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aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 10:04 AM
What makes you madder the inclusion of the kit figure or the 'absurd' bidding.

Collectors will eventually be able to get kit if they are willing to pay the ridiculous ebay price for them, just like they could get a vlix if they wanted.
The point is, completism, at any price, would need to be your motto however.

Mine is the bidding/ebay thing.

On the most part , do you think that all the high bidders now are legit in the 10-30 k range of jmps? I honestly dont. Sure there may be a few 'hardcore' 800 figure owners here, but they are in the far minority. I got a room full of toys and am maybe in the 3-4k(maaaybeee) range if i were to cut it all.

Ya think the auctions will ever get that low that they would be worth clipping? i dont.

If you were to go out and buy1 thousand figures today , you still cant bid for anything...

plo koon 200
10-03-2003, 10:47 AM
My biggest complaint is the lack of product up for bid. But overall I am upset with this system being unfair to 99% of the collectors out there.

aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 10:53 AM
Its is totally unfair to oversea collectors granted.

To carded collectors, they are just s.o.l.
They wouldnt be able to take part unless they damaged thier cards, which is thier choice to do. The figures arent sold to remain unopened remeber, thats a collector thing.

There are only what 4 auctions for how many thousands of collectors? Thats wrong totally...

amidalak
10-03-2003, 11:48 AM
Its is totally unfair to oversea collectors granted.

no question about it.


To carded collectors, they are just s.o.l.
They wouldnt be able to take part unless they damaged thier cards, which is thier choice to do. The figures arent sold to remain unopened remeber, thats a collector thing.

i agree, it's their choice to open or not, if they don't open, they don't participate.


There are only what 4 auctions for how many thousands of collectors? Thats wrong totally...

these auctions are supposed to last until dec. 31st. that's three months of auctions and three months of products to go up. these are just the first weeks worth of products to go up, not the only products to go up!


My biggest complaint is the lack of product up for bid. But overall I am upset with this system being unfair to 99% of the collectors out there.

in the first 4 auctions, there are actually 15 products up, 10 saculs, 1 kitik, 1 jango, 3 playskool MF's.

how is the system unfair? hasbro didn't have to do anything with these things. and they made it completely clear over the last few years that they were not going to make an exclusive mail away figure because of the cost involved. i think it is completely fair that the folks with the most JMP's (who obviously are the folks who have bought the most hasbro/star wars product) have the best opportunity to get the best stuff. and let's not go there with the whole scalpers/dealers argument. there isn't a scalper/dealer out there that is going to destroy 100's of pieces of product that they could sell and make a profit on to win one of these auctions.


On the most part , do you think that all the high bidders now are legit in the 10-30 k range of jmps? I honestly dont. Sure there may be a few 'hardcore' 800 figure owners here, but they are in the far minority. I got a room full of toys and am maybe in the 3-4k(maaaybeee) range if i were to cut it all.

i do think that at this point the bids are legit, except for the jango. looking at the previous bids and seeing them jump so greatly makes me think that that one is still hosed. someone in the other thread gave a pretty good rundown on how it wouldn't be that hard to have gotten that many points.

plo koon 200
10-03-2003, 12:06 PM
[QUOTE=amidalak]no question about it.


how is the system unfair? hasbro didn't have to do anything with these things. and they made it completely clear over the last few years that they were not going to make an exclusive mail away figure because of the cost involved. i think it is completely fair that the folks with the most JMP's (who obviously are the folks who have bought the most hasbro/star wars product) have the best opportunity to get the best stuff. and let's not go there with the whole scalpers/dealers argument. there isn't a scalper/dealer out there that is going to destroy 100's of pieces of product that they could sell and make a profit on to win one of these auctions.

QUOTE]

You have missed the meaning of my post. Where have I on any posts on any thread mentioned anything about scalpers/dealers?

How is the system unfair? How is it not? Yes collectors who have spent the most money deserve a chance at the good stuff. However that does not mean collectors who dont spend as much money dont deserve a chance as well. There are many big Star Wars fans out there and they spend all their payroll on product when it comes out. They just dont make as muchl. Not everyone in the world is blessed with a job that makes millions. These auctions are supposed to be for the fans so why is it that only less than 1% of the fans are allowed to participate?

aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 12:32 PM
I read the 'possible to get 500,000 points' deal.
IF its possible, I bet there may be 2 people on the planet with that many clipped points.
If they bought that much product , and if they opened those products, and if they saved all those points ...thats too many if's for me

i bet if you took a poll of everyone on this site with saved points, the average would be 1-2 thousand points

plo koon 200
10-03-2003, 12:39 PM
I read about the possible 500,00 and I am POSITIVE that the person was over-exaggerating. In order to get 500,000 points even buying clearanced out TRU figures you would have to spend at least $50,000 on common figures. There is not that many figures, army builder-wise that can add up to that amount.

