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vader121
10-12-2004, 08:49 AM
There are a few scenes that I remember in the theatrical release that do not appear in any of the released videos.
-I could swear that in ROTJ that a few ships crashed into the force shield before
being able to pull up or realize that it was still up.
-I could swear that the ewok that crashes in the glider actually gets stepped on by the At St.
-there are other scenes that I know were cut (Piett getting killed by Royal Guards, Luke hanging on the grate before falling in the Rancor pit, etc.)

There are a few items that appear in the movies that still don't make sense to me:
-why was the rebel dressed in the Biker Scout uniform on Endor? You see him in the clump of caught Rebels but there is no explanation at all why he is dressed like that. Missing scene?
-if Stormtroopers are Clones then why do they appear in all different kinds of heights? They also have different sounding voices (ex. when tractor beam is deativated by Ben the two troops talk to each other and have different voices). This leads to the theory that at least some of them were from captured worlds.

DarthChuckMc
10-12-2004, 09:42 AM
-if Stormtroopers are Clones then why do they appear in all different kinds of heights? They also have different sounding voices (ex. when tractor beam is deativated by Ben the two troops talk to each other and have different voices). This leads to the theory that at least some of them were from captured worlds.

This can be chalked up to NEW hosts for DNA, since Jango Fett was killed by Mace. The Kaminoans needed fresh DNA to keep pumping out Clone/Stormtroopers after his demise, so they most likely just found new sources to keep the numbers growing.

Imperial Officers, Moffs, etc, were enlisted men from different worlds, loyal to the Empire.

As far as your other scenes go, I think they might just be "created memories". much like people swear they remember the Biggs footage actually being in ANH.

ps...Moff Jerjerrod was taken out by the Royal Guards...Piett was killed when an A-Wing crashed through the bridge of the Executor.

JEDIpartner
10-12-2004, 09:45 AM
Hmmm... I don't recall any of those things being cut and I was in my mid-teens so I would be old enough to remember. I recall something about those deleted scenes/shots regarding Piett and Luke in the Rancor pit. Those were discussed in some issue of Insider last year.

As far as the Stormtroopers being clones, it's been EU'd that they have come from different sources at this point and are no longer ALL Jango clones.

Mandalorian Candidat
10-12-2004, 10:52 AM
ps...Moff Jerjerrod was taken out by the Royal Guards....

Huh? When did this happen and why?

Darth Jax
10-12-2004, 11:18 AM
i remember one of the lead ships not pulling up in time and running into the shield from when i first saw ROTJ.

Exhaust Port
10-12-2004, 11:41 AM
I too have vague memories of a ship hitting the shields. Perhaps I'm just nuts.

Devo
10-12-2004, 11:49 AM
Well the only 'lost or unclear' scene you mention that I used to think I was seeing was the ewok being trampled by the AT-ST. But I now figure my imagination was running away with me and that I somehow extrapolated that the AT-ST that passes in the background was actually coming towards the downed ewok. I definitely never remember seeing any ships hit the death star shield.

DarthChuckMc
10-12-2004, 11:50 AM
Huh? When did this happen and why?

I guess it was cut due to time, and just not being all that important to the story.

Supposedly Vader chokes the Royal Guards, too, but that was cut because GL felt "the choke" was being overused.

El Chuxter
10-12-2004, 01:03 PM
You can very briefly see, if you look very closely, after Han and Co think they've taken the bunker, the Rebel who eventually ends up in armor force the captive to strip down.

B'Omarr Monkey
10-12-2004, 04:16 PM
The ships hitting the shields was in the novelization, which might be why you remember it that way. I had the same confusion myself at one point.

I don't think that any clones still exist during the OTC. If memory serves me, the black uniformed officers, such as in the detention block ("Where are you taking this thing ? are high ranking stormtroopers, and clearly they do not all look the same.

The pilots are not the same either. Remember, Han was an Imperial, I would guess he was a pilot. Biggs went to the Imperial Academy before joining the Rebels, and he's no clone either.

i just never understood why all the imperials were human. I always thought it would be cool if there were stormtroopers with armor and helmet variations meant for other species. In fact I used to design these back in 6th and 7th grade.

Slicker
10-12-2004, 04:56 PM
-why was the rebel dressed in the Biker Scout uniform on Endor? You see him in the clump of caught Rebels but there is no explanation at all why he is dressed like that.If you look closely when they enter the bunker you can see him putting on his helmet. I would assume that they had him dress in the uniform in case the Scout Troopers that chased Paploo came back and he could lead them on for a little while.

As for the Stormtroopers only being human it's kinda like Hitler only wanting pure Aryans. If the Empire lets non-humans in it would dilute the purity of the soldiers. I mean heaven forbid they have a wookiee battalion that can actually hit a bull in the ***** with a snow shovel.

B'Omarr Monkey
10-13-2004, 01:11 AM
I know in the EU stuff they explain the human exclusive Empire as being a case of racial bigotry (of course I don't recall seeing any non-white human Imperials either), but it still doesn't make any sense. Granted tehre are a lot of humans in the SW universe, but when you're trying to conquer a galaxy full of a very wide and diverse range of humanoid types, it seems like you'd really be spreading yourself thin, without being able to build up too many alliances. So, what would be the point, or how could the Empire succeed?

There were plenty of alien species allying themselves with Palpatine in the PT, and he didn't come across as merely tolerating them? What about Darth Maul? Non-human.

Then again, except for the few we saw in ROTJ, there didn't seem to be a lot of alien support in the Rebel Alliance either. maybe they were all too busy being bounty hunters. ;)

Mr. JabbaJohnL
10-13-2004, 06:06 PM
Well, it just so happens they cloned a human for the army. If they cloned, say, a Rodian, then a lot of the stormtroopers would be Rodians. But then they'd be even poorer shots. :D

B'Omarr Monkey
10-13-2004, 08:15 PM
Yes, but that was for the original army. There's no indication that the OTC stormtroopers are clones. In fact, in one of my previous posts I listed a bunch of evidence suggesting that they were not all clones. Which academy was Luke rushing off to enlist with? Obviously the Imperials were recruiting soldiers, pilots, and officers, not just growing them in jars.

Exhaust Port
10-13-2004, 08:37 PM
There was a thread quite awhile ago discussing the Stormtrooper/Clone issue. I think the bit of evidence that spurred the common believe now that the Stormtroopers are clones was an issued card from the SW card game that listed the Stormtrooper as a clone. Since the card was officially released by LusasArts it was taken to be canon.

I'm with you B'O. Monkey, I tend to see them as NOT being clones as more fitting the universe of the OT. As you stated, there was quite a lot of mentioning of the academy in the first movie which always led me to believe there was a recruitment drive by the Empire.

Kidhuman
10-13-2004, 09:35 PM
If the stormies were/are clones, then why the Imperial Academy? The Empire conquered galaxies, why not use those people as troops. And to think they were all cloned from Jango....he nailed Zam from how far away in the neck with a dart, and stormtroopers cant even hit the broad side of a barn.

El Chuxter
10-14-2004, 12:53 PM
If Stormtroopers are clones, then it's a pretty unclear scene by the tractor beam controls, where two engage in small talk. Clones, having their personalities suppressed, wouldn't be able to do that.

Once again, it's more cost effective to simply train recruits than to clone them and then train them. There may still be clones in the OT, but at least 1/2 of the Stormies are conscripts. Even if Lucas says otherwise, I won't believe it.

2-1B
10-15-2004, 04:17 AM
The POTF2 cardback from 1995 speculated that they might be clones.

Who knows, maybe Episode 3 will clear up the picture a bit more.

Slicker
10-15-2004, 03:52 PM
Even if stormtroopers are indeed clones the Empire would almost have to conscript normal humans especially after catastrophic losses like those suffered when the Death Star was blown up. If they kept losing troops at that rate the cloners would never be able to keep up.

DarkArtist
10-16-2004, 04:07 PM
The scenes with Luke hanging on the grate in the rancor pit, were stills given to Topps for the RETURN OF THE JEDI card sets. That scene as well as Jerjarred being killed by the guards are both still frames I believe that made the cutting room floor before they were even finished. I don't remember ever seeing ships crashing into the Death Star, but I might have just missed it. Is it a big scene or just a brief second of footage.? :confused:

Turambar
10-20-2004, 08:45 PM
I remember the LP booklet for rotj had the story include some ships crashing into the deathstar's shield.
Maybe that's where I saw Luke hanging from the trapdoor grate, too.

I've never seen that shot with Jerjerrod and the Royal Guards! That looks awesome! What is the story that led to that scene?

rbaumhauer
10-21-2004, 04:56 PM
I've mentioned this in another thread, but the "Star Wars Poster Monthly", circa 1978, had an article describing the life of the cloned Stormtroopers. While it's not an "official" source, I figure somebody at LFL must have given them the idea.

B'Omarr Monkey
10-21-2004, 11:41 PM
Remember the eu cannon, officially sanctioned or not, changes constantly. For one example, the battle droids were originally supposed to look like the beings that manufactured them (which makes complete sense). When GL switched from using CGI Neimoidians to actors in masks, their frail form designs went out the window, and so the battle droids were explained as resembling the skeletons of the Neimoidians (or, their desicated corpses). Of course in AOTC, we learn that the Neimoidians didn't actually manufacture the battle droids, so now we're back to them physically resembling the beings who built them, the Geonosians.

Rocketboy
10-22-2004, 12:07 PM
Remember the eu cannon, officially sanctioned or not, changes constantly. For one example, the battle droids were originally supposed to look like the beings that manufactured them (which makes complete sense). When GL switched from using CGI Neimoidians to actors in masks, their frail form designs went out the window, and so the battle droids were explained as resembling the skeletons of the Neimoidians (or, their desicated corpses). Of course in AOTC, we learn that the Neimoidians didn't actually manufacture the battle droids, so now we're back to them physically resembling the beings who built them, the Geonosians.
I remember that was considered at one point, but when they changed the Neimoidians, I thought that idea was dropped.

El Chuxter
10-22-2004, 12:56 PM
I don't think it was ever stated anywhere in the films or the EU that the Neimoidians actually made the Battle Droids, nor whether the BD's were designed to look skeletal or like their makers.

Droidekas, however, were supposedly built by another race (the name eludes me). But who can say they weren't at the time of TPM?

sg_inr
10-23-2004, 03:19 AM
[QUOTE=vader121]There are a few scenes that I remember in the theatrical release that do not appear in any of the released videos.
-I could swear that in ROTJ that a few ships crashed into the force shield before
being able to pull up or realize that it was still up.
-I could swear that the ewok that crashes in the glider actually gets stepped on by the At St.
-there are other scenes that I know were cut (Piett getting killed by Royal Guards, Luke hanging on the grate before falling in the Rancor pit, etc.)

I swear I remember a scene that was cut from the original when I saw it. it was a scene in ROTJ sometime during the skiff sequence and it briefly showed jabba with some sort of urban sombrero on his head. this must have also been cut out due to time constraints though. Does any one else remember that?