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Eternal Padawan
06-05-2003, 03:42 PM
Hey, with almost sixty long boxes and around 20,000 funny books, I've bought some turds. I'll admit it.

Limited series that didn't need to be.

Ongoing series that were mercifully short.

Smaller companies struggling to get started with subpar retreads of classic heroes.

For instance. After Avengers West Coast finished it's run, the main Avengers called the West Coasters in for a little meeting and said "Hey. We are shutting down the West Coast Compound. You have no say in it..." and this sufficiently ticked the WCA off enough to start FORCE WORKS. Lamely named because the use of force gets the job done. Force Works. Get it? U.S. Agent got a superbly lame new costume and a bunch of other lame stuff happened. Lame.

Or how about Fantastic Force? A F4 spin off title with all the rejects from the Fantastic Four who decided to join together like Layla, the Human Torch's Skrull wife, and some other lame people. Lame.

Then there was the guy what started off in Spider-Man books, that was basically a rip off of Spawn with a possesed cape/costume who was from a couple of years in the future and was trying to track down his own murderer or some crap. LAME.

There are more to be sure. Plenty more. So what's clogging up your long boxes?

El Chuxter
06-05-2003, 04:44 PM
I actually (please don't laugh) pre-ordered the first issue of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers solely on the fact that way-cool artist Al Bigley was slated to draw it. And something happened and he didn't, but I couldn't cancel the order! :mad:

Most or all of the Liefeld issues of X-Force, and, though now I wonder why, a lot of the early Image comics. All of which, except for Spawn, Shadowhawk, and Savage Dragon, sucked hard.

Most would say my complete run of Sleepwalker and not-quite-complete run of ROM: Spaceknight suck, but I beg to differ! :crazed:

dr_evazan22
06-05-2003, 05:10 PM
About 10 years ago I bought just about anything that was from Marvel, including The Swimsuit Issue and a takeoff of Time mag. Looking back, about 60-70% (maybe as high as 85%) was a total waste of money.

EP- 60 long boxes?! Where in the world do you keep it all? When I used to live w/ a girl a few years ago I had mine on storage racks in garage. Then Hurricane Floyd came along in '99 and flooded entire basement. I ended up losing 10 boxes. Luckily, a lot of it would fall under this threads domain.

Something else that most would consider sucky but I like: Spider-Man 2099 and Ghost Rider 2099. W/ GR, the coloring was great, I thought the characters were very cool, and I thought it was great how they made up a future vernacular like "Look at this" = "Vid this".

My two cents:)

El Chuxter
06-05-2003, 06:27 PM
I thought the Marvel Swimsuit thingy was kinda funny, with the fake ads and articles and all. When all the Marvel artists jumped ship to Image and a swimsuit special came out from Homage, I pre-ordered it thinking it was the same type of thing. Now that was a waste!

Most of the 2099 series sucked, but the first few issues of Ravage, when Stan Lee wrote it, were rather good. As soon as he left, they completely threw everything out the window, including the cool storylines. :mad:

Beast
06-05-2003, 07:07 PM
Kitty Cat Beast from the new X-Men comics. I hate what they've done to my favorite character with a passion. Now that they say one aspect of his mutation is a de-evolutionary deal, I'm waiting for him to turn into a Dinosaur. :p :)

MTFBWY and HH!!

Jar Jar Binks

Bel-Cam Jos
06-05-2003, 07:09 PM
Ugh.

* Most of the summer crossovers from Marvel in the late 80s/early 90s; i.e. Atlantis Attacks, Evolutionary War.
* Spellbound limited series.
* Virtually any B&W small press comic from the mid 80s (Daffy Quadafi, Adolescent Radioactive (something) Hamsters, Fish Police, etc.)

jjreason
06-05-2003, 10:06 PM
Secret Wars II.

James Boba Fettfield
06-05-2003, 10:15 PM
I got one of those Secret Wars II comics. I never read it, but the cover has this man's figure burned into the ground and it says something like who is the beyonder on it. I got it in a pack full of comics I bought from a mail order catalog. I did it hoping to get some cool comics, which there were a few I enjoyed. Anway, it's good to know I got an "official suck" comic now. I feel happy.

jjreason
06-05-2003, 10:29 PM
Not only do you have A comic that officially sucked, you may have an issue of the single most suckingest comic that ever sucked. Man did it suck.

