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View Full Version : Who is Star Wars best "extra" villain?



Tycho
07-12-2004, 05:50 PM
We all know you can't have an epic tale of good vs. evil without some awesome baddies.

Conventional wisdom would tell us that the top 2 Sith would leave with most of the accolades: Vader (especially) and Palpatine (secondary).

However there are a lot of other cool villainous characters in the Star Wars saga - and let us count the expanded universe as part of this for the moment.

Who is your favorite villain?


Choose from:

Exar Kun
Nute Gunray
Darth Maul
Aurra Sing
Jango Fett
Zam Wessel
Count Dooku / Darth Tyranus
Durge
Asajj Ventress
General Grievous
Prince Xizor
Grand Moff Tarkin
Jabba the Hutt
Boba Fett
Ysanne Isaard
Grand Admiral Thrawn
Shadao-Shai
Nom Anor


Right now a lot of the Clone Wars villains are really interesting to me.

I have to say that Count Dooku / Darth Tyranus is very intriguing to me.

General Grievous might be the new baddie on the block, but he takes his orders from Dooku. Don't you think Dooku can control him then? Even if the Jedi can't?

I think Dooku's mystery, his sophistication, and his lack of predictability make him a very cool character.

stillakid
07-12-2004, 06:05 PM
I've always been partial to Bikerscouts myself. Here you've got these guys, probably conscripts from some backwater hole in the ground, out on their own willing to push 12 cylinders at 200mph through a redwood forest. That takes some chutzpah. :cool:

Bosskman
07-12-2004, 06:21 PM
Jabba. He's a fat lazy gangster who surround himself with hot "women" and eats, drinks, and does drugs all day long. Jabba's a badass and he's always been one of my favorites.

Bossk is up there too. I know his role in the movies was less than minimal, but thanks to some EU books he's probably my favorite SW villain next to Jabba (other than Vader and Palpy of course). He's always getting screwed over by everybody else and he just gets angrier and angrier until he explodes.

ew2seal
07-12-2004, 08:04 PM
i would have to say the best are jengo and boba fett. the whole entire bounty hunting thing is the coolest. just to prove it check out my last tattoo. i plan on getting boba at a later time. granted to all of you who would say they died quick in the movies. i laugh, read the stories of of there lives and successes in the novels they were the greatest of bounty hunters in the star wars galaxy so bad the bounty hunter guild feared them.

mabudonicus
07-12-2004, 08:21 PM
I currently like Dooku as the most intriguing character.... Tycho, a thorough search of my posts will reveal that I am in total agreement with your theory (tho I think mine came first ;)) about his role in Anakin's .... well, backstory, to say the least (not long now, BTW)


But as for, say, OT classic "extra" villain???? it's a bona-fide toss-up... it's either Dengar (that whole F.U. story arc where he was a wife abusing NASCAR driver was totally wicked)

OR



21-B.... those glinty little eyes as he totally sarcastically uttered "Take care, Sir" my very soul froze at the sheer ruthlessness and evil of the droid....

And the part where in the F.U. he gets converted into a Bass-o-matic and shreds literally dozens of undersized fish into disgusting, pinkish paste was creepy to the max

:D

:beard:

Tycho
07-12-2004, 08:41 PM
Yeah - it's kind of funny how Dooku grew on me.

I was not interested in him that much at all, even when I was reeling with excitement before and after Episode 2.

There was just so much there that the movie filled in and offered - especially clone troopers, etc.

Well, now that we're in the Clone Wars and 2/3 of the way through the prequels, there are a bunch of new villains - and the EU have added some too.

Each one is the next sort of flashy super-powered character with something special about them.

Grevious is the latest to date - he's a killer and bent on cruel executions. He's a droid with double-joints and whatever else - and he can wield a lightsaber (not that most of them can't)

Ventress is the angry orphan - and Aurra Sing fits the same class. Darth Maul was just (supposedly) better trained than them, but their all pitbulls that just want to fight.

Jango and Boba are the got-a-lot-a-gadgets guys that bounty hunt like they're James Bond. They're survivalists, though the EU gives them the hidden cause to rebuild the Mandalorian forces of old - which I give them credit - is an interesting motivation.

