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El Chuxter
04-30-2003, 01:19 PM
I don't know if there's anyone out there still reading this, so this may very well be a nostalgia thread of sorts. I was looking through the new X-Men Encyclopedia and a few comics at the store a few days ago, and some of the events of the past decade (since the death of Colossus and the whole Onslaught debacle caused me to swear to never buy another new X-Men comic) astounded me:

1) Juggernaut is a good guy. Juggernaut! Now I know Magneto is an on-again, off-again baddie and actually led the X-Men for a while, and during the sales-hungry period known as the early 90s, Sabretooth ended up on the team briefly, but isn't Juggernaut some sort of arch-villain?

2) Speaking of bad guys turned good. . . A new title called Weapon X looks basically like Marvel's mutant take on the old DC title Suicide Squad: bad guys doing good things. Members include Sauron (another fellow I never expected to be on the good side of the fence), Wild Child, and (IIRC) Mesmero.

3) In the Encyclopedia, I learned that Psylocke died some time ago. :cry:

4) Wolverine has a full origin now, and the early years don't match at all to the cool tidbits we used to get. (Like his being the son of a chief, kicked out of the tribe because of his short stature and taken in by wolves.)

5) Domino and Strong Guy are not mentioned in the Encyclopedia at all. However, it appears that the rumors of the Multiple Man's demise were greatly exaggerated.

6) Professor X can walk again. . . this week.

7) The name "Cable" never shows up in the Encyclopedia. "Nathan Summers," however, does. Apparently The Artist Formerly Known as Cable is now a Matrix-esque suited guy who works with the X-teams. The more or less disavowal of all things Cable must especially suck for Rob Liefeld. Cable was the only thing he ever created that was worth anything.

James Boba Fettfield
04-30-2003, 01:29 PM
That doesn't sound like the X-Men I remember. Professor X is walking. That's like Superman not flying.

Dr Zoltar
04-30-2003, 01:37 PM
Thanks for the recap, El Chuxter. I haven't picked up an X-Men title since Onslaught as well. The huge gap in continuity really drove me nuts, as well as the fact it took the X-Men 2 years -- 2 YEARS! -- to search for Prof. X after he disappeared. That didn't make much sense. I also used to love Gen X, but the artwork got so poor that I could barely follow the storyline anymore. X-Men and Spiderman were the 2 Marvel titles that really liked to make a story arc last forever with no closure in sight. So I dropped all things Marvel in the 90's and haven't looked back. Well except for the new Captain Marvel and Punisher. Those titles have been pretty solid so far...

Patient Zero
04-30-2003, 01:38 PM
Strange!!! I haven't read any of them since around issue 225 or something. What are they on now?

El Chuxter
04-30-2003, 03:40 PM
I have no clue, Jonna. I think Marvel's "reset" all their titles to #1 about fifteen times in the last decade. I stopped reading shortly after #300, IIRC, and that was about a decade ago.

So you stopped at #225? Arrrgh! You missed Jim Lee's stellar run, as well as the introductions of Jubilee and Bishop, two of my favorites! (On the plus side, you missed everything with that cornball Gambit, too, so it balances out.)

My biggest problem with Onslaught is that it completely screwed up Portacio's original (and obviously hinted at) story that Gambit was (or might become) the traitor who killed the X-Men. The squeezing of fifteen lines of explanation about Professor X going bad into a split second of static from the original tapes Bishop saw in the future--that was as ridiculous as they come. It's about as disrespectful to previous writers as the entire Spider-Clone fiasco (which made me stop reading that title as well).

JBF, I'm pretty sure Professor X was able to walk for a few years in the late 80s and early 90s, when he was off with the Shiar, but that may have been due to alien technology. . . .

Patient Zero
04-30-2003, 03:56 PM
Well I just checked at the official site and it stated that UNCANNY X-MEN is up to #421. So I guess it has been awhile. Is X-factor (I think that is what it was called) still around?

Dr Zoltar
04-30-2003, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by El Chuxter
It's about as disrespectful to previous writers as the entire Spider-Clone fiasco (which made me stop reading that title as well).

I got sucked into the Spidey Clone garbage too. It dragged on for so long that I dumped the title. I think I stopped at the "Trial of Peter Parker." I couldn't stand the Parker clone with long hair and bizarre puffy outfit. The only plus side from having those issues is that an artist that worked on them lives locally so I've gotten him to sign them.

Bel-Cam Jos
04-30-2003, 07:46 PM
I left X-Men after the Inferno/Fall of the Mutants crossovers (I think it was around #250 or so), which was late 80s/early 90s. I was always more of a Spiderman fan, but Wolverine was cool until he became the Ice Cube of comics (first hard core and mysterious, then in sit-coms and comedy films). I left because of the "Get the Limited to Only 7 Trillion Copies Special Edition Bronzed With Play-Dough Cover" period. Ugh.

James Boba Fettfield
04-30-2003, 08:49 PM
So he could walk before. I saw him doing it on the cartoon with Magneto, but I didn't know he had spent some doing it in the comics.
You guys should have stuck through all of that clone mess, there was nothing like seeing Ben get by the Green Goblin. It was a messed up issue, but still, they killed Poochy, I mean Ben Reiley.

Eternal Padawan
05-01-2003, 08:42 AM
Wow. I can't believe we ALL left Marvel at the time of the SpiderClone/Onslaught/Heroes Reborn(renumbering) fiasco.

X-Factor got cancelled didn't it?
And Generation X?
Then they had Mutant X which was Havoc in an alternate dimension, but then he came back and is in a coma and that got cancelled.
X-Force reached 100 issues (much like its predecessor New Mutants) before getting cancelled and turning into a parody X-comic titled X-Statix or something.
Uncanny X-Men is still around.
Jim Lee'sX-Men got renamed New X-Men after a hundred issues or so (when it was no longer new...)
And then There's the third X-Men title Extreme X-Men...

Apparently the cohesiveness of Claremont's work for 16 years has been trampled into chaos in the ensuing years and nothing makes any sense in the books anymore, but it's okay because it won't matter when the next artist/writer takes over in six months.

I tried picking up a few issues here and there and reading them but it just doesn't interest me like when I started. To me, the peak Golden Age of X-Men was from the Mutant Massacre up through Inferno. The X-Men were on their own without Xavier, living in the Australian Outback. The original team was "hunting mutants" and both teams were headed for a confrontation of epic proportions. After that, the glitzy Cable showed up, teams were realigned into a harder edged fighting unit, X-Force, the govt sanctioned X-Factor, etc. The X-Men wandered throught the seige perilous. It was controlled Chaos that was entertaining to look forward to every month wondering "When will it all stop?" Then the Age of Apocalypse happened (which was a cool story) but after they came back, everything seemed....different. It was as if the popularity of the X-Men (cartoons, upcoming movie, etc) had morphed the whole idea of the X-men into a reflection of itself that was designed to appeal to the mass audience that it had created. It seemed flat and prepackaged and it was missing what had made the X-Men cool in the first place. Now the whole thing has been coasting ever since....


Don't even get me started on Spider-man and his clonage. not only was it a lame storyline, it wore out it's welcome and stayed waaaaaaaaay too long. Wasn't it ongoing to two years or more? It was like a marathon of waiting for an excrutiating root canal to be over and the dentist keeps drilling and drilling and drilling....I gave up. I don't even care if the Jackal made Spider-Man or the Green Goblin never really killed Kane or whatever the heck else was going on at the end. Then they killed Aunt May (fine...no problem) and BROUGHT HER BACK. <------Last straw.

I started reading Strazynski's ASM recently and I love the dialogue. Vintage wisecracking. it's like the Spider Clone thing never happened.

Dr Zoltar
05-01-2003, 10:09 AM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
Then they killed Aunt May (fine...no problem) and BROUGHT HER BACK. <------Last straw.


How in the world did they explain that? Clone? She faked her death? Aliens!?!?

El Chuxter
05-01-2003, 01:20 PM
What? Aunt May lives? How?!?

I think the best Aunt May line was from one of the 30th anniversary issues. Something like: "How does it feel to swing above the city, Peter? Oh, come on. How could I not know?"

Eternal Padawan
05-01-2003, 05:01 PM
Yeah. Everybody always knows when the hero finally decides to reveal himself. I'm waiting for the day J. Jonah slips and lets Peter know he's known all along. I mean, he's a freakin' news reporter for petes sake. How could he NOT have figured it out by now?

"Just sellin' papers m'boy. Nothin' personal. Keep up the good work of savin' lives."

Adam
05-04-2003, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
Yeah. Everybody always knows when the hero finally decides to reveal himself. I'm waiting for the day J. Jonah slips and lets Peter know he's known all along. I mean, he's a freakin' news reporter for petes sake. How could he NOT have figured it out by now?

"Just sellin' papers m'boy. Nothin' personal. Keep up the good work of savin' lives."


That, would really, really suck.


I stopped reading X-Men after Onslaught.. although the series was lame, Onslaught: Marvel Universe is my favorite comic of all time. There is this one page I just love. The X-Men all attack Onslaught, and of course get the crap kicked out of them. Then as Prof X sits there in horror, through the mist you see Captain America's sheild, and all of the other heroes there. It's just such an awesome image.


I got back in a year or so later and thrudged through all that Cerebro, and 2nd set of X-Men crap. Dropped it again soon after, but bought a few issues leading up to Magneto's death. Then X-men became New X-Men, and I hated the art, so I didn't pick up any more. I've been kind of interested in picking it up again, but I just don't have the money. I've read a few issues of Ultimate X-men, and I thought it was pretty good... damn you Dreamwave and your TF comics!

Dr Zoltar
05-04-2003, 04:28 AM
Wait, Magneto died?!?! The last story I read was about his clone Joseph -- which was several years ago. When did this happen?

El Chuxter
05-06-2003, 03:33 PM
Last I heard, Magneto had taken over Genosha and set it up as an all-mutant state.

Is it just me, or did the X-Men seem to go off in space to help the Shiar take on the Brood every so often, and either drop off or pick up Professor X in the process? I hated the Shiar. I still do. Lame alien rejects from JLA.

Who would you say are your all-time favorites and least favorites?

Favorite good guys:
Wolverine
Nightcrawler
Storm
Jubilee (basically Boom-Boom done right)
Shadowcat
Colossus
Bishop
Magneto
Archangel (much more interesting than plain-jane Angel)
Beast

Least favorites:
Gambit (overrated)
Havok (always seemed he was useless)
Boom-Boom
Cyclops (hey, look at me! I'm goodie-two-shoes!)
Feral (Wolfsbane done wrong)
Captain Britain (if he technically counts)
Polaris
Psylocke version 2
With the exceptions of Wolvie and Sabertooth, anyone involved in any way, shape, or form with the Weapon X project
Anyone I didn't name from the New Mutants/X-Force (except Cable, Cannonball, Warlock, Wolfsbane, and possibly Majik)

Bel-Cam Jos
05-06-2003, 07:39 PM
Posted by X-Chulter: :p
Who would you say are your all-time favorites and least favorites?

Faves:
Wolverine, bub
Beast (only in blue; wait, was he ever an X-Men in blue, or was that just X-Factor?)
Nightcrawler
Colossus
Cyclops
I prefered Kitty Pride to Shadowcat ;)
Rogue
Psylocke

Non-Faves:
Thunderbird (Hey! Let's intro a character and kill him 2 issues later)
Storm (too moody and brooding)
Angel or Archangel
Forge
Dazzler

Eternal Padawan
05-07-2003, 06:33 AM
Magneto did indeed take over Genosha and set it up as a mutant refuge. Then the Sentinels showed up and blowed EVERYBODY there up real good. Magneto was last seen standing on a balcony, defiantly shaking his fist as an armada of rockets slammed into his building. And since Joe Quesada enacted a "no killing and then bringing people back" rule at Marvel, Mags is toast.

Faves

Wolverine and Havoc, because of the Meltdown series. More mutants should head off to Mexico for binge drinking contests before saving the world from Russian splinter cells.

Nightcrawler. Always a swashbuckling gentleman before. I hear he's found God now or something. meh. whatever.


Non-faves

pansie on again off again X-Men who can't find anything productive to do when they [i]aren't X-Men, but really don't fit into the team concept, so they just guest star when the real team is in trouble.

Banshee
Forge
Sunfire

El Chuxter
05-07-2003, 03:41 PM
Forge was sort of cool, but he definitely falls into the "wasted character" category. He could've been so much more than what he is. (If he's still around; they seem to like to kill off folks lately.)

EP, your mention of Mr Quesada brings something to mind that I've been wondering: how did an artist (admittedly a good one, but an artist nonetheless) with no writing background become editor-in-chief of the biggest comic company? Seriously. And a "no resurrection" rule? I would hope it would be up to the editors' discretion, because to cut them out entirely would spoil some of the fun of comics. You just expect most characters to come back from the dead. ;)

BCJ[III], Beast was blue when he rejoined the X-Men after the original X-Factor disbanded. I don't know for sure about pre-X-Factor.

Is there anyone out there who is currently reading any of the X-books that can offer some insight and maybe answer some answers to our questions about the whereabouts and status of the mutants? I tried the Marvel site, and it's a mess and a half with little info. :eek:

Adam
05-07-2003, 08:50 PM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
Magneto did indeed take over Genosha and set it up as a mutant refuge. Then the Sentinels showed up and blowed EVERYBODY there up real good. Magneto was last seen standing on a balcony, defiantly shaking his fist as an armada of rockets slammed into his building. And since Joe Quesada enacted a "no killing and then bringing people back" rule at Marvel, Mags is toast.


Wait... I thought Wolverine killed Magneto.. I bought that issue specifically because of that event.. don't tell me he lived and was offed by sentinels...

Eternal Padawan
05-07-2003, 09:03 PM
Originally posted by Adam
Wait... I thought Wolverine killed Magneto.. I bought that issue specifically because of that event.. don't tell me he lived and was offed by sentinels...

Hmmmm....maybe. I'm going off what others tell me. I remember Mags "relieving" Wolvie of his Adamantium, then later on Magneto in a coma (or stasis) on Asteroid M with a big long beard, and Colossus leaving the X-Men to join him there, and then Joseph showing up and Gambit making a crack about how he was gonna change his name to Roy (or something) and after that, I quit collecting.

I don't know the story behind Quesada's rise to power. I know Bob Harras got the boot when Joe came in.

You just expect most characters to come back from the dead. I think rampant resurrections was the reason for the policy. Some writer had a character make a comment like "Boy, I can't wait til I die, so I can come back to life later!" Quesada thought it was a funny line, but realized there was a bigger problem at the heart of it and that was no one took deaths in comics seriously anymore and they had lost their gravitas. So he said, "Look. If you're gonna kill somebody off, they're going to have to stay dead from now on."

El Chuxter
05-08-2003, 03:23 PM
Forgive me, Wolvie, for I have strayed. It has been about 3,650 days since my last mutant comic.

Yesterday, I went by the comic shop to pick up Voltron #0 (okay, BTW, but not as good as I had hoped). The new issue of Uncanny X-Men was $0.25! I guess they anticipated a lot of folks like me thinking, "Man, Liefeld and Nicieza screwed up the X-Men titles royally, but that movie reminded me of why I read back in the day. I wonder what my old mutant pals are up to?" So I picked it and the new X-Treme X-Men (a horrible title for a comic, but it's written by Claremont himself), as well as the new Ultimate X-Men at the recommendation of the shop proprietor.

First, Ultimate X-Men is an alternate universe title. I expected little, and little's what I got. Looks like it's in mid-story, shortly after Wolverine tried to murder Cyclops to have Jean to himself. I honestly couldn't take it seriously after that.

X-Treme (ugh, I can't like that title no matter how often I see it) looks like an updated X-Force in that it seems to be a more militant group of X-Men. Thing is, from this excellent stand-alone filler issue, I only know that Storm is the leader (apparently there's some sort of rift between her and Xavier) and Cannonball just joined. I think I'll check out next issue: Claremont's sequel to "God Loves, Man Kills" sounds too good to miss. :D

Now for the first X-Men comic I picked up and the last to comment on, as it affected me emotionally. Uncanny begins with the X-Men (mostly classic characters, though a couple of alumni of Generation-X) finding several mutants crucified and left for dead. Jean can detect no signs of life, and then one of the X-Men (I forget which one) says, "This one looks like Jubilee. . . . Oh my God, Wolverine, it is her!" :cry: I went ten years without reading X-Men, pick up one issue, and they kill my favorite character before the fifth page? :mad:

Luckily, it turned out she was only mostly dead, and Archangel has apparently manifested a power that makes his blood sorta like a chocolate-coated pill from Miracle Max. And so, aside from some nasty injuries through her palms, she survives and dresses like she thinks her name was Dick Grayson instead of Jubilation Lee. (I guess the writer didn't want to tick off me and Logan.) :D:D:D:D


"Like, note to self: Lay off the fireworks until hands heal. Totally ouch, y'know?

Seriously, at a quarter, I'd definitely recommend the new Uncanny. If you don't like it, it cost you less than a candy bar (even if you buy 'em in bulk at Costco).

EP, I agree with you that the rampant deaths and resurrections in Marvel were way overboard. At one point, when a book ended, it seemed they killed the title character just because they knew anyone could bring him or her back at any time. (Is Morbius still dead, BTW?) But I would hope there's some loophole when the reason for resurrecting someone is strong enough for the characters and the plot involved.

Eternal Padawan
05-15-2003, 08:49 PM
Wow! I did the exact same thing today, El Chuxter. I saw the $.25 X-Men on the shelf (and little else) so I grabbed it and the last five issues of Uncanny. Here are my thoughts.

Scott has become a *ick with a capital D. Tearing into poor Kurt like that.

What's up with Havok's outfit? It's like he welded some spare scrap metal to his black skivvies and said VOILA! ARMOR! Looks dumb. Actually whats up with ALL the outfits? Iceman's lavender look with shades is euugh.

The romance/infighting is as rampant as ever. The Warren/Husk/Chamber thing. And the Polaris/Havok/Annie, the school nurse thing. There's probably a Scott/Jean/Logan thing going on in New X-Men.

Why aren't there more X-Men books? We've got Uncanny, New, Xtreme, and Weapon-X. I think there's room for The Astonishing X-Men and The Intrepid X-Men.

And now some questions.

What issue did Generation X end?

X-Factor?

What issue did Magneto die?

Where are Gambit and Rogue?

What happened to the alternate Nathan Summers from Age of Apocalypse? X-Man? And is Cable calling himself Soldier-X these days?

jjreason
05-16-2003, 11:52 AM
Good questions. Want to know what sucks? I'll pretty much go on a limb and GUARANTEE I have every one of the comics those things happen in - but I haven't READ any of the X-Men books since issue 95 of "new" X-Men, when Wolverine was turning into the horseman "Death". I stopped because there was a three issue limited series "Astonishing X-Men" that you needed to read to be up on the story, and I missed an issue. So I stopped reading. It's been 3 years, and I have an entire long box of X-Men, Uncanny and Wolverine back issues to catch up on. Im planning on reading the 25c issue to start, then working my way back. It just gets more and more out of control, to the point where I can't even see myself getting through all of it even if I swore of the internet for a month. Oh well. someday I guess. It's not like I read all of old issues in order either, back issues were super hard to find back in the times.

Oh, Prof X was walking in that great era of Paul Smith art on Uncanny. Maybe my favourite X-artist ever (as weird as that sounds). I also really liked Joe Madureira, but he seems to have fallen out of favour lately due to his chronic inability to produce books on time.

My favourite characters are Wolverine, Professor X and Storm.
I don't like Juggy being a hero, as his hatred for Charles is what fuelled his villainy. I always thought along the same lines for Emma Frost, but she seems to have stuck in her "good girl" role for quite some time now.

Anyone re-read any Byrne era stuff lately? Get your hands on the stories from 126 - 142, it's the best comics have ever been.

El Chuxter
05-16-2003, 01:21 PM
While thumbing through a bunch of reprint paperbacks at Barnes and Noble, I got a few questions answered.

The Professor is walking as a result of the end of "E Is For Extinction," when he comes out of some healing chamber [hey, like I said, I thumbed through 'em, I didn't read 'em] and tells Beast that he no longer needs his wheelchair.

So, as for the new Uncanny: was there something in Generation-X between Jubilee and whichever New-Mutant-Reject-Of-The-Day this Angelo who died must've been? She seems a lot more upset than Husk, and I know just enough about GX to know Husk was on that team, too.

How did these guys end up dead and crucified? There's no cliffhanger in the previous issue.

And will the teams please go back to spandex? Arrrgh!! :mad:

Eternal Padawan
05-16-2003, 03:57 PM
Okay, in a fit of not knowing, I rummaged through some boxes today and found my COMIC BOOK LOG. It's one of those l'il chunky memo books where I have ALL ( and by all I mean most) of my comics written down. I also found some old photos of my daughter when she was two and three years old. She's such a cutie :)...but anyway, according to my records, my last official Uncanny X-Men was #328 and my last X-Men was #45. I'm pretty sure I have a the occasional issue after that because I didn't realized I had stopped collecting and would pick up a comic or two here and there (See my "and by all I mean most" comment above). I seem to remember having an issue where Onslaught punched the Juggernaut and he flew from Canada into upper New York (or vice versa) before feebling whisper "Onslaught is... coming...") And there was an X-Men issue with the X-babies in chinatown somewhere. But I don't have those written down.

What's really cool is how far back my collection goes! I have #46!, Then it jumps to #114 and is spotty up until #178 ( I have runs of two-three issues, then a gap, than an issue, then another gap...) and then from #178 on until #328 is a complete run (excepting #207, which is very bizarre. I don't know why I'm missing that one.)

I agree about the costumes. They just look...clunky.

El Chuxter
05-16-2003, 05:49 PM
I think, occasional spotty storytelling and the impending rise of the great evil known as Fabian Nicieza notwithstanding, the costumes were the best overall at the time of the "Mutant Genesis." Everyone had a unique costume (except X-Factor, and it made sense they were in uniforms) and none looked silly. . . well, except for a certain comic-relief kid sidekick who shall remain nameless, but kid sidekicks are supposed to dress funny.

Remember Storm with the mohawk? Or Psylocke's armor? How about the blue Cyclops suit that kept the goofy skullcap from the original costume? Or Dazzler. . . period? Ugh and double ugh. I guess the new outfits are at least better than those.

Eternal Padawan
05-17-2003, 01:42 PM
Hey, I liked Psylocke's armor. Especially after that frilly purple smock she wore.

Cable (and Leifeld) ushered in what I like to call the "buckles and pouch" era. Everybody had to have harnesses with extra pockets and stuff. Cyclops had a bandolier. (Although Jim Lee could make anything look cool.) Which led into the "bomber jacket" era where everybody was wearing a brown flight jacket with a little X insiginia on the sleeve over their costumes. Funnily enough, that overflowed into the Avengers where everybody (including CAPTAIN AMERICA!!)was wearing a bomber jacket with a little A on the sleeve. There was an Avengers/X-Men crossover in Genosha and there were twenty superheroes and twenty brown leather jackets. That alone made the crossover goofy.

Whatever happened to Exodus? Mr. Sinister? Apocalypse? The Acolytes?

jjreason
05-18-2003, 02:54 AM
Magneto's Acolytes were great. The first Magneto arc in the new book (Claremont's swan song?) was a beauty.

I have X-Men #1.

No, really.
I have every issue of "New" X-Men, X-Men Unlimited (where some very pivotal plot developments have happened) and a run of Uncanny starting at GS#1 (first app Kurt, Storm, etc) and #94 to the present day.
No kidding.

I have a few other 12c issues, but no major runs. I don't like the old Xmen as much as the old FF or Amazing Spidey books, so I usually don't actively seek them out. All in good time I guess.

Im in that tough spot right now where what I buy far outweighs what I have time (or enough burning desire) to read. X-Men, unfortunately, has fallen to the bottom of the list simply because of how much I've missed. This thread has helped me rekindle the interest though, you guys have good memories for the storyline.