Say this person bought 1000 BD's that is 10,000 points plus 1000 stormies that is 20,000 points. I would then assume that all other army builders would be in the 100 range because they cost more than $1 at TRU's clearance. 100,000 points may be a possibilty but it would take a lot. I'm almost sure that this person is exaggerating. You should ask Tycho how many points he has because he buys around 10 of each figure. If Tycho does not have 100,000 points or more then I can't think of who would.

aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 12:47 PM
we all buy tons of product, some much more than others but having 25,000 jmp is very high. Its roughtly $4-5 per 10 points in toys that you opened and saved every point counting ships and clearance figs.


I read about the possible 500,00 and I am POSITIVE that the person was over-exaggerating. In order to get 500,000 points even buying clearanced out TRU figures you would have to spend at least $50,000 on common figures. There is not that many figures, army builder-wise that can add up to that amount.

Say this person bought 1000 BD's that is 10,000 points plus 1000 stormies that is 20,000 points. I would then assume that all other army builders would be in the 100 range because they cost more than $1 at TRU's clearance. 100,000 points may be a possibilty but it would take a lot. I'm almost sure that this person is exaggerating. You should ask Tycho how many points he has because he buys around 10 of each figure. If Tycho does not have 100,000 points or more then I can't think of who would.

amidalak
10-03-2003, 12:53 PM
You have missed the meaning of my post. Where have I on any posts on any thread mentioned anything about scalpers/dealers?

How is the system unfair? How is it not? Yes collectors who have spent the most money deserve a chance at the good stuff. However that does not mean collectors who dont spend as much money dont deserve a chance as well. There are many big Star Wars fans out there and they spend all their payroll on product when it comes out. They just dont make as muchl. Not everyone in the world is blessed with a job that makes millions. These auctions are supposed to be for the fans so why is it that only less than 1% of the fans are allowed to participate?

and you missed the meaning on mine, i was just heading off that argument before somone chose to make it.

these auctions are not unfair. we as collectors are not entitled to the auctions or any of the stuff put up for bid. hasbro has done this as a goodwill gesture. the only thing we are entitled to from hasbro is toys, and only after we have paid for them. your argument that some people have more and some people have less to spend on star wars toys has nothing to do with the auctions being fair/unfair. it has to do with life being fair/unfair, and here's a hint: life is unfair, get used to it.

more than 1% of collectors will be able to participate. in fact, as long as you have JMP's you can participate. you might not win, but you can participate. again, these auctions are supposed to last for three months. in that time i am sure there will be plenty to bid on. the 4 auctions that are up right now are just the first weeks worth, not the only ones. you might not be able to win kitik, but that doesn't mean you won't be able to win something. most of the complaining going on right now just seems like "i can't get kitik and jorg, so since i can't have them, i don't want anyone else to." it doesn't make any sense because these figs (in the current form) weren't going to be available to anyone anyway.

these auctions are a reward to collectors because of the facts involving the JMP's. fact: hasbro is not going to make an exclusive figure to be mailed away for. they have said this consistently over the last few years. fact: hasbro is not going to produce any figures in large quantities to distribute to the masses that don't have to be paid for. fact: hasbro has some items that have not been mass produced, and are not going to be mass produced that fans would like to have an opportunity to get. the auctions are the opportunity. fact: hasbro is choosing to reward the fans by providing an opportunity, especially to those who have provided the most financial support (those with the most JMP's) to their company/brand. just because some people can't get what they want doesn't make this unfair or a bad idea.

bobafrett
10-03-2003, 12:59 PM
Its is totally unfair to oversea collectors granted.

To carded collectors, they are just s.o.l.
They wouldnt be able to take part unless they damaged thier cards, which is thier choice to do. The figures arent sold to remain unopened remeber, thats a collector thing.

There are only what 4 auctions for how many thousands of collectors? Thats wrong totally...