Except for when the Beyonder got really fat, and was surrounded by hot chicks on his yacht, and then he realized that the chicks didn't think he was hot cause he was fat, and then he turned himself all buff again. That part rocked.

James Boba Fettfield
06-05-2003, 10:48 PM
I don't know man, if that yacht thing really happened, then this comic is probably better than that issue of Spider-Man I have where Ben (the now infamous real clone and one time Spider-Man replacement) gets it from the Green Goblin and falls victim to that clone defect that made basically made him "fall apart". I cried tears of happiness watching him die, because he was like the Poochy of Marvel.

Eternal Padawan
06-06-2003, 02:53 AM
Originally posted by El Chuxter
Most or all of the Liefeld issues of X-Force, and, though now I wonder why, a lot of the early Image comics. All of which, except for Spawn, Shadowhawk, and Savage Dragon, sucked hard.

Whoa. yeah. Youngblood sucked hardcore. And Brigade. And the second wave of Image books like Wildstar, the guy powered by an intergalactic spacemollusk or starfish or whatever. Jerry Ordway never lived that one down. The ultimate Image suck fest was Boof or Boof and the Bruise Crew. Why on earth I have ANY copies of those is beyond me. Here are some BSLOS

"Mm-hmm, That's Right. Uh huh. Oh No.
Check yourself girl, you got camel toe."


originally by dr_evazan22
EP- 60 long boxes?! Where in the world do you keep it all?

In my parent's basement on two ten ft. long industrial worktables side by side (in case of flooding). It was a pain to get them down the stairs because they weighed over a hundred pounds, but anything else wouldn't have supported the weight of that much paper. That's not counting the stuff I've bought in the last year.

dr_evazan22
06-06-2003, 08:38 AM
Yeah, that paper gets heavy. My fam and friends weren't too keen on the idea of helping me move. I think there was a little sigh of relief after losing 10 boxes.

Speaking of suckity-sucky comics, anyone remember Booster Gold? How about Blue Devil?

About the same time as Marvel's WCA, at DC there was JL Europe w/ the starfish aliens that sucked face.

Dr Zoltar
06-06-2003, 11:42 AM
Believe it or not, there was a Secret Wars 3. I think it was a story line in Fantasic Four. Needless to say, I did not buy it.

El Chuxter
06-06-2003, 12:25 PM
How about the Infinity Gauntlet series? Thanos is a twisted worshipper of death who gets a glove that, in effect, makes him God. How the &*$# is Spider-Man supposed to take him down? I mean, yeah, Spidey and Cyclops didn't end up beating him, but why'd they even bother trying?

And why, when Thanos killed one-half the living beings in the universe, didn't he kill everyone who could possibly be a threat?

Infinity Gauntlet also killed Jubilee (albeit very briefly), so it sucks double in my book. (I believe she was clinging to life with a barely perceptible pulse in Uncanny, and Jean's a pompous doofus, as normal.) We all know Thanos wouldn't have stood a chance against her mastery of wisecracks and would fallen to his knees, allowing her to steal the Gauntlet and recreate the Marvel Universe into something cooler, preferably with Wookiees.

Then came the spin-offs. Infinity War. Wasn't this the one where Warlock's evil half, the Magus, sucked the brains out of everyone, and Professor X had to team with Sleepwalker (way to tie in the already ailing new book there, Marvel!) to save the earth?

And then Infinity Crusade. I didn't bother. If Warlock got rid of his good and evil aspects, why would his former good side want to kill the heroes? It made zero sense.

Pretty art by George Perez, though, if nothing else.

jjreason
06-07-2003, 01:14 AM
I think those were all written by Jim Starlin, no? I've heard mixed reviews. The TPB's I've flipped through show some great art - lot's of spreads. I may have to test the waters on the first ltd series, as I kind of think Thanos is a pretty cool looking villain.

Eternal Padawan
06-07-2003, 08:00 AM
I'll have to admit, I was reading the Infinity buildup in Silver Surfer and the Thanos Quest limited series for over a year before it became the full blown Infinity Gauntlet crossover, so I liked it. Seeing Thanos reach his goal was sweet.

Here's a crapfest. Nth Man by Larry Hama. Supposedly a comic book about "the ultimate ninja" but this guy was too Ninja. He would make arcane hand symbols like the fist of monkey or triangle of the iron heart and warp reality to defeat the bad guys. Ninjas are supposed to whip out katanas and slice and dice. Plus he walked around in a pair of pajama pants and no shirt and had long white hair, instead of a proper ninja outfit. I would flip through issue after issue waiting for him to cut loose and break out the can of ninja whupass, but all he did was spout taoisms and think the bad guys into submission. Apparently every other reader was fed up to because it cancelled before the year was out. LAME.

Bel-Cam Jos
06-07-2003, 08:28 AM
Marvel's "New Universe" series.
To sell-ebrate its 25th anniversary, they decided to make an interconnected collection of 8 books set in "reality," with "real" people as the characters. Cases in point: Codename: Spitfire, Mark Hazzard: Merc, Kickers Inc., and Nightmask were canceled after only 12 issues! :eek: Spitfire had THREE DIFFERENT TITLE NAMES during its year-long run. PSI Force, Justice, DP7, and Starbrand lasted maybe another 2 years after. When you have the entire city of Pittsburgh blown up (arr! :Pirate: ), a football team as heroes (Kickers, Inc.), you change the entire storyline of a comic (Justice; one book was called something like "Everything you know is wrong" ), and every character seems to run into the others on every seventeenth panel, you are hurtin'. Sad thing is, I have almost every issue, including some Annuals (which suggest it'll last over a year).

jjreason
06-07-2003, 01:34 PM
Didn't the New Universe end in a book called "the War"? Apparently that's a tougher book to find, I've never seen a copy. I read Jvstice (at least that's what the logo looked like - it was probably supposed to be just Justice) for a bit. Merc had a good first cover, and DP7 wasn't the worst thing I'd read up to that point. Mind you, I was likely 12 or 13. Everything rocks when you're 12 or 13.

Eternal Padawan
06-07-2003, 02:49 PM
The New Universe was Jim Shooter's brainchild when he was E.I.C. at Marvel. D.P.7 was the X-Men of the New Universe and it weren't that bad. Starbrand was okay. The rest of it sucked pretty bad though. Later on, in QUASAR, Wendell Vaughn went traipsing thoruhg all these Marvel alternate realities, like the Squadron Supreme's world, etc, and for an issue, he went to the New Universe, and accidentally brought back the Starbrand and gave it to his girlfriend!

Speaking of E.I.C. brainfar..er childs. Tom DeFalco, ever with his pulse on the heartbeat of youthful America, introduced a Bruce Wayne ripoff with high tech armor and a skateboard?!?! "Hey kids dig this skateboard thing, I'll make a hero who rides one when he fights crime..." Night Thrasher was the Dazzler of the 90's. The sad thing is, he got a limited series, and then an unlimited one...

Tom DeFalco also thought up Thunderstrike, the hip, urban, totally human ThunderGod and forced him into HIS own ongoing series (porbably because DeFalco wrote it). Thusly armed with the newly minted Thunderstrike and old standbys Beta Ray Thor, and plain ol' vanilla Thor, Defalco came up with THOR CORPS! Which was lamer than a hobbled three legged horse.

jjreason
06-07-2003, 10:45 PM
Hahahaha! I was going to put "Thor Corps" in here, but I didn't think I'd given it enough of a chance to trash it. Funny, Ep, very funny!

El Chuxter
06-09-2003, 12:21 PM
Anyone remember NFL Superpro from Marvel? No? You're probably better off. :)

I liked the look of Thor when Eric Masterson became him, but when Thor came back and Eric became Thunderstrike, he sucked.

Night Thrasher could've been cool if they'd played down the skateboarding angle. He wasn't too bad as the leader of the New Warriors (the only comic Nicieza should've ever been allowed to write).

Eternal Padawan
06-09-2003, 02:24 PM
I remember buying a bookshelf one shot about a supposedly real life singer who doubled as a fictional skimpily clad vigilante named NightCat. It had a cool Jusko cover and mediocre Klaus Janson artwork inside. I guess it was supposed to be a springboard for an ongoing series, but it (and her career apparently) fizzled.

Dr Zoltar
06-09-2003, 05:30 PM
More sucky comics:

The Spider-man Clone thing (Dragged on and on and on)
X-Men Onslaught -- (I hated that it took the X-Men 2 years before they began searching for Charles after he disappeared)
Trencher (from Image comics)
DC/Marvel Amalgaman-er-whatever Crossovers
Vext (From DC)
DC's Day of Judgement
GI Joe -- In the 80's after they killed Cobra Commander and had Neon Ninja
The L.A.W (From DC)

I'm also going to have to defend the New Universe titles. I really enjoyed StarBrand, Justice, and DP 7. I was hoping Marvel would revamp them and bring them back. There was so much more they could have done with them. I'd be interested in hearing the story on how Wendell Vaughn brought the Star Brand back.

Eternal Padawan
06-10-2003, 02:37 PM
It's been so long since I read Quasar but... whoever had the Starbrand was going insane from it and they gave it to Wendell ( with or without his knowledge, I don't remember) then when he got home, he hugged his girlfriend and it stuck to her. After that I thought it was going to become a regular thing that his girlfriend was the new Starbrand, but...like I said, it's been awhile. I also seem to remember the little shadow guy from D.P.7 ( or at least one of his little shadow thingies) hitched a ride home with Wendell, but nothing ever came of that. It was in the last panel that the little guy stuck his head out of the shadow of Wendell's foot or whatever and winked at the "camera"

Speaking of Crossovers. The Deathmate crossover from Valiant and Image.

SPEEDBALL! Out of the blue, Marvel introduced this guy in his own ongoing series? What the heck? I have the first issue for some reason. It's obvious why I don't have the rest...

El Chuxter
06-10-2003, 02:44 PM
God. Deathmate. I'd blocked that out. Thanks for dredging up such bad memories. Worst. Crossover. Ever.

Remember how half the early Image losers first showed up in Deathmate? Leaving you wondering, "Okay, who are all these stupid characters?" And Spawn didn't even participate!

Speaking of bad Image dreck, how about the infamous mail-away Image #0? Clip a coupon from seven (mainly) first issues, get a freebie. Erik Larsen's Dragon story from that was extremely important to bridging the limited and regular series, and that moron Liefeld kept delaying it. By the time the book came out, Larsen had had to print the story in the collection of the limited series, so it was a reprint story! And for what? So Liefeld could "write" a story that obviously was done immediately before the book finally came out. . . over a year late.

jjreason
06-10-2003, 10:14 PM
The whole Image "thing" (if you don't include Spawn) - sucked. THey've straightened a lot of things out, but Image is pretty much responsible for that whole god forsaken shiny die cut cover craze, limited variants, tons of crap. And so many bad comics and characters.... yikes. No wonder, that was all the stuff the big companies turned away.

I guess Stormwatch came around (from #36, when Warren Ellis took it over - and led it into being the Authority), and WildCats more recent versions (by Joe Casey and Ian Churchill) have been good, but those are Wildstorm - which is essentially DC - nowadays.

Bel-Cam Jos
06-11-2003, 05:08 PM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
SPEEDBALL! Out of the blue, Marvel introduced this guy in his own ongoing series? What the heck? I have the first issue for some reason. It's obvious why I don't have the rest...
I was going to post about that very comic, EP! It was Steve Ditko's try at Spiderman-type gold. In fact, Speedball is another clone of SM, as far as the origin goes. Ugh.
How about the Millenium mega-crossover from DC? Only good crossover DC did while I was collecting was Crisis O.I.E. I tried to like Legends. Crossovers are more often crud-overs, I believe.

Dr Zoltar
06-11-2003, 05:59 PM
Originally posted by Bel-Cam Jos
How about the Millenium mega-crossover from DC? Only good crossover DC did while I was collecting was Crisis O.I.E. I tried to like Legends. Crossovers are more often crud-overs, I believe.

I agree. The most recent crossover I liked was DC One Million. Our Worlds At War, the Jokerizing one, and the crossover where they all reversed ages (I can't remember this one's official title) were bad.

I wonder why DC feels the need to do these? In hopes that someone picks up a title they don't normally read and decide to purchase it every month? If this is the case, they need to improve the crossover plots.

Eternal Padawan
06-11-2003, 06:24 PM
What was the DC crossover where Captain Atom was supposed to be the "suprise" hero turned villain at the end, but readers got wind of it half way through the crossover, so they inexplicably made Hawk from Hawk and Dove the bad guy? It sucked because H&D was one of the few DC comics I was collecting at the time, and they ended up having to cancel the book since y'know he was a villain now. SUCK.