Dooku is something else. He has wealth. He has class. He has style. And he's up to something far beyond the vision of any of these other characters, including even Anakin/Vader in so far as the material we've been given (I don't worry about that, because I think Anakin gets a major "just cause" case developed for him with his transition to being the Emperor's servant. But meanwhile...)

Yup. Dooku is under-rated.

It's precisely his lack of flash that makes him so much more intriguing. Don't you think? (Dooku fans?)

Bobby Fett
07-12-2004, 09:35 PM
For "lack of flash" and total coolness, I'd have to go with Grand Admiral Thrawn. It's been a long time since I've read the books, but as I remember it, he was a thinking villain - something you seldom see in this universe other than the major baddies.

Kidhuman
07-12-2004, 09:36 PM
I gotta agree with Stillakid. I have always loved the biker scouts. Something about them that looks awesome.

As for a regular bad guy, I will go with Tarkin

stillakid
07-12-2004, 11:02 PM
Bossk is up there too. I know his role in the movies was less than minimal, but thanks to some EU books he's probably my favorite SW villain next to Jabba (other than Vader and Palpy of course). He's always getting screwed over by everybody else and he just gets angrier and angrier until he explodes.


Ahh, yes. The victim card. The pieces are falling into place now. I wonder where I've seen this type of thing before.... :sur: Hmm? I wonder.....

dr_evazan22
07-12-2004, 11:45 PM
I like Dooku for most of the same reasons i like Ani / Vader, a good guy turned bad.

I may be in the minority here, but I do like Jango and Boba quite a bit, but I think that the whole "storyline" of them trying to rebuild the Mandalorians is lame. I can understand and believe that once upon a time a Mandalorian swore an oath to some Sith, but to say that to this day they have a connection, well, that's where the lameness comes in. In Aotc we already have an army of Clone Troopers. Now Jango and Boba are trying to create their own army of clones, except they're not genetic clones.

ew2seal
07-13-2004, 12:26 AM
don't worry dr evanza your not alone. boba and jengo take the cake. i would have said dooku but he seems more like a lackie than a villian. and as for greivious well we will see when ep3 comes out cause right now all there is of him so far is a 5 minute cartoon and hype from the star wars insider. if greivious does in the movie what he does in the cartoon he will get my vote. also any one of the stormtroopers, snowtroopers, biker scouts, clone troopers ect. are always cool.

scruffziller
07-13-2004, 08:16 AM
I would have to say EXAR KUN because he makes the Empy look like a Sunday School Teacher.

Droid
07-13-2004, 10:35 AM
Jabba the Hutt

(From Jedi, don't really think of Phantom Menace or a New Hope when I think of Jabba!)

JediTricks
07-13-2004, 08:29 PM
From your list, here are the names I focused my choices down to (in no particular order):


Maul
Dooku
Jango
Durge
Ventress
Xizor
Tarkin
Jabba
Boba (adult)
Thrawn
Of those, I'd have a really hard time choosing which is my "favorite", so I will go on the criteria of "best villain" (most effective, most entertaining, most menacing).

Dooku has worked to create a civil war, he is the face of the Confederacy, and in his spare time he's also a dark lord of the Sith. But he's an old guy who seems like a minimalist in terms of actions and costumes, and he's a pawn of Sidious even if he is a plotter and a fallen Jedi.

Maul, on the other hand, is merely a Sith pit bull, he seems limited in strategy and mastermindedness. He's a flash-in-the-pan, a junk-food villain who looked as if he would have been killed by Qui-Gon in their second meeting if not for Obi-Wan's repeated interference.

Jango is just a regular bounty hunter guy, but he doesn't back down from a fight with a Jedi, and seems to understand his place in things. Playing "Bounty Hunter" on PS2 makes the character a lot more fun than just AOTC. Still, he died like a punk.

Boba is a little grittier, the quiet type who will push the envelope to get the job done. He's the kind of guy who would wait in the muck three days just to bushwhack a bounty, and then disable or kill anybody who stands in his way of collecting. Unfortunately, like father like son, he died like a punk.

I don't care to know much about Durge, his on-screen performance in CW cartoon was cool right up until he became a stupid-*** monster thing. His hibernation and hatred for the Mandalorians was silly EU writing for my tastes, but his outfit looks cool and he has a great deluxe action figure.

Jabba is a fat, lazy crime lord who mainly controlled his empire through intimdation of death and destruction at the hands of his minions. Still, when it came right down to it, he got choked out by a woman he had enslaved and none of those he surrounded himself with lifted a finger to help him. Plus, Jabba had a big fall between the prequels and ROTJ, he was much more a petty thug in the ANH era.

Xizor, on the other hand, ran a galactic crime syndicate for quite a while and manipulated the fate of even the Sith. He surrounded himself with only the best, including uber-cool assassin droid Guri, and lived in a palace on the Imperial homeworld of Coruscant. It took a hell of a lot to finally kill him, including a Star Destroyer and all the key Rebel players.

Tarkin held Vader's leash and commanded the Death Star itself, not to mention was a governor of an entire star system. His tactics were ruthless enough to destroy entire planets with a single stroke and not bat an eye. He was nasty and viscious and cruel, and apparently had some insight into the nature of the Jedi & Sith themselves. His every action in ANH spits venom even when calm and composed. His death was caused by his overconfidence in his battle station's defenses, and even then he was showing the lower ranks who is boss... without even killing any of them.

Grand Admiral Thrawn was a master tactician who surrounded himself with the right players and pieces, taking a broken military force and turning it into a powerful rebellion against the rebels. However, he underestimated his own bodyguards and put too much faith into his acedemic-based strategies, which ultimately led to his downfall.

Ventress was a Sith wannabe who was used by the Sith to her own peril. However, as someone not trained by a Sith, she was pretty tough and a strong Dark Jedi. Her action figure is cool enough that I would have preferred her as the prequels baddie under Sidious.



So to choose "Best Villain", I've got to go with Tarkin. He's a freakin' STAR of the film and he doesn't even have any Force powers. The guy is bad to the bone, he killed millions of people just to make a point and made the planet's captive senator watch the whole thing. He told Vader to shut-it and didn't have to worry about repercussions. Tarkin was the man!

stillakid
07-13-2004, 08:39 PM
Tarkin held Vader's leash and commanded the Death Star itself, not to mention was a governor of an entire star system. His tactics were ruthless enough to destroy entire planets with a single stroke and not bat an eye. He was nasty and viscious and cruel, and apparently had some insight into the nature of the Jedi & Sith themselves. His every action in ANH spits venom even when calm and composed. His death was caused by his overconfidence in his battle station's defenses, and even then he was showing the lower ranks who is boss... without even killing any of them.

So to choose "Best Villain", I've got to go with Tarkin. He's a freakin' STAR of the film and he doesn't even have any Force powers. The guy is bad to the bone, he killed millions of people just to make a point and made the planet's captive senator watch the whole thing. He told Vader to shut-it and didn't have to worry about repercussions. Tarkin was the man!

Unofficially in my head, I share your choice. I agree that Tarkin is probably the most well-drawn and complete secondary villain in the saga. But you said that he showed everyone who was boss...without even killing any of them. I disagree. He showed them alright and they all cowered at his word until they all became space slug kibble. :dead:

Bosskman
07-13-2004, 09:03 PM
I always hated Xizor. The best part of the SOTE novel was when Vader said to blow up his skyhook. Serves him right for even thinking he could be anywhere near as badass as Vader.

Tycho
07-13-2004, 09:09 PM
This is a tangent, but I couldn't help myself - Qui-Gon was my favorite character in TPM.

How in the heck do you attribute Qui-Gon losing his battle with Maul due to Obi-Wan's interference?

Obi-Wan helped his master. When Qui-Gon was led closer to the smelting pit room, it was because he smacked Darth Maul down to that catwalk that led there.

Perhaps it was because he was mad that Maul sent his padawan off on a nearly fatal fall - but there was no garauntee where Maul was going to fall when Qui-Gon smacked him unless Maul was THAT good that he orchestrated that!?

I'm sure his plan was to make it easier by way of separating the Jedi so he could kill one at a time, but he was such a zealot and true-believer, sometimes I wonder if he let himself get killed by Obi-Wan because that was what he was ordered to do? The ultimate sacrafice for the cause so that Anakin didn't end up in the hands of someone who could capably train him...

(Qui-Gon)


Honestly, that seems way to complex (not only for Lucas, but for Palpatine - to adapt his plans so quickly when Anakin was discovered on Tatooine).

Anyway, a lot of things in the galaxy are Obi-Wan's fault (mostly due to Anakin) but Qui-Gon's death was not one of them!

JediTricks
07-13-2004, 10:11 PM
Stilla, I meant he didn't murder them, didn't directly kill them unlike Vader who killed a third of his officer corps in ESB.


Tycho, watch TPM again, in the Naboo saber battle, every time Qui-Gon and Maul go against each other, Qui-Gon gets the upper hand and often gets a hit in (a punch here, an extra swipe there), but every time Obi-Wan joins in the battle, he gets in QGJ's way and Maul often gets the upper hand. Qui-Gon even outpaces Maul once in the fight, and in the screenplay Maul is worse off while waiting for the red field gates to come down. In fact, except for that last move where Qui-Gon slows down and gets himself run through, he holds up very well against Maul's double-bladed attacks and nearly kills the villain on the jump down the catwalk (and almost certainly would have if he had led his jump with his saber).

Just watch it again, pay attention to who is leading when Obi-Wan is in the battle vs when he's not directly involved. I'm not saying Obi-Wan is responsible for Qui-Gon dying, but if Obi-Wan had not joined in the fight as often, Qui-Gon may have very well defeated Maul before getting stabbed in the belly.

Tycho
07-14-2004, 01:26 AM
That's a reasonable point. Obviously you meant before Qui-Gon had his chance one-on-one vs. Maul in the smelting pit room.

In any case, I thought that since Qui-Gon was older and Maul young and in his prime, he'd have that advantage. AOTC negates that because Dooku was in his 80's and kicked Anakin (19) and Obi-Wan (34) pretty hard. And then Yoda (874) kicked Dooku's butt, LOL.

So experience does matter.

Meanwhile, by TPM, Qui-Gon should have had 11 years of experience fighting with Obi-Wan and teaching him how to fight using teamwork. Perhaps chalk it up to inexperience, but it wouldn't be the first time we notice Obi-Wan making a mistake during that fight.

stillakid
07-14-2004, 09:58 AM
Stilla, I meant he didn't murder them, didn't directly kill them unlike Vader who killed a third of his officer corps in ESB.

True. But I always looked at Tarkin as having a somewhat worried look on his face after telling his officer to buzz off, as if he was aware of what could happen if the Rebels succeeded. So he put his pride and the pride of the Empire above being reasonably safe and as a result he indirectly killed more people than Vader could ever hope to.


:D

Deoxyribonucleic
07-14-2004, 01:42 PM
Tarkin for me

I love the last scene of him with his fingers on his chin...waiting....waiting, he just knew he was going to win and the rebels were no threat to him whatsoever! Although that ended up being the wrong attitude to have ;)

dr_evazan22
07-14-2004, 10:24 PM
The 2 worst villians on the list are Durge, with that stupid EU Mandalorian-hatred thing going on, the part where he turned himself into slime and reconstituted himself. And Xixor... Just plain ol' crap! A very poor attempt to make another Thrawn-esque character. That's who it was, Thrawn, with green skin, a top knot hair do, and pheromones that could seduce ANY female, except Leia.

Greivous is still too new, don't kow anything about him, but he could possibly make the worst list.

Tarkin is a great choice, he was my second.

Deoxyribonucleic
07-15-2004, 03:12 AM
make the worst list.

Tarkin is a great choice, he was my second.

but who's your first choice ;)

Kidhuman
07-15-2004, 09:35 AM
It was Thrawn Deoxy.

Deoxyribonucleic
07-15-2004, 11:41 AM
It was Thrawn Deoxy.


Oh. :sur: :D

JediTricks
07-15-2004, 06:47 PM
That's a reasonable point. Obviously you meant before Qui-Gon had his chance one-on-one vs. Maul in the smelting pit room.Even in there, Qui-Gon was doing pretty well until... well, he stopped moving and got himself stabbed.