So what your saying is that my money that I spent on my figures isn't as good as yours just because I choose to leave about 97% of my figures on the cards? My problem with it is, it will only allow a scant few to actually bid especially when the JMP reaches even beyond what you probably have saved up. What I liked about the old redemption of points is you didn't need to have some astronomichal number to get a cool collectible. Maybe 100 points and a couple bucks for shipping got you an Anakin or Emperor figure and everyone was happy. For you to say that carded collectors are just s.o.l. is garbage. The whole auction is a joke, and I might consider not spending any more of my hard earned money if this is the way Hasbro chooses to "reward" collectors. I see nothing wrong with leaving my collection carded as I do. For one thing, I will never lose any weapons or accessories. I like the art work on the cards, they are easier to dust and if my friends want to look at them they can do so with out damaging the figure looseing some piece, only to have a blaster get vacummed up on cleaning day, or chewed up by the cat.

amidalak
10-03-2003, 01:00 PM
I read about the possible 500,00 and I am POSITIVE that the person was over-exaggerating. In order to get 500,000 points even buying clearanced out TRU figures you would have to spend at least $50,000 on common figures. There is not that many figures, army builder-wise that can add up to that amount.

Say this person bought 1000 BD's that is 10,000 points plus 1000 stormies that is 20,000 points. I would then assume that all other army builders would be in the 100 range because they cost more than $1 at TRU's clearance. 100,000 points may be a possibilty but it would take a lot. I'm almost sure that this person is exaggerating. You should ask Tycho how many points he has because he buys around 10 of each figure. If Tycho does not have 100,000 points or more then I can't think of who would.

he probably is, 500,000 points is a ton, but 100,000 does not seem as unreasonable. just another possibility, but what if a couple people are pooling their points just to get a hold of kitik?

aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 01:07 PM
Not saying that at all, im saying you are CHOOSING not to clip your cards.
So therefore you cannot enter.
I have many things i chose not to open, thats my choice.
I am not *****ing about it, ive accepted the fact that those cards arent going to be clipped. You got points, use em, or dont. I have around 2k points and im not bothering to clip anymore of my unopened things at this point because they arent enoug to put me over the hump..

I wish it was a send 100 jmp's and $5 shipping, id do that in a second, but it aint.

Star wars wont do those anymore, gijoe can, simpsons can, but star wars wont.
Thats pretty weak in my book but i have no say in the matter.


So what your saying is that my money that I spent on my figures isn't as good as yours just because I choose to leave about 97% of my figures on the cards? My problem with it is, it will only allow a scant few to actually bid especially when the JMP reaches even beyond what you probably have saved up. What I liked about the old redemption of points is you didn't need to have some astronomichal number to get a cool collectible. Maybe 100 points and a couple bucks for shipping got you an Anakin or Emperor figure and everyone was happy. For you to say that carded collectors are just s.o.l. is garbage. The whole auction is a joke, and I might consider not spending any more of my hard earned money if this is the way Hasbro chooses to "reward" collectors. I see nothing wrong with leaving my collection carded as I do. For one thing, I will never lose any weapons or accessories. I like the art work on the cards, they are easier to dust and if my friends want to look at them they can do so with out damaging the figure looseing some piece, only to have a blaster get vacummed up on cleaning day, or chewed up by the cat.

amidalak
10-03-2003, 01:07 PM
So what your saying is that my money that I spent on my figures isn't as good as yours just because I choose to leave about 97% of my figures on the cards? My problem with it is, it will only allow a scant few to actually bid especially when the JMP reaches even beyond what you probably have saved up. What I liked about the old redemption of points is you didn't need to have some astronomichal number to get a cool collectible. Maybe 100 points and a couple bucks for shipping got you an Anakin or Emperor figure and everyone was happy. For you to say that carded collectors are just s.o.l. is garbage. The whole auction is a joke, and I might consider not spending any more of my hard earned money if this is the way Hasbro chooses to "reward" collectors. I see nothing wrong with leaving my collection carded as I do. For one thing, I will never lose any weapons or accessories. I like the art work on the cards, they are easier to dust and if my friends want to look at them they can do so with out damaging the figure looseing some piece, only to have a blaster get vacummed up on cleaning day, or chewed up by the cat.

i hear your complaint, and i sympathize, but these are toys we are talking about, and they are meant to be opened and played with. and it's not really about whose money is better, you are making a choice to keep your figs carded, and that has consequences. in the future, it might mean you could make a profit on what you have bought. in the short-term, though, it means you can't participate in the auctions. btw, i hope no one is getting a feeling of hostility from my posts, there is none intended, it's just that this is the first topic in a long time i think has actually been worth discussing beyond an "i agree" or "i disagree" reply.

aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 01:11 PM
he probably is, 500,000 points is a ton, but 100,000 does not seem as unreasonable. just another possibility, but what if a couple people are pooling their points just to get a hold of kitik?
How many points do you have?
how many people would it take to get 50000 let alone 100000

bobafrett
10-03-2003, 01:22 PM
i hear your complaint, and i sympathize, but these are toys we are talking about, and they are meant to be opened and played with.