Hasbro'sBountyHunter
05-18-2003, 05:21 PM
When it came to comics, I only bought X-Men related ones. I've got all the Fatal Attractions comics as well as X-Men #30 (Cyclops and Jean wedding issue), Wolverine #100, Generation-X #1, and X-Men Omega. All my other 200+ X-Men comics are in pretty horrible condition, because I never knew how to take care of comics. I stopped getting comics around the time of Onslaught. My favorite storyline would have to be the Phalanx Covenant. I actually liked the fact that Sabertooth was a good guy in that story.

jjreason
05-19-2003, 03:16 AM
Someone above (pardon me for not looking) mentioned that Wolverine was given a "true" origin. Well, there was a 6 issue Origin limited series, and it did fill in a few blanks. The good news is that it didn't do anything to dispell any of the other historical Wolvie stories we've been treated to. It deals with a well to do young man discovering his claws in an accident. He then leaves his family with a beautiful red haired woman and grows up a little in the Canadian Northwest. It's beautifully painted, and so poignantly written (particulary issues 1 and 2) that I can't recommend it strongly enough. Should definitely be available in TPB form by now, and would be well, well worth the money. For all the fanfare and hype it was released under, the first couple of issues really lived up to it. Check it out!

El Chuxter
05-19-2003, 02:24 PM
EP, I was referring to the armor she's supposed to have worn under the smock. There were a couple of references to her being a pansy and afraid of being injured before dumb ol' Mandarin got ahold of her. The armor she briefly wore under his command, though. . . YOWZA!!

I recall, not too fondly, the age of buckles. It was annoying how the buckles never actually seem to go to anything! Equally annoying was the age of banded arm armor. Cable started it, and I don't Liefeld was able to draw anyone without it.

Doesn't the Wolverine origin story dispute the story he tells waaaaay back in Wolverine #25 (or thereabouts) where he was the son of a Native chief, kicked out due to his small stature and taken in by wolves?

What's with the Magneto clone? When he led the X-Men, was that a clone? Way to spit in Claremont's eye, Scott "No-Talent" Lobdell and Fabian "I Made A Lot Of Folks Stop Reading Marvel" Nicieza. :mad:

Oh, and, uh, I looked at the number of X-Men comics I've picked up in the past couple of weeks: the last two Uncannies, the last two X-Tremes, and the last five News. I think it's safe to say I've fallen off the wagon. Given that most of them aren't worth the paper they're printed on, I might go back and pick up the issues I missed. X-Treme X-Men and New X-Men by Claremont and Grant Morrison, respectively, are highly recommended.

Also, the Legend of Wolverine DVD that came out recently is worth picking up for an interview with Claremont and commentaries on four episodes by Claremont, too! (They're listed on the packaging as "Power of the X," which I would think is a commentary, wouldn't you? :rolleyes:

jjreason
05-19-2003, 02:55 PM
I've never seen that DVD??? Where did you find that? Is it movie related or animated series or comic? All 3? Wow, I need to check Future shop more often.

How old was the young Logan to have been in #25? For whatever reason Im missing a number of issues between 25 or so and 50, and haven't read that story. If he's 18 or so; no. The Origin story deals with him at an (apparent) age of around 12 to 16 or 17 I would estimate.

I wasn't completely thrilled that they decided he had been born with bone claws - I always found that hokey. I liked imagining the horror of him popping the adamantium ones for the first time - wretching, in pain, horrified but unable to look away the same as someone pulling a thorn out of their finger after it's festered for a week or so. Gnarly.

El Chuxter
05-19-2003, 03:31 PM
The Legend of Wolverine is five episodes of the 90s series released about a month ago by Buena Vista. (One of the episodes is a "bonus episode" included in the bonus features.) The first two are the two-parter with Lady Deathstrike, and the third is the Nightcrawler episode. I can't remember off the top of my head what the fourth and fifth are (since I just picked it up yesterday). The interview is one of the typical "Buena Vista interviews with the author, where you can tell it's super-condensed from a bigger and better interview" and runs about ten minutes. Claremont makes some allusions to being unhappy with the way the X-Men titles were going about ten years ago when he was more or less forced out, but nothing too scathing.

The commentaries are mostly factual, but a little bit of what goes through Claremont's head when writing the X-Men comes out. I haven't listened to any of them in full yet.

In the story I'm referring to, young Logan would've been around 7-10. Old enough to talk and make decisions, but still pretty young. Of course, it's a story Logan tells to someone else, so it might not be an origin, but I always liked it as such.

The bone claws are, unfortunately, not new. When Magneto, under pressure from stupid editors and writers, pulled Wolvie's adamantium out, he shortly afterwards was shocked to find bone claws. (The removal of the adamantium somehow must've taken out the little rubber plugs that keep the blades from slicing up his hands, since the bone claws were always bloody when extended.) Prior to that, there's a throwaway line in Barry Windsor-Smith's excellent "Weapon X" storyline where one of the scientists is (IIRC) inspired to give him metal claws after finding the bone claws in his x-rays.

Eternal Padawan
05-19-2003, 05:32 PM
I just scored about the last years worth of Uncanny. Good reading. I loved Juggernaut and Sammy the fish kid rating all the X-Hotties at the mansion. And Warren and Paige sharing a tender moment with the video of Stacy playing in the background.

"That was the most beautiful thing anyone has ever said to me. I'd kiss you right now if I didn't want our first kiss to have the image of Stacy jump roping nude in the background."

"I understand."

I was going to snag the New X-Men issues, but it looks like "Murder at the Mansion" issues are all gone. The most recent ones I can find are the "Riot at Xavier's" Great. Now I have to hunt...

El Chuxter
05-19-2003, 05:47 PM
Check Waldenbooks for the Murder at the Mansion issues. The local Waldens had one copy of part one to Murder at the Mansion, and a gazillion part twos. If you can find them, though, I'd say (despite a title that makes "X-Force" sound good) X-Treme X-Men is probably the best of the three titles right now, though not by much.

jjreason
05-20-2003, 03:00 AM
Thanks for the info El Chux. I knew about Wolvie popping the bone claws after Mags pulled out the Adamantium, I had just kind of hoped they would go back and edit that out a la the death of Aunt May. I actually liked that storyline, but the bone claws always freaked me out - like what if he broke one off? Wolverine can heal quickly, but I don't know that he can regenerate parts that he loses. I took them way too long to put the adamantium back in too - all the way to Wolverine 100.

Half of this stuff I see the same way as Greedo shooting first - I have specific ideas about what happened, or the way things ought to be, that won't get changed by one or two wacky storylines.

jjreason
05-20-2003, 12:54 PM
Sorry to double post, and sorry for the length of this one. Key points in blue, the rest is drivel and opinion.

I just checked a resource I use periodically www.mycomicshop.com

to see for EP what issue xfactor crapped out at. Astonishly enough, they ended it at issue 149, which I believe was around the time in 1998 Mystique was gunning for the Senator Kelly. Ill have to look and see if I even have this book - I'd given up on X-Factor some time before that. The whole "give a book to a rebellious, militant group of mutants" thing never worked for me, I liked Walt and Louise Simonson's ideas at the beginning: Arcangel and Apocalypse, but little else from that book. I was always choked they brought Jean back just for that.

Edit: Generation X made it all the way to issue 75. This book looked like it had legs, Chamber, Husk, Emma Frost, beautiful (like REALLY beautiful) art by Chris Bachalo and Mark Buckingham made this great. I guess it's deja vu all over again, books about the young uns in development always turf out when they grow up and join the main teams.

I just read the issue where Colossus kicks off: Uncanny 390. I also read the issues before and after to give myself some pre and post.

"Dream's End" (4 part crossover) Uncanny 388, XMen 108 - Mystique via Blob and the Brotherhood takes another crack at Presidential Candidate Kelly, Moira has discovered the Legacy Cure. Some how between these issues (Cable 87 apparently) Muir Island gets toasted, and Rogue is wounded by Mystique, as is Moira - mortally. Xavier travels in astral form to bond with the dying Moira, preserving her Legacy breakthrough. Kelly gets killed by a human zealot after doing a 180 on his mutant views when Cable (his bodyguard apparently) is away in astral form trying to help Xavier. Rogue is having a lot of trouble dealing with her powers after absorbing a metamorphic alien somewhere in the Maximum Security storyline, which was Marvel-wide.

389 - Xavier dealing with the passing of Moira. Written nicely by Claremont, offers up a little more background about the good professor and his meeting Moira, the start of their relationship, her funeral and Senator Kelly's.

390 - Beast figures out Moira's solution, but Cecelia Reyes realizes it will have to be injected into a "victim" whom it will kill prior to releasing the cure (the cure works the same way as the virus, which needed a living host to die for it to work). Colossus can't resist out of memory to his sister, so he injects himself and dies, completing the formation of the Legacy cure. Written by Scott Lobdell, it was pretty emotional.

391 - Scott meets with his dad Christopher Summers (from the Starjammers) and confronts him about why he never came back to check on him and Alex after throwing them out of the crashing plane. Nice stand alone issue, not much fallout fromt the Colossus death being dealt with here though. Lobdell.

X-Men 109/110

Next, Im going to read the 5 issue Uncanny and New XMen crossover "Eve of Destruction" which carries on the story and deals with Magneto, I'll post a blurb in here when I'm done.

Did anyone here have the issue of X-Force where Cannonball gets called up? It's written like a letter to his mom, and is one of the best X-Family books I've ever read. Again, I'll have to dig it up and post the issue number. Well worth picking up.

Eternal Padawan
05-20-2003, 04:13 PM
Is that issue with Cyclops and his father have them camping or something? And they forget matches and Chris asks his son if he can't ...y'know...just zap the wood? And Scott goes off on him about how its a concussive force, not heat. I almost bought that one for some reason. I was jonesing for a comic fix a few years ago and flipped through that one, but nothing really happened so I didn't get it.

I thought Illyana's death issue was very moving. She was one of the very first victim's of the legacy virus.

My last Generation X was issue 9. My last X-Factor was 116.

jjreason
05-20-2003, 04:22 PM
Man, you hung with X Factor for a long time!!!! I think I stopped getting it myself around 60, then picked it up again much later (after Age of Apocalypse, when I was buying everything X).

This almost warrants trying to come up with every ongoing Xtitle ever started, and seeing where they died - just to prove to whoever stops by to read this that they're better off focusing their talents on 2 or 3 main books, and Wolverine's solo series. Everything else falls way short, and spreads the characters and creators too thin. Someone once told me he needed a scorecard to keep track of who was where and what was going on in the X corner of the Marvel Universe - it shouldn't be that convoluted. Too scary for new readers.

Edited: EP, check up two posts for a couple of answers about "which issue", and yes they were camping. -jjr

Eternal Padawan
05-21-2003, 06:51 PM
Would Alpha Flight be considered an X-book? They started in X-Men. And Defenders was 40% X-Men when Beast and Iceman were in their ranks. And tons of the X-Men regulars have graced the Avengers like Quicksilver and Beast (again)

There's Uncanny X-Men, New Mutants, X-Factor, Wolverine, Excalibur, X-Force, (New) X-Men, Cable, X-Men Unlimited, Generation X, X-Man, Gambit, Mutant X, Exiles, Weapon X, Xtreme X-Men, X-Statix, and Ultimate X-Men (although that one wouldn't give you a continuity headache.) Did I forget anything? X-Men 2099?

Then there's been innumerable limited series like X-Terminators, Astonishing X-Men, Amazing X-Men, and the Adventures of Cyclops and Pheonix and just about every X-Man has gotten their own limited series or two. Did I miss anything?

And of course, the reprint comics, or the ones that "attempt" to go back and put band-aids on continuity, X-Men Classics, X-Men: The Early Years, etc. I know I forgot some of those...

I just picked up a bunch of (New) X-Men comics and also the X-treme X-Men issue El Chuxter mentioned. Is Wolverine on ALL the X-teams? They just march him out there for the consumers don't they? He's their little poster bit...boy.

jjreason
05-22-2003, 12:12 AM
Maverick and Quicksilver had their own (shortlived) ongoing series, as did Deadpool.
John Byrne's "X-Men: the Hidden Years" attempted to bridge the gap between 66 and GS1, with little to none of the lustre he put on the book in the late 70's.
Then there's the whole Malibu comics "Exiles" continuity rift that happened when Juggernaut crossed over into their books upon the death (Marvel takeover) of that company back in 96 or so. Man that sucked.

To me, Alpha Flight is important only until issue 24 (or thereabouts, when Byrne kicked off). #12, the issue Vindicator dies in is one of my great comic rememberances as a kid. Pure and utter shock, even though it's so obvious what was coming upon reading it nowadays. Great, great art in the early Alpha issues.

Eternal Padawan
05-22-2003, 08:01 AM
So...Wolverine was Weapon'Ten'? Not Weapon X? Man, that's just dumb. And there's an X-Corporation?? What does that do exactly? To make money I mean. And when was it started?

What happened to Trevor Fitzroy? The Strucker Twins? I remember all these dangling plot threads concerning various villains and now the X-Men don't seem to fight anybody.

Deadpool is now 'Agent X' and Cable is now 'Soldier X', according to an order form in the back of the book. I stopped Cable at #26. I have no idea if they renumbered the series when they renamed it Soldier-X. Same goes for Deadpool. I only got his first two limited series.

My head is starting to hurt already...

El Chuxter
05-22-2003, 12:26 PM
I looked at the first page of the new Soldier X. Looks like when Cable killed Apocalypse or something like that, the timestream changed so the Askani weren't perpetually at war, and this resulted in the grown-up Nathan Summers not being a big nasty merc cyborg anymore. Or something like that.

I'm really liking New X-Men, though the public knowledge of mutants and the complete backlash against spandex is taking some getting used to.

The new Wolverine series (why it reset to #1 this week, I dunno) is excellent, but completely unlike the previous series. It's hard-boiled, more like what you might expect of Punisher. And a whole first issue without a single claw being extended. The only thing that could make this perfect is to (and I'm not being lighthearted here) seeing Jubilation in the next issue in a cameo, with Logan saying, "I'm glad the X-Men found you. There's no telling how you might've turned out."

Sounds like with Soldier X and Agent X, there's (in addition to an abundance of ridiculous uses of "X" in titles that makes the early 90s look tame by comparison) a rush to eliminate all traces of Rob Liefeld. Those two were his only worthwhile contributions to the Marvel Universe. Although if anyone can tell me how someone mopped up that huge mess he created with the Externals and Cannonball being basically a knockoff of the Highlander, I can't wait to hear it.

El Chuxter
05-22-2003, 03:46 PM
Okay, one that I think you may have missed, EP, is Bishop, which I believe was an ongoing series. As was the case with Havok, Bishop suddenly found himself thrown into a dark alternate reality for a bit. Between that, Mutant X (or whatever Havok's series was called), the Age of Apocalypse, and the horrid Spider-Man Unlimited TV show, someone at Marvel was obsessed with that concept a few years ago.

There's also X-51, a mercifully short-lived update of the old Machine Man series. I'd include it as an X-Men title because he was updated somehow with Sentinel technology and, whenever he came near a mutant, he was unable to control his Sentinel components and went into kill mode. Of course, this left itself wide open for all sorts of fun X-Men guest stars, which occupied most of the few issues this POS lasted.

I think the X-Corporation is just a name used to refer to a worldwide network of X-teams that aren't cool enough to get their own titles or even names. (Would you buy a book about Feral and Warpath? I didn't think so.) But what baffles me is the "X-Factory Store" that's referred to just prior to "Riot at Xavier's." And a fashion designer who specializes in tentacle wear? And a "Mutant Town" district of NYC?

Where did all these stinkin' mutants come from? Man, I thought there were getting to be too many a few years ago. So, in comic time, we have Apocalypse, Mr Sinister, Wolverine, Magneto, Xavier, and (if their ridiculous tale wasn't completely nullified) a few Externals as the only mutants prior to, um, let's say the mid-to-late 80s. Then we get the first team of X-Men and a handful of villains. A couple of years later, we meet up with the "all-new X-Men" and they have a few years of adventures. Kitty Pryde probably joined around 1992, let's say, at the age of 12 (?), and the New Mutants were probably founded around 1993 or 1994. There still aren't exactly throngs of mutants, and let's say the Morlocks were wiped out around 1996. The X-Men lived in the Outback for a while and, by my best guess, returned to the mansion in early 1998, shortly before they rejoined X-Factor and Cable took his little New Mutants and left to play on his own. This would put Generation X's founding in 1999 or early 2000 (well after the term was out of vogue). Mutants seem to be numbering in the hundreds, or possibly thousands, by this point. Wolvie's adamantium was restored and Magneto took over Genosha in 2001. Grant Morrison explicitly writes that the "Magneto memorial" issue of New X-Men is one year after the destruction of Genosha, which would therefore be in early-to-mid 2002. This timeline would put Cannonball around 23 and Cyclops around 33 at the present, which sounds about right.

Sooooo. . . . This means that within two years, the number skyrockets from the low thousands (being generous) to such an enormous number that 16 million can be killed off at once, still leaving enough for "mutant towns" in at least one major city and the legions of heroes and villains who don't seem to care about fighting one another anymore. Dang. Given that kind of exponential population explosion, they'll not only take over the world in a year or two, they'll need the rest of the solar system by 2010!

Imagine the shell-shock these guys must be experiencing, having non-stop battles for 15 years, and then almost 2 years of no super-villain fights.

Of course, this timeline is pretty glitchy when broken down. Jubilee (hey, you saw this coming, didn't ya?) joined the X-Men in 1997 at the approximate age of 12, which would make her about 14 or 15 when she joins Generation X and 18 now. And yet she seems to still be a smartalecky kid. Worse (and really rather disturbing) is that Cannonball's little sister, Husk, appears (at least by my recollection) to be younger than Jubilee, around 12, when Generation X is formed. So she's now 16, maybe 17. And yet she's got a little something-something going on with Archangel. Call in Bishop. This guy needs to go to jail! :)

You thought your head hurt before?

Eternal Padawan
05-22-2003, 06:50 PM
Yeah, I want a super arch villain to show up and all the X-Men are like "Dang. We forgot how to fight evil mutants and save the world..." and then he mops the floor with them.

And when Warpath and Feral showed up in costume, it made the most sense out of all the X-comics I've read in the past couple of weeks! You're super-heroes! Start acting like it! Your supposed to wear spandex and stuff!

jjreason
05-23-2003, 01:11 AM
The success of the first movie has left an amazing mark on the printed matter. It's like watching the cast from "Fast and Furious" start shooting eye beams and lightening bolts at each other.

At least that wouldn't have sucked.

El Chuxter
05-23-2003, 01:19 PM
I don't mind the uniforms per se, but everyone in all the teams suddenly not only getting rid of spandex but taking every available opportunity to talk badly of it? That's a bit much. Especially when every other hero wears it. I wonder if the new uniforms are made of unstable molecules?

By my last check, these were the only currently active X-Men not in the uniforms (which need a bit of a redesign):
The X-Treme X-Men (for some reason, they split with Xavier, though I've not been able to find out how yet): Storm, Bishop, Sage, Cannonball)
Warpath, Feral, and Thorrrrnnnn (whoever she is)
Havok (wearing the uniform with some serious hardware attached)
Iceman (again, the uniform with customization)
White Queen (because there always has to be one scantilly-clad bimbo for the fanboys)
Jubilee (well, duh, it doesn't match the giant pink shades)
Archangel (IIRC, he's still in the red spandex)
the new New Mutants (if the cover isn't a flashback, they're in the classic yellow and black X-Men tights)

I've noticed two characters who aren't my favorites but who are conspicuous in their absence: Gambit and Rogue. Where are they? And how did Psylocke die? :cry: And what's ol' Forge up to lately?

jjreason
05-23-2003, 03:24 PM
I think Rogue is having trouble with her powers, after absorbing the abilities of a shape changing Alien in Maximum Security she's suffering from schizophrnia like symptoms. Wolverine had to hunt her down on the School grounds in one of the last issues (#?) I read - mind you I'm still way behind.

Eternal Padawan
05-23-2003, 04:42 PM
Still waiting on the Genosha Holocaust issue number oh loremeister jj. Start reading! ;)

Thorrnnnn is Feral's sister(?) from X-Force. She was a morlock or something I think...I had to think back to who she was, as well.

X-Corp, as I'm now reading it (flipping thru old books) is something Banshee started.

Why did they restart Wolverine at #1? I'm not buying it, but it just seems strange.

And whats this New Mutants #1? The student books never last... (plus there is no X in the title and I think that violates a Marvel Mutant ordinance or something...)

El Chuxter
05-23-2003, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
And whats this New Mutants #1? The student books never last... (plus there is no X in the title and I think that violates a Marvel Mutant ordinance or something...)

I think it's because they've used all the possible names except for X-Crement. ;)

I'm 99% sure the Genoshan holocaust takes place in chapter 2 of "E Is For Extinction," somewhere around New X-Men #115 or so.

Both New Mutants and Wolverine #1 are X-cellent, but I'm in serious danger of getting hooked on too many comics again. My spending a decade ago easily rivaled yours, EP.

BTW, if you're reading the Uncanny issues where Banshee starts up X-Corporation, can you verify something I read, either online or in the X-Men Encyclopedia, that Jubilee now works for the Freedom branch of X-Corp. And if so, why is she (and the rest of Generation X, for that matter, who are all losers, BTW) suddenly at the mansion in the new Uncanny?

Hasbro'sBountyHunter
05-23-2003, 08:48 PM
There was also X-Men Annual...

Eternal Padawan
05-23-2003, 09:13 PM
Don't know how Jubilee got from X-Corp to Crucifi-X...I think that'll probably be explained "next issue"..

I basically got every issue from 400 up now ( a hole here and there but...) and basically the X-Corp is a police coalition Banshee started using his former students (Gen X) as well as some other Muties like MultipleMan and Sunfire's sister (who ends up dying during the storyline). This explains Warpath and Feral hanging out in that hotbed of mutant activity, uhhhh....whereever. He also had Jason Wyngarde's daughter in a stasis field and was using her to control a bunch of evil mutants for his cause, like Blob, Avalanche, etc. Then Mystique comes in and messes everything up, slashes Banshee through the throat ( as in "in the back of the neck, out the front"....euuch), and makes off with Wyngarde's daughter. Avalanche escapes, but Blob gets snagged by Husk and Jubilee (I'm assuming it was Jubes, she wasn't dressed like Robin) and Stacy-X (The X-Men's resident prostitute...this is NOT your father's X-Men). But before that happens, Paris gets wasted and the Eiffel Tower falls down goes boom. This all happened in UXM 401-406. After that, Jubilee doesn't show until the newest issue.

jjreason
05-24-2003, 08:34 PM
Im all over it, EP....

It looks like Magneto is the star of the "Eve of Destruction" story which Im about to read on next days off. I'll give you a rundown.

Eternal Padawan
05-25-2003, 03:27 PM
Yeah, New Mutants (Not The New Mutants; I was expecting to see Vol. II at the bottom of the page...) was okay, but I think they have enough random student mutants floating around, that they didn't have to introduce Wind-Girl.

Whatever happened to Artie and Leech? They were doing some serious character development waaay back in X-Factor with those two, Rusty, Skids, etc Then Rusty gotten eaten by ol' whatsisname, Skids went catatonic and I've not seen or heard from the little guys in awhile.

They start these new books with all these characters, then when they get cancelled you have to make up lame X-Corp teams to explain what the students are up to.

Anybody pick up the Shadowcat-heavy Mecanix limited series? Just a ploy to get us to buy yet another X-Book? I skipped it because I just can't afford it.

PS, jj El Chuxter said Genosha was decimated in (New) X-Men #116, the second part of E is for Extinction. I found that issue. Harrowing stuff. Even better was when Cyclops killed Ugly John at point blank range to put him out of his misery. "Look into my eyes." Whoa.

jjreason
05-25-2003, 11:24 PM
E for Extinction starts up right after Eve of Destruction. Problem is, every time I read I want to go back instead of forward, for explanations of what the heck's going on. Based on the reviews, it sounds like the good stuff is happening in Morrison's X-Men as opposed to Uncanny. Based on the covers, it looks like fewer crossovers are happening between the books as well.

Is X-treme Xmen inside the Uncanny continuity? When the book was first advertised, it was under the auspice that Claremont would have the book to do with as he pleased - continuity be damned. Has anyone read it from #1? I only have a very few issues, and haven't read any of it (not a huge Bishop fan, and he's on every cover it seems).

Ketchup

XMen 109 - stupid Christmas filler "100pg Monster" issue. The reprints included were 10x the book this was. Nothing to see here.

XMen 110 - better, dealt with Kitty taking Pete's ashes back to the Russian farm, nicely written as a letter to Prof X telling him she's leaving the team to go back to school. At the end Xavier erases(??) all her data from the computer. The Epilogue shows Mags barging in on a small group of "radical" muties I didn't recognize and telling them to get ready to follow him into war. They don't listen, and try to attack him so he kills 2 of them. Rock. The other one kneels at his feet. This issue was a good read.

Eternal Padawan
05-26-2003, 10:29 AM
Somebody brought up the variant covers to X-Men #1.

I have 7 As, 5 Bs, 4 Cs, 6 Ds, and 7 Es. It's the same reason I have 14 X-Force #1s and 9 Cable #1s. And my comic guy has them all in his 25 cent bins...

jjreason
05-26-2003, 04:19 PM
The print run on those was a little *ahem* large. Biggest selling book in history apparently - and worth every penny of that cover price. Not a penny more, mind you, but every penny nonetheless.

Here's the dilly on "Eve of Destruction", a 5 part story by Scott Lobdell and Lenil Yu / Tom Raney (awesome artist there, boy).

X-Men 111 - prelude, Trish Tilby reporting from Genosha that in the wake of Colossus curing all victims of the Legacy virus, the mutate slaves have all assembled under Magneto, and are amassing to go to war against humanity. At the end, Prox X gets kidnapped from the mansion (by who?).

Uncanny 392 - The heavy hitters are gone looking for Destiny's 13 volumes of her visions of the future, so Jean has no choice but to recruit a ragtag bunch of muties to act as her X-Men. Northstar, Sunfire's sister (Sunpyre), Wraith (powers unknown as of yet), Dazzler (back from Mojoworld where Longshot may have been killed), one former Acolyte (and former representative of Genosha - Johanna somethinorother) and some Italian wannabe gangster with invincibility are all she can muster up. Not looking good.

X-Men 112 - Scott and Logan infiltrate the Genoshan sewer system and run into Polaris. They save a group of human Genoshan refugees who are fleeing to Wakanda. Magneto's apparent aide (and former lover of Xavier) Amelia Voght, is shown behind the scenes sitting on the fence as to what side she will be on for the upcoming war.

Uncanny 393 - The ragtag X-Men get sucked into Magna square, right in the middle of the amassing mutate army by Mags. Professor X is crucified in the middle of the arena, with his mind turned off by Magneto. Daz freaks and tries to blast Maggie with her light power. Mags then turns Daz into a pile of ashes by reflecting her light back at her. Scary.

X-Men 113 - the grand finale. Mags goes at it with the rookie X-Men, who don't really hang in there too great. Scott and Logan to the rescue, of course. Turns out Daz ain't dead, as Jeannie was using her powers to render Magneto's invalid, as well as to distract him while Prox X was freed. Finally, Wolvie guts Mags. At the end, the new recruits and Dazzler leave, not interested in staying with the team. That leaves Scott, Jean, Logan and the good Professor to head out for a drink.

Lobdell writes the X-Men pretty well. This was obviously a filler bridge between Claremont and Casey/Morrison, but it wasn't too bad. Lenil Francis Yu ain't my favourite on X-Men, and that's all I'll say about that.

Next: Casey on Uncanny and Morrison on "New". We've got the lowdown on E for Extinction from EP, so I'll focus on Uncanny up to #400.

The Overlord Returns
05-26-2003, 05:04 PM
SPOILER>>>>>>>>>>


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Just so everyone knows....in "E" we see what we think is a





wheelchair bound Magneto in a hospital room on Genosha looking up as a massive sentinel is about to lay waste to the building.....and it does...

So...presumably...Mags is dead.

Eternal Padawan
05-27-2003, 08:03 AM
Until they decide to bring him back...He'll show up and say something like "One of my Acolytes' father worked as my janitor until his arthritis got the best of him and he had to use a wheelchair. His name was Roy and he liked to sit in my citadel and watch the seagulls. Occasionally we would chat about the Cubs or how television was going down the tubes with all the reality shows. Well, one day, I had to go to the Savage Land on business and he asked if it would be all right if he went up to the Citadel to watch the seagulls and I saod fine. Turns out it was the same day as the Sentinal attack. Poor Roy...Anyway, I've been in hiding ever since."

;)

El Chuxter
05-27-2003, 11:42 AM
So Dazzler's dead? I think we need a moment of silence.

Or a moment of cheering!!

Still, think of poor Shatterstar, losing his goofy mommy like that. :cry:

But seriously, did Mags go completely nuts in the last few years or what?

What did happen to Artie and Leech? Or stupid old Wizkid? C'mon, the guy was all set to be the next Forge!

The Overlord Returns
05-27-2003, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
Until they decide to bring him back...He'll show up and say something like "One of my Acolytes' father worked as my janitor until his arthritis got the best of him and he had to use a wheelchair. His name was Roy and he liked to sit in my citadel and watch the seagulls. Occasionally we would chat about the Cubs or how television was going down the tubes with all the reality shows. Well, one day, I had to go to the Savage Land on business and he asked if it would be all right if he went up to the Citadel to watch the seagulls and I saod fine. Turns out it was the same day as the Sentinal attack. Poor Roy...Anyway, I've been in hiding ever since."

;)

Sadly you are most likely correct. After Morrisons run, a lesser talent will get his claws on the book, and, having no original ideas, will throw the x men back into their tired costumes and ressurect Magneto for a big "brawl"......:rolleyes:

jjreason
05-27-2003, 01:17 PM
Originally posted by El Chuxter
So Dazzler's dead? I think we need a moment of silence.

Or a moment of cheering!!



Ooops, I may have erred. Dazzler's death was also part of Jeannie influencing Mag's psyche - she was never really toasted. She marched out of the mansion with her bag same as the other nobodies Lobdell introduced, ignoring Xavier's willingness to help with her Mojoworld issues. Oh well, I guess she'll be back again to look hot in her nice blue off the shoulder spandex some other time.

El Chuxter
05-27-2003, 01:22 PM
Ah. Was Lobdell around right up until Morrison took over, then?

I think it would be the mark of a great writer to take several uber-lame characters like Dazzler and mold them into a best-selling team.

The X-Crements:
Dazzler
Beak
Feral
Shatterstar
Warpath
Boom-Boom
Siryn
Domino

Hey, minus Dazzler and Beak, wasn't that a bestselling book about ten years ago and with no writer at all? ;)

If there'd been any writing talent in the past decade, think of the great character development there could've been between Dazzler, Longshot, and growed-up Shatterstar. Same goes for Jean, Scott, Rachel, and Cable, whose relationship didn't get nearly the development it should've. Ahh, missed opportunities.

jjreason
05-28-2003, 02:50 PM
Yeah, we could use an Art Adams visit to Mojoworld, to see the Xbabies grown up (apparently they started wreaking havoc there when they were cast in an "Age of Apocalypse" pilot that went awry, that's according to those Eve of Destruction issues I just read). Art Adams drawing the X-Babies was funny stuff (ann. 9 or 10 I think?). Maybe a 4 issue "Mojoworld" by Art himself, to deal with Longshot, Daz and the Xbabies once and for all. I know, I'll go write it right now and sell it to Marvel for ONE MILLLLLION DOLLARS MUHAHAHAHAHAH.....MUHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!! :D

Scotty Don't. :)

Eternal Padawan
05-28-2003, 05:52 PM
I always thought an ongoing X-Babies book set in Mojoworld would sell like hotcakes. ;)

As for Magneto returning, I've was thinking how absurd it was that certain villains always fight certain heroes. Like the Master of the World is always foiled by Alpha Flight. And Captain America always stumbles onto the RedSkulls nefariousness. I bet the X-Men could spend the next five years and never fight the same villain twice.

I'd always like to see the X-Men switching costumes all the time. Each one has about a half dozen costume changes. Have them mixing it up all the time.

jjreason
05-28-2003, 11:39 PM
Especially Storm, Psylocke and Emma Frost. Mrrrrrrrow........ :D

Great Uniforms we seldom get to see any more:

Jean's "Marvel Girl" bit with the short green dress and "Electro" style eye piece. Wow.

Wolvie in the Brown and Gold, a la Byrne's X-Men, DD 196, and Frank Miller's 4 part Wolvie Ltd. series. Rock.

Spidey in Black (although I love the whole Symbiote/Venom concept with the black costume, I loved it on Spidey. Wicked.)

Spidey in the Silver Armor donated by Tony Stark...... :eek:

El Chuxter
05-29-2003, 01:13 PM
Remember when Iron Fist starred in a story in Marvel Comics Presents and got a new costume that was supposedly going to be featured in a new series that didn't happen? And when an Iron Fist series finally came out, he was back in the old duds? No biggie, since the original costume looked better.

Two great costumes we'll never see again:
1) Dazzler in roller skates
2) Power Man with the open shirt and gigantenormous 'fro

I got my copy of Wolverine: Origin in the mail yesterday and read it last night. Awesome, awesome, awesome. I'm starting a separate thread on it, since there's some serious spoilers I want to ask fellow fans who've read it about. Eternal Padawan, your punishment for not initially listing Wildman in the artists/writers thread will be to read this ASAP. :p

I've not read the new Uncanny, but here's some issues with the crucifixions that I doubt will ever be addressed:

1) These guys were supposedly dead on crosses, and were resurrected.

2) They were resurrected by a huge blood transfusion from mutant resembling the traditional image of an angel.

2a) What are the scientific ramifications of a massive blood transfusion from a mutant with a different mutant power than oneself, most notably a healing factor?

3) One of the crucified characters shares a name with an apocryphal Old Testament book that retells Genesis and Exodus with many appearances by angels. . . and with a Hebrew tradition detailed in Leviticus about returning to one's family, among other things. (For a hint on which X-Man, think "What's the only one of the crucified X-Men El Chuxter gives a rat's about?")

4) The X-Man mentioned in #3 rescued Wolverine from crucifixion years ago.

And yet, even though the name of the story's "Holy War," I doubt we see anything beyond the obvious. The guy writing's good, but I'll be surprised if he can pick up on some of the more obvious symbolism he's thrown out.

Eternal Padawan
05-29-2003, 02:08 PM
I bought Origin a few months ago. Right about the time I started getting G.I.Joe and Batman. It beckoned to me (and a guy I worked with said it was a great read.) Start your Thread, I'll be there...

El Chuxter
05-30-2003, 01:17 PM
What is with Wolverine? He's not in as many silly guest appearances as ten years ago, but at least back then he wasn't on every single X-Team. This month, he's somewhere in the northwest with Storm, at the Mansion, in Montana, and in a big city that I guess is New York. Jeez. The guy must be using the frequent flyer miles he earned in the early 90s.

The new Uncanny X-Men was a bit of a letdown. The guy set up a great two-parter in the last issue, and it fizzled bigtime. He should read "God Loves, Man Kills II" for a clue on how to do an X-Men story with religious undertones. The mere quoting of scripture back and forth was not enough for me. Kurt was pretty out of character throughout, and his sudden diatribe about abortion was completely jolting. (Austen talking instead of Wagner, methinks?)

And Wolvie should've been in full-on berserker mode. I'm sorry, but there are certain X-Men you don't so much as look crosseyed at unless you want Logan to kill you. Jubilee's near or at the top of that list. And he jumps into battle crying that he wants vengeance for Skin? Skin? What a joke. "My name's Skin. I have rubbery grey skin. Give me some candy!" Whoop-dee-doo.

However, Skin got one of the worst death scenes in comics. I don't like him, but he was in every issue of Generation X, which should afford him at least a full panel. I've always thought the death scene should be appropriate to how many issues a character's been in, and he got screwed.

I'm going to withhold judgment for now on the new X. . . uh, Claremont X-Men. (X-Treme's the new France!) It's a bit on the "huh?" side, but Claremont's famous for writing multi-parters that confuse you and make you think he's lost it for the first chapter or two, then come together spectacularly in the end.

One thing's for sure: that cover rules! I never had a crush on Kitty before, but now I think she's the cat's meow! [Insert groan here.]

I picked up Phoenix despite the too-slutty cover, mainly because I was hoping it'd tie in with the building Phoenix storyline over in New X-Men. When I got home, I couldn't make heads or tails of it. I doubt I'll pick up #2.

I found Sentinel #1 at a comic shop I don't normally go to (since my usual shop doesn't carry More Than Meets the Eye for whatever reason), so I got the first two issues. Not sure what to think. The concept is a good one, even if not original. Basically, a boy finds the (memory-wiped) remains of a Sentinel in his father's junkyard and I guess they'll become friends. I say "I guess" because it's the end of #2, and the Sentinel's just begun rebuilding itself. Lots of high school drama of the sort that all TV shows are based on but rarely happens in real life. The art is awesome, and the writing is solid despite the lack of action, so I'll give it at least one more issue. It'll either be one of those books like Sleepwalker or Damage that are awesome but don't last, or one of those that never ends up going anywhere.

Eternal Padawan
05-30-2003, 04:20 PM
UXM looked like Austen was just wrapping up Casey's Church of Humanity storyline, and not doing it very enthusiastically. He already pushed Stacy-X out of the picture. Happens all the time when they change writers. One thing to note was the Previously page this issue made it seem like everybody except Jubilation died. But I clearly remember Magma getting hot cocoa or something after her ordeal, and I thought the others were sitting up too. Only Angelo bit it. Hmmph.

Yes! The CXM cover rocked! I'm going to marry Kitty Pryde someday. :D I don't know what to make of the story, since it's obviously been slapped together from movie elements, but I have faith in Chris to make it interesting.

Phoenix was waaaaaay to Anime for me. I flipped through it and put it back on the shelf. Gladly.

Eternal Padawan
05-30-2003, 04:29 PM
Speaking of guest appearances. I'm not sure where to put this because frankly, Captain America wouldn't get many posts in his own thread.

Apparently, the Captain America series was cancelled and Steve Rogers has some aging disorder caused as a side effect of the super soldier serum and has been put in cryo-stasis or something (see my red tagline). But a little birdie told me that Marvel is going to be introducing a character next year that will work her way through all the major selling books like Amazing Spider-Man and the X-Books before getting her own series. It turns out she is the daughter of Captain America and has a naturally occuring super soldier serum in her, without any of the side effects (the age thing) which of course gives her super speed and strength. Hmmmmm.....

El Chuxter
05-30-2003, 05:20 PM
So I wonder if that stupidity pre-dated the same thing happening to a much younger Steve Rogers on X-Men: Evolution. :rolleyes:

I too was confused by the "story so far" dealio. At least the goofy blonde girl survived, too.

jjreason
05-31-2003, 03:36 PM
More Ketchup for those interested:

Uncanny 394 - First issue by Casey and Churchill (of Wildcats fame). Show-off the art, standalone issue dealing with a "new" mutant named Warp who goes bonkers on his 18th birthday. He takes out a bunch of marines at a military base, then tangles with Jean and Logan who are both sucked into the darkest regions of the kid's mind (his power deletes them from the "real" world and deposits them there). In his psyche, Jean and Logan have a big kissie moment - one they believe to be their last as the kid's mind is disintigrating all around them. Turns out, Angel has just zapped him with 2 pulses from the EMP (mutant cancellation) gun, and has knocked him out. Logan and Jean come back to the real world, and the kid uses his own powers to commit suicide upon reawakening.

Art - amazing. Story - nice introduction to the new, "mature readers only" X-men.

"E is for Extinction" New X-Men 114-116. This has been discussed. I had mixed feelings about it which I'll go into here.

Good: Writing, art, intensity, colours, everything about the comic itself was so good, it literally made my hands sweat. I couldn't put it down.

Bad: It's nearly too mature. I don't know if I'd feel comfortable letting my kids near this, even if they were 13 or 14. For a mainstream "grocery store" comic, this was pretty grown up.

Watching Magneto's (apparent) death was disturbing. The man was a defenseless, wheelchair bound invalid when the Sentinel Jet smashed into his tower. A sad end for maybe my favourite Marvel character (good thing his magnetic powers would have kicked in subconsciously, protecting him from the impact and blast - as well as shielding him from the Cerebra scanner ;) ).

Next: "Poptopia", Uncanny #'s 395-398.

jjreason
06-01-2003, 09:00 PM
More:

Uncanny 395 - "Poptopia" (1 of 4).

Nightcrawler, Arcangel and Iceman are in London looking for 2 things: Chamber, and the source of a large spike on the Cerebra Unit emnating from that city. They discover a clan of English Morlocks, but can't seem to get through to them, so they leave. Chamber meets a pop star, who seems to fancy him. The press is all over the new romance and it makes the front page. Of course, the touring X-Men catch wind of it. An apparently new villain "Mr. Clean", wipes out many of the English muties with Pyro-like powers.

Uncanny 396 - Bobby and Kurt confront Jon about his current fame in the media, and try to convince him it's not real. Chamber doesnt' buy it - having too much fun with the Britney knock off (and rightly so, she's pretty hot). The X-Men locate and confront Mr. Clean, who stabs Arcangel and shoots Bobby, then shoots his gas canister causing a large explosion. At the end of the issue, Wolvie is arriving in London to support his comrades....

Uncanny 397 - Sean Phillips takes over on pencilling from Churchill (too bad - but it's not too bad a let down). Wolverine confronts Chamber and gives him pretty much the same message as the others. Turns out some of the tunnel dwellers survived Mr. Clean's cleansing, and are on the lam trying to get out of London over to Europe. Nightcrawler finds them at the end and introduces himself as an X-Man in hopes that the team's reputation will put them in better stead with the group this time. Sugar Kane's manager let's Chamber know in no uncertain terms he's not welcome to be around her. The tabloids report she's pregnant with a mutant baby.

Uncanny 398 - grand finale. Phillips on pencils again, much grainier. Not my favourite. Arcangel, Nightcrawler and Drake are trying to coax the English muties to come with them to guarantee their safety, they'll have none of it. Mr. Clean finds them, with an eye on wiping them all out, including the X-Men. Drake blocks him off from the group, and it's Mr. Clean vs. Logan. Guess who wins. Chamber gets dumped by the pop princess when their relationship starts to sour her celebrity status - her manager arranges an "abduction" to make it look like she gets a clean break from ol' Starsmore. At the end, Chamber is waiting on the "X-Wing" (the new Blackbird jet) to go back to Xavier's with the other X-Men. Welcome home, Chamber. You always were the coolest Gen X mutant.

AT-AT Man
06-01-2003, 09:26 PM
hello everyone, this will sound like a dumb question, but what is the newest issue out right now? i mean, what is the issue number and title. i haven't been to the comic shop in about a month, but plan on getting there this weekend. thanks in advance.

jjreason
06-02-2003, 08:09 AM
Okay, I'll bite. Uncanny X-Men had 2 issues this month, 423 which was a 25cent issue, and 424 which was regular priced, and came out last week.
X-Treme X-Men 25 came out last week as well.
New X-Men will likely come out on Wednesday, or a week Wednesday, and is up around issue 140(?) or so.
X-Men unlimited came out 2 weeks ago, and is now at issue 47.

Good luck.

AT-AT Man
06-02-2003, 09:59 AM
Ok thank you very much JJ, are the stories in those any good. Are they worth picking up?

El Chuxter
06-02-2003, 01:18 PM
Originally posted by jjreason
Welcome home, Chamber. You always were the coolest Gen X mutant.

No, no, no, NO! :mad:

All the Generation X mutants sucked with one exception, and she dressed like a DC character. I hope I don't have to tell you who she is.

Eternal Padawan
06-02-2003, 05:42 PM
I have to disagree.

Skin had the dumbest power imaginable.

The Samoan guy was a pretty weak character. (What happened to him?)

Monet St. Croix's powers were generic.

Husk's powers are just plain silly.

But Chamber is so freakishly weird looking and with an attitude on top of it, and that big hooked english nose, and that accent, he's cool.

Just not as cool as the Jubester. But she needs to cut her hair, because right now she looks like Karma, and she needs to get back to the spiky 'do she wore back in the day.

El Chuxter
06-02-2003, 05:50 PM
I only picked up the first issue of Generation X, and I'm not 100% sure I actually read it. The characters mainly looked dumb. Also (personal preferences aside) it seemed a bit ridiculous that a girl who's saved the universe a few times and held her own alongside Wolvie and Remy suddenly gets demoted to the "Special Ed Class" of Xavier's? (Well, we all know the real reason. They wanted one familiar character around (outside of stupid ol' Banshee and Emma) to entice everyone to read the book.)

Chamber seems okay in the second-to-latest issue of Uncanny, so maybe I'll try to revise my previous opinion of him if everyone likes him. (My previous opinion was, "What, you blew half your face off the first time you used your power? You shoulda tried harder.")

jjreason
06-02-2003, 10:19 PM
Y'know, I was with you at the start, El Chux. I only bought the first few issues because I was buying pretty much every X-book out at the time (I was drawn back into comics by the whole "Age of Apocalypse" Saga that ran in all the titles), and went back to pick up the first 4 issues of Gen X that had preceded that story line once it had ended. I figured I'd only get the first 8 or 10. Well, by that time Gen X was the book I was reading right after Uncanny. I was really impresses by Chris Bachalo, and remember being pretty stoked when he got the Uncanny job a year or so later (too bad he was short lived on that book, he did well IMO). I really liked the play between Banshee and Emma, and felt for whatever reason the book was working pretty well on a character (if not always on a "superhero" or "cool powers" level). Im a sucker for the character parts, I think that's maybe why Marvel has always appealed to me more than DC.

Dr Zoltar
06-02-2003, 11:38 PM
I too was a big fan of Gen X, but stopped around issue 35. The art was getting poor and there was a story that ended up annoying me. IIRC, the kids were kidnapped and left on a deserted island. There was a big build up that they would be stranded at sea and their conflicts trying to survive. Well the story lasted one issue (maybe half of an issue) and they were back on dry land. I really hated that.

I also disliked the fact that Mondo turned out to be a bad guy. But there wasn't a big build up to it. He was in a few issues as a teammate, disappeared for a while, then came back and was evil. I had no idea what that was about.

I also remember there were a couple of issues at the time where the art was really hard to follow and I couldn't even discern what was going on in some of the panels. So I dropped the title and never looked back.

jjreason
06-03-2003, 12:25 AM
That's pretty much where I cut it off, too Dr. Z.

ATAT Man - I think if you buy Uncanny 423, you'll get your money's worth (it has a cover price of 25cents!!!!!). From there, I would recommend you try X-Treme X-men 24 and 25 (or is it 25 and 26 already?) the "God Loves, Man Kills" part 2. Im sure you'll see something you like.

Hope you survive the experience........


More Ketchup:

New X-Men 117 Beast does a virtual study on Cassandra Nova's DNA - suprise! It's the same as Charles'! We find out Cassandra Nova has infiltrated the mind of her "twin", and has decided to hijack his body by taking him into space with the Shiar and away from the school. There are now masses outside the school protesting, since Charlie went public with them all being mutants. Jean is left in charge of the school.

Nova blasts Hank McCoy mentally, defeating him by filling his mind with negative feelings about himself, playing on his fears. She also controls a young mutant (a freak known as "Beak", whom Hank was helping learn to use his powers) to beat McCoy senseless with a baseball bat. This AIN'T yo momma's X-Men, as Eternal Padawan has previously said.

New X-Men 118 "Germ Free Nation" part 1. The X-Men have problems with a guy who's writing books about normal people stealing mutations by injecting themselves with X-Genes, and having mutant parts surgically added. Freaky. A new mutant is introduced, Im calling her "Bee Girl" for now. She's captured by forces trying to take her wings on behalf of those people wanting to have powers added. Wolvie's gonna save her.

119 Wolvie rescues the Bee Girl ("Angel", I guess - pretty original). Scott and Emma are trapped by the guy they confronted about making "man plus" via surgery (I believe they're calling him Mr. Sublime). Jeannie also goes into Beak's mind, and figures out Prox X was responsible for the beating of Beast (that's what she sees, his visage). Mr. Sublime's forces storm the mansion, where only Jean is left with the students. Time for the grand finale.

120 Emma saves herself and Scott from Sublime's soldiers, and releases them. Jeannie goes nova (turns back into Phoenix apparently) and defeats the soldiers storming the mansion singlehandedly. Wolvie brings Angel back to the mansion just as this is wrapping up, she's not too impressed. Beast exits the mansion at the very end of the issue, bandaged and obviously still hurt, carrying the deceased body of Cassandra Nova. He asks for "help, the Professor's mind is trapped in this old woman's hedd........"

121 'Nuff said issue. No words makes it tough for non-art-focused JJR to get anything out of the book, but I think I did. Jeannie and Emma do a psychic rescue on Professor X to see what exactly is going on in the big guy's noodle (trapped now in the body of Nova, remember?). Emma takes out the defenses, Jeannie probes deep and finds out Charles and Cassandra were twins. Charles tried to kill Cassandra while the pair were in utero together, apparently his mutant mental abilities were working even then. Frank Quitely back on pencils, and thank goodness. His art on this issue just rocks. Also very insightful was the script by Morrison, included in this issue so those of us not getting the message via art can glean a little insight. They put these in all the 'Nuff said issues, and they're really interesting.

Uncanny 399 - Warren finds out his money has been distrbuted to some fairly odd places, including an all mutant *****house. Drake infiltrates it undercover to see what's up when the place gets attacked by the Church of Humanity (whoever they are). "Stacy", a snake skinned female mutie who can secrete stuff that makes a person feel however she wants) helps with the fight and is taken back with the X-Men at the end of the issue.

I guess that's about it, EP. You have it from here. If there's anything you guys want to be debriefed on while Im reading, let me know.

Eternal Padawan
06-05-2003, 12:57 AM
Thanks for the summaries, jj! I was going to pick up the poptopia issues next. Now onto the new issues...

STOP! Is it just me or are The X-books coming out like every other DAY!?! I swear I just bought Uncanny and (New) like last week.

(New) X-Men. Bachalo art. Alright! And the whole issue doesn't do anything except get Scott **** drunk and a little (non) showdown between Logan and Victor in the men's room. What's up with that? The title, Assualt on Weapon Plus suggests that Fantomex is going to help Logan find out that he's really James after all this time. Maybe. And they sort of left the other plot thread dangling. Just who held the gun to Sage's head? Hmmmm....maybe it will all tie together.

Uncanny. Austen is superb. :D


"Do a nun for my friend here!"
"Anything with red hair for the man to my left! Or something underage for my friend with the wings!"
"Tigra! Tigra! Tigra!"

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

He writes exchanges superbly. The dialogue between Annie and Bobby? Wow. And then again with Scott and Alex. Even the thing with Cain asking Scott if he can join the X-Men. I just love these characters in Chuck's hands! And Phillip Tan is a breath of fresh air after Garney's heavy handed artwork. Ron is okay, but not top notch like X-Art should be. PST! is great. He's been doing the cover honors for a few issues, but now we are graced with his interiors as well. I hope he sticks around for awhile.

El Chuxter
06-05-2003, 01:11 PM
Uncanny did come out last week. I saw it on Diamond's shipping list and figured it was an error, so I didn't notice the comic shop I frequent sold out of it on the first day again!

I loved New X-Men, though. That was possibly the best Sabertooth/Wolvie confrontation I've ever seen, and all they did was recycle their beer! :D

Eternal Padawan
06-05-2003, 04:07 PM
Man I HATED that "confrontation"...all the pent up conflict between these two and we get a little verbal sparring? BOOO! :mad:

jjreason
06-05-2003, 11:33 PM
EP - Chuck Austen is writing Cap right now as well. It's meh. Some books, you just can't make cool, no matter how many times you start them over at #1, or how many times you put them under a different "cooler" division of your company. Yep, Cap is one of them books. Never gonna be cool.

Unless they give him back to Mark Waid and Ron Garney, that is. Now those issues were cool.

Eternal Padawan
06-06-2003, 06:19 PM
Was that the Man without a Country storyline? I can't even remember if I was collecting still. I seem to remember Garney doing a lot of silouhette work and defining Cap by the color or his uniform without actually drawing lines or anything. A very cool effect.

Cap doesn't work because there's no inner conflict there. Every Super Hero has their demons. But Cap really doesn't have any that I can think of.

Batman is a borderline psychopach in his pursuit of criminals. Spidey is haunted by his Uncle's death. The X-Men are despised for being different. Bruce Banner has a monster inside him. Daredevil was always ripe with religious overtones and legal conflicts, lawyer by day, vigilante by night, not to mention the blindness. Iron Man is an alcoholic/cripple/whatever.

Captain America is just a big goody goody. Where's the inner conflict?

jjreason
06-07-2003, 02:22 AM
Hmmmmm. He's struggled for 50 some odd years over not having been able to save Bucky, I guess the guilt there (unfounded or not) drives him a little bit. It's not Cap that sucks though, it's Steve. How boring is Cap when they're dealing with Steve? Ugh. Most other Marvel characters are as interesting out of the suit (or in Thor's case - in Asgard as opposed to on earth) as they are kicking butt. Not Steve. It's Clark Kent all over again.

Eternal Padawan
06-07-2003, 09:11 AM
Yeah. At one point his secret identity was comic book artist for Marvel, and he was drawing Captain America!:rolleyes:

If they played up that angst or maybe how he's time displaced and he has nobody left that he knew, so basically he's alone and being Captain America is all he has, but at the same time THAT'S what put him in this position so he's resentful of having to BE Captain America. Or maybe since that's all he has, he's kind of taking his identity as AMERICAN a bit much and is becoming a borderline zealot/patriot and watching how that affects his heroism. That would be interesting to read. Basically he's just the leader of the Avengers and he really doesn't need his own book for that.

jjreason
06-07-2003, 02:39 PM
Word. Time for Marvel to re-merge Iron Man and Cap into "Tales of Suspense". 2 reasons - reduce the number of books I'm buying, and fortify the writing a little bit. Neither of these books is lighting me on fire right now. The could even make Avengers bi-weekly and kill those other two, though I know that won't happen. Thor as well can be hit or miss, works best for me when Thor is set in Asgard so he can still talk funny. We're off topic, time for a couple of new threads maybe.

Eternal Padawan
06-18-2003, 06:22 PM
Right. Back to the X-Men. Picked up New Muties 2 and Uncanny 426. This New NM book intrigues me. I'll drop it from my list as soon as any of these kids suit up and save the world. I want to meet MORE of the 200+ students traipsing around Xavier's. And where are the other old New Mutants? It'd be a hoot to see Sunspot and Magma and Karma "recruiting"...

The UXM delivered again. (Except for the subpar hokum cover by Garney) Alex flies?? Interesting. And it's funny how the Eiffel Tower has already been rebuilt after the shenanigans in UXM 407. Austen must really not like anything Casey did on the book.

El Chuxter
06-18-2003, 06:27 PM
I guess good ol' Jubilee just vanished into the background again? Claremont liked the character, so maybe she'll join the X-Treme (urrrrgh) X-Men soon. She's too great a character to waste! (Of course, for years we said that about Angel and Iceman, right?)

Eternal Padawan
06-18-2003, 06:58 PM
She's on a page of UXm. At the end, She and Paige Guthrie are chatting about the events of the issue.

Since Juggernaut is now a member of the team, I think it would be interesting to see them slowly replace each of the current X-Men with a villain from their past. Then in about 25 issues or so, you look and BAM! Toad, Juggy, Mastermind, etc are the X-Men! Fan boys everywhere begin crying...

jjreason
06-19-2003, 03:33 AM
Checked out Woverine #2 yet? Pretty good stuff... as per usual Logan being the best he is yadda yadda yadda. Cool art so far on this though, and I'm going out on a limb and am going to say that there's going to be a little more violence over the next couple of issues. Giddy up.

El Chuxter
06-19-2003, 01:21 PM
RE: Sacred Vows (Uncanny 425-6)

I picked these up last night. (I didn't get any other comics, though. Long story short, I was near a comic shop I normally hate, but the place I usually go to has sold out of the last four issues of Uncanny and it's not on my "hold list," so I got those and will go by my usual comic shop next week for the other good stuff.)

Wow. What can I say? Lorna Dane just jumped off my mental list of lame X-Men. :D She kicks some serious butt. I see she again thinks her daddy is Magneto, but she's obviously flipped out, so it's forgivable.

This Tan guy is an awesome artist. He just officially was named as an "El Chuxter's favorite Jubilee artist." If anyone knows where I can find that pic from the last page of 426, which is also on the dramatis personae page, I think I just found my next Jubilatar! :crazed:

I think Annie's a moron. She passed over Bobby for (ugh) Alex? What a maroon! I hope she comes to her senses, slaps her son silly, makes Havok pay for all the drinks on their trip, and comes back singing "Ice Ice Baby." Nothing against Havok, but he carries the Summers gene! They could potentially have a wooden kid!!

And why in the name of everything wasn't Ice invited to the bachelor party? (And how did Husk and Jubilee get into a bar? They're obviously still minors.)

Speaking of those two. . . man, what a can of worms! Beast's comment at the party makes it clear that Warren does have some serious issues, so that's confirmed for sure. Husk is apparently older than Jubilee, who's obviously still as naive as when she jumped into that portal to Australia about fifteen years ago (our time).

Storywise, very strong. I think between the three X-Men books, I'm enjoying the series at least as much as I did years ago. Only one complaint. This follows very close on the heels of "Holy War." But aside from a reference to Havok's life being hectic, nothing. At least two X-Men died, for God's sake! We learned Nightcrawler's been a pawn of a bunch of nutjobs for quite some time, Lorna Dane killed some folks, Wolvie got burned to a crisp, and Jubilee was crucified! Jeez. Yeah, Wolvie can shake it off, Kurt is probably too in shock to talk about what happened to him, and Lorna's flipped out anyway. But at least showing bandages on Jubilee's hands or. . . you know, now that I think of it, she was very (appropriately) toned down, so forget I complained. ;)

So there are indeed two teams? Aside from throwaway comments by Scott and Kurt, do we ever see any indication? In New X-Men, they hang out at the mansion. In Uncanny, they defend the mansion. No superheroing going on that I can see. (At least they have cooler threads in Uncanny. Even if the black and tan suit for Juggernaut isn't my cup of tea, and Havok needs to shed the metal!)

EP, it's obvious that Damage Control is still in business and rebuilt the Eiffel Tower. Duh. :crazed: (I wonder if, given recent real-world events, Marvel will completely disavow any knowledge of Damage Control. Funny as they were, they kinda seem in poor taste nowadays.)

Eternal Padawan
06-19-2003, 04:09 PM
A cool group like Damage Control wouldn't set FOOT in that damnable foreign country.

Jean Grey obviously mind tricked the bouncers into letting Jubes and Paige in. I thought it was bizarre that not only did Bobby MISS the bachelor party, he wound up at the bachelorette party instead. Huh??

I'm not sure what the deal with the two teams is. It seems like both books ( and now New Mutants) concentrate on the school aspect of things (or getting hammered in Mutant bars). Where's Mr. Sinister when you need him to blow some sh..tuff up?

Lorna Dane jumped off the lame list into the psycho nutjob list. :crazed: I think Austen is setting it up so Bobby and Lorna get together. They both got dumped (although Bobby was like after 24 hours of "dating").

El Chuxter
06-20-2003, 02:23 PM
Okay, the big bad villain scorecard:

Magneto is dead. :cry:

Apocalypse is dead. :rolleyes:

Stryfe, I think, is dead. :D

Juggernaut is a good guy now, as is Emma Frost.

Mastermind seems to be more or less retired.

Sabertooth is on the Weapon X team and seems more interested in watching Wolverine tinkle than causing trouble.

I haven't actually read "E Is For Extinction" and the follow-ups yet, but it looks like Cassandra Nova is basically fried.

Someone is waiting in the wings, someone who only Esme seems to know the identity of. He may or may not be the unknown assailant from "Murder at the Mansion."

I don't know where Mr Sinister's at these days, but if he's around I wouldn't mind seeing him pop back up.

Stryker is alive and well, causing trouble for Kitty as we speak.

Was Master Mold ever destroyed? I always wanted to see him somehow merge with Ultron, capture Forge and possibly Whizkid as well, and use their powers in conjunction with his own technologies to create a nearly undefeatable wave of Super-Sentinels.

Eternal Padawan
06-20-2003, 06:38 PM
Well, if indeed all the cool X-troublemakers of the past are gone. (What happened to the Strucker Twins? Shinobi Shaw? Trevor Fitzroy? Exodus? Donald Pierce? Anybody?) they need to concoct some NEW world class baddies for the X-monkeys to spank.

They are all sitting on their duff's back at the mansion watching American Idol and dusting that orange powder off their fingers from eating too many cheese doodles. Their world-saving skills are getting rusty and it's time somebody churned things up a bit.

That goes for ALL the Marvel Heroes. What, villains gave up on world domination ALL at the same time?

El Chuxter
06-20-2003, 06:50 PM
Can't answer you on most of those guys, EP, but I know from thumbing through the Marvel Encyclopedia: X-Men that Fitzroy is dead. He was sliced in half by some sort of time portal foul-up. :eek:

I wonder if the current trend at Marvel away from super-smackdowns is Quesada's doing, a backlash against the silliness of a few years ago, or what. It is definitely time for some baddie to remind these heroes what they're there for. Devil's Due came up with a perfectly reasonable explanation for why so many uber-terrorists came out of retirement at once, and I'm sure Marvel could do it as well.

It's like Marvel almost seem to have forgotten what they make comics for. I find it rather amusing that all their superhero titles are "Marvel PG" and the Comic Code seems to have finally vanished when I wasn't looking. I'm enjoying the X-Men titles, but there's a lot of things I wouldn't want to have to explain to a ten-year-old. (I'm sure kids want to read about "psychic affairs.")

BTW, I bet Cyclops voted for Clay and Havok voted for Ruben! Jubilee was too ticked that Simon wouldn't let her on the show to bother voting. :D

jjreason
06-21-2003, 03:46 PM
Nova wasn't fried as of my last issue, but there's lots left for me to read. I'd like to see the Hellfire Club pop back up, been long enough.

Eternal Padawan
06-25-2003, 11:11 PM
Wolverine (or one of his clones, was there a comic where Multiple Man and Logan merged? I missed that issue) continues to bounce around the X-universe. This time, he's hanging out with those renegade X-tremely X-traneous X-yabbos over in Claremont X-Men.

That whole "default state" for Kitty where she's intangible to gravity has never come up before has it? If that were true, then before she made it to Xavier's and learned to control her power, she'd have been hurtled off into space and died years ago right? And every time since when she used her powers, wouldn't she have shifted 90 miles away? I guess Chris can change facts to suit his story at will. It's his mutant power...

El Chuxter
06-26-2003, 12:47 PM
I wondered that about Kitty, too. How does she sleep if intangible is the default for her?

I have no question that this city is not a good thing. And with only one issue to play out, I have a feeling the next issue will be severely rushed.

This isn't bad writing, but it's not Claremont's best.

New Mutants is rather good. I actually hope this focuses on the school aspect of the students, allowing at least Uncanny to go back to fighting supervillains.

Can't say I've ever noticed Danielle Moonstar referred to as a "hottie." :D

One thing that jumped out after reading X-Treme and New Mutants: there are tons of mutants, but why are almost all of them deformed or generic? It seems that if you're a mutant, you're either hideously ugly, you've got a totally lame we've-seen-it-a-million-times power, or you join the X-Men.

Edit: I just realized something. In the new Claremont X-Men Storm suddenly goes completely nuts while on a mission to find Stryker. After they get her under control, they immediately say, "Obviously someone phased adamantium through the earth. This must be the work of Shadowcat! We find her and we find Stryker!" Was there some 1/2 issue in between there that I missed?

Eternal Padawan
06-26-2003, 04:27 PM
And if the quaint little mutant haven town is advertising, why haven't the X-Men investigated it before the population has hit several hundred or thousand mutants and their families?

Eternal Padawan
06-26-2003, 04:33 PM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
That goes for ALL the Marvel Heroes. What, villains gave up on world domination ALL at the same time?


I spoke too soon. No sooner do I gripe, then the Avengers and their nemesis, U.S. Secratary of Defense, Dell Rusk restore my faith in classis good vs evil comic book world class world domination schemes. :D

Dell Rusk....that's an anagram, no? ;)

El Chuxter
06-26-2003, 05:55 PM
Methinks the mutant town is somehow fake. Stryker's got something up his sleeve. :)

Who's in the Avengers now?

Eternal Padawan
06-27-2003, 06:07 PM
Cap, Scarlet Witch, Vision, Black Panther, She-Hulk, Iron Man, Ant Man, Jack of Hearts, Warbird(formerly known as Ms. Marvel and/or Carol Danvers), Falcon, and Henry Gyrich, who is not as big a jerk as he used to be (but still a jerk). But enough Avengers talk! Go to the Marvel Heroes thread to chat more about Earth's Mightiest Heroes...

As for that little mutant haven, the family with that kitty cat kid that showed up in the winnebago said they had read about it or something didn't they? Like in a Mutant Magazine I'm guessing. Which means the Prof and crew would have gone out there and seen whats what....except....oh, that's right. BOTH X-Teams refuse to leave the mansion...never mind.

El Chuxter
07-01-2003, 03:25 PM
I noticed something interesting in the comics packed in with ML Beast and Gambit. In both, there is a subscription form. And on both, Agent X, Soldier X, and X-Statix are listed. But the part that I found rather intriguing, especially given Marvel's complete disavowal of the existence of Liefeld, is that each is followed by the original name in parentheses: Deadpool, Cable, and X-Force.

Also, the three-digit codes for the books that appear to be for Marvel's internal use seem to be based on the original titles. Odd, given that all three original books were cancelled and replaced with new series.

Eternal Padawan
07-02-2003, 07:14 PM
I noticed that too, in recent back issues I've purchased.

Onto the latest X-Men!

Uncanny was a nice stand alone issue. The art didn't blow me away, but the story was good. I liked the new Collusus type guy. Hope to see more of him. I didn't like Jubilee's hair. And it seemed bizarre that Angel would just show up at a hospital and they would go along with his plan. Everone seems too paranoid these days about lawsuits and malpractice for the staff to "experiment" with the patient's like that.

I'm hoping this healing power Angel has developed is some sort of latent recovery program Apocalypse instilled in him and it heralds the return of Apocalypse and Warren becoming Death again. It'd make for some cool conflicts, if he turned baddie/blue/bald against his will....



(N) X-Men was....confusing. Is the "World" like a Matrix? And AIM and some reporters and some other guy from Philadelphia and mutants all jumping in and out of the story... I'll have to reread it more carefully.

El Chuxter
07-03-2003, 01:01 PM
Got to agree on New and disagree on Uncanny. :)

New was extremely confusing, and unfortunately I get the idea that we're in store for an "everything you though you knew about Wolverine's origin is wrong" story. :mad:

Uncanny was a bit too hokey for me. The entire thing was too convenient, too coincidental. Austen has been rather hit and miss with me, and this is a miss. Warren's wings were way too long, and the whole "another Colossus" bit had me longing for the days when the powers were unique.

Oddly, about the only thing I liked was Jubilee's hairdo. :)

Dr Zoltar
07-07-2003, 03:22 PM
Just read on sci-fi wire that in an upcoming issue of X-Treme X-Men that the writers are bringing Princess Di back from the dead as a mutant. Blah! You know, stunts like this is what caused me to dump the X-Men titles years ago.

jjreason
07-08-2003, 12:44 AM
That just has to be false. Leave it to Grant Morrison....

Dr Zoltar
07-08-2003, 03:05 AM
I also read it on another entertainment site (I don't remember which one it was). But they had the title as X-statix X-Men. And it listed that the government in England was none to happy about it.

Every time I see these two X-Men titles I keep remembering an ep of Stargate SG-1 where they were spoofing themselves with a fake show called Wormhole X-Treme. Everyone had an X on their uniform and it was revealed that the show had an X in it because demographics showed that things that began with an X sold more.

jjreason
07-08-2003, 03:32 AM
Aahhhh. That explains things a little. X-Statix is written kind of tongue-in-cheek, poking fun at the Mutants' place in pop culture. A weirder mainstream comic you'll likely not find. That is one book where I could see them pulling a stunt like that, and having it work with the current storyline and tone. I don't read it, and this won't make me start. Pretty cool art though, and some wild colour schemes happening over there.

AT-AT Man
07-13-2003, 09:25 PM
ok i have a queston, which mutants are the players in X-Treme X-Men cause i'm thinkinig of picking up a subscription to either it or Uncanny. leaning towards X-Treme cause i saw a picture of Gambit on a recent cover. Anyones oppinion would help here.

Beast
07-13-2003, 09:35 PM
ok i have a queston, which mutants are the players in X-Treme X-Men cause i'm thinkinig of picking up a subscription to either it or Uncanny. leaning towards X-Treme cause i saw a picture of Gambit on a recent cover. Anyones oppinion would help here.
X-Treme's Current Core Members are as follows. Note that not all of them may be active at the moment. Because there was a huge happening in the book that had some of them taking time off. You can read more, at the link at the bottom.

Storm (Leader)
Bishop
Sage
Rogue
Thunderbird III
Gambit
Lifeguard (UGH!!)
Slipstream
Red Lotus

http://www.uncannyxmen.net/db/current/showquestion.asp?faq=5&fldAuto=2

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
07-13-2003, 09:52 PM
so Beast is not active, cause his picture was on the firs three episodes. What are the core charecters in Uncanny X-Men

Beast
07-13-2003, 10:36 PM
so Beast is not active, cause his picture was on the firs three episodes. What are the core charecters in Uncanny X-Men
Well, X-Treme was only formed to track down and recover Destiny's diarys that foretold the future. Storm was against someone like Charles Xavier having access to them, and gathered whatever X-Men would follow her and took off in a race to recover them first. Beast originally went with Storm, and was one of the main team members. That was until he was almost killed. Sage used her abilities to activate latent mutations and activated Hank's Healing Factor which allowed him to survive. It also triggered a secondary mutation effect, which Cassandra Nova told him is a de-evolutionary effect that will one day have him regress to a slime mold. She could be lieing, but it's put Beast in a bit of a funk. But anyway, his job with X-Treme was later finished, and he rejoined the Institute to teach, and shocked quite a few with his new form. Frankly I hate Kitty Cat Beast with a passion, and Beast is my favorite character. :)

Soon aftertwards, Storm decided that the recent discovery of the 13 Diaries of Destiny required attention. She did not trust Charles Xavier with the power contained in the future predictions and, instead, gathered a select group of X-Men to aid her in searching for the diaries: Beast, Rogue, Bishop, Psylocke, Thunderbird, and Sage. Most of them left Westchester, quietly, in the dead of night, and cut all ties to their former collegues, except Wolverine, who would act as a liaison. [X-Men (2nd series) #109]

The Beast stayed behind, to design the cure for the Legacy Virus, based on Moira's notes. However, the cure had to be released into the atmosphere in the same manner the virus originally was: through the death of a mutant. Beast resolved to find another method of curing the virus, but Colossus heroically sealed himself into the medilab, and sacrificed his life to release the cure. [Uncanny X-Men #390]

After mourning, Beast too left Xavier’s school and met with Storm’s team to begin their quest with a visit to Valencia, Spain. They came into conflict with the country's own Guardia Civil and also a mysterious man known as Vargas, who killed Psylocke and seriously wounded Beast. Hank was only saved when Sage jumpstarted his latent healing abilities, which also foreshadowed a further mutation. Beast’s injuries forced him to return to the mansion, as Storm considered him a security risk for the rest of her team. [X-Treme X-Men #2-4]
MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
07-13-2003, 10:58 PM
Wow this really fills me in on a lot. so in your oppinion which should i get a subscription to, Uncanny or X-Treme. I'm definately leaning towards X-Treme now that I'v read this. How does Gambit work into this.

Beast
07-13-2003, 11:03 PM
I've really not been following comics at all, as of late. I started picking them up again recently, as I needed them for research on Beast. I'd say New X-Men is fairly good. If your up for a total revamp that places the X-Men into current time and starts things over, look into Ultimate X-Men. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Eternal Padawan
07-16-2003, 08:55 PM
The current Claremont X-Men story is not as interesting, in my opinion as the current issues of Uncanny written by Chuck Austen. I'd go with Uncanny if I were to subscribe.

Speaking of Uncanny, this new storyline revolving around Nightcrawler, Mystique and Kurt's father looks to be shaping up as what will surely go down as a classic X-Men story! People ten fifteen years from now will be saying "Remember The Draco storyline? That was AWESOME. Only a prologue issue so far, but Herr Azazel is shaping up to be the next X-uber baddie( wasn't I just pining for one of those a few weeks ago?) I am VERY excited.

New Mutants delivers another solid issue. This is becoming my second fave of the X-Books. Claremont's writing is tired, and Morrison's (N) X-Men is confusing. Hopefully Sunspot, Karma, etc will show up soon.

Claremont X-Men. Another ho-hum issue. I was mildly interestd in finding out about all those dead bodies and all these interesting new mutants, especially the Kitty Cat woman. But then Chris goes and kills her off. And each month, it gets more and more annoyinig to see Logan traipsing around ALL the Marvel mutie books every month. I think that might be why I like New Mutants so much.

Emma Frost. Interesting. I'll admit I picked it up because Emma was such a hottie on the cover ( Joe Quesada and co. know their core audience...horny teenage fanboys.) but the story seems like it will play out a nice pace and the art was decent, if not spectacular. I'll probably finish out the series.

jjreason
07-17-2003, 11:18 PM
I too liked the Emma Frost cover issue. Very interesting and (hot) deserved back story on the White (hot) Queen - who has truly (hot) become a "core" X character since Generation (hottie hot hot) X.

I'm getting pretty close to caught up. Im now at "Riot at Xavier's" in New X Men, and maybe one issue behind that in Uncanny. Problem is, I don't have all the issues of Claremont that go along, so I'm missing a big facet of the story with those. I'll get them and go back later, but It's not the same as getting them all in one chunk. I miss Storm. For my money, New X has been the best of the newest stuff I've read, especially when Quitely is behind the art. I usually like Ron Garney (who teamed up with Chuck Austen on the "Hope" issues I just finished), but his X-Men aren't exactly what I'm in for.

Where did Paul Smith ever go? Anyone?

El Chuxter
07-21-2003, 01:20 PM
Well, I'm about three weeks behind on my comics, but I take it from EP's post that yet another issue of Uncanny has hit? :eek:

Major players in Uncanny seem to shift around a bit, but here's the current scorecard:

Nightcrawler
Havok
Juggernaut (!)
Arch-Pedophile-Angel
Husk
Jean
Cyclops
Wolverine

(Yeah, Jean, Scott, and Logan are in the other books, but it doesn't seem to bother them none.)

Jubilee showed up about a month ago (so about thirty issues back? :)) and has been hanging around, so maybe she'll actually be on a team again soon.

jjreason
07-21-2003, 01:52 PM
Well I just read Riot at Xavier's and Murder at the Mansion in fell swoop. Very, very good stuff, but I missed Quitely's Quirky art after the Quentin Quire story. (X-Q's me for all those Q's :rolleyes: ).

Assault on Weapon Plus issues 1 and 2 will have me caught up on New X, I'm still back at "Dominant Species" on Uncanny, but will be done with that by the time I go back to work.

jjreason
07-22-2003, 05:22 PM
I've now finished Dominant Species and Holy War in Uncanny, and it's just not happening like the New X-men. Weirdly, I noted in one issue of Uncanny, when Scott and Kurt are having their little spat about leadership (and Kurt relying on Warren to help him lead team 2) that there was no mention of the 3rd, Storm Led X-Treme team. Wonder what's up with that? Anyone read X-Treme from the beginning? Have they been disowned?

EDITED: Finished the last of New and Uncanny, so I'm all caught up and ready to play, coach. Mystique is a) Really Kurt's Momma, and b) older than she looks. I think the Draco story might be interesting, but the only real thing blowing me away on Uncanny lately is the covers. Crazy covers this last bit. Why did Philip Tan only do 2 issues? DId Kurt really "BAMF" as a baby?

Finished Assault on Weapon Plus 1 and 2, not bad. Guiltily, I like Fantomex (likely because he reminds me of Firefly). I'd like to recognize him when the mask comes off - that would be pretty cool if it was a good surprise.

Finished X-Treme #1 (the only issue I have previous to the current "God Loves, Man Kills 2" line), and #25. Meh.

I still have about 10 issues of each series (Uncanny and New) backed up, but they're from over 2 years ago, and will require me winning an ebay auction for the 3 issue "Astonishing X-Men" limited series about Apocalypse to allow me to read them. Hopefully that will occur tomorrow morning.

Eternal Padawan
07-30-2003, 09:06 PM
As if the news about Jim Lee doing Supes and the Wildman returning to Transformers wasn't cool enough, my perusal of the latest Wizard (#0) revealed the most exciting X-New I have read in...well. since I started collecting again.

MARC SILVESTRI is doing New X-Men!!!!! A four issue story arc. Marc was the artist when I started collecting Uncanny lo those many years ago and to me his is the greatest run on the series. EVER. The Juggernaut rampaging through the English countryside, their "death" in Dallas during Fall of the Mutants, spanking Reaver tush in the Australian outback, Inferno, and the Siege Perilous story arc.

And now he's back. Comics are cool again!

Beast
07-30-2003, 09:17 PM
They'll be cool when they fix all the terrible things Grant Morrison did to the book while he was running it. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Eternal Padawan
07-30-2003, 09:37 PM
Grant's still writing it, Marc is just drawing the pretty pictures.

Mmmmmmm...pretty pictures....

Beast
07-30-2003, 09:46 PM
Grant's leaving after Issue #154, to go work at DC from what I heard at the Comic Con. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
07-31-2003, 03:33 AM
Was there anything specific you didn't like JJB (besides Beast's secondary mutation)? I thought the stories and (for the most part) the art were top-notch, and jolted the X-books in a good way. Things were not holding my interest in either book for some time, but all the ketchup I've done over the past couple of months was made worthwhile by these mature and well executed storylines. Cassandra Nova and Quentin Quire were just great villains, and uncomfortably close to home. The desecration of Genosha at the hands of Nova's sentinels? Highlight material for sure. I love Morrison on new X, for me it will be very bitter when he leaves.

Beast
07-31-2003, 03:43 AM
I don't like a lot of these sudden secondary mutations popping up. Like Bobby's starting to turn totally to ice and become a complete prick. Cyclops being merged with Apocalypse. Emma Frost's Organic Diamond Form. Basically anything that butchered classic X characters just to try to up the readership count. I guess I'm having TMNT Image flashbacks when they just mutilated the characters just to do it. :p :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Eternal Padawan
07-31-2003, 09:47 AM
Well the Iceman thing is in Uncanny, so that's Austen's bag.

And the Cyclops/Apocalypse thing was before the current crop of writers. It was before Quesada even took over, I think.

So at least some of your anti-Morrison rage is misplaced. And as far as McCoy goes, his feline features notwithstanding, his characterization is the best I've seen in a long time. Brilliant and distracted in a scientisty kind of way, making obscure quotes and musing, while at the same time, frightened of his changes to his body. He's set up a goldmine and I don't think Morrison is using him enough.

jjreason
07-31-2003, 06:29 PM
He's done really well with the whole Emma/Scott/Jean thing - very good characterization there - and the lasting effects of the merge with Apocalypse has made me a little more interested in Cyke. Now that Havoc's back, I think it's interesting to see Scott playing the "wild" role, while Alex settles down into the straight and narrow with "Nurse X" or whateverthehellhernameis.

How many issues does that leave? We've likely got 2 more in "Assault on Weapon Plus" (which could really delve into Wolvie's history if we're lucky - and at the same time as we're delving into Nightcrawler's over in Uncanny!!! Gonna be a good couple months here, folks) and then what? 4 more after that? They're probably already scripted and in the can waiting for art. Hard to believe he'll be gone so soon after I caught up - to me it seems like he just got here. I wish I'd been reading the whole time, that way I could have savoured it a little more.

Now Im all verklempt.....maybe I'll go watch "Philadelphia" again to cheer up. :D

Eternal Padawan
08-06-2003, 05:58 PM
Annnnnnnd it's time for the mutant round up...

Claremont X-Men Wolverine ver 2.3 gets his rump handed to him by Lady Deathstrike, proving once and for all that the Wolvie in CXM is not the true Logan. Then Lady Deathstrike gets beat up by a clumsy southern hick whose sister attracts pedophile billionaires, proving she must not be the real Lady Deathstrike, but only an actress playing her in a movie adaptation which happens to unfortunately take place in regular continuity. And Kitty Pryde runs around in a kinky little schoolgirl outfit with the top few buttons on the blouse undone, so all is not lost. This book should be mercifully cancelled to make way for better X-Books.

Uncanny X-Men Man, Tan is a groovy artist. I think his opening pages of Kurt slinking around the mansion are HOT. And the funniest thing ever is when Logan (ver. 3.7) runs in and freaks everybody out by telling them Kurt actually LEFT THE MANSION. As we all know, X-Men no longer go out and do any kind of world saving, so for Kurt to leave left the rest of the team in a tizzy. Looks like the Jubester is back in full X-Men team status, with her foofy poodle tail hairstyle. Well...all I can say, is this thing is going to be awesome.

NEW X MEN uhhh...more confusion. I guess the Weapon + program is on....MiR? maybe? This one is definitely getting reread once all four issues are here. Anyway, Cyclops and Wolvie ver 7.9 (ugh Him again?!?! This guy needs to pop up in Batman and then he'll officially be EVERYWHERE) run around a big dome in Canada that nobody ever noticed before, especially those hoodlums from Alpha Flight. Way to go dunderheads, no wonder your book got cancelled. Besides the Box, you are all tools, especially that little Puck. Remember when he lost his Puckness and turned tall and old? Gads, that series sucked for a good long while...PS a Fantomex Marvel Legend figure would be pretty sweet.

PPS T minus 5 issues until wunderbar Silvestri makes me die a happy man!

jjreason
08-07-2003, 03:14 AM
Yep, the Draco has every ounce of potential. Number 1 on my reading list with a bullet - someplace Uncanny hasn't been since Onslaught. No kidding. Good for Chuck Austen, he wasn't realling keeping up with Morrison in my eyes until this - right when Morrison is getting a little confusing over on New. Hope that arc wraps properly as well, there's some work to do.

What the hell is X-Treme going on about? That's the worst X-Story I've read in some time. No way in hell am I continuing to buy that book after this story - it's terrible. Bring on Rob Liefeld *ducks*.

And just to brag a little (for those who didn't see this elsewhere), here's my (material) pride and joy.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-8/313407/xmen1front.jpg

Adam
08-07-2003, 03:42 AM
What issue is Uncanny on? The last one I bought was the Draco Prolouge, am I missing an issue?

Eternal Padawan
08-07-2003, 07:26 AM
Well, the next one came out yesterday. So yeah.

Heh. Speaking of Xtreme X-Men, remember Adam X-Treme? What ever happened to that dillhole? All the X-Treme X-men should head back to the mansion ( except that one Wolverine, since then there'd be like three Wolverines at the mansion and people would start asking questions) and Adam X-Treme should be the only mutant in X-Treme X-Men. And then gather up all the other lame X mutant ideas from the early 90's and make them into a lame super X team that actually gets trapped in their own final issue and then somebody burns in for kindling in a fireplace and all those turds are up in smoke.

Then the real X-Men find this lame Claremont impostor and force him to tell them wheres he keeping the REAL Claremont and go rescue him. or maybe this is the real Claremont suffering from senility in which case he should quit writing and stick to waving at fans from a convention table...

El Chuxter
08-07-2003, 11:29 AM
Ooh! I've got it!!

One of these Wolvies running around is Albert!!

(I'm waiting for the first hardcore Wolvie fan to identify that reference.)

Eternal Padawan
08-07-2003, 11:39 AM
Albert...now that's a name I've not heard in a long time...a long time....


Actually, it's been so long I'm not sure of the reference anymore. I do know it unlocked something in my memory from decades past, though...

El Chuxter
08-07-2003, 02:49 PM
Well, the ball passes to jjreason (or anyone else who remembers ol' Albert) then, I suppose.

I do remember an awful story from Marvel Comics Presents in which the Mimic has somehow permanently (and looking at him now, we see how permanently it really was :rolleyes: ) taken on the appearance and healing factor of Wolverine. So we've explained two of the extras. Is the other perhaps a leftover Infinity War doppelganger?

Eternal Padawan
08-07-2003, 05:22 PM
That Albert thing was circa Wolverine issues in the 30s or 40s right? Man, it is right there and I just can't figure it out...


Maybe the Jackal cloned Wolvie while he was at Weapon X and the real Wolverine(James Howlett) has been roaming the Canadian wilderness all this time and...


...ooog...


...Marvel Universe implosion ver 2.0 imminent......



URK ***(thud)

El Chuxter
08-07-2003, 05:58 PM
That Albert thing was circa Wolverine issues in the 30s or 40s right? Man, it is right there and I just can't figure it out...

Think Larry Hama and Elsie Dee. . . .

Adam
08-08-2003, 12:40 AM
Well, the next one came out yesterday. So yeah.


Ah.



Albert and Elsie Dee.. I occasionally wonder what happened to them.. the last time I read an issue of Wolverine with them, I think they landed on Muir Island after the Phalanx Covenent (which I understood very little of as I was only reading Wolverine at the time).

JON9000
08-08-2003, 03:12 PM
Ah- the downfall of comics and why I got out of them.

1. Marvel really went to pot when it started getting shopped around and got picked up by Revlon, who demanded an annual crossover in order to sell more books. What started out as a little bit of fun with Secret Wars and the Beyonder, as well as the Mutant Massacre, spun out of control. It strains the storylines to try and pull it off year after year, and most of the storylines truly sucked, although it was cool to see Logan finally plant one on Jean in Inferno. Anybody remeber that awful time they tried to turn every book's annual into one long disjointed crossover?

2. Egotistical artists who were under the impression they could write. Did anybody really like Spiderman, X-Force, or any of the books where the penciller had the writing chores as well? Spiderman #1: doom-doom-doom. Great story there Todd. Art is great for the short term and for getting some fanfare, but the stories are what count.

3. Sometimes dead is better. If they get killed off, let 'em lie. to bring them back is an insult to the reader, and weakens the impact when someone else gets killed off. When Colossus died I quit.

4. Five collectible covers all in special polybags!!! Hobbys die when they choke on their own greed and are no longer fun. Way to alienate your readership, guys.

by the way, I remember the Silvestri days. they were good, except frontal views of character faces were sometimes very flat looking. X-Men vs. Avengers was one of my favorite stories though. I think that was some of his earliest work.

jjreason
08-11-2003, 01:29 AM
Ha! "Atlantis Attacks" was the Annual crossover - awful. Included in that set was DD Annual #7 - even though Annual #7 had been released the year before....brilliant work there.

Polybagging IS the single greatest evil the hobby EVER knew. I hate foil covers, but polybags were wrong - money grubbing scum use polybags.

Albert..... I don't think I read those issues. I remember Elsie Dee, the exploding maid robot, no? Wasn't there a little girl android as well? Wolverine's own series has been quite odd. I kind of stopped reading that one when he squared off against Galactus *wince* and only went back with #1 of the new volume (which has been fine). I'll go back and read the last 50 or so issues at some point.

Bel-Cam Jos
08-11-2003, 11:29 AM
Ha! "Atlantis Attacks" was the Annual crossover - awful. Included in that set was DD Annual #7 - even though Annual #7 had been released the year before....brilliant work there.

Polybagging IS the single greatest evil the hobby EVER knew. I hate foil covers, but polybags were wrong - money grubbing scum use polybags.

True; AA needed to say "My name is Atlantis ["Hi, Atlantis" ] and I have a problem."

Here's an interesting tidbit: a book is meant to be read. Having a "special" book, i.e. one that probably many people would want to read, enclosed in a sealed bag, therefore making it harder to open and therefore read, prevented from easy access to the reading public is faulty. I only bought one (X-Force #1, Cable card) and sold it about a year later. It's the only comic to this day that I ever owned that I never read. :(

jjreason
08-11-2003, 05:03 PM
I think Marvel learned their lesson. The only books I remember being polybagged were Spider-Man #1, The X-tinction Agenda crossover (which deserved to be left in the bags and never read - cuz it sucked), and the annuals from whichever year (New) X-men Annual #2 came out. A few books more recently have been sent with the AOL discs packed in, as recently as last year I believe. Those got cracked open and read right away - they should always offer bagged and non-bagged versions (though they'd probably being throwing away advertisers' money by not including those discs in some copies).

Either way - open them up.

Adam
09-10-2003, 09:30 PM
New X-Men 146 revealed just who Xorn is...

S
P
O
I
L
E
R

S
P
A
C
E
!
!
!




The Master of Magnetism returns! Huzzah!

Beast
09-13-2003, 02:42 PM
I had issues with that revelation, I thought it was cheap and just done because Morrison was getting ready to leave. And he wanted to just write away every change that he's done to the book while he was on it. But after someone directed me to a thread on Google Groups, I have to say that it was pretty clear that it was planned from the beginning. Just going back over the issues since Xorn's apperance in the books. I'll repost it here, because you can't link to it. Remember, do not read unless you want spoilers. :)


So, how does New X-Men #146 add up with Xorn's previous appearances? Let's take a look.

NEW X-MEN 2001: The opening scene which recapped Xorn's history is written as a demonstration for John Sublime of the U-Men and so it's consistent with Magneto's claim to have falsified the whole thing. Ao Jun, the Chinese government agent who's present at the demo, is a mutant and is evidently in on the scam - he plants the clues that lead the X-Men there. (He was killed by a U-Man at the end of the issue, so we'll probably never know for sure.) The scheme was also trying to set up the U-Men, and Magneto would be opposed to them anyway.

The flashback to Xorn being imprisoned is actually Emma Frost reading telepathic imprints from a key which, in retrospect, must have been planted by Magneto. The key is very, very important indeed, for reasons that I'll come back to.

Xorn's first line of dialogue - in English, even though nobody should be able to telepathically teach him the language - is this: "I could have built heaven on earth, if only they'd let me. I could have laid the foundation stones of paradise here on earth." Entirely consistent with Magneto's view of himself.

Xorn's fake prison was called Feng Tu. When asked about this name, Emma Frost replies "It's from mythology."

NEW X-MEN #122: After that, Xorn is packed off to a monastery "for healing." Cyclops picks him up in New X-Men #122 to help in the fight with Cassandra Nova. This is where he suddenly develops healing powers, despite that having nothing whatsoever to do with the "sun in the head" concept.

NEW X-MEN #123: Xorn and Cyclops are knocked out by the Imperial Guard off panel without ever getting off the blocks.

NEW X-MEN #124: Xorn and Cyclops spend this issue as prisoners aboard a Shi'ar craft. Of course, Magneto has a common interest in stopping Cassandra, so there's no logical problem with him siding with the X-Men here. Xorn dutifully plays naive throughout the story, and camps it up tremendously ("He [Scott] is NOT mad. Scott is my friend! WHAT IS THIS WORLD OF LIARS?!")

They escape when Xorn knocks out G-Type of the Imperial Guard as a distraction; Scott attributes this to his suggestion to do something-or-other involving the "sun for a brain" gimmick, but what G-Type actually says is "My core is in flux. There is an unknown gravitational source interfering..."

NEW X-MEN #125: As the fight continues, Xorn is shown to be affecting G-Type with energy waves from his hands, not his head. He goes on to save Lilandra, but then why wouldn't he? It's consistent with his cover, besides which he has no issue with Lilandra, who isn't human.

When Xorn reveals that the spacecraft is about to blow up, his dialogue is (emphasis added): "This superdestroyer machine is about to commit suicide... I can hear its ELECTROMAGNETIC alarms."

NEW X-MEN #126: Xorn and Cyclops return to the Mansion, where Cassandra's body is dying and Xavier has been downloaded into Jean's mind - and she's also dying, because of the nano-sentinel infection. Xorn pronounces Cassandra dead and says that there is nothing he can do about her. Cyclops protests that Xorn said he could "bring the Professor back" - and he was healing dead birds when we saw him in issue #123, so Scott's response isn't unreasonable.

Xorn dodges the question somewhat. He replies "I can, but he is gone from that body and my true task is now clear to me. I'm hear to heal you [referring to Jean]." Xorn then "heals" everyone in the mansion by killing the Sentinel infestations in their body. ("There. The Sentinels in your bloodstream... they are dead now.") Of course, Magneto would have no problem with that, because they're metal creatures. Presumably this is where Magneto picked up the nanosentinels which he claims to have used to fix Xavier's nervous system - the mansion was overrun with them at the relevant time. Xorn then proceeds to help in the fight against Cassandra, but again, why wouldn't he?

Issue #126 is the only time that Xorn the "healer" actually heals anyone - and it's from a disease involving nano-Sentinels. Every other time he's asked to heal someone from anything else, he makes up an excuse not to do it.

NEW X-MEN #127: this is the Xorn solo story. As the penultimate page makes clear, the narration is a letter written by Xorn to Xavier, in character. Therefore, it's all lies and can be safely ignored. What remains is in character for Magneto. He goes to Chinatown in accordance with his cover story. He sees a teenage mutant who's unwell, and tries to help. When the mutant goes nuts (in an area shown to be heavily populated with other mutants), Magneto tries to calm him down. He regrets the boy's death. Strip away the narration, which we now know to be falsified, and the story makes perfect sense - albeit from a rather different light. The narration happily replaces a large chunk of the actual dialogue, so a lot of the time we're left with Xorn's highly dubious account of what was said.

Note also that Xorn establishes in that issue that Xavier can't read his mind - which he attributed to the "blinding" effect of the sun in his head. Presumably the mask actually served a double purpose of disguising Magnus' identity and blocking telepathic scans.

NEW X-MEN #135: Xorn's founded his Special Class. Of course, Xorn remains in character as they go off on their field trip over the next few issues.

In issue #135, Xorn is able to light a campfire by... well, doing something with his head. We see it from behind and vaguely. Device in the helmet? All the other characters are standing behind him as well, incidentally.

Meanwhile, back at the Mansion, the Riot is starting. Oddly, Xorn has chosen to get the hell out of the way and go on a camping trip instead. And just where was Quire getting his drugs from...?

NEW X-MEN #136: Xorn slaughters a bunch of U-Men - entirely out of character for the pacifist. Angel finds him in the aftermath. Xorn's comment is that "Sometimes the teacher must leave to make room for learning," which in retrospect may refer to him dropping his persona. Xorn then tells Angel that "this will be our secret." But why did Xorn want to keep it secret? Now we know.

Angel quietly acquiesces; as we saw this issue, Xorn has extended some sort of mental control over the Special Class, by hijacking Martha's telepathy. ("Martha says we have to do what Mister Xorn says!", according to Ernst. Martha, of course, is hooked up to a machine and therefore at Magneto's mercy...)

NEW X-MEN #137: Xorn is present at the tail end of the Riot, but does nothing of note.

NEW X-MEN #138: Xorn and the Beast head off to recapture Glob Herman. Now we know how Xorn was somehow able to move a bloody great cement mixer apparently using only his physical strength - it's made of metal. Later in the issue, when Quentin Quire is dying, Xavier summons Xorn to heal him. Xorn attends, but again makes excuses for not using his supposed healing powers. He says that Quire is "only changing" and it would be "wrong to interfere." Of course, he's lying. The final exchange of dialogue reads very differently in retrospect:

XORN: When I was a boy, not much younger than you are, Quentin, a little star opened like a flower inside my head.

QUIRE: What if the real enemy... was inside... all along?

XORN [saluting]: A flower made of lights is opening in you. I can help you to let go of your last, painful attachments to this flesh where you were grown. There is something in you that is like me. Do you see?

And then Xorn removes his faceplate, for only Quire to see. Quire screams... and dies before he can tell anyone why.

NEW X-MEN #139: The Jean/Emma showdown. Xorn stands around and has a couple of neutral lines. "I can feel such stress and pain here... like gravity bending space." Hmm.

NEW X-MEN #140: Xorn is looking after the Special Class when Bishop and Sage come round to visit. Sage asks him what he was doing when Emma was shot; his reply is "Meditating, I believe." Near the end of the issue, Sage sets out some of their unanswered questions in narrative captions. One of them, "Who supplied the drug called Kick we keep hearing so much about?" is positioned right next to a panel of Xorn and the Special Class...

NEW X-MEN #141: Sage comments that "We shouldn't have come here, Bishop. There's something rotten at the Xavier School. Riots, drugs, telepathic adultery, murder..." I'll come back to that list later.

The Beak, one of the Special Class under Xorn's influence, offers himself as the murderer but botches the confession. Is Magneto trying to throw the investigators off the scent?

Later, Xorn accompanies Xavier, Sage and Bishop to the hut where Angel and Beak are looking after their pupae. Dialogue:

XORN: Angel and Beak are not killers, Charles. I know these children and trust in their goodness.

XAVIER: Sometimes even the best people will do terrible things to protect their secrets, Mr Xorn.

Did Magneto have Emma killed by one of his Special Class because she had worked out who he really was - or perhaps she knew he was the Kick dealer?

Xorn was, presumably, the man who pointed a gun at Sage's back. She described him as male and "at least six foot two, possibly taller". According to the Official Handbook, Magneto's height is... six foot two.

And Xorn makes no appearance in issues #142-145.

Now then...

Sage listed four things that were symptoms of something being "rotten" at Xavier's school. Presumably Magneto is responsible for all four.

1. RIOTS. Magneto has been subverting the pupils - note that Quire was pro-Magneto. And Quire was also on Kick.

2. DRUGS. Which he got from Magneto.

3. MURDER. Magneto tried to kill Emma, presumably because she either worked out who he was, or found out that he was the Kick supplier.

4. TELEPATHIC ADULTERY. Hold on... telepathic adultery? Magneto was responsible for Scott and Emma's relationship? Ludicrous, I hear you cry!

But no.

Scott and Emma's adultery subplot started in... NEW X-MEN 2001, Xorn's first appearance. Emma is given a key which is supposedly the key to Xorn's cell, but which we now know must have been created by Magneto as part of the charade. Cyclops asks her to read it telepathically for information. Emma replies "I'll try, but I hope you all realize this could take hour upon tedious hour..."

To her immense surprise, she is instead bombarded with overpowering images of Xorn's supposed origin story in the very next panel, and doesn't even get to finish her sentence. Emma finds exposure to Magneto's poisoned key so unpleasant that she collapses and then switches to diamond form in order to turn off her telepathic powers.

That night (and a mere two pages later), Emma turns up at Scott's room wearing an evening gown and holding champagne. "I couldn't sleep after the traumas of the day," she says.

The key was clearly set up to deceive telepaths. Did it also poison Emma's mind and put the idea of the affair into her head? Apparently so...
MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

THE Slayer
09-15-2003, 11:41 PM
I have read x-men for years, minus a small gap just before and after onsluaght. But right now, the stories basically suck, I havent even finished an entire issue of late, basically because of the art in a couple of the last ones. But I hate the Xorn twists.. whatever. I kinda liked Xorn before, he was just another mutie with a secret but now, this is possibly one of the worst things... ever.

jjreason
09-18-2003, 12:37 AM
Im nearly inclined to agree here, Slayer. The huge problem - and it's medium wide in comic books - is that there's NO SHOCK left when someone rises from the dead. None. Been done to death. Magneto's death on Genosha was brilliant, and showcased Magnus perfectly: full of defiance right until the bitter end. It was a death that fit the character, and felt final - at least to me. That being said, the Marvel Universe (and particularly the X corner) is a lot less interesting without him in it. I figure'd they'd bring him back AGAIN at some point when sales were lagging and they needed a boost, but Im a little disappointed Morrison did it himself. He should have gone out like Byrne (who left Jean Grey dead).

All that being said - I have hope for the rest of Morrison's era. He's done more for the X-books than anybody since Byrne (Claremont was around so long, obviously he's the reason we're all here reading this stuff - but his time has come and gone as he so spectacularly showcased in X-Treme over the past 6 months. Byrne stirred the pot, and so too has Morrison).

Beast
09-18-2003, 12:57 AM
How did he show defiance? He was sitting recouperating in a wheelchair on Genosha when one of Cassandra Nova's Sentinels smashed into the window of his tower causing it to explode and supposedly finally kill him.

And clearly by all the issues that came before the revelation of Magneto, it was something that was always planned from the start. Basicall Xorn was a 2-year long Eric the Red. All of Xorn's appearances clearly show that it was planned from the very beginning.

As for the Morrison era? Thank god it's over with. He leaves the New X-Men comics at Issue #150. He's headed over to DC after that, being signed to work on some of their minor characters in one of their fringe books. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
09-19-2003, 01:36 AM
Have a look at the art, JarJar - he's daring that thing to smash through the window - at least that's what I see. He wasn't shaking his fist or anything like that, but Ill stick with defiant nonetheless. Arrogant, as if he knew it couldn't hurt him. And yes, based on that info you copied from someone else's post from another site - it's apparent it was planned out. I never tried to argue that point -I simply voiced my displeasure with the revelation. Having now read the book, Im filled with hope that the rest of this arc will be well done.

I still don't really understand what exactly you don't like about Morrison's run either - you continue to post about not liking it, but the only thing I can remember you commenting negatively on was the look of Beast resulting from his secondary mutation. In my opinion, these were some of the most thought provoking and emotional X-Men stories I've ever read. He's aimed New X at an older audience, one that's seen the inside of comics like Preacher and the Authority, one that's used to a little more edge. God knows we (the longtime readers) needed it, with crap like Onslaught and the 2nd Age of Apocalypse, the X-Men were mired in mediocrity for nearly 2 years. Someone needed to kick those books in the ***.

Oh, and FYI, he'll be around until issue 154. Once Planet X is over, the last 4 issues will be drawn by Marc Silvestri.

THE Slayer
09-24-2003, 11:53 PM
Not to stray from the Xorn debate but has anyone else noticed that out of the last 15 or so issues of Uncanny X-men, that Northstar has been the on the cover three times . . . Not that I keep a running Northstar count, but he's been alone on all three, (and he's hardly in two of those issues/ he's in like four panels of the current issue.)
What's going on here . . .

AT-AT Man
09-25-2003, 06:51 AM
hey, nother question, is Ultimate X-Men worth the cash as well. It looks pretty cool. Which charecters are main players, both good and bad. Which charecters have been in past issues, and which issues have been your favorites. Any help would be fine, seeing as i haven't read any Ultimate series before. Thanks in advance.

El Chuxter
09-25-2003, 11:34 AM
I personally don't care for any of the Ultimate books, but I know they're very popular (and well-written). The art is pretty consistently good; on X-Men, the artist is one of the Kubert brothers. (I get those two so confused.) Well, let me restate that. I don't get most of them, but I will probably buy all the trade paperbacks at some point so I do know what's going on.

The last time I thumbed through Ultimate, the cast was Charles, Jean, Cyclops, Storm, Colossus, Beast, Wolvie (James to RooJay :p), Iceman, and maybe Kitty. I know Gambit showed up once, as well, but I'm not sure if he joined. They need Ultimate Jubilee. :cool:

Beast
09-25-2003, 12:46 PM
Ultimate X-Men is actually quite good. A lot of old comic fans have problems with it, because it's made a lot of massive changes to the universe that people are familar with. But it's also updated that X-Men (And the other Marvel Properties) for the new millenium and restarted the universe for new readers. Yes, I have issues with it myself. But less then what's going on in the current 616 Universe.

And El Chuxter is right, the current team is Charles, Marvel Girl, Cyclops, Storm, Colossus, Beast (Yipee!!), Wolverine, and Iceman. Kitty is a member of the school, but her mother doesn't want her going on missions. Though she's stowed away once in the back of the X-Jet on a trip to the Savage Land. :)

Issue #40 is gonna be the big one, for a lot of classic fans. As they are finally going to introduce Warren Worthington III, aka Angel. And Alison Blair, aka The Dazzler is set to make her first appeareance as well. I wouldn't be suprised if Jub-Jub showed up then as well. As the goverment is forming 'The New Mutants', a group of Mutants that will be able to take down the X-Men should they go rogue again. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
09-25-2003, 03:36 PM
ok sounds pretty cool. I think i'll have to pick up some back issues. Who are the major villians, or is it jusy Magneto.

Beast
09-25-2003, 04:08 PM
ok sounds pretty cool. I think i'll have to pick up some back issues. Who are the major villians, or is it jusy Magneto.
Well, the main Villian is Magneto and his Brotherhood of Mutants. The main Brotherhood roster at the start of the comics was:

Magneto
Scarlet Witch
Quicksilver
The Blob
Toad
Mastermind

Weapon X turned up for a time, kidnapping the X-Men and and introduced Sabretooth. That also brought in Nightcrawler, Rogue, and Juggernaut. When Weapon X was destroyed, Sabretooth, Rogue, and Juggernaut joined the Brotherhood. It also gained Multiple Man and Forge. But just like 616, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver eventually turned their back on Magneto and joined up with the Ultimates (The Avengers).

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
09-25-2003, 05:34 PM
ok sounds very cool.

Beast
09-26-2003, 03:32 PM
I have to say, that I don't like Magneto's new look at all. They're doing the same thing they did with Mystique and Bullseye, trying to make them look more like the movie versions. I much prefer his armored costume. :p

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

El Chuxter
09-26-2003, 03:38 PM
I have to say, that I don't like Magneto's new look at all. They're doing the same thing they did with Mystique and Bullseye, trying to make them look more like the movie versions. I much prefer his armored costume. :p

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Yeah, but they've already taken most of the X-Men completely out of costumes and into street clothes, so it's not so bad a change. What do you mean about Mystique, though? I haven't noticed any major differences. At least she doesn't run around nekkid. :sur:

Beast
09-26-2003, 04:03 PM
Yeah, but they've already taken most of the X-Men completely out of costumes and into street clothes, so it's not so bad a change. What do you mean about Mystique, though? I haven't noticed any major differences. At least she doesn't run around nekkid. :sur:
Yeah, but they still have the leather uniforms. Really hoping that now that Morrison is leaving and undoing all that happened during his reign on the books that we'll see Beast re-evolve to his ape-like self. :)

As for Mystique. Around the time the movie came out, she was altered in the books to gain the scales that she has in the movie in her normal form. Though she's lost them as of recently, either that or she remains morphed in her old form now most of the time. Here's the info from a comic site I frequent. :)

After time-travelers returned from their journey, Mystique realized that Prosh himself was the threat that he had warned them about, having been programmed by the Celestials to attack humanity and he set about attacking the team. They fought him off and Toad discovered that the true driving force behind the events had been the Stranger, who had been manipulating everyone for his own gains. The time-travelers quickly realized that the severely-wounded Toad was the key to defeating the Stranger (due to Toad's extensive knowledge of the Stranger's technology). Mystique grudgingly accepted that she’d have to help save Toad if she wanted to escape the situation, so she went with him to Prosh's medical bay and oversaw his care. However, the conduit which provided the cellular regeneration for his body came loose and she was forced to repair it, in spite of the danger to herself, as she was doused by the energy. The result of this was that Toad's mutant potential was fully expressed and Mystique's body was changed by the energy into a naked, scaly, default form.

6) When Mystique tried to save Toad, she too was genetically changed by Prosh’s machines. As a result her default state sported scales with slicked back hair. [X-Men Forever #6] Actually, this was done to make her look like in the successful movie adaption of the X-Men. It is unknown whether the scaly state is still her default form and Mystique only shapeshifts into her old template because she likes it more.
MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
09-27-2003, 02:03 AM
Some very intresting info about the future of New X-Men and some intresting pictures have been posted for an interview with Grant Morrison. Note the preview page I'm attaching for New X-Men 151 (which is supposed to take place sometime 100-150 issues in the future), shows Beak (Adult), Ernst?/Stuff?/Cassandra Nova? w/ Martha, and Wolverine together. :)

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=2815

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Eternal Padawan
10-02-2003, 04:54 PM
Beak(Adult) doesn't begin to describe the bulked up, chain wearing, hawk headed, Silvestri drawn awesomeness that is Beak in the future.

And how does our resident Hank McCoy fan feel about the furry one's demise in New X-Men 150? The grand finale to Planet X leaves the X-Men short one blue scientist kitty...permanently.

Beast
10-02-2003, 05:08 PM
And how does our resident Hank McCoy fan feel about the furry one's demise in New X-Men 150? The grand finale to Planet X leaves the X-Men short one blue scientist kitty...permanently.
I don't believe that they're going to permanently kill him. Remember Marvel's new edict that dead = dead. So I doubt that they're going to off one of the original X-Men without a way to bring him back. And Morrison's own little comments about 'Noone really dies in Marvel, they just change'. If it is the end for Henry Phillip 'Hank' McCoy, he better go out with a bang. Give us fans some closure on his death, instead of him dieing lamely. And Cripes, I just lost Splinter this year. Leave Beast alone, for gods sake.

But I still think they're going to twist the death, so that he appears to die. Maybe even getting a visit from Colossus as he's starting to cross over, so Henry can have some closure for his friend dieing due to his cure. But that Piotr will tell him that it's not his time. And that way, they can have him return later in his earlier ape-like form. Almost all Beast fans hated the feline change. Even Marvel uses his old form for most other projects and merchandise. And he still is ape-like in Ultimate and Evo. And especially the reasons behind why it was done. Quietly thought that Beast should look more like the Disney 'Beauty and the Beast' Beast. And Morrison liked the idea. It is a ridiculous reason for to change a character, to make them look more like a Disney Character.

It's also been postulated that the Phoenix Force inside Jean is what dies, and Jean reverts to normal old Jean Grey/Marvel Girl. That would also be a satisfactory way of ending things. Especially since the cover picture for #150 shows Jean on fire from the Phoenix Force, and Wolverine on his knees in agony or tears. I can definatly see the Phoenix dieing so that normal Jean returns. We'll have to wait and see, but I still doubt whoever they are killing is a main cast member, or being a permanent death. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
10-02-2003, 07:17 PM
Well, sadly EP seems to have his finger on the pulse of all things comic. Based on his post, I think we'll be seeing the Beast bite it. Really, what can they do with him that hasn't been done? This is the mutant that they've had to re-mutate twice to keep interesting. Marvel is rife with mad scientist types, so there's no need to worry about that job being vacant. That being said, he's a long standing character, and his loss would be felt Marvel Universe wide - if it's handled properly. He would deserve an Avengers sanctioned funeral and everything.

I guess reading the X-Men will be a Hankless job from that point forward....... :rolleyes:

Beast
10-02-2003, 07:42 PM
Well, I've been following the news pretty closely myself. The only people it's confirmed not being is X, Scott, and Jean. So there's still Wolverine, Emma, and Beast of the main crew. And there's tons of students and second stringers that could die. We'll just have to wait and see. But I still have high doubts for his death, since Morrison was incredibly upset that he didn't get to use Colossus or Moira due to their deaths. Hence the reasons he gave Emma her Diamond form and wrangled Beast from X-Treme. So I have a feeling he's not going to kill another major player, with no means of bringing them back. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
10-03-2003, 05:58 PM
Well, I just read 147 and Im of the mind that they might go ahead and whack Magneto again. His powers are just beyond understanding thanks to the kick (which I had no idea he'd even used before reading this issue - but he says "Once more can't hurt" or something when Esme provides it for him), and he's on a rampage scarier than most I've seen in comics. I don't know what else they'll be able to do, what with Chuck in the "bacta tank" and most of the big guns MIA or otherwise incapacitated. Killing Magneto again so soon would be a surprise, but it might be called for before this arc plays out.

El Chuxter
10-03-2003, 06:07 PM
Ahh, Jubilation will finally live up to her potential and off him in #150. :crazed:

Beast
10-03-2003, 06:08 PM
Well, that's if what he's doing is really happening. It's speculated that he's being tricked by one of the telepaths that what he's doing is real. Remember he did remove his helmet infront of Xavier, so Xavier could have whammied him. Or Esme is manipulating him, since she was the one that made Beast believe he was at a play with the Cuckoos that one night. There's also Martha and supposedly Cassandra Nova in his new Brotherhood that are Telepaths.

What makes me believe it's not really happening, is the fact he's destroyed the Brooklyn Bridge and toppled the Statue of Liberty. You would think the Avengers, FF, Spider-Man, or one of the other X-Teams would have shown up to try to stop the madman. I know it's an X-Comic, but still it's in a large universe of other heroes, being set in New York. But nothing, no X-Men even other then naked Xavier in his Bacta tank. :)

People have been complaining about Magnus' use of the Kick drug, to enhance his powers. Saying that it's not Magneto-like for him to do that. But he's been known to use other means to gain more power. Polaris and Fabian Cortez for examples. So I don't see it as being that much out of character. And after so many years of being beaten, and the last blows of being paralyzed and then having his precious Genosha destroyed, he's probably a bit desperate.

The really odd thing is, that Xorn is shown to appear on the front of New X-Men #149. So is there a real Xorn that Magneto replaced? Or what exactly is going on. It's really getting confusing, but Morrison is good with the confusion and red herrings. So we'll have to see how things play out. Maybe the real Xorn will be the X-Men that will die in #150. It better not be Beast, like I already said, I just lost Splinter this year, for cripes sake. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
10-03-2003, 11:45 PM
I suppose that's possible, but Marvel's odd about when they choose to get everyone involved in assaults on NYC. Over in Thor, for the last 6 months or so Asgard has been hovering right above Manhattan. Any mention of that in the other books? Nope. Huge battle between the Asgardians and Earth.... any other heroes there? Nope. Weird how some major threats attract everyone whereas other calamities seemingly go ignored. I guess it can all be explained by the ever popular "well, the Avengers were out west with the Red Storm, and the FF is over in Latveria" (which would essentially be true in Marvel Time), and there you go. Magnus has a Manhattan devoid of heavy hitters to lay waste to.

I would expect there to be a real Xorn. I can't think why else he'd be on the cover, unless that's part of the big mind screw the telepath is playing on ol' Mags. We'll have to wait and see I guess.

Whatever happens, New X has leapfrogged Uncanny as my #1 "to read" book - ahead of EVERYTHING else.

jjreason
10-05-2003, 01:59 AM
More X reading has been done at JJ's house. Unlike some (EP, CHUX, COME OUT HERE AND OWN UP) Im pretty happy with the Draco after part 3. I liked Tan's art again on the whole, and his covers are amazing. Im sticking with my original assessment: Island of Los Demonas and the whole Demon Spawn concept is a little contrived - but at least their doing something with Nightcrawler's origin. I think it's a very interesting revelation for Kurt to find out he actually IS the very thing he has strived his whole life to NOT be (at least the thing he has strived to NOT BE SEEN AS).

The truth about who begat who (pertaining to Polaris as well as Kurt) has also been interesting, though somewhat predicatable - except for Azazel. I don't think anyone saw that coming without reading Previews.

Over in Wolverine's solo series, issue 5 contained a fairly significant flip out rage, Logan style. Pretty great 2 page spread by Darick Robinson when Wolvie finally finds the guy who...... well I won't spoil any more than that. The first arc has been worth the money, that's all I'll say.

Beast
10-07-2003, 07:07 PM
*WARNING SPOILERS*

Some very intresting pictures and news about the Future Arc for New X-Men 151-154. What I'd like to know, is why Normal Beast appears with a nightcrawler tail. And why Kitty Cat Beast seems to appear wearing a cape and working for what appears to be a bad guy? Kitty Cat Beast = Dark Beast? Of course, since it's so far in the future, who knows what's going on.

Kind of like “Here Comics Tomorrow.” Set nearly two centuries in the future, the story reveals an entirely new team of X-Men (with some familiar faces) facing a global conflict. It’s not post-apocalyptic, as Silvestri explains, it’s set at the brink of the apocalypse. And it’s Morrison’s last word on the Phoenix.

http://www.newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6052

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
10-18-2003, 06:04 PM
hey quick question to whoever has read the Ultimate X-Men Arc, Return of the King. I haven't read it, but i have looked through the TPB and the drawing style changes in the middle to a very weird looking animation. Can anyone tell me why they do this, without spoilig the whole story. Looking at this, is stopping me from buying this, because i think it looks stupid, but if it's significant to the story i might have to pick it up.

Beast
10-18-2003, 06:40 PM
hey quick question to whoever has read the Ultimate X-Men Arc, Return of the King. I haven't read it, but i have looked through the TPB and the drawing style changes in the middle to a very weird looking animation. Can anyone tell me why they do this, without spoilig the whole story. Looking at this, is stopping me from buying this, because i think it looks stupid, but if it's significant to the story i might have to pick it up.
Are you sure it's TPB #6: 'Return of the King' that does that. I looked through my TPB, and I don't see any major change in the art. And the info on the issue, says that it's all been done by the same artists. Are you sure you're not confusing it with TPB #4: 'Hellfire and Brimstone'? There is a very blatent change in artists for two issues in the middle of that arc (Issue 23 &24), when they used a new artist. And instead of fairly realistic character drawings, it went to a freaky Anime style. It is very jarring, to say the least. As the characters look way to cartoony for those two issues. As for whether or not to get 'Return of the King'. Yes, it's one of the best arcs in the entire series.

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
10-19-2003, 12:40 AM
my bad, thinking back, your right. My fault. I confused the two. I feel stupid now. Definately going to pick it up then.

On a side note, is Hellfire and Brimstone worth getting even though the animation is screwed up.

Beast
10-19-2003, 12:53 AM
Don't feel bad. It's an easy mistake. As for whether to pick it up, I would say go for it. It's the worst story arc in the series though, in my opinion. But there are some very important things that happen that tie into 'Ultimate War' (TPB #5) and 'Return of the King' (TPB #6). Storyline-wise though, it's definatly the weakest of the 6 that are out now. But better then the current story arc, 'BlockBuster'. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
10-19-2003, 12:57 AM
So Blockbuster isn't worth gwtting into? I bought issue 37 yesterday because i was curious, and it seemed aright, but i was a little confused as that was the only issue in the arc i'v picked up.

Beast
10-19-2003, 01:06 AM
It's not bad, it's just the focus for the first 4 issues of Blockbuster isn't even on the 'X-Men'. It's Wolverine, Spidey, and Daredevil. And I'm not a huge fan of Wolverine, so I hate when his character becomes he driving force of the story. Issue #38 does get Wolvie back to the mansion, with some appearances by the X-Men, especially Xavier and Jean. But I'm waiting for #40, for the premiere of Angel and Dazzler. :D

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
10-19-2003, 01:07 AM
yes i too am waiting to pick up that arc. I can't wait, angel is one of my other fave mutants.

THE Slayer
10-20-2003, 11:33 PM
Well the latest X-book, with beast on the cover, can I just seg-way real quick. One of my least favorite practices is when the cover art is not reflective of what's inside the book, WHATSOEVER!! Beast on the cover! Is he in a frame that I missed?? ANyways, I read the whole thing and now I'm somewhat, a lot, confused. Who is going to die?? SO is that 'stabbing' thing real or no?? So, so, so confused!!!

Beast
10-20-2003, 11:47 PM
I know, I've been reading a ton of complaints about the cover of the comics as of late. New X-Men in particular. Are they just trying to give everyone that could possibly die their own cover? Not that I believe that anyone of any importance will actually -Die Die-.

Someone mentioned over on another board, that Beast is in the issue. But he was either full of it, or everyone else is missing him. Cause he never said where. And then there's the fact that Xorn's on the cover of the next issue. Makes no sense what's so ever. :rolleyes:

As for who's going to die and what is going on. I think it's all a red herring. I'm betting that the last issue will reveal everyone in stasis tanks like Xavier. And all of them being TP tortured by Esme. I'm betting she's manipulating Magneto's mind also, by combinaton of the Kick drug and her own TP powers. I don't think anything we're seeing Magneto do, is really happening. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

THE Slayer
10-23-2003, 12:35 AM
Well I just happen to have #148 in front of me, and beast clearly isnt in it. ARG. anyways, I kinda like the solo covers, I think I brought this up with northstar a while back, but a least he's in like two pannels. I just don't like covers that include either scenes or people that are not in the issue. I know covers gernerally like to destort what's going on inside. How interesting could 6 pages of wolvie and jean diatribe be anywas. But I still think a cover that resemembled what happened in the end would have made sooooo much more sense....

AT-AT Man
10-24-2003, 06:57 AM
Hey JarJar, picked up the Return of the King TPB, I haven't reas ti yet, but i flipped throuh it and it looks magnificent

Beast
10-24-2003, 08:25 AM
Cool. Let me know what you think of it. Note that it does tie into things that occured in 'Hellfire and Brimestone' and 'Ultimate War'. Though you don't have to have read them to know what's going on. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

AT-AT Man
10-24-2003, 04:21 PM
well i read Ulimate War and i have it, but like i said earlier i haven't and don't know if i will pick up Hellfire and Brimstone.

AT-AT Man
10-30-2003, 06:52 AM
picked up Draco part 4. Glanced at the new Ultimate X-Men, but decided i'd wait for the TPB which is coming in January.

Also on another note, picked up the second part to the new Ultimate Spidey arc about the Kingpin. This arc is very good. I like the way the story is going.

On a side note, where did the purchases thread go.

jjreason
10-30-2003, 02:25 PM
Yes, the weekly purchases thread has been removed, for reasons unknown. I've made the appropriate enquiries, and am waiting to hear back from the powers that be. Until then, we can talk x-books I guess.......

Draco Part IV - Personally, Im more interested in what's happening with Sammy and Cain than the whole Azazel thing which is kind of fizzling. It has promise though, and remains my #2 book to read right now.

New X "Planet X part 3" - whoa. Quite the last couple of pages, Im sure next issue is going to reveal a lot, leaving issue 150 as the tidy up story.

Wolverine 6 - Kurt and Logan "in the bar" again, discussing Logan's concern over what happened in issues 1-5. I found this a good read, and beautifully drawn. If you're not getting this book regularly, I'd recommend this issue as a "test the water" one. Worth the money.

Aside: Does anyone find it a little odd to read these books each month? Logan is everywhere, all the time. I think the editors need to build a little more cohesion between the 2 main titles. Plausability does matter a little.

Jedi_Master_Guyute
10-31-2003, 07:16 PM
Pay dizay!! Haven't picked much up lately, but scored big today!!

Got Ultimate spidey 47-48 and Hulk 61-62. Lookin' forward to see where Spidey is going; i haven't read it since Aunt May's breakdown a few issues back.
Also curious where the hell Jones is taking Hulk. :D

jjreason
11-07-2003, 02:31 AM
JMG, we're gonna need a review of the Hulk books. I've found them very good, and have been very happy to see Deodato back on this book. Were you surprised by the ending of 62? I don't want to spoil it for anyone, so that's all I'll say......

El Chuxter
01-08-2004, 03:13 PM
Marc Silvestri is awesome!

Grant Morrison is going out with a bang!

150 years in the future, and Wolvie is going strong, the Stepfords are still rather young, Cassandra Nova is in charge of the mansion. . . And the Beast is evil and trying to kill them all with clones of Nightcrawler! I can't make sense of it, but Grant's shown an amazing ability to create awesome stories out of confusing beginnings.

But where's the continuity throughout? In the latest issue of Wolverine: The End, he's half-dead of old age at the age of 210! (Also, who's been trying to kill him for 200 years? Sabretooth? Dog Logan? Pa Logan? Grandpa Howlett?)

And in Uncanny, what a mess. Only the art and Jubilee (who is apparently nothing more than a minor foil to main character Husk) have kept me coming back. Soooo, the flashback at the end of New X-Men implies the X-Men have completely dissolved. But I guess no one felt the need to tell Nightcrawler's team. Nor do they seem to care at all that Jean, a close friend to all, is dead.

jjreason
01-14-2004, 08:10 PM
I posted this elsewhere. If you've read it before there's nothing new here, beside this lame lead in, that is.......

Okay, I went on a bit of a reading binge. First off, the bad:

Draco: Conclusion. Man, would anyone have said this storyline would finish on such a flat note? Crikey, the subplot with Juggernaut outdid this mess for interest, action, plausability, you name it since the third issue. This was meant to be a huge revelation story - the secret of Kurt's lineage revealed once and for all. I would have made "The Draco" a four parter, containing much briefer glimpses of Sam and Cain. The next 4 issues could have been devoted to the fall out from Draco, Cain in Vancouver and then the subsequent trial. The art in the last Draco issue looked like a joke. I seriously couldn't get over how bad it was compared to the first couple of dark and gritty issues.

Here's how the conclusion to that story SHOULD have gone:

DO: Have a final, tense confrontation between Azazel and Kurt, making him choose between his demonic biology and his learned "Xavierist-Good Samaritanism". Ideally, throw Azazel's or even Mystique's life in the balance, so his choice (to save her, to let her die, to let Azazel fall into a forever-closing dimensional portal, you name it) reflects his choice to be a good man rather than a demon. This was totally disregarded. No tension = no trial = Kurt doesn't grow or change at all as a result of this "pivotal" story (for that particluar character, anyway).

DONT: give up on the story half way, letting it peter-out in favor of the better Juggernaut story.

DO: Make sure the art stays constant through each story arc. If not by the same artist, at least make sure the finished product is cohesive.

DON'T: put the final approval on some 6th grader's inks the last issue of an important story, inks that cheapen the whole feel of the final book. The first issues in this arc were dark and gritty. This issue looked like Power Pack.

NOW, ON WITH THE GOOD!

Trial of Juggernaut - not bad, I didn't need the obligatory slug-fest between the Juggies, and didn't understand how that kid (NOTE: whom I don't recall in any issue I've read hurting animals near the Mansion.... where's the editor's footnote on that - JJ) got ahold of the armor, or how he ever managed to get it to work for him that well. I did prefer Garney's art, though it looked a little rushed. His Rhino looked pretty cool on the splash page. Jesus.

PLANET X: CONCLUSION

Good story. Too bad I spoiled it for myself, and too bad everything old is new again. Im of the opinion Wolverine found out he was being turned into a hound, which drove him batty. Excellent, and not belaboured. I didn't see that coming. Fantomex is pretty Firefly-like in terms of coolness. Great looking character. I would have preferred to see someone else bite the big one, but it's all apparently done for a reason, as we find out in....

HERE COMES THE FUTURE PART 1

Great art. The new computer age fits Silvestri to a T. His art always looked a little scratchy to me, but he approaches Jim Lee levels of cool facial expressions in this first issue now that the computer can sort out the color separations a little more cleanly.

And I still have to read issue 1 of "She Sleeps with Angels" before I'm caught up. The art looks better again, though. Not minding the whole Japanese thing as a break here and there.

Beast
02-10-2004, 11:57 AM
Wow, this is massive news. I wonder what direction he's going to take the series in. But Variety has confirmed that Brian Singer, director of X-Men and X-2: X-Men United will be teaming with co-writers Mike Dougherty and Dan Harris to do a full year of Ultimate X-Men comics for Marvel Comics before they work on X-3. Damn, this is big news. And now Ultimate X-Men may be able to steal back some of U-Spidey's popularity!!

http://www.countingdown.com/movies/2756437/news?item_id=3357672

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
02-19-2004, 05:27 PM
Yay. The May (Re-Loaded) Solicitations are up. And so is the reveal that Joss Whedon's new book will start then. Astonishing X-Men #1. The team is back in costumes again. And Beast's shed all that extra clothing. Now if only they can get him to shed that damn Lion look. That will probably happen sometime during the series. But it does looks like a good team. Emma, Wolverine, Cyclops, Shadowcat(?) (or is that Jean?), and Beast. :)

ASTONISHING X-MEN #1
Written by JOSS WHEDON
Pencils & Cover by JOHN CASSADAY
"GIFTED" pt. 1 (of 6)
Dream-team creators JOSS WHEDON (creator of TV’s Buffy the Vampire Slayer) and JOHN CASSADAY (Planetary, CAPTAIN AMERICA) bring you the explosive #1 issue of the all-new flagship X-Men series! As part of X-MEN: RELOAD, this issue marks a return to classic greatness and the beginning of a brand-new era for the X-Men.
32 PGS./MARVEL PSR …$2.99
UPC: 5960605543-00111
http://newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9329

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

El Chuxter
02-19-2004, 05:43 PM
Don't like the Cyclops costume with the skullcap. Sorry. :) Other than that, it sounds cool.

SPANDEX!!!!

-Durge-
02-21-2004, 06:52 PM
Nice pic JJB. Yes I to do want Beast to shed the lion look.

jjreason
02-22-2004, 09:37 AM
John Cassaday is outstanding, that picture of the X-Men looks great. Will this be, then, a FOURTH monthly X-Men book? Weekly X-Men isn't what I need. I'll try it out, but I haven't been getting "X-Treme" X-Men, and I'm not 100% sold on buying this either, unless it's great.

El Chuxter
02-23-2004, 11:49 AM
But JJ. . . SPANDEX!! And maybe BAD GUYS, too!!

I'm wondering 'bout the teams. This looks to be:
Wolverine
Cyclops
White Queen
Beast
Kitty (?)

New X is:
Wolverine
Cyclops
Beast
White Queen
Esme
Beak

Uncanny is:
Archangel
Nightcrawler
Havok
Polaris
Husk
Jubilee
sometimes Wolverine

X-Treme (for what it's worth, if anyone cares) is:
Storm
Gambit
Bishop
Rogue
Cannonball
that computer woman
sometimes Wolverine

That's a lot of overlap!! Especially from Master Howlett! :eek:

Beast
02-23-2004, 12:26 PM
El Chux, all the books are being that revamped that month. Line-ups will change and teams will break off and go seperate ways. Like Angel is going with Xavier to start rebuilding Genosha in Excalibur (previously X-Treme.) And New X-Men is becoming just X-Men. New Mutants is becoming, New X-Men: Mutant Academy. Etc. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

El Chuxter
02-23-2004, 12:49 PM
Ah, I see. X-Treme is chucking that ridiculous moniker? Nice. I never thought I'd say this, but hopefully they're putting Claremont out to pasture?

Any full team rosters yet? I'm dying to know which book I must buy to get my regular Jubilation fix. :D

jjreason
02-23-2004, 06:51 PM
Oh, man. Guess I'll have to start with everything, then weed out the books I'm not enjoying as much. I don't want to spend all my comic money on X-books every month.

Beast
02-23-2004, 07:16 PM
No full rosters yet, just rumors and hints from the covers that were pulled down. Emma, Scott, Wolverine, Kitty(?), and Beast seem to be the focus of Astonishing. Emma and Scott are running the school, in New X-Men: Academy X. Bishop and Sage are going to District X, Bishop's new 'Cop' book set in a section of New York's mutant town. I forget what else I've heard. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Eternal Padawan
02-26-2004, 12:32 PM
Well, you'll be happy to know that Extreme X-men is getting canned and Claremont is jumping back over to Uncanny and Austen ( I think ) is taking over New. AND Claremont and (HOORAY!) Alan Davis are restarting Excalibur. The only confirmed team members are Archangel and Professor X. So you're newly freshly minted complete X-roster is ALREADY outdated, bubba. :)

I would like to submit my idea for a ANOTHER monthly X-Title called The Intrepid X-Men starring all the Marvel Mutants who don't get no lovin' like Cloak & Dagger, Sunfire, Skids, Artie, Leech, that little Asian kid in the wheelchair who is now probably in his early twenties. So are Artie and Leech for that matter. I bet Leech probably speaks pretty good english now. And Artie, even though he's mute, can probably "project" english up so you can just "read" what he's saying to you. I submit that Leech is the most powerful mutant the X-Men could take along on missions because he CANCLES the X-Gene. And he's probably been honing it all these years back in the soup kitchen at the mansion or wherever they've had him and Artie holed up.

Artie and Leech RULE.

Beast
02-27-2004, 04:30 AM
It's confirmed to be Kitty. A section of the 'script' for the first issue turned up in Marvel Previews. Sounds pretty dang good. Scott, Wolvie, and Emma are spot on. Kitty seems a bit off, and to early to tell on Hank. But so far it sounds good. And another member of the Excalibur cast has been confirmed. Rachael Summers as the New Marvel Girl, will be joining Xavier and Angel on Genosha. The following was posted over on Millar World. :)

Thought you might find this interesting! The people on the cover of Astonishing X-Men #1 are Emma Frost, Wolverine, Cyclops, Shadowcat and Beast! This is in the Marvel Previews you'll get tomorrow.

Plus, a bonus script from Astonishing X-Men #1

Page Sixteen:

Panel One:
On Kitty and Emma in the Danger Room:

Kitty
Remember when this place was just flame-throwers and rotation knives? I miss that.

Emma
Can we please let Scott finish, people?

Kitty
Now I have cloud-hair.

Panel two:
Above them all as Scott continues -- Hank working a floating keypad not unlike the one on Emma's podium before.

Scott
The point is simply this: we need to get into the world. Saving lives, helping with disaster relief...we need to present ourselves as a team like any other.

Scott
Avengers, Fantastic Four -- they don't get schased through the street with torches.

Logan
Here comes the tights...

Panel three:
On Scott.

Scott
Sorry Logan, Superheroes wear costumes. And quite frankly, all the black leather is making people nervous.

Panel four:
On Kitty, her hair a little wet, raising her hand. Logan in BG, Emma looking away.

Kitty
Ok, I officially really really don't know why I'm here. I'm not a fighter like you guys.

Logan
You've been in it plenty, kid. I'd take you at my back any day.

Panel five:
Scott again, as the background behind him becomes weirdly digitized.

Scott
But you're not a fighter. Your power isn't aggressive, it's protective. That's good to show. And people like you.

Page Seventeen:

Panel One:
On the group, as a beach locale, normal size, is forming around them. Hank looking up from the keyboard.

Hank
(to himself)
Here we are...

Scott
Hank's articulate as anything, but what people see is mostly...well, a beast. Emma's a former villian. Logan's a thug.

Logan
Born and bred.

Scott
And me...I can lead a team.

Panel two:
Tight on Scott.

Scott
But I haven't looked anybody in the eye since I was fifteen.

Panel three:
Kitty doesn't look happy, therefore Emma is.

Kitty
So I'm, what, a PR Stunt?

Emma
Yes, our own poster child. Isn't it sweet? "The Non-threatening Shadowcat". Or "Sprite", or "Ariel" or whatever incredibly unimpressive name you're using nowadays.

Panel four:
Scott. And the rest in BG, Emma looking taken aback --

Scott
Emma, shut up. You all may have perfectly good reasons for not wanting to do this. But you're the team I chose. So think about it.

Panel five:
HZ on a rather glum group, Hank gamely offering:

Hank
Am I the only one who's dying to see the outfits?
MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Eternal Padawan
02-27-2004, 06:52 PM
Sorry Logan, Superheroes wear costumes. And quite frankly, all the black leather is making people nervous.

Man, that's a funny subtle dig at Quitely's redesign of the X-Duds. Heh.

Beast
02-28-2004, 05:01 PM
Oooo, the new X-Mansion from 616 sure is looking snazzy. I'll have to pick up the handbook, if it has a good map of the mansion in it. Oh, the covers and solicits are up again. Should you want a peek at reloaded. :)

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0402/25/xmenhandbook.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0402/25/marvel.htm

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

-Durge-
02-28-2004, 06:56 PM
Is this Iceman? http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0402/25/xmen157.htm

-Durge-
02-28-2004, 07:00 PM
What has happened to Beast?! He looks horrible!! http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0402/25/excalibur1.htm

Beast
02-28-2004, 07:12 PM
Yes, that's Iceman.

And yes, that's Beast. And that's what New X-Men's Morrison did to him. Frank Quietly had did some designs of Beast based on the character from Beauty and the Beast. Morrison liked the look, and got Marvel to approve it. Since Beast was one of the main stars of X-Treme X-Men at the time, and was still apelike, some changes had to be made. Basically, the writers had Vargas (a big lame baddy at the time), nearly kill Beast. He was in a coma and not expected to live. Sage, who posesses the ability to advance the X-Gene to the next level amped Beast's X-Gene up. Increasing his healing factor and allowing him to heal and live. When she did that, she saw a ghostly image of a possible feline form in his future.

He left in a wheelchair, still looking very much apeline. Soon, New X-Men #1 came out. And revealed that he's basically devolved (which is lame as hell) into a 600 pound feline man, with crude paws. And who was ashamed by his new body and wore a full body exo-rubber uniform with ascot. Who also had to relearn how to write and had a litter box in his lab. Because he had trouble adapting to his handpaws. Then there was the Trish/Beastiality mess, and then Hank saying he was gay to hurt Trish. Basically it's an awful change to a classic character. Especially since his original mutation and change to furry Beast, had nothing to do with Devolution. Thankfully according to rumors, going to be undone during Whedon's run. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

-Durge-
02-28-2004, 08:00 PM
So he is not going to stay like that...GOOD!!

JJB, why is Iceman soo heavily featured on the cover of that comic.

P.S did you get my pm.

Beast
03-18-2004, 03:24 PM
Two preview pages are up now for Whedon's Astonishing X-Men. They correspond to the earlier script that I posted. Looks pretty good. I still don't like Hank's kitty cat look, but at least he no longer looks like he weighs a half ton like he did in Morrison's book. Can't wait for this to be released in May. Also a tease of the cover for Astonishing X-Men #2. :)

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/preview.php?image=news/ASTXM001015.jpg
http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/preview.php?image=news/ASTXM001016.jpg
http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/preview.php?image=news/AXM002.jpg

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
03-19-2004, 04:32 AM
Well I just finished reading the last real arcs in Uncanny and New X-Men until the relaunches. Both wonderful, but for different reasons. Let's recap, shall we?

Uncanny X-Men 439, 440, 441: She Lies With Angels, parts 3,4 and Conclusion. This story was phenomenal in every aspect. I fully expected another letdown after finishing the Nightcrawler origin arc leading up to this story. I was happy to see Larocca working on Uncanny, his style is unique and pretty, and suits the characters very nicely. He's a gem. Chuck Austen's take on Romeo and Juliet finished very strongly, and goes to show that pain and suffering don't have to be dealt directly to the main characters in your book to have an enormous and lasting emotional effect. The last few pages of the final chapter unwind seemingly in slow motion, perfectly displaying the fallout of the story's events, and the painful burden they will leave with everyone involved. How is Angel, never great at being there for someone in distress, going to be there for Paige?

New X-Men 153, 154: Here Comes Tomorrow parts 3 and 4. Well, Grant Morrison's run has come to an end. When the story finally breaks and Logan explains to Jeannie how we actually got to that particular point in that particular future, I almost had to hold back a sob. I knew we were close to the end of what I'll call the boldest take on the X-Men I've ever had the pleasure of reading. I was distracted as the story wound down, thinking "No more Beak. No more Cuckoos. No more Quentin Quire, Kick or Cassandra Nova" and feeling sorry for myself. But then I put those issues away - and realized that those stories will always be there, just like Jeannie dying, Wolvie fighting with Wendigo, Days of Future Past, Magneto being put on trial, Rogue joining the team, Wolvie's wedding, and every other great moment I've enjoyed. All I have to do is open the right box. That made me feel a little better.

Well, I guess there's a couple of issues left before the big revamp. With any luck, someone will come along soon that can take these books to similar heights.

El Chuxter
03-19-2004, 01:15 PM
Holy crap! I've not read the recent issues yet, but you're saying the entire Morrison run was a dream, a hoax, and an imaginary story? :eek:

But if that's the case, how is Beast still a kittycat, and why would Professor need to rebuild Genosha? Did I just misunderstand you?

Beast
03-19-2004, 03:15 PM
Nope, not a dream El Chuxter. Angel IV, the Stepford Cuckoos, Dust, etc. will be turning up in New X-Men: Academy X. And Beak is getting a three issue guest appearance in Exiles, when the Exiles come back to the 616 universe. That arc is entitled "Earn Your Wings". I'm wondering if Beak is going to become a permanent character in Exiles, due to his popularity. As for Beast, I think he'll get reverted sometime during Whedon's upcoming 12 issue run. As for New X-Men 154, since the issue has been out a few days, I'll toss some spoilers up for it now. This is going to be a little nuts, so bare with me. :)

We find out that 'Sublime' is really an intelligent bacterial form of life. Basically RNA/DNA. And was the first species to gain sentience when the Earth was 'born'. And as more 'lesser' creatures started to spring up on the earth, the Sublime hid and influenced evolution inside the creatures very DNA. Until Mutants appeared. A species that was not the same as the others. That didn't contain the 'Sublime'. So, to keep the mutants busy while it found a way for dominance, it influenced humans to fear and hate mutants. Causing strife while it worked on it's plan for ridding the world of mutants.

Beast having harvested blood from the Jean/Phoenix that was hatched from the Phoenix Egg that was found on the moon, injects himself with it. As the scene switches to 'Dark Phoenix' and Logan talking. Logan tries to explain to Jean, about what happened. About why 'Beast' wants to exterminate mutant life. And create the next species, creatures made in his image from the genetic material of the original X-Men. Cassandra Nova and Martha, the brain in the bubble (who is revealed to be No-Girl) shut of Jean's access to the Phoenix Force. And she falls into Logan's arms.

Logan explains what happened 150 years ago. That Scott decided to not restart the school. And Hank tried to do it himself. Unfortunatly, he couldn't take the stress. Trying to run to school, and also find the means to stop the extinction gene in humans. That was slowing making sure that mutants would become the dominant species. Stressed out and unable to cope with the stress, Hank turned to kick. Which is really an aeresol version of Sublime. Which was why Magneto went bonkers, and was trying to start a massive war between humans and mutants. Humanity died, and mutants went to war in the ruins. Against 'The Beast' and his creatures.

Note, I hate the idea of Hank being written so weak that he's turn to a drug that he knows is dangerous. But Morrison loves using Hank as a whipping boy. But I digress. During this, Beast appears. Flying/Hovering and clearly posessing the Phoenix Force. He destroys the X-Jet, killing Cassandra Nova and leaving Martha's brain bowl broken open when she hits the ground. Meanwhile, at the 'Institute' Beast's feeders are breaking down the doors. And the Stepford Cuckoos, who are revealed to be Weapon 14 of the Weapon X project self destruct rather then be taken over.

Tito (Beak's great grandson) flies into battle with Beast. And with a mere gesture, Dark Beast uses the Phoenix force to cause him to burst into flames. He's bragging about his power, and then attacks Tom. A man who has a old Sentinel model for a sidekick. He calls 'Rover' to him, and it starts fighting Beast. As Weapon 13, EVA the thing that used to be a part of Fantomex attacks Beast. He uses the Phoenix Force to basically destroy her programming and leave her to die.

There's a real touching scene between Beak 2.0 and Wolverine. Where they are talking about Beak's Great Grandad, the Beak from Morrison's run. It's really sweet and sad and heartwarming. And one of the best things to come out of Morrison's run.

Wolverine: "Tito! Hold on, bub! Hold on!."

Tito (Beak 2.0): "Ff...fff...failed... I knew I'd mess up... Grandad's gonna be laffin' down at me... ... never could live up...to a hero like that... legacy like that..."

Wolverine: Kid, yer about three feel taller then yer grandad. If ya only knew. Just let yourself go... ya did good. Fly." (Wolverine Pops his Claws) "Cause you do not wanna be around for what's comin' down!"

Wolverine charges into battle, slashing at Beast with his claws. Cutting open his chest and slashing his eyes. But Beast just grabs Wolverine. And tells him that he can shut off his healing gene. He does so, and then throws Wolverine asside. Using psychically generated blades to basically 'Darth Maul' Wolverine. He cuts him in half, and Wolverine goes flying. Starting to die. And then Beast turns on Jean. Who tells him that it was all a means of keeping him busy. While she was disenfecting him of the Sublime.

Jean pulls the Sublime infestation out of Beast, and he falls to his knees. Coming back to his senses. And returning to the beloved Hank McCoy that everyone knows. He admits that he lied about the cure to the extinction gene. That he tried to save the human genome. But that coupled with trying to run the school himself, he just couldn't handle things. He tells Jean he's happy to see her, and it's been so long. That he never thought he'd live so long with his asthma. I have no clue where that came from, as Beast has never had Asthma. But suddenly Henry's decapitated from behind, by Appolyon (Beast's 2nd in command) who is revealed to be Fantomex.

Wolverine finally dies, and Jean seeing how everything is going to hell and everyone she cared about is dieing. So she decides to cut the future from existance. But she's summoned into the White Hot Room, which is is sort of like a cross roads of all space and time. Where she's surrounded by many many people that all are wearing the mark of the Phoenix. She's told that the universe that she cut the future from is dieing from what she did. And she needs to make a choice. Save it or let it die. Quinton Quire is here also, also wearing the Phoenix symbol on his chest. He tells her, if it was his choice, he'd let it die.

Jean decides she doesn't want her friends to suffer this future fate, and mentally nudges Scott. We see him standing over Jean's grave with Emma. Just as they did back in Issue 151, 150 years ago. Again, Emma suggests that they rebuild the school and take over for Xavier. To teach the next generation of X-Men. Scott suddenly changes his mind, deciding that Emma is right. That he can't live in mourning about Jean's death. That he needs to live. And Scott and Emma kiss at Jean's grave, and agree to take over the school. Preventing the disasterous future that came from him not taking over the school from Xavier. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
03-19-2004, 07:18 PM
That's interesting that it was intended to be Fantomex in the Apollyon disguise - my interpretation was that it was Professor X (the Silvestri art makes everyone look young and chiselled, I figured Chuck might be looking that dashing with his mask ripped half off).

My overall opinion was that this was the weakest Morrison arc. I'd personally love to see a page by page "author's interpretation" of everything that happened in it, because I'm sure there's TONS going on that I didn't catch.

Beast
03-19-2004, 07:39 PM
Yeah, it's Fantomex. It's hinted that it's him during the arc. Especially when EVA mentions something horrible happening to him. But not wanting to talk about it. And then when he rips off his mask, EVA thinks she heard Fantomex's voice. A lot of fans consider the character of Fantomex like a loser. But they don't get is, that Morrison wrote him to be the loser. He's only cool because of EVA. Which is proven after she becomes a sentient 'Super Sentinel' and he's left just being this big whiny loser that doesn't have what made him 'cool' anymore. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
03-19-2004, 07:55 PM
Im definitely going back to read these four issues over again. I had a very long layoff in the middle, never a good idea when trying to get the "whole" story. So they'll tidy up for a couple of issues, then the big reshuffle. Are we going to see everything starting at #1 again, or will they just be adding a bunch of new books? I need to go and look at the Marvel site to try and understand, I've just told my store to hold the first 3 issues of ALL the X-books starting in May, and that I'll narrow it down from there. Going to be an expensive process.

Beast
03-20-2004, 01:38 AM
New X-Men is becoming X-Men, but is keeping the current number.
Uncanny X-Men is staying the same name, and keeping the current number.
New Mutants is becoming New X-Men: Mutant Academy and relaunching with #1
X-Treme X-Men is ending, but they're launching Excalibur to replace it.
Astonishing X-Men is Joss (Buffy, Angel, FireFly) Whedon's new X-Men Book.

And the rosters were more finalized now, with the new issue covers:

Astonishing X-Men - Beast, Cyclops, Emma, Shadowcat, and Wolverine
Uncanny X-Men - Storm, Nightcrawler, Cannonball, Bishop, Marvel Girl 2.0 (Rachael Summers), Sage, and Wolverine
X-Men - Havok, Gambit, Rogue, Juggernaut, Polaris, Iceman, and Wolverine
Excalibur - Professor X, Angel, (Likely Husk), (Maybe Magma), (Probably Wolverine).

http://www.newsarama.com/Marvel/UNCX445_covcol.jpg
http://www.newsarama.com/Marvel/XM158crx_col.jpg

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

El Chuxter
03-22-2004, 03:34 PM
Astonishing X-Men - Beast, Cyclops, Emma, Shadowcat, and Wolverine

Yep. let's dredge up Kitty again. Nothing against her, awesome character, but how often does she retire from this game and come back again?


Uncanny X-Men - Storm, Nightcrawler, Cannonball, Bishop, Marvel Girl 2.0 (Rachael Summers), Sage, and Wolverine

BISHOP!! Funny, though. I was under the impression Rachel had lost her powers.


X-Men - Havok, Gambit, Rogue, Juggernaut, Polaris, Iceman, and Wolverine

So all these folks who participated in the travesty of a mockery of two shams, X-Treme X-Men, are back at the mansion where they belong!


Excalibur - Professor X, Angel, (Likely Husk), (Maybe Magma), (Probably Wolverine).

I guess this leaves a few of the recent major players in the lurch? Like Jubilee, Beak, Jubilee, Cannonball, Fantomex, JUBILEE! I guess since she's got her own upcoming book, where she'll be the scourge of the seven seas in an alternate reality with a crew of drunken bears, she doesn't need to be in the X-Men proper.

Beast
03-22-2004, 03:43 PM
I mentioned Cannonball. Fantomex and Wolverine will be appearing in Weapon X. As for Rachael, all she lost was her access to the Phoenix Force. She still has all of her mother's telepathy and telekinesis. As for Beak, he's making a 3 issue guest apperance in Exiles. This is planned for May and June. When the Exiles return to the 616 Universe. I have a feeling that he may actually end up joining the dimension hopping team. It would make me pick up the book, since I'm a huge fan of Barnell Bohusk. :D

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
03-24-2004, 08:10 PM
Looks pretty good. I'm glad that the X-Men are pretty much going back to normal after the influence of the movies and especially Morrison. Nice to see that beast is no longer going to be written as "Mr. Moody hiding his strange body with tons of clothes". Here's 7 preview pages from Uncanny X-Men #444 and 1 from Astonishing X-Men #1. :)

http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0001.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0002.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0003.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0004.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0005.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0006.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0007.jpg
http://www.anotherpilotdown.net/xmenscan/scan0008.jpg

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

THE Slayer
03-31-2004, 01:57 PM
But she's summoned into the White Hot Room, which is is sort of like a cross roads of all space and time. Where she's surrounded by many many people that all are wearing the mark of the Phoenix. She's told that the universe that she cut the future from is dieing from what she did. And she needs to make a choice. Save it or let it die. Quinton Quire is here also, also wearing the Phoenix symbol on his chest. He tells her, if it was his choice, he'd let it die.


Who is Quinton Quire?
This was the best post! I've read them all, albeit somewhat sporadiaclly, and was slightly confused by this whole future thing. How exactly did Jean 'cut the future'?
Thanks JJB

Beast
03-31-2004, 02:09 PM
If you read the whole Morrison's run arc, he's the purple haired punk that was taking Kick and was in charge of the Omega Gang. Aka Kid Omega. He took over the School in the 'Riot at Xavier's' arc. Xorn killed him when he was getting to close to finding out he was really Magneto. :)

As for how Jean 'Cut the Future', her Phoenix powers give her ungodly powers. She basically just snipped time, and cut it away. And then had to replace it with a different future. I.E., nudging Scott to kiss Emma and take over the School. So that Beast wouldn't take over the school. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
03-31-2004, 03:41 PM
The new Professor Xavier centric comic coming in May with reloaded now has some preview pages posted online. It looks pretty damn good. I do find it funny that he had a damn hover chair in the 90's, and almost never left the mansion. Yet now he has one with wheels, in the rubble of Genosha. Ah well, it still looks good. Love his uniform and that gun. The new Excalibur is written by Chris Claremont and artist Aaron Lopresti. And is due in stores on May 12 :)

"Forging The Sword" Part 1
The island of Genosha was once a thriving nation of mutants, built from the ground up by Magneto, the mutant Master of Magnetism. Then, one day, an apocalyptic attack killed every man, woman and child, and reduced an entire society to rubble within hours. Now, Professor Charles Xavier - legendary founder of the X-Men, and the man who dreams of peaceful coexistence between humans and mutants - has come to Genosha with one intention: to rebuild a nation from its ashes.

Excalibur #1 (http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/Excalibur_1.jpg)
Excalibur #2 (http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/Excalibur_2.jpg)
Excalibur #3 (http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/Excalibur_3.jpg)
Excalibur #4 (http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/Excalibur_4.jpg)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

THE Slayer
03-31-2004, 05:45 PM
If you read the whole Morrison's run arc, he's the purple haired punk that was taking Kick and was in charge of the Omega Gang. Aka Kid Omega. He took over the School in the 'Riot at Xavier's' arc. Xorn killed him when he was getting to close to finding out he was really Magneto. :)

Do we know how he came in touch with this phoenix force? Or I guess more specifically, why was he dressed in Phoenix garb?

-Durge-
03-31-2004, 06:19 PM
Any word on a Iceman or Beast comic?

Beast
04-01-2004, 12:30 PM
Uncanny X-Men #422 & New X-Men #155 Preview Pages!!!

First Up, Uncanny X-Men #422. Looks like it ties into Excalibur #1, what with Xavier bringing Magneto's body to Genosha for a proper burial. And of course, we have Wolverine with him. Because god knows that you can't have a freakin' X-Book without Wolverine. :rolleyes: Freakin' overused damn character.

http://www.popcultureshock.com/reviews.php?id=2840
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2840&p=1
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2840&p=2
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2840&p=3
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2840&p=4

And then, X-Men #155. Wow, the new artist can not draw Feline Beast at all. Good lord, that's just horrifyingly bad. Hopefully they revert him to apelike soon, I can't stand such badly drawn Beast. Noone seems to make the feline one look good. And I find it odd that noone seems to know that Ernst was Cassandra Nova. You would think Xavier and Jean would tell the rest of the X-Men. Oh well. :)

http://www.popcultureshock.com/reviews.php?id=2839
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2839&p=1
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2839&p=2
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2839&p=3
http://www.popcultureshock.com/previewer.php?id=2839&p=4
http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/X-Men_155_pg6.jpg
http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/X-Men_155_pg9.jpg
http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/X-Men_155_pg14.jpg
http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Beast/X-Men_155_pg16.jpg

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

-Durge-
04-01-2004, 07:46 PM
I disagree. I think Beast looks fine.

Beast
04-01-2004, 08:05 PM
Beast looks freakin' awful man. That damn Kitty Cat version needs to be fixed, and now. Some people draw it good, but good god, he looks awful by that artist. Oh, a couple more pages and some more info about Excalibur. :)

http://newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11229

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

-Durge-
04-01-2004, 10:00 PM
Jar, I want him to look like ML4? He looks great there.

Beast
04-02-2004, 01:03 AM
Exactly, that's Apelike Beast. Not the abomination Kitty Cat one. That's what I'm complaining about. I want the classic comic Beast back. Not the Beauty and the Beast reject version. :)

Here's another preview page for New X-Men #155. The newest page doesn't even make freakin' sense. What does Scott do, change his mind every 30 seconds. The guy serious has to have some sort of psychological issue.

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/01/nx5.htm

At the end of 154, we saw that Scott agreed to reopen the school with Emma. Thanks to a mental nudge from Jean. But now he acts like he doesn't want to do it again. And the original timeline said that if Scott didn't do it, then Hank would. Which led to the Kick and the Disaster Timeline. But here Hank doesn't even wanna do it. He'd rather work on his experiments. And the only one that does is Emma, who says she'll do it alone. But in the original Timeline it was Hank that did it alone. Oh my, I think I've gone crosseyed.

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

-Durge-
04-02-2004, 05:22 AM
Jar, I want him to look like ML4? He looks great there.Nice, I'm with you on that one.

Beast
04-16-2004, 05:04 PM
Continuing my usual X-Men Comics previews, here's the previews for New X-Men 156 and Uncanny 443. They should be out later this month. As they wrap up some storylines, and get things started for the upcoming 'Reload' in May. First up, New X-Men #156. What is with Beast and rubble? Seriously, he just had a massive blast go off behind him in Ultimate X-Men #44, and ended up buried under rubble. The same thing also happed in Ultimate X-Men #4. Spookular. Comic looks good though. And we finally learn the name of the mystery Cuckoo. But I can't make it out.

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/nxc.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/nx1.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/nx2.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/nx3.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/nx4.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/nx5.jpg

And Uncanny #443 continues the set up for 'Excalibur' with Xavier returning Magneto's body to Genosha for burial. And about damn time that Quicksilver popped up in the comics again. I started to think that everyone forgot about the other spawn of Erik Lensherr. Looks like Excalibur might turn out to be a good series after all. I wonder if they'll keep Quicky on as a recouring character. Would be better then Wolverine all the time. I believe both of these are scheduled for release next Wednesday.

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/uxc.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/ux1.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/ux2.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/ux3.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/ux4.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/ux5.jpg

More Previews:

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0404/15/marvelfirsts.htm

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

El Chuxter
04-16-2004, 05:35 PM
So, are they going to hold with their traditions prior to this massive shakeup and kill half the characters? (I couldn't bear the thought of poor lil' Jubilation dying. . . a third time. :D)

El Chuxter
04-19-2004, 01:16 PM
Okay, I picked up a few weeks of comics on Saturday, and was psyched to see a Jubilee solo story in the new X-Men Unlimited.

Until I read it.

Worst.

Jubilee.

Solo.

Story.

EVER!!

This made the stupid story about the Reaver dog look like freakin' Shakespeare! Heck, it made Dreamwave's Transformers Generation One Volume One look like a masterpiece!

So Jubilee hung out with the X-Men and Generation X, fought evil mutants in Europe, was crucified and saved by Archangel, only to find out her rubbery boyfriend died in the same attack. . . then spends all her stinkin' time sneaking out of the mansion to go to the mall hanging with non-mutant friends, where she steals from an arcade and attacks human police officers? WTF? The art was decent, but the "writer" smoked a few thousand dollars worth of crack before writing this crap!

And Jubilee is clearly the same age as or even slightly older than Husk in the beginning of the Generation X comic. Husk was specifically stated to be nineteen recently in Uncanny. Did some evil mutant turn Jubilee back into a cornball twelve year old prior to this story and I missed it?

If not for the headmaster of the school being Cyclops, I'd swear this was a pig terd story they've sat on for years. In fact, I'm not sure it wasn't. Just a quick stroke of the brush and Chuck's replaced with Scott.

I have never ever read a Jubilee story and wanted my money back. Like, y'know? :mad:

Beast
04-27-2004, 05:45 PM
Mile High Comics posted a full preview for Ultimate X-Men #46.

WARNING - MASSIVE SPOILERS FOLLOW

There's a full preview of Ultimate X-Men #46 over on Mile High Comics. It's the entire issue, and answers the question about who died in the 'New Mutants' arc. It was indeed Beast, he died when the Sentinels attacked. I really have to say that I'm not a big fan of this choice. He's my favorite character, at least until they started making him the Ultimate Screw-Up. Rest of the issue is good, as everyone is shown trying to deal with their pain. Storm going psycho over the loss was a nice touch. Annoying to see that just like 616 Scott, he can make out with his girl while trying to grieve for his friend. Mr. Sinister looks odd, but I'm gonna hold out any massive opinions on the 'Serial Killer' thing, until I see how it goes. After all, he's supposed to be working for someone.

http://www.milehighcomics.com/firstlook/marvel/ultxmen/

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
04-27-2004, 05:50 PM
And here's 5 preview pages from Issue #2 of Joss Whedon's flagship 'Astonishing X-Men' title. Looks good, but I still don't like how they do Beast in the book. He looks more like a Wookiee then a Feline Man. All we need is Emma saying, "Somebody get this big walking carpet out of my way!" and we'd be set. :)

http://www.newsarama.com/pages/Marvel/Astonish_2/Astonish2_1.htm

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
04-29-2004, 02:24 AM
Popculture shock posted four pages from the upcoming reload of Exiles. And I already love how well Bedard gets the character of Beak. It's just great to see some focus go to that character. Since he's #2 for me, right under Beast. I really love the fact that they're showing a slice of his family life with Angel.

Not to mention the fact he seems to have have Xorn's helmet, and appears to wear it when he's in battle. That just kicks major arse!! I love the fact he's put aside his padlock and seems to be wearing a Phoenix pendant. I wonder if that's a hint that Beak may pick up the Phoenix Force in a future issue. ;) :D

http://www.popcultureshock.com/reviews.php?id=2917

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
04-29-2004, 05:38 PM
The newest issue of Wizard has a 5 page preview of Astonishing X-Men #1. I just can't wait for this to come out. The comic gets better the more I hear about it. Just love Kitty and Emma's snarking. And the winks at fans with Wolverine being 'elsewhere'. Synopsis was taken from CBR. :)

Pg 1
Kitty enters the mansion's empty foyer(sp)
"I'm a kid again. Out of my depth--- completely overwhelmed by everything here and it isn't the Sidri, or sentinals, or the broodthat surround me... it's the smaller pieces. Shards. Of me."

Looking at the stairs she remembers sneaking up behind Colossus with some mistletoe

Kitty: Merry Christmas sexy!
Clossus: KITTY!

She smiles at the memory and then turns away

Pg 2
She begins to walk through a wall
"At least I hope I'm not late"

She stops with her head sticking out of the wall. She looks stunned.
Kitty: Hi. It's possible that I'm late.

Wideshot revealing that Kitty has just stepped on stage in the middle of a student assembly, Emma, Scott and Hank are also on stage.

Emma: Quite so.
Emma: This children is Kitty Pryde, who apparently feels the need to make a grand entrance.
Kitty: I'm sorry. I was busy remembering to put on all my clothes.
Emma: So gushingly glad you could join us.

Pg 3
Kitty sits down beside Scott and Hank.

Emma: Ms. Pryde will be teaching advanced computational theory, as well as acting as a student advisor and liasion to the administrative staff.

Scott: It's great to see you.
Kitty: Sorry about the timing. Did I miss the sorting hat?
Hank: Just Scott's scintillating introduction speach.
Scott: Even I was bored.

Emma: Since Proffessor Xavier is on sabbatical, Mr. Summers and I will be acting heads of school.
Dr. McCoy and Ms. Pryde will round out the senior staff along with Logan, who is.... elsewhere.

Kitty: What does she mean "elsewhere"?
Hank: It means we've narrowed it down to "else".

Emma: Now. This is a place of learning. Not just about your mutant gifts, but about the world. Respect for your teachers mutant and human alike, will be expected of all of you.

Emma: Control of your powers, the safety of those around you, is of paramount importance.

Emma: Violence of any kind will never be tolerated.

Pg 4-5

The roof explodes as 3 sentinals reach down into the auditorium. Scott fires of an optic blast as Hank begins to rip off his suit, Kitty on her feet phases back behind the chair.

The students scramble and retreat falling over each other.
Emma presses a button on her podium and the sentinals vanish,
-the panel readout on the podium reveals it to be the danger room.-

The student stop and look back at the podium.

Emma: So what have we learned?
MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
05-13-2004, 11:22 AM
Just wanted to post this, due to the fact that it may intrest some people. As many of you may know, Kordey was fired off of Excalibur and replaced by Lopresti. Well, Kordey has posted his entire issue of pencils for download on his official site. So enjoy if you're intrested, while I post the other info.

http://www.kordey.ca/inprogress/upcomingpencils/xxcalibur1.html

*SPOILER* - Highlight to Read.

Yes, that is who you think it is on the last page.

And here's the Lopresti version of Exalibur. I have to say it looks pretty good, but he doesn't nail Xavier as well as Xavier. I have high hopes for this series, especially after the reveal that happens at the end. It's big.

http://www.popcultureshock.com/reviews.php?id=2943

And here's the preview for the formerly New X-Men. The rumors I'm hearing about the reveal at the end of this one blows away what happens in Excalibur. I just hope it's handled well. The art is fabulous as usual, so it should be a good series by all accounts.

http://www.popcultureshock.com/reviews.php?id=2945

*SPOILERS* - Highlight to Read

The X-Men go to China and seem to find Xorn???

MTFBWY and H!!

Jar Jar Binks

Beast
05-13-2004, 12:24 PM
Here's an interview with Igor Kordey, about being fired from Marvel and Excalibur. He's pretty vocal in how ****ed off he is, but I guess you can't really blame him. :)

http://www.lospaziobianco.it/articolo.php?chiave=1412

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

El Chuxter
05-13-2004, 01:11 PM
*SPOILER* - Highlight to Read.

Yes, that is who you think it is on the last page.

Who are you referring to? Chuck and Archangel were given. The one girl is definitely Angel (from Morrison's run). As for the others, Generic Man and possible the Jubilatrix? That'd be like totally :beard:.

Beast
05-13-2004, 02:59 PM
*MASSIVE SPOILER* - Highlight to read.

The person I'm referring to is Erik Lensherr. That's who Xavier is shaking hands with on the very last panel of Kordey's art work. The actually comic just has Erik showing up, no handshake. They're trying to make everyone thing he's a ghost. And the fact is, it seems that Xavier may have pulled an Ultimate X-Men and faked Magneto's death.

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

jjreason
06-03-2004, 12:24 AM
Astonishing #1 was a good comic. Nice art, snappy story, good characters. This series is going to work fine.

Excalibur #1 was an okay comic. I don't need Magneto back, but I can understand why Marvel feels like they need him there. Mr. Sinister and the Hellfire Club are also pretty darned good nemeses for the X folks when used properly - and they haven't been used at all lately. Give Mags a break.

X-Men: Mutant Academny #1 was a bad comic. Simple art, boring new characters, lukewarm story. I won't be following this book.

Uncanny and the X-Men comic formerly known as "New" X-Men: I haven't read May's issues yet. I haven't read (and don't plan on reading) District X #1.

What do you think so far?

El Chuxter
06-03-2004, 01:08 PM
I'm kinda with you. Although I picked up District X on a whim and found it surprisingly good. I can't swear I'll follow it, but it wasn't bad.

A dumb question: are there other X-Teams at the moment? We have the "Astonishing" team, led by Cyclops and the "Formerly Known As New" team led by Havok. Then there's the "Uncanny" Quasi-Police Force led by Nightcrawler and Storm, the New Mutants (or whatever they're going by this week), and supposedly a few X-Men are going to wind up in Genosha with Professor X.

But in Adjectiveless X-Men, there are a lot of other mutants discussing team rosters with Cyclops. Among a lot of currently unassigned (as far as we know) mutants there was Jubilee. Personal bias aside, she's referring to Paige's team. Paige, AKA Husk, who doesn't seem to be on any team at the moment. Ummmmm. . . ?

Beast
06-03-2004, 02:00 PM
Jubilee will 'supposedly' be going to Genosha with Angel. Husk was rumored to be going to Genosha also, but if Jubes was begging Scott to be on Husk's team, then I'm not sure what is going on here. We may have to wait and see. :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Reefer Shark
06-03-2004, 09:18 PM
Here's an interview with Igor Kordey, about being fired from Marvel and Excalibur. He's pretty vocal in how ****ed off he is, but I guess you can't really blame him. :)

http://www.lospaziobianco.it/articolo.php?chiave=1412

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks
Thanks for posting that JJB. I had no idea he was fired from Marvel, what a stupid thing to do! Whosever decision that was must have their head up their arse. Kordy is one of the best artists out there IMO.

Very interesting interview, thanks again!

Beast
07-15-2004, 01:23 AM
Mile High Comics has posted full preview 'First Looks' for Ultimate X-Men #50 (Featuring the Return of Gambit), X-Force #1, and X-Men: The End #1. All 3 books are due out August 4th, but you can read them now for free. :)

http://www.milehighcomics.com/firstlook/marvel/ultxmen50/
http://www.milehighcomics.com/firstlook/marvel/xforce1/
http://www.milehighcomics.com/firstlook/marvel/xmenend1/

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks