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View Full Version : How a jedi becomes a ghost...maybe.....?



TheDarthVader
01-06-2003, 06:17 PM
I have a good idea and I mentioned it in the "Is Mace a bad guy thread" but I wanted to post here. I think I am onto something when I tell you how a jedi becomes a ghost. There are only two ways:

1. die at the hands of a sith either apprentice or master
2. kill a sith either an apprentice or master

There you go...any comments? My way of thinking...

1. Qui-Gon died at the hands of Darth Maul
2. Anakin-- killed Palpy and was killed by Palpy
3. Kenobi-- killed Maul and was killed by Vader
4. Yoda--we'll see but I am sure he's killed a sith at some point!!

sith_killer_99
01-06-2003, 06:48 PM
This will be revealed in EPIII.

However, the novel (AOTC) states that Yoda is suprised to hear Qui-Gon's voice. At that point, it was believed that when a Jedi dies he became one with the force, completly indistinguishable. So how could Qui-Gon's voice have called out?

Yoda decided he would have to meditate on it later. And he decided not to reveal, that he had heard Qui-Gon's voice, to Mace. Interesting? Perhaps Yoda does not fully trust Mace? Or he just wanted to get more insight before revealing it to Mace.:crazed:

Jaff
01-07-2003, 03:23 PM
I believe that qui-gon was a part of the LIVING force. Though he died by a sith he was so strongly connected to the force that a remnant of him remained. Jedi's die left and right in II, whether any of them come back as ghosts will see. However I have my own hypothosis and it is just that.

Whoever lets go becomes a ghost: What do I mean - Ben lowers his defenses and let himself die in peace. Yoda is old, and lets go to die in peace. Vader lets go, and dies in peace. Thus their lives did not end in panic or pain, or confusion, or surprise. They simply GAVE their existance to the force. Thus they continue.

The Overlord Returns
01-07-2003, 05:24 PM
I think it's as simple as being prepared for death.

Obi Wan: Prepares for Death before Vader strikes him down.

Yoda: Prepares for death at his old age.....

Vader: Prepares for death once reconciled w/ Luke

Jinn is an anomaly, perhaps he knew he was facing possible death, but was not fully prepared. It seems as though he can't quite communicate the way Kenobi and yoda can.....

Jedi Clint
01-07-2003, 07:21 PM
Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
I think it's as simple as being prepared for death.

Obi Wan: Prepares for Death before Vader strikes him down.

Yoda: Prepares for death at his old age.....

Vader: Prepares for death once reconciled w/ Luke

Jinn is an anomaly, perhaps he knew he was facing possible death, but was not fully prepared. It seems as though he can't quite communicate the way Kenobi and yoda can.....

He waited patiently on one knee to face Maul right before his demise in TPM. He very well could have been preparing for the worst.

scruffziller
01-09-2003, 10:38 AM
Originally posted by TheDarthVader

4. Yoda--we'll see but I am sure he's killed a sith at some point!!

Unless he does it in the next movie(or in between), he wouldn't have since the Sith were gone before he was born.


Originally posted by The Overlord Returns


Jinn is an anomaly, perhaps he knew he was facing possible death, but was not fully prepared. It seems as though he can't quite communicate the way Kenobi and yoda can.....

Don't speak too soon, remember Neeson is cast for EPS 3!!!!!

The Overlord Returns
01-09-2003, 10:57 AM
He is?

scruffziller
01-09-2003, 02:14 PM
Unless it was an utter lie, it was reported as such.

There is also a rumor of Hugh Jackman going to be in it as well.

Chiesa
01-09-2003, 04:42 PM
Yes yes Liam Neeson is back to reprise the role Qui Gonn. So we will be seeing him return as a ghost. Not a major maybe but nevertheless he will be back!

I do believe that Qui Gonn always trusted in the Living Force which was different from what the others practiced. So I would go with Jaff's theory. He probably just died and became one with the force. Something which Yoda and the rest didn't really understand and prob. Qui Gonn came back and told them abt it.

But if that's the case, then I would now wonder wouldn't the rest of the Jedi Masters / knights do the same and leave as spirits? Or did he only reveal it when they were killed? Also how did Palpy learn abt it since we know he dies and enters his clones...??

Jedi Clint
01-09-2003, 04:49 PM
Originally posted by scruffziller
Unless it was an utter lie, it was reported as such.

There is also a rumor of Hugh Jackman going to be in it as well.

The Jackman rumor has been debunked by the same person who started it: Rick McC.

The Overlord Returns
01-09-2003, 05:00 PM
How did I miss this Qui Gon jinn thing......