I understand that, but I'm 38. I don't "play" with the toys. I collect them. I don't understand why. I mean why do I feel it neccessary to get at least one of every figure made? I open about 3% of my 3 3/4 inch figures (doubles only), and I display them throughout the apartment. I was delighted when Hasbro released the different troopers Rebel and Imperial in 4 pack non carded. I have ne reason not to takes those out and display them. I still do not play with them In fact I got a little irrate when my brother came into town, and decided to make the Stormtroopers doing a leg kick line dance. I look back now and laugh about it. Regardless if they are toys or not, at my age I choose to simply enjoy them on the cards. However I do not think what Hasbro has done with the auction will make many people happy. I'm sure not enjoying it.

amidalak
10-03-2003, 01:37 PM
How many points do you have?
how many people would it take to get 50000 let alone 100000

i've got about 4500, but i am neither a completist or an army builder by any stretch of the imagination. i don't even do many of the vehicles (not that there are that many). but 2 completists or big army builders i would think could manage it, if not just one. my buddy from my home town does 5 (2 for him, 3 each for his kids) or more of every fig and 3 of every ship/playset and army builds. 50,000 JMP's means that since ep. 1 (1999) he would have had to spend approx. $25,000, give or take ($5=10 JMP's). he has easily spent that much, his room looks like a museum. He is loaded, inheritance and a good job, and is not an average collector, but it makes me believe that it is not impossible to do. it also leads me to believe that with these huge auctions going down in the first week, many of the few super collectors can spend their massive amounts of points so that later in the auctions the rest of us have a chance. btw, thanks for reminding me, but i haven't talked to him in awhile, so i'm going to give him a ring, see if he is one of the big dogs barking in the auction.

bobafrett
10-03-2003, 01:37 PM
Okay, I went and counted up my JMP's from the figures and so fourth that I have opened. I have:

37 X 10 = 370 JMP's
06 X 20 = 120 JMP's
01 X 30 = 30 JMP's
01 X 40 = 40 JMP's
02 X 50 = 100 JMP's
--------------------
Total = 660 JMP's not quite enough to bid on spit from the Hasbro janitor.

bobafrett
10-03-2003, 01:57 PM
Here we go, someone selling some JMP's to us who don't open our figures...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3147428834&category=50264

aikman8_1999
10-03-2003, 03:19 PM
See.Thats the thing, I thought I had a lot of stuff, but to even approach even these 10000 jmp numbers is ridiculous.
There are a few legit bidders but id hazard not too many.


Here we go, someone selling some JMP's to us who don't open our figures...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3147428834&category=50264

plo koon 200
10-03-2003, 03:44 PM
and you missed the meaning on mine, i was just heading off that argument before somone chose to make it.

these auctions are not unfair. we as collectors are not entitled to the auctions or any of the stuff put up for bid. hasbro has done this as a goodwill gesture. the only thing we are entitled to from hasbro is toys, and only after we have paid for them. your argument that some people have more and some people have less to spend on star wars toys has nothing to do with the auctions being fair/unfair. it has to do with life being fair/unfair, and here's a hint: life is unfair, get used to it.

more than 1% of collectors will be able to participate. in fact, as long as you have JMP's you can participate. you might not win, but you can participate. again, these auctions are supposed to last for three months. in that time i am sure there will be plenty to bid on. the 4 auctions that are up right now are just the first weeks worth, not the only ones. you might not be able to win kitik, but that doesn't mean you won't be able to win something. most of the complaining going on right now just seems like "i can't get kitik and jorg, so since i can't have them, i don't want anyone else to." it doesn't make any sense because these figs (in the current form) weren't going to be available to anyone anyway.

these auctions are a reward to collectors because of the facts involving the JMP's. fact: hasbro is not going to make an exclusive figure to be mailed away for. they have said this consistently over the last few years. fact: hasbro is not going to produce any figures in large quantities to distribute to the masses that don't have to be paid for. fact: hasbro has some items that have not been mass produced, and are not going to be mass produced that fans would like to have an opportunity to get. the auctions are the opportunity. fact: hasbro is choosing to reward the fans by providing an opportunity, especially to those who have provided the most financial support (those with the most JMP's) to their company/brand. just because some people can't get what they want doesn't make this unfair or a bad idea.