In any case, I thought that since Qui-Gon was older and Maul young and in his prime, he'd have that advantage. The end of this sentence is vague, I figured out what you meant by the next sentence, but this is a prime example of why writing skills are important (I only mention this because I often catch myself doing the same thing with my posts, and sometimes don't catch it in time ;)).



True. But I always looked at Tarkin as having a somewhat worried look on his face after telling his officer to buzz off, as if he was aware of what couldhappen if the Rebels succeeded. So he put his pride and the pride of the Empire above being reasonably safe and as a result he indirectly killed more people than Vader could ever hope to. Another "if _____ then ______" claim, eh Stilla? ;) I could sorta see what you mean about Tarkin's expression after he refused to evacuate, but it could just as likely, if not more so, be pensive or concerned or he had gas :D so that's why I personally don't subscribe to yer theory. Plus, even if he was worried, his chances were very good compared to Luke's pitiful run, it would have been his duty to hold fast to his mission instead of bailing out - as a soldier he accepts that he takes risks and as a military leader he has to decide risktaking for his men too. We know what the outcome is because we've seen the movie, but Tarkin's odds of success in his mission to destroy Yavin IV and the heart of the Rebel Alliance were quite good and clearly worth taking not knowing the outcome... nothing ventured, nothing gained. ;)

Besides, while his pride may have caused the fall of thousands of imperial troops, it was still not a conscious action to cause their demise, he didn't do it to show them who's boss or to reward them for their sloppy work. And the discussion about evacuation was only about Tarkin, it was his ship that was to be standing by, not a lifeboat system (I bet the empire didn't even have an evac plan for the Death Star, just let 'em go down with the ship).

dr_evazan22
07-15-2004, 10:12 PM
Dooku was my choice, posted earlier.

----

And if Luke had been 10 or 20 seconds later, Yavin would've been destroyed (too).

Kidhuman
07-15-2004, 10:23 PM
Oh,my bad. :beard:

Deoxyribonucleic
07-16-2004, 12:00 AM
Oh,my bad. :beard:

oh :sur: ;)


hehe

Tycho
07-16-2004, 12:07 AM
Hey, I thought of another thread idea! (what a surprise!)

It's not even about Mouse Droids, either.

I thought if we have a thread discussing extra villains, what about extra heroes?


Check the top section of General Discussion for a new thread which promises to be entirely just as stupid as this one!

scruffziller
07-16-2004, 10:02 AM
I agree that Tarkin is probably the most well-drawn and complete secondary villain in the saga. But you said that he showed everyone who was boss...without even killing any of them. I disagree.I think he means before he blew up Alderaan.



Maul, on the other hand, is merely a Sith pit bull, he seems limited in strategy and mastermindedness. He's a flash-in-the-pan, a junk-food villain who looked as if he would have been killed by Qui-Gon in their second meeting if not for Obi-Wan's repeated interference.

Absolutely agree. Maul was put in EPS1 for the sake of fan boys everywhere.

stillakid
07-16-2004, 12:20 PM
I think he means before he blew up Alderaan.

Nope, I meant the Death Star. What I was getting at was that by Tarkin choosing pride over practicality (standing firm on the space station when there was a definite threat to everyone on board instead of issuing an evacuation just in case), by default Tarkin murdered a lot more people than Vader ever has. But, as JT suggests, Tarkin was playing the odds and indeed, had Luke been a few seconds late, Tarkin would have been proven right. It's a game of inches...

Kidhuman
07-16-2004, 01:56 PM
Even if Luke was ga few seconds late, Tarkin still would have died. Luke isnt going to abort the mission because the base was blown up. So Tarkin would have killed all those people regardless and the only change would have been he died a hero instead of a schmuck.

El Chuxter
07-16-2004, 03:04 PM
Okay, before I read this, I thought "extra" was a little less broad than "everyone but Vader and Sidious."

That said, my favorite semi-major villain of the bunch is probably Dooku. He has class, which a lot of the villains don't.

Jabba the Hutt is second, and for the opposite reason. He has no class. Period. And he controls all the other classless thugs.

Third is Sebulba (who you didn't list). Not a villain in the traditional SW sense, but an expecially dangerous Dug you don't want to mess with. He wants to win, period, and he'll stop at nothing to do so.