Anybody ever read Power Pack? Towards the end of the series, they turned the oldest kid into a talking horse alien, and there was three eyed alien or something called gleep glop. And they tried to ressurect the Original Human Torch (or maybe it was Tor his sidekick)as a recurring character, but nobody told the writer that he was already a recurring character over in Namor as the head of security for Oracle Industries. dumbass.

Dr Zoltar
06-12-2003, 01:35 PM
Oh man, was that Armagedon 2001? It was before the time I was reading DC, but I heard that story line was messed up. DC tried to fix it with Zero Hour and it's been touched upon in the new JSA (which is a great read). But Hank (Hawk) did become The Monarch and then Extant. Dove did return to this world just recently -- She was disguised as someone else and left in a coma for a few years.

El Chuxter
06-12-2003, 02:20 PM
I remember Armageddon 2001. I remember feeling ripped off, since it made no sense (outside a marketing standpoint) for Waverider to check the futures of some heroes (mainly Superman and Batman) multiple times. And then the baddie was some relatively minor hero that he'd already checked out.

How about the DC Annual crossover ("New Blood"?) where aliens came to earth, started drinking blood or something, and inadvertently created one new hero per annual. . . each of which promptly faded away.

Or the worst move DC ever made, IMHO: making Hal Jordan, the Green Lantern, go wacko for no real reason and kill the rest of the Corps, only to be replaced by a knockoff in a snazzier costume? Up until Emerald Twilight, GL was the best book DC published. After that point, meh.

And to keep them alive when favorites like Kilowog were offed, DC made Jon "Not the Cooler Guy Who Hosts The Daily Show" Stewart one of those GL ripoff Darkstars, and turned Guy Gardner into some freaky-deaky alien mutant piece of crap thingy.

Eternal Padawan
06-13-2003, 05:09 PM
Heck, yeah. Guy Gardner had the snazziest GL costume with the giganto lapels and the turtleneck action. :D Then they turned him into that jackass living weapon or whatever that crap was.

I enjoyed Darkstars (Travis Charest was a B-version Jim Lee) but I always wondered what they were thinking when they created them.

"We need some kind of interstellar police force in the DC Universe."
"Hey! Great idea! We'll start a new series right away!"

(six months later)

"Hey. Uhhhh guys? Didn't you already have a DC universe interstellar police force?
"Oh yeah? Who?"
"Uhhhhh...Green lantern Corps?"

(long pause)

"oh."

El Chuxter
06-13-2003, 05:14 PM
So, what's Guy up to now? Or is he dead?

I kinda liked when he first got kicked off the GL Corps and went through hell and high water to get Sinestro's ring, then became a sorta non-GL GL. :D What was that cool artist's name? Joe Staton?

Eternal Padawan
06-13-2003, 05:39 PM
Beats me. I have no idea what 9/10 of the DC guys are up to.

Remember the Midnite Sons books from Marvel? They took all the "occult" books like Ghost Rider and Dr. Strange and slapped them under a new banner with three or four new books like a new Jonny Blaze book, and a Nightstalkers book with Blade. one of the new books was called Darkhold and not only did it have the crappiest artwork EVER, the plot revolved around three boring non superpowered people hunting down pages of some "occult" book of the dead. It SUCKED hardcore. And yet I have 16 issues since it crossed over with all the other MS books.

El Chuxter
06-13-2003, 05:44 PM
Yeah, I remember those. Remember how Morbius sucked because they tried to make him a superhero, then toward the end of the run a horror writer and artist took over and turned it around? Unfortunately, like TF vol 1, it was too late and no one cared, so Morbius ended his series by committing suicide. :cry:

(I got the artist, whose name escapes me at the moment, to draw me a Sleepwalker at the Heroes Convention in Charlotte years ago. It freakin' rocks, and I have it hanging on the stairs in my apartment.)

I remember Darkhold sucking, then seeing part of a re-run of the lame Friday The Thirteenth (or was it Poltergeist?) TV show and thinking, "Hey! That's Darkhold! It even sucks the same!!"

Dr Zoltar
06-13-2003, 06:51 PM
Originally posted by El Chuxter
So, what's Guy up to now? Or is he dead?


