection to the figure.


I thank you!

INDIANA
10-26-2001, 07:01 PM
I need to admit that I am probably a minimalist. I actually LIKE the up-comming POTJ cards (FX-7 wave)! Simple and neat.
No "stupid" or "needless" pack-ins (not to offend those of you that like comm-techs or force files) just a good sculpt of a figure I want.

I do not like the EII cards. They are trying to capture the feeling of the original line with certain graphics, but I think we have moved beyond that for an established line. Mauls face and the Vader/Obi-Wan graphic were better than the hands & lightsaber. The bold line around the card does nothing for me either. The bigger bubble looks too much like other figure lines (and for smaller figures like R2 I think will look stupid). If this was the packaging for the up-comming 25th 2-packs...GREAT!!!...but not for the mainstream line that will, presumably, go on for a few years besides being the showpiece for the EII line.

The figure.....looks like what I have come to expect from the POTJ line. Not great but not a complete disaster. The key for me will be this 3-D laser face sculpting thingy. We can't see the face well in the photo but if it really is good it will only make the figure better.

Also, about the title of this forum. By knockout I assumed you ment you liked the package. It's clear (to my relief) other aren't blown away or impressed either.

Hasbro, I believe, is about making money, not pleasing us. If everyone here HATED the package they wouldn't do a thing to change it.

This is the package design we will have to live with of the next year at least.

End of story.

Fulit
10-26-2001, 07:16 PM
I think the packaging looks sort of lame personally, but they could put it in a clear plastic sack and write "Star Wars" on the side and I'd buy it, if the toy was cool, because I'm interested in the toy, not the packaging it comes in. But that's me, I'm an open collector. I can understand how it would suck if you're a carded collector and they come out with a package design you think sucks. The new card certainly would look weird hanging next to an Ep1 card.

LTBasker
10-27-2001, 10:47 AM
I think the whole thing is just a prototype run to see how fans react. Look at the lightsaber, and then at that thing he's got with him, I doubt LucasFilm would've wanted them to released an image about something that is a spoiler to us so they probably just popped it in there which is something to something else, I dunno... The E2 packaging looks something like what you would find for little $1-3 bootlegs or something, I don't like it, but I didn't like the POTJ packaging at first but now I love it... eh *shrugs* Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll do a major overhaul on it, one good thing though, no guys flying with a lightsaber in hand on the card. ;)

Fulit
10-28-2001, 07:31 PM
Actually I think that droid with Obi-Wan is from a scene in E2 where **POSSIBLE SPOLIER**

**POSSIBLE SPOLIER**


**POSSIBLE SPOLIER**



**POSSIBLE SPOLIER**




**POSSIBLE SPOLIER**







In some script leaks, there is a scene on Coruscant where Obi-Wan leaps onto a droid that was hovering near the window to Padme's room. It falls or something, or maybe he attempts to ride it back to whoever sent it, I can't remember.

bigbarada
10-28-2001, 08:35 PM
From all the pictures everyone has seen thus far, Obi-Wan is wielding the EXACT same lightsaber he used in Ep1. So I assume the dead master's lightsaber doesn't necessarily go to the padawan. So, either Obi-Wan managed to scrounge up his old saber or he rebuilt one that is exactly the same. Who knows?

sith_killer_99
10-29-2001, 03:19 AM
INDIANA "We named the dog Indiana." Sorry, I just had to do that.

Anyway, Hasbro seems to be listening to the collectors a little more. We asked for blue cards, we are getting blue cards. Despite the fact the blue is a "cold color". In marketing terms this means that consumers are less inclined to take notice of a particular item with that color.

The fan choice figures were probably just a gimik to find out what consumers were after. Hey, it's also a good PR gimik.

As for the "Real Scan" technology? I have little hope for it. The new wrestling figures use "Real Scan" and they are just as ugly as ever! And those are 6 inch figs.

JediTricks
10-29-2001, 11:31 AM
SK99, ever see those "Charlies Angels" movie dolls? Those were also realscan... YIKES!!! :eek:

master jedi
10-29-2001, 02:24 PM
PLease...don't bring up the Charlie's Anglels movie dolls up. They make me want to puke all over the place they're so ugly. It's like the movie wasn't bad enough so they had to come out with hideous(sp?) dolls.

Wolfwood319
10-30-2001, 10:29 PM
The new blue card reminds me of figures that come out for movies with just a marketing gimmick going for them. Take for instance action figures for Lost in Space, Wild Wild West, Battlefield Earth (*shudder*), Titan A.E., the list goes on.

I would really like a blue card, but more along the lines of what the cards on Snake's link look like. Like the current POTJ cards only with a blue lightsaber. The picture at Hasbro's site just doesn't look too intriguing to me.

As for the title "Attack of the Clones," I think it matches up with the rest of the titles. All of the titles for the movies seem reminescent of titles to old throwback 50's sci-fi movies.

