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Kidhuman
04-07-2003, 05:56 PM
In ESB how long did Luke spend on Dagobah? He trained pretty quick compared to the Jedi in the new trilogy. The new trilogy shows Jedi taking years to train. Luke did it in the matter of ?????????????????

Darth Jax
04-07-2003, 08:16 PM
the falcon didn't have an operating hyperdrive. it could've taken han and leia days to make bespin. so that gives luke about a week with yoda and possibly a couple of days with ben. who would've thought such a whiny little punk would be such a quick learner.

JediTricks
04-07-2003, 10:44 PM
This was covered in the following thread: http://www.sirstevesguide.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=42602

I still think 6 weeks.

stillakid
04-08-2003, 10:41 AM
Originally posted by kidhuman
In ESB how long did Luke spend on Dagobah? He trained pretty quick compared to the Jedi in the new trilogy. The new trilogy shows Jedi taking years to train. Luke did it in the matter of ?????????????????

And he did it all without learning about Midichlorians! That's real talent! :D

The Overlord Returns
04-08-2003, 10:50 AM
Originally posted by stillakid
And he did it all without learning about Midichlorians! That's real talent! :D

midi chlorians are merely a measure of ones potential force sensitivity, they don't seem to have any influence on how adept one is at training in the ways of the force........

Besides, even GL has forgotten about them.....why can't you? ;)

Bel-Cam Jos
04-08-2003, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
midi chlorians are merely a measure of ones potential force sensitivity, they don't seem to have any influence on how adept one is at training in the ways of the force........

Besides, even GL has forgotten about them.....why can't you? ;)
Wait; you mean that knowing my GPA in school doesn't make me smarter? Wha-?!? :eek: ;)

I think Luke was on Dagobah for 3 weeks. The Falcon was on the asteroid for a couple days before it left, it took about 16 days to "limp" to Bespin sans hyperdrive, a couple days on Cloud City, then the Imperials arrive to capture the Rebels. Just my opinion, no facts to support. Unless you count this website: http://allSWquestionsansweredfora5milliondollarfee.argh/gullible/sheesh ;)

icatch9
04-08-2003, 12:23 PM
Time is such a hard thing to tell in movies. Certianly this one when it follows two differnt plots.

Regardless how long Luke was on Degobah, I'm sure he didn't get the full Jedi training treatment. More like the "Cliff Notes" version. Yoda clearly tought him many things, as did Ben. However, there was no logical way he could of learned everything a Padawan learns in his/her 20+ years of training. Quick study or not, it's not possible. Yoda tought Luke what he needed to know. Except for the "Force Lightning" thing, Yoda and Ben must of forgot to tell Luke that Palpy could do that :D.

How do we know that Luke doesn't know about midicloriants? We didn't see every single word of wisdome Ben and Yoda shared with Luke. We saw the important ones, but how important are midicloriants to Lukes destiny? Not important at all. I doubt Ben or Yoda had a handy dandy midi counter just lying around either.

Kidhuman
04-08-2003, 02:37 PM
Okay I read the other thread on the issue. But you also have to account for Luke getting to Bespin as well .How long was Cloud City from Dagobah? That would also have to cut into Lukes training with the fact of getting ready and hyperdriving it over there. I always thought that he was there for about 2 weeks. But, how did he "crash" and learn all the information that took all other Jedis atleast a decade to learn?

Even if you count the 6 months between ESB and ROTJ that gives him less than one year total.

stillakid
04-08-2003, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Besides, even GL has forgotten about them.....why can't you? ;)

I take a sadistic pleasure in twisting the knife of inconsistency. :D


Or to put it another way, in a hundred to one long shot, I hope that when he puts together his Super Duper Nifty Edition of the Star Wars Saga on DVD, instead of raiding the original films to wrest them into continuity submission with the Prequels, he'll instead use his new CGI Superpowers to fix the Prequels. Surely by now he's gotten the clear message that more people love(d) the original films better than they have taken to the new ones. Why fix the piece that ain't broke? That's like having a car with a flat tire, then changing the other three to match the flawed one. :confused:

Imperial Monarche
04-08-2003, 05:20 PM
well, everybody seems to focus on the fact that Luke couldn't have possibly learned all he needed to know to become a Jedi because the Padawan's in the Prequals took more than a decade to reach full Jedi status. but listen to this theory...the Jedi religion is extinct. yoda knew he only had a little bit longer to live (definitely not 10 years or more) ben had to give himself to the Force to be with Luke at all times. so, that leaves little time for yoda to train luke so he basically coulda trained him in a new form so that he would at least have some kind of knowledge and everyone knows that if you have some kind of knowledge about something, you can pretty much teach yourself the rest if you try. luke learned the bare mimimum to get his feet wet and basically took the title of Jedi after yoda died and he defeated the last two dark Jedi's. he was then able to access hidden records to finish his training and become a master and rebirth the Jedi's.