He's not dead, but I wish he was to put him out of his misery. He lost the Yellow Ring to Hal Jordon when Hal became insane, then was that living weapon thing. He mellowed out and opened a bar with a GL theme. Spent most of his time running the business and drinking with the living human GL's.

But then DC decided to screw it up again and had him die kind of and go to hell and become a demon. I swear to god. It was in a Superman comic during Our Worlds At War. The story is vague because it sucked and I didn't pay too much attention when I read it.

Imperiex killed him and somehow he came back as a shape changing demon for the new Zod. The last issue was a few months back where he's upset that no one cared that he died (everyone thought he just disappeared). So he gives Superman grief and Guy tells Supes that he could kill him if he wanted. But doesn't and then disappears.

DC -- What we're you thinking?!?!

dr_evazan22
06-13-2003, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
Remember the Midnite Sons books from Marvel?

I was thinking of this earlier, but couldn't remember the name!

Since you guys are talking GL, what ever happened to Gnort?

El Chuxter
06-14-2003, 11:48 AM
Gah. Zoltar, I must agree I now wish Guy was dead. I caught the beginning of that "living weapon" garbage but didn't know about the later crud.

BTW, slightly off topic: right after the launch of the new GL series about 12-15 years ago, I was at a flea market at the local mall and found an old Green Lantern comic in great shape in the $0.50 bin at one of the booths. I was sort of surprised, since this was one of those places where the newer comics were way overpriced. But I wasn't going to pass on what I was sure would be a great read, especially not at that price. After reading it (and, to my surprise, Guy Gardner showed up briefly), I looked in my price guide. The first appearance of Guy Gardner!! :D:D:D:D:D:D

Dr Zoltar
06-15-2003, 12:26 AM
Originally posted by El Chuxter
After reading it (and, to my surprise, Guy Gardner showed up briefly), I looked in my price guide. The first appearance of Guy Gardner!! :D:D:D:D:D:D

Nice find! I believe it's issue #59 from the 1st series. I've seen the price anywhere from $10 to $500 for a mint copy. I wouldn't mind owning one sometime as I'd like to read the original story. I wish DC would reprint some of the original important issues.

And as for the person who mentioned Gnort -- He showed up in an issue (annual maybe?) a few years back. This was after all the GL's had their rings lose their charge. Gnort was last seen in an alley digging through garbage cans looking for something to eat. He's pretty much been reduced to a stray dog now.

However, Mojo (the planet) has returned.

Bel-Cam Jos
06-15-2003, 08:54 AM
That's kinda how I got my Amazing Spiderman #238 (first Hobgoblin). It was in a "All for $2.50 each" bin, and it has the tatoo, too! Maybe a new thread idea, eh? :rolleyes:

What about the Spiderman goes to an insane asylum crossover? Only three issues long? Useless, plus it has Bill Stienkiewcz (sp?) covers. Ugh.

Eternal Padawan
06-16-2003, 02:41 PM
Does anybody remember a bunch of comics that Marvel put out with a religious slant? Like religious super heroes, but with a little harder wdge? I'm not saying they were lame or not, because I never read 'em, but I remember seeing the ads in my other Marvel books all the time.

Speaking of lame Spidey storylines, one time Spidey went down to Alabamba or someplace in Spectacular and fought some creepy inbred hillbillies for an issue of two. They all had big bug eyes and bumpkin hillbilly overall outfits. Man, I couldn't WAIT for that story arc to be done.

dr_evazan22
06-16-2003, 03:06 PM
I know a lot of people don't like the Clone storyline from Spidey, but I dug it for the most part. What ruined it for me was the hundreds or thousands of Spidey's that were running around at the finale. That, plus I think that they should have left May dead. I thought it was so well done and Peter had MJ to take care of him. I liked how May said she had known for a long time.


As for Gnort, that's too bad. He was kind of funny.

Going back to Spidey.... The storylines where Spidey was fighting Hobby and trying to find his secret ID were some of the best modern Spidey tales, IMO, esp. ish's 248 - 250. I love reading those!

Dr Zoltar
06-16-2003, 05:35 PM
So how did Marvel manage to bring May back from the dead? I have the issue where she died, but I had no idea they brought her back.