Now, as for all you "fans" who seem to have nothing better to do than go around to these forums and just badmouth Star Wars, saying you hate this and don't like that, well here's a suggestion, if you don't like it, stop posting. Not everyone is going to like everything about the new movies, and George Lucas knew this. TPM was a pretty decent movie, but all people did was badmouth it. Jar Jar this, and midichloreans that, if you didn't like, fine, but don't go around polluting the all the forums, cause quite frankly, if you were a fan by definition, you would like the movie.

You people really should rethink your status as a "fan" if all you seem to do is hate everything starwars post 1999. You people aren't fans at all. Its ok to dislike something, but not hate everything.

bigbarada
10-30-2001, 10:56 PM
That's dangerous ground you tread Wolfwood319, watch your step around these parts.

Needless to say I agree with you completely. I asked my brother the other day why he doesn't like posting on these forums and he basically said that he likes to stay away from "Star Wars Hate Sites" like SSG. His basic idea is if the moderators and staff members have really nothing good to say then how can they call it a fan site?

I agree with him on some points, since to the casual visitor who comes here to talk about the latest Star Wars news is bombarded with angry, negative, hateful insults to Star Wars. What are they expected to think?

JediTricks
10-31-2001, 12:07 PM
It must be hard to talk with all this HOT AIR flowing around here.

Barada, this statement seems quite rude to the staff:
if the moderators and staff members have really nothing good to say then how can they call it a fan site?Perhaps you guys just don't READ all the stuff you consider to be out of the "nothing good to say" category written by the staff here, perhaps you are harping on the negative comments because you're not looking for the positive ones. Nobody said being a fan meant being a Lucasfilm cheerleader.

Wolfwood and the rest of you folks saying this stuff, maybe you should try to find something more positive to say than "if you don't like it, stop posting" as if you really know what makes these people fans or as if you have a legitimate judgement to make on someone else's opinions. This isn't a site just for folks who have only one agreeing opinion about everything Star Wars, and those so-called "negative" folks aren't trying to infringe upon your opinions of Star Wars in general, so why infringe upon their's? Obviously these people are Star Wars fans enough that they're willing to discuss their grievances with certain elements and risk getting trashed over their views in the hopes that somehow this might give the next Star Wars film, toy, book, or whatever a better chance at living up to the Star Wars legacy of magic.

Reading the first post in this thread should have clued you "anti-whining" whiners in on the direction the thread was taking, I mean the guy starts the thread saying I logged on moments ago to witness what I believe what will the beginning of the end for my Star Wars collecting. If you took the time to read the opening post, you should KNOW this isn't a thread that's in favor of the packaging and if you don't agree, you can state your argument, but why waste everybody's time getting all flustered at the support Snake's getting for his negative view of the packaging? This is ridiculous, please, let's have more comments about the packaging and less about the posters.

Part of what makes Star Wars great is that it's a rich tapestry of characters and motivations and philosophies and myths all rolled into a great big saga - not every character is a rebel commander who dreams of toppling the evil Empire, not every villain motivated by the Dark Side of the Force. Just because you don't see eye to eye with some other fans doesn't mean they are any less of a Star Wars fan than you; Star Wars isn't just one movie, it's cobbled together from the 4 (going on 5) films, the TV specials and cartoons, the toys, the books, the games, the comics, etc., so not every view on all that is going to add up to yours because it is that rich tapestry of ideals and opinions that makes these forums - and Star Wars fandom as a whole community - something special.

INDIANA
10-31-2001, 12:34 PM
I agree.

Who has the right or moral authority to tell me what I should like or dislike. I do NOT like everything Star Wars. Anyone who told me they did I would question. I'm not a fan of most of the novels but I would GREATLY take to task anyone saying I am not a fan.

I will like what I like and will allow everyone else the right to like or dislike what they will without making judgements.

bigbarada
10-31-2001, 07:47 PM
JT, that was just me voicing my brother's opinion of the site based on what he saw when he visited after the Ep2 title announcement. If you look at the old threads you'll find him somewhere in the EP2 section under the name 'padawanob1'

Personally I really hate EU, not the actual idea of an expanded universe, just the direction the writers decided to take it. It could have been a cool mythological kind of story about Luke rebuilding the Jedi Order; but instead we got military sci-fi. I believe that the novels can be totally disregarded and deleted from Star Wars continuity with no loss at all to the Star Wars magic.

However, I see the movies as "straight from the horses mouth" so to speak. Right now we are in the middle of the story that already has an established beginning and end; so we are just waiting for the peices to come together. Most of the hateful criticisms leveled at Ep1 and 2 are just the result of impatience in my mind. Therefore not really valid. If I don't understand something right away it means I don't have all the necessary information or haven't really thought it through. Just because everything wasn't layed out on a silver platter doesn't make it stupid or lame. Non sequiturs, in a story like this, are almost a requirement to keep the interest of the established fan base. If something doesn't make sense then make an effort to understand it or wait for more info; don't just pass it off as stupid.

Just my view on the whole matter. In a nutshell, wait until you see all six movies in order before you make your judgements.

