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DarthAngel
05-03-