El Chuxter
06-17-2003, 12:40 PM
EP brought up Valiant comics in another thread (and Deathmate already popped up), and they produced some books that definitely belong here. Most of their pre-Unity stuff was pretty good, but shortly after (possibly due to the firing of Jim Shooter?), the emphasis went from story to art and then to (ugh) variant covers. Early issues of Rai, Archer and Armstrong, and XO Manowar were awesome, but Bloodshot, Turok, and Hard Corps sucked hard. Even in Valiant's heyday, they never could disguise the fact that Harbinger was a second-rate X-Men knockoff.

And the intentional underproduction to drive up demand was a no-no. :mad: Plus I never got the second issue of Unity because it was one of those stupid dealer exclusive "freebies," and it vanished before I could get to the comic shop.

Then Shooter started up Defiant. Remember that? The first comic they did was Warriors of Plasm #0. Which was sold as trading cards that, when placed in nine-card pages, formed the issue. Of course, to get a few pages of the story, you had to buy the official Plasm binder. And every single issue of every comic they did referred back to this incredibly expensive, difficult to complete issue that they never reprinted in normal comic form!

Not to mention that every book hit shelves in completely different form from what had been solicited (which normally sounded more interesting). What was the longest run of any Defiant title? Five issues? Six?

Poor Jim Shooter. He went from being an in-joke in the first issue of GIJoe to boozing it up in an alley with David Faustino and Rhea Pearlman.

Eternal Padawan
06-17-2003, 02:55 PM
Wait...wait. let me check...YES!! I have Warriors of Plasm 1-5!!! I am officially lame! :D

Valiant got its start being the Nintendo comics company, so they had Mario Bros comics and crap like that.

Here's one: Impact! DC ressurected the old Red Circle(?) comics line under a new banner. The Fly. The Shield. The Comet. The Black Hood. This mini universe started out cool, but quickly disintegrated after constant artist and writer shuffling. I think it ended with a mini-series a few years later where everybody went into the future and died.

El Chuxter
06-17-2003, 03:10 PM
Yeah, the mini-series was about the Black Hood having to kill the Comet because he was going to destroy the universe. I actually bought a couple of Chuck Wotjkiewicz's (and I'm 100% sure I misspelled that) pages from that series dirt cheap at a convention years ago. (He's one of those who I can't figure out why he didn't hit it big.)

Impact (or was it technically "!mpact"?) definitely started out cool, but it died fast and hard. A shame.

Eternal Padawan
06-17-2003, 03:29 PM
Except for The Web. Which was lame from the get-go. What was that final mini series titled?

El Chuxter
06-17-2003, 06:03 PM
Ooh, yeah, Web was kinda bad from the start. I'd forgotten that one.

I want to say the mini-series was called Crucible: The Final !mpact. Does that sound right?

El Chuxter
08-07-2003, 01:58 PM
Does anyone remember the period in the early '90s when there were several Marvel UK titles that weren't really Marvel UK titles but normal bad Marvel comics done by British folks?

The first was Death's Head II. I always had a soft spot for the first Death's Head (maybe it was the Furman/Senior/Transformers connection), and this killed him off in the first issue, replacing him with a stupid Cable/Punisher/Ghost Rider/Terminator clone. Gone was the witty banter, replaced by big guns.

Then there was Motormouth: a punky British girl and total foul-mouthed knockoff of Jubilation who happened upon a pair of sneakers. The catch? Inside the sneakers had been hidden an interdimensional transportation device. (Because that's the logical place to put such things.) This book became even better :rolleyes: after she suddenly and with no explanation teamed up with a big assassin sent to kill her and the book was retitled "Motormouth and Killpower."

Dark Angel I don't remember too well. It was going to be called Hell's Angel, but the biker gang sued or threatened to sue or something.

I recall there were more, but don't know what they were.

And every single issue of every Marvel [pseuedo-] UK comic featured Wolverine or the entire X-Men team. I recall one of them had the absolute worst X-Men art and characterization of all time.

Eternal Padawan
08-07-2003, 04:40 PM
Heh. I have tons of those issues. At some point, there was a guy called Die-Cut introduced solely so they could have die-cut covers and be clever...

There was a team of interdimensional jumpers ( forgot their names) and 80% of them would die each issue. Kinda tough to get fan favorite characters going.

Then there was Pendragon, which was reincarnations of Aurthur and his knights in spandex and Captain Britain joined them (so the covers would have a recognizable character on them, I think).

What the hell was Annex? I think it was a Spider-man spin off. I have it and don't know what the hell it is...

Who decided Prowler should get his own series? Marvel was scraping the barrel for awhile wasn't it? His powers derived from pneumatics. PNEUMATICS, people. People have been shot for less.

Ego, the living planet is just a lame concept. Period.

El Chuxter
08-07-2003, 04:48 PM
Annex was a spin-off of the Marvel vs DC series. I thought it was going to be a dude who sorta went between universes without control, but he was supposed to protect the boundaries between the universes and enlisted guest stars every issue to help. I don't care how neat it was the first time, how cool both characters are, or whether the Annex comic was considered canon in both universes, you can seriously only have so much sexual tension between Jubilation and lil' Timmy Drake, especially when it's pretty much a no-no to have it permanently affect them in their own titles.

Or am I thinking of Access? Ah well. Either way it sucks.

Marvel vs DC could've been great, but it ended up sucking. The match-ups were silly. I think I said in the "Comic Character Showdown" thread how incredibly ludicrous it is that Wolverine could ever beat Lobo. Wolvie's tough, but he never killed off entire worlds because he felt like it or gained immortality by scaring the occupants of both Heaven and Hell.

The Amalgam books were hit and miss. Some were fun, like "Dark Claw" (I think that was the name). Given that James and Bruce wear similar costumes, have goofy kid sidekicks who wear similar costumes, and have the same attitude, they were born to cross over in such a method.

JON9000
08-19-2003, 09:28 PM
Speedball! It was awful. I think he was introduced around the time of Atlantis Attacks!

Eternal Padawan
08-20-2003, 03:14 PM
Speedball was supposed to be the light hearted,quirky Spider-Man type of the 90's. They missed the target on that one. They even missed the big bale of hay that gets put behind the target to catch stray arrows. The shaft probably landed in some little old lady's rump while she was bent over in her garden pulling weeds.

Only when Fabian Nicieza stuck him in New Warriors did Speedball become an interesting comic relief.

Having just got a plumb stash of Daredevil comics including almost the entire run of the new series, I was amazed at how long that title coasted in suck mode before they did the Marvel Knight renumbering thing. That whole Jack Batlin, con man thing? Ugh. I can't even remember any of the stories from the last two years I collected it.

dr_evazan22
08-21-2003, 01:45 AM
I'll add in any reference, in continuity, of 9/11. Kinda shatters teh make believe world.

RooJay
08-25-2003, 08:22 PM
Some were fun, like "Dark Claw" (I think that was the name). Given that James and Bruce wear similar costumes, have goofy kid sidekicks who wear similar costumes, and have the same attitude, they were born to cross over in such a method.

You did NOT just call him "James".
Which reminds me: I must've been one of the few people who thought Origin pretty much sucked.
Don't get me wrong - it was a pretty decent story (minus the part where little Jamie inexplicably overcomes his medical problems and suddenly starts actin' all big and butch after having lived his entire life up to that point as a major nancy-boy. Hello? An explanation would be nice!), but that sickly little pansy will never be the man I know as Wolverine. Wolverine stated his life as a bed-ridden little irish sissy named James?! WhatEVER! :rolleyes: :frus:

Also, books that were named here that I don't feel belong:

Booster Gold
!mpact Comics like - The Hood
The Fly
and the Comet (they did fail at the end, but only after DC had completely given up on the line anyway)
the original Turok series (c'mon, how can a book that starts out with Bart Sears and ends with the awesome Rags Morales on art ever suck?)
and while they were definitely very different, I actually quite enjoyed much of the Defiant Comics line, especially Warriors of Plasm, Dogs of War, Charlemagne and the Great Grimmax.
Someone also mentioned all of DC's Bloodline heroes yet forgot to mention that at least one good thing came of that crossover - HITMAN! Yes, Tommy Monaghan got his start as one of the Bloodline heroes!


Of course, no one has yet mentioned the suckiest comic ever published. I'm speaking, of course, of Marvel's own Terror Inc.! You know, the one with the demonic, zombie-looking hitman who would steal people's limbs and attach them to his own body so he could gain their skills? Yeah, that sucked BIG TIME!

Here's a link to a site I love to visit that's dedicated solely to sucky comics -

http://www.ape-law.com/GAF/index.html

Unfortunately, they only update about once every year and a half it seems, but I often find myself in stitches laughing out loud at what this guy has to say! Check it out!