Kidhuman
04-08-2003, 07:40 PM
Good theory, but how do you learn all in a few weeks when he had no patience and was wreckless?

JediTricks
04-09-2003, 02:07 AM
I think Qui-Gon's theories about how midichlorians work is wrong, they're not what lets a person communicate to the Force, they're merely a byproduct of how strong that person is with the Force - like when you're sick, a white bloodcell count is higher. (that's the short version of the theory :D, I'll spare you the longer version which I love to pull out of mothballs all the time. ;)) But that's not what this thread is about IMO.


Kidhuman, I would say the trip from Dagobah to Cloud City would probably be less than a day - it seems like nobody spends more than a day in hyperspace in the SW universe to me.


I think that Obi-Wan had been training Luke in the deeper stuff while he was growing up, and Luke simply didn't know he was being trained at the time. This would help explain why Obi-Wan lives so close to Luke, and if Obi-Wan and Yoda used the Force to teach Luke subconciously, this would explain Luke's line about Dagobah feeling familiar. Only the more hands-on training would be required of Obi-Wan and Yoda once Luke took up the lightsaber - teaching discipline and meditation and patience and not falling into the emotional trappings of the outside world. Plus, this would also explain how Luke becomes a Jedi in the 6 months between ESB and ROTJ, he taps into subconcious learnings to help his friend and unlocks the buried Jedi treasures of knowledge.

stillakid
04-09-2003, 02:19 AM
Originally posted by Imperial Monarche
he was then able to access hidden records to finish his training and become a master and rebirth the Jedi's.

What, um, hidden records?

icatch9
04-09-2003, 07:55 AM
I think he's reffering to the Jedi Library. Chances are it still exists. Plus, in the EU Luke finds all kinds of relics from the Jedi past. Even finds a force detector similar but different to a midicloriant counter. In turn he test Wedge and his is totally force free :D.

Imperial Monarche
04-09-2003, 01:56 PM
Originally posted by stillakid
What, um, hidden records?

you really think the emperor would keep records of the Jedi's around after he has them destroyed. the best way to destroy a people is to destroy their history and records.

Kidhuman
04-09-2003, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by Imperial Monarche
you really think the emperor would keep records of the Jedi's around after he has them destroyed. the best way to destroy a people is to destroy their history and records.

You wrote about hidden records first. I was thinking they were maybe in the Jedi Library. But the emperor probably would of had them destroyed. So what hidden records?

Imperial Monarche
04-09-2003, 04:01 PM
my mistake, i didnt mean to say that they were destroyed or to lead ppl to believe that i meant they were destroyed, i meant that the emperor hid them and perhaps lead ppl to think they were destroyed.

stillakid
04-09-2003, 08:53 PM
If the library is in the Jedi Temple, my own speculation regarding Episode III is that we will see the Clone Army fly in and lay waste to the entire complex just after some shots of the younglings and the other Jedi Masters who are caught off-guard. So any records housed within those walls will be destroyed. In effect, aside from the two Jedi who escape to see Episode IV, all remnants of the Jedi will be wiped out.

Bel-Cam Jos
04-10-2003, 10:32 AM
In the NJO book (Force heretic: Remnant, I think), Jacen feels a strong sense in the Force and is told he's standing over the former Jedi Temple. So maybe scavengers took some of the files after its destruction.
I think the whole "now Luke knows" is goofy in the NJO stories. You gonna tell us how he does, Lucas Books? Sounds like it's ripe for continuity errors galore! :(

But back to the thread topic. If Luke is as great as Yoda and Ben think, he could pick up on the physical aspects of Jedi-ness quickly. Their hesitation is that he's not mentally ready, so if they show him the moves and try to stress that it's mainly a mind strength, maybe he'll do fine.
Ben: "He has learned the techniques quickly. I told you he was gifted."
Yoda: "But unready for the pain, is he."
Ben: "What's the worst that can happen?"
Yoda: "On my hand can I count the problems."
Ben: "Oh, yeah. Losing a hand or arm. I forgot. Any way I can use my 'certain point of view' excuse on that one?"
Luke: "What're you guys talking about?"
Yoda: "Talk to the hand, we are."
Luke: "Oh. Then I'll leave..."
:rolleyes:

Imperial Monarche
04-10-2003, 12:42 PM
i still hold to the theory that before the emperor destroyed the temple he snuck out a bunch of records reguarding the Jedi's of the past. someone already did that reguarding kamino, so therefore whoever stole those files could easily steal slowly files of the Jedi history and hid them across the galaxy in storehouses, remember Mount Tantiss.

Kidhuman
04-10-2003, 02:29 PM
When talking about the classic trilogy, the EU has nothing to do with them. Mount Tantiss was a hidden base never mentioned in the OT.

Imperial Monarche
04-10-2003, 02:31 PM
yeah....so....