Is their some sort of link that can be put up with the info?

sith_killer_99
01-09-2003, 05:33 PM
WOW, this has been going around since long before AOTC was released.

Yes, Liam will be reprising his role.

The Overlord Returns
01-09-2003, 05:34 PM
Good Lord............... what was I on when this was announced.....???

Jedi Clint
01-09-2003, 05:45 PM
Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Good Lord............... what was I on when this was announced.....???

http://www.sirstevesguide.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11109

Don't be too hard on yourself. The information was hardly confirmation of Liam's involvement in E3. It merely said that the inclusion of his voice in E2 was related to a plot point in E3.

Chiesa
01-10-2003, 12:54 AM
That kind of means he will at least be voicing himself over sometime in EPIII? So I guess his involvement is quite a safe bet.

PoggleTheGreater
01-10-2003, 05:50 AM
Maybe it will be similar to obi-wan's "force" voice at the end of ANH.

Back to the spirit thing, I think it's one of two things: All jedi (and maybe even everybody else) become spirits after they die; or becoming a force spirit is an act of will. In a way, they kill themselves by turning themselves into energy (similar to the end of Powder).

As for the explanation being in III, McCallum asked Lucas about it. He just looked at him as if to say, "what, are you a fan?", according to starwars.com.

stevenmh
01-16-2003, 07:07 PM
The thing I'm most curious about is the time period between death and showing up as a ghost. Obi-Wan, Yoda, and Anakin all showed up as ghosts not long after death. In the EU, they only continued to do so for a certain period of time...after that they truly become one with the Force and can no longer maintain their individuality and appear as ghosts. They're gone for good.

Qui-Gon, on the other hand, doesn't make a supernatural appearance until 10 years after his death. If he had somehow learned to maintain his consciousness after death, why did he wait 10 years to speak to Anakin? Surely Anakin showed some dark side tendencies prior to the events of EP2....Obi-Wan noticed his recklessness and arrogance. And how can he maintain his consciousness so long after his death?

I'm hoping that Lucas will actually explain some of this in EP3, instead of leaving it to the imagination.

zeroplate
01-17-2003, 04:04 PM
yeah, it's best to have everything spelled out for you instead of having to rely on those pesky things like 'creativity' and 'imagination' :)

El Chuxter
03-29-2010, 12:32 AM
I'm hoping that Lucas will actually explain some of this in EP3, instead of leaving it to the imagination.

How does the disappointment feel? :(

JimJamBonds
03-29-2010, 10:46 AM
yeah, it's best to have everything spelled out for you instead of having to rely on those pesky things like 'creativity' and 'imagination' :)

True dat' zeroplate. :D

Bel-Cam Jos
03-29-2010, 01:04 PM
Yeah, remember that scene in ROTS where Yoda hands Obi-Wan that datacard labled "The Secret," and Yoda said, "Think positive thoughts, you must, Obi-Wan, and receive whatever you want you will"?

JimJamBonds
03-29-2010, 03:18 PM
Yeah, remember that scene in ROTS where Yoda hands Obi-Wan that datacard labled "The Secret," and Yoda said, "Think positive thoughts, you must, Obi-Wan, and receive whatever you want you will"?

Is that before of after Yoda says he has more training for Obbers and will teach him how to 'commune' with Senior Ginn?

TheDarthVader
03-31-2010, 01:09 PM
I am still upset that we did not get an answer to this question. I guess Yoda implies through meditation and blah blah blah. Yeah, that pretty much sucks as an answer. Darn you, Liam. We needed you to come back in person to explain this! Well, as a ghost though. :D

El Chuxter
03-31-2010, 01:20 PM
You notice how they didn't include Qui-Gon in ROTS because the filming on that day interfered with Neeson's schedule, so they wrote it out? And they didn't include Short Round and Sallah in the end of that supposed fourth Indiana Jones movie because the actors' schedules interfered with filming on that day?

What is it with the single most advanced filmmaker on Earth, technologically speaking, having such a short window of opportunity to include characters in important scenes, and likes to just ignore the scenes or characters altogether instead of either filming for another day or even digitally dropping someone in?

Rocketboy
03-31-2010, 02:42 PM
They never filmed a Qui-Gon scene because Neeson never agreed to do one.

Hell, the guy contemplated retirement after his experience on Episode I.


As for Indy, that would have been much tougher to digitally drop in a cameo. And I'm sure that schedules of Speilberg and Ford are a lot less flexible than those of Sallah or Short Round.