Anyways, in an almost complete reversal of the "hate it now/ love it later" phenomenon; the new packaging design has begun to wear very thin on me. Oh well, some graphics on a slab of cardboard is the least of my worries right now.:rolleyes:

JediTricks
11-01-2001, 12:14 PM
Indy, thanks for the cool words. I hope everybody understands what you mean by that last part, my comments were (as usual) long-winded, but yours were right to the point. :)


Barada, I did understand what you were saying about quoting your bro, I simply said the statement itself was what I felt was rude, not the author. As for your brother, I honestly think he just saw the pinacle of negative opinions and his view was simply a product of bad timing. The AOTC title issue was probably the biggest hot-button SW issue since Jar Jar in '99.

While I see the classic trilogy as being "Straight from the horse's mouth", I am still not too confident in everything in Ep 1 being true canon TO ME. I mean, on one level, I know there's zip I can do to change it and it's canon (until Lucas decides to "Special Edition" it), but on another level, there's stuff in there that I feel personally betrays the classic trilogy in so many ways that I have to think of ways to either weasel the story around it or to simply cut it completely from my mind. However, to say that just because you view others' opinions about Ep 1 and 2 as being "impatient" and therefore not valid, that doesn't give you the right to treat other fans as if their views ARE invalid on the forums, especially since you have NO way of knowing what's really in their minds. Yes, you're accepting that Ep 1 is an incomplete film and not supposed to be taken as a complete film as well as part of a saga, but LFL has said otherwise about the films and so if others don't agree with you on those issues, that does NOT make their opinion invalid. I mean, some folks might say that your view
In a nutshell, wait until you see all six movies in order before you make your judgements. could be considered naive, blinded, and far too forgiving towards Lucas and LFL, and thus, invalid. You wouldn't like to be treated as if your views were less valid than another's, would you?

BTW, that reversal of yours IS kinda entertaining, especially in the context of this thread's content. ;)

bigbarada
11-01-2001, 01:17 PM
Yeah, the more I look at it the more my eye gets distracted by the awkward border breaks. Especially the abrupt break just below the hands on the left side. Something I learned in art class as a "competing point." Basically a portion of the drawing that draws your eye immediately and detracts from the rest of the artwork. Just sloppy composition, but not nearly as bad as the OB1 in the top left corner of the POTJ cards. (Which my brother showed to his college art professor and she described it as a "horribly misguided design." I can't wait to see what she says about the EP2 cards.;) ) But as I mentioned before it really isn't a big deal.

JediTricks
11-02-2001, 12:57 AM
The only thing good I can say about the POTJ card's Obi-Wan drawing is that at least it isn't the original prototype one (http://www.figures.com/Features/index.html?show_article=2463&domain=sirstevesguide.com&dom=ss&domain_id=5). ;)

Tycho
11-02-2001, 01:38 AM
Well thanks for sharing that with us JediTricks!

To me, that card is kind of cool. If I collected carded, especially variations, I'd want one!

Aside from that, seeing two much generic-ness on any packaging, over and over again, and it gets tiresome. I'd really rather have vintage style movie scene custom cards again...

snakeplkn
11-02-2001, 02:01 AM
I hadn’t seen that picture before Jedi Tricks, pretty awful drawing of Obi-Wan. Notice how Obi looks to be in agony in the prototype and current version? Power of the Jedi would have been the perfect time for a blue starburst with Anakin-Darth Vader mesh on the corner. It seems as though Hasbro has no concept of marketing outside of how to cut corners while raising the price.

Tycho, I agree with you 100% on vintage style cardbacks. Definitely gave each package uniqueness to it. With the new blue, the only major difference will be a small picture and text. Furthermore if the “droid” is the new gimmick, it’s a poor one. A perfect idea would be small CDs that could contain movie clips, images, dossiers, figure previews, exclusive Internet links … but I’m sure the price would skyrocket.

Allegedly, George Lucas once said:

"I took over control of the merchandising not because I thought it was going to make me rich, but because I wanted to control it. I wanted to make a stand for social, safety, and quality reasons. I didn't want someone using the name Star Wars on a piece of junk."

In terms of Episode II packaging, I think this speaks volumes on the current state of affairs...

Snake Plissken
“A little human compassion”

JediTricks
11-02-2001, 11:23 AM
Originally posted by Tycho
Well thanks for sharing that with us JediTricks!

To me, that card is kind of cool. If I collected carded, especially variations, I'd want one!

Aside from that, seeing two much generic-ness on any packaging, over and over again, and it gets tiresome. I'd really rather have vintage style movie scene custom cards again... I bet if you look real hard on the internet, maybe ebay or something, you could probably get one of those prototype packages. I mean, look how many they had at this Toy Fair 2000 display (http://www.figures.com/Features/index.html?show_article=59&domain=sirstevesguide.com&dom=ss&domain_id=5), there's probably over 100 of those protos that got printed up but never used.

BTW, check out the starburst behind the vehicles, reminds me of the opening titles of "Futurama". ;)