So you are telling me Hasbro has the right to make fans think they will do something for them and then don't. Hasbro is a corporation and corporations are entitled to make the people who purchase their products happy. By alienating 99% of the collectors they have lost a whole lot of money if you think about it. If Hasbro only insulted the few collectors who had a lot of points by making a program that is fair for everyone (which I don't see why those with a lot of ponts would be insulted) then Hasbro really would not being losing the majority of their base. But what Hasbro is doing is saying that those 99% of people who only contributed a small amount of money aren't important. Without us, the people who buy a figure here and there, there would be no Star Wars period. It is fans like us that keep the line moving. Even those super collectors with 500,000 points benefit from us collectors with only 4,000 points. With each fan that quits collecting that means the less opportunities there are for product to continue. I really want you think about that. I for one belive Hasbro is entitled to keep the majority of their customers happy if they want to make a profit.

amidalak
10-03-2003, 04:31 PM
So you are telling me Hasbro has the right to make fans think they will do something for them and then don't. Hasbro is a corporation and corporations are entitled to make the people who purchase their products happy. By alienating 99% of the collectors they have lost a whole lot of money if you think about it. If Hasbro only insulted the few collectors who had a lot of points by making a program that is fair for everyone (which I don't see why those with a lot of ponts would be insulted) then Hasbro really would not being losing the majority of their base. But what Hasbro is doing is saying that those 99% of people who only contributed a small amount of money aren't important. Without us, the people who buy a figure here and there, there would be no Star Wars period. It is fans like us that keep the line moving. Even those super collectors with 500,000 points benefit from us collectors with only 4,000 points. With each fan that quits collecting that means the less opportunities there are for product to continue. I really want you think about that. I for one belive Hasbro is entitled to keep the majority of their customers happy if they want to make a profit.

i don't remember hasbro in the last few years making us think they were going to do anything at all with the JMP's. in fact, to the contrary, most of what they have said indicated they weren't going to do anything at all with them. again, 99% of fans aren't being alienated over the whole auction, really just those who think they are entitle to kitik and jorg, the first week's worth of products in a three month auction. besides which, these figures weren't going to be offered to everyone anyway! and i still haven't seen a logical argument as to why the auctions are unfair to anyone.

plo koon 200
10-03-2003, 04:35 PM
i don't remember hasbro in the last few years making us think they were going to do anything at all with the JMP's. in fact, to the contrary, most of what they have said indicated they weren't going to do anything at all with them. again, 99% of fans aren't being alienated over the whole auction, really just those who think they are entitle to kitik and jorg, the first week's worth of products in a three month auction. besides which, these figures weren't going to be offered to everyone anyway! and i still haven't seen a logical argument as to why the auctions are unfair to anyone.

What makes you think that I think I am entitled to Jorg or Kitik. I had ten Jorg's at one point. I have TF Vader. I don't have a Kitik but if I really wanted one that bad I would have got one and guess what I feel alienated. I have all the products except the Kitik. My problem is not in the products being offered but in the quantiy and way that they are being offered. And I really would not say these are being offered.

amidalak
10-03-2003, 04:56 PM
What makes you think that I think I am entitled to Jorg or Kitik. I had ten Jorg's at one point. I have TF Vader. I don't have a Kitik but if I really wanted one that bad I would have got one and guess what I feel alienated. I have all the products except the Kitik. My problem is not in the products being offered but in the quantiy and way that they are being offered. And I really would not say these are being offered.

why do you feel alienated then? hasbro didn't mass produce those figures, and aren't going to, so of course there is a small quantity. that they are available at all is surprising to me. and what's wrong with the way they are being offered? what's wrong with a little competition, especially when in the end, even the winners don't pay anything real. i didn't mean to specify you, but the reason i think people feel they are entitled to jorg or kitik is no one has made an argument that really makes sense to me as to why these auctions are so bad, besides "i want one but don't have enough points to win." just because some people didn't get something they wanted? i don't understand the problem. i would rather see some super collector get these things by sending in JMP's than see this stuff on ebay after a hasbro employee walked out the door with them to make a buck. or would everyone rather hasbro just destroy this stuff?

you are more fortunate than i am. I don't have either of those figs. got an extra jorg? :D