El Chuxter
03-31-2010, 05:36 PM
That's not what I heard, and my source is reliable.

As I heard it, Lucas called up Liam and said, "Yo, Liam, old buddy, we're filming a scene that needs Qui-Gon's ghost to really make it perfect, but it's only on Wednesday. You in?"

And Neeson said, "Actually, George, I've got a date Wednesday. See, there's this guy on this Star Wars collecting website who goes by 'Rocketboy,' and his mom, well, she's really easy. Like really easy. I mean, this woman, you even just hold the elevator for her, and you're in for a world of carnal pleasures."

:pleased:

JimJamBonds
03-31-2010, 05:39 PM
RB's mom?!?!?! And here I thought this was a post about Slicker's mom! :sur:

El Chuxter
03-31-2010, 05:41 PM
Neeson was confused, as he discovered that Wednesday, much to his chagrin. Rocketboy's Mom is a saint. And I'm not making a crack about being a missionary. Rocketboy's Mom was canonized by the Catholic Church for her work with the poor orphans in Bangladesh, and she's not even Catholic.

JimJamBonds
03-31-2010, 05:42 PM
But in addition to that she's... umm... easy?

El Chuxter
03-31-2010, 05:45 PM
No, and she smacked the hell out of Liam Neeson! That's why he is appearing in s*** like Clash of the Titans 2010; his common sense was severely damaged.

Rocketboy's Mom did feel sorry for him, though, and gave him Slicker's Mom's number. Funny thing is, though, Slicker's Mom just laughed at him, made a comment about how it made no sense for him to be in Episode I since he was never mentioned in the original movies, and slammed the door right in his face.

Quite a few parts of Liam Neeson were blue that evening.

2-1B
03-31-2010, 09:36 PM
Chux, what about this thought (and I'm being serious here):

Can I make the argument that ROTS would have been WORSE with a Qui-Ghost cameo? If he was in that flick, people who criticize it EVEN MORE since he's not floatin' around the OT...I'm just sayin', is all. As it stands now, there's a school of thought that Qui-Gon didn't belong in the PT in the first place...

El Chuxter
03-31-2010, 09:48 PM
You're going to make me be serious, aren't you? How out of character, Cae. :p

With the cut of the film as it is, it needed a scene of Qui-Gon's ghost. Why? Because Yoda tells Obi-Wan, completely out of the blue, that he has training with Qui-Gon. Obi-Wan not only buys it, but gets this totally flabbergasted and amazed look on his face. Like he sees something that convinces him Yoda hasn't lost it.

The scene should've been acted differently, if there's no Liam Neeson. It's ridiculous as it is.

2-1B
03-31-2010, 10:19 PM
Obi-Wan not only buys it, but gets this totally flabbergasted and amazed look on his face. Like he sees something that convinces him Yoda hasn't lost it.

Sees something...such as...a ghost ? :eek:

Darth Jax
03-31-2010, 11:43 PM
Sees something...such as...a ghost ? :eek:

yep... but since it was dom deluise, that explains the surprised look on his face

JimJamBonds
04-01-2010, 10:20 AM
You're going to make me be serious, aren't you? How out of character, Cae. :p

With the cut of the film as it is, it needed a scene of Qui-Gon's ghost. Why? Because Yoda tells Obi-Wan, completely out of the blue, that he has training with Qui-Gon. Obi-Wan not only buys it, but gets this totally flabbergasted and amazed look on his face. Like he sees something that convinces him Yoda hasn't lost it.

The scene should've been acted differently, if there's no Liam Neeson. It's ridiculous as it is.

So in your mind Yoda lost it? Wouldn't you have a flabbergasted and amazed look if somebody told you you could communicate with somebody (close to you) that is dead?

Bel-Cam Jos
04-01-2010, 10:38 PM
They could have a tied-up clone trooper, and take off its helmet to reveal... old man Jinn?!? Ahhhh! G-G-G-Gon Jinn! :eek:

Darth Jax
04-01-2010, 10:41 PM
They could have a tied-up clone trooper, and take off its helmet to reveal... old man Jinn?!? Ahhhh! G-G-G-Gon Jinn! :eek:

and he would've gotten away with it if not for you darn whippersnappers

2-1B
04-02-2010, 11:39 PM
So in your mind Yoda lost it? Wouldn't you have a flabbergasted and amazed look if somebody told you you could communicate with somebody (close to you) that is dead?

Not if he went to parochial school.

JimJamBonds
04-02-2010, 11:40 PM
Not if he went to parochial school.

You'll have to talk to my parents about that one!