Adult Boba and Maul are probably tied for fourth, but they're both pit bulls with cool designs more than characters.

Thrawn would be fifth; a mastermind who, without powers or political influence, was more of a threat than Palpatine.

For what I think of as "extra," I've always loved 4-LOM and Zuckuss, though some of their stories are pretty dumb.

Worst of all: Waru. He's so lame most folks block him out. A gold-plated chunk of meat that somehow fell in from the Star Trek universe.

Or how about Trioculus? The fake pretender to the Empire's throne, who gets Vader's indestructible glove and thinks it will give him the power to choke anyone, which will come in handy in his quest to force Princess Leia to marry him. The authors of those books could be poster children for the anti-drug war.

JediTricks
07-16-2004, 08:44 PM
Tycho, while villains rule, secondary heroes generally aren't anywhere near as exciting. It's a strange cinematic law, but seems to hold true most of the time, possibly because the villains have to be drawn with broader strokes to get the impact across with less screentime.


KH, if the Death Star had gotten off its shot, Tarkin's mission would have been a success and the Rebel Alliance would have been destroyed and Palpatine's grip on the galaxy would have been cemented. Luke destroying the Death Star after Yavin's destruction would have been for not -- Luke, Wedge, and the mystery man in the Y-Wing would have been the only ones left from this powerful, vital Rebel cell, fatally crippling the rebellion.

Kidhuman
07-17-2004, 12:04 AM
Totally agree JT, that is why I said Tarkin would of died a hero instead of a schmuck. I dont know if the entire alliance would of been killed off, there might have been a few splinter cells out there, but not nearly as many. ALot of people would have left because they felt defeated.

Tycho
07-17-2004, 01:10 AM
I was watching Clerks and they brought up a very interesting point:

What about all the home-improvement contractors that needlessly died on the Death Star when Luke blew it up?

I mean the plumbers, the air conditioning man, the guys laying down the carpeting in Tarkin's quarters?

Who's at fault for their deaths and what did they tell their families?



I'm so full of it sometimes I amaze even myself!

Kidhuman
07-17-2004, 01:16 AM
IIRC they were talking about the second death star. Being that it was incomplete and all

Deoxyribonucleic
07-17-2004, 02:53 AM
I was watching Clerks and they brought up a very interesting point:

What about all the home-improvement contractors that needlessly died on the Death Star when Luke blew it up?

I mean the plumbers, the air conditioning man, the guys laying down the carpeting in Tarkin's quarters?

Who's at fault for their deaths and what did they tell their families?


Yes, and what about the daycare centers (The Onion) and all their staff and clients (kids...KIDS!). These kids probably belonged to all the people you mentioned above!
:mad:

scruffziller
07-18-2004, 02:46 PM
Nope, I meant the Death Star. What I was getting at was that by Tarkin choosing pride over practicality (standing firm on the space station when there was a definite threat to everyone on board instead of issuing an evacuation just in case), by default Tarkin murdered a lot more people than Vader ever has. But, as JT suggests, Tarkin was playing the odds and indeed, had Luke been a few seconds late, Tarkin would have been proven right. It's a game of inches...
Oh----ho..................:cheeky: Genius point Stilla.

Rocketboy
07-20-2004, 01:36 PM
I was watching Clerks and they brought up a very interesting point:

What about all the home-improvement contractors that needlessly died on the Death Star when Luke blew it up?

I mean the plumbers, the air conditioning man, the guys laying down the carpeting in Tarkin's quarters?

Who's at fault for their deaths and what did they tell their families?Didn't George mention that on the AOTC DVD commentary and say that the contarctors were Geonosians?
I guess they weren't really that innocent, were they? :D

Rocketboy
07-20-2004, 01:41 PM
As for my vote:
The Imperial Stormtroopers - all they know is killing in white uniforms.

InsaneJediGirl
07-20-2004, 02:21 PM
I would have to go with Exar Kun,Ventress,Thrawn and Quinlan Vos.Kun because he was one of the orginal Sith baddies,Ventress because we needed a chick to kick butt ;),Thrawn for his cool tatics,and Vos for turning on the Jedi and being a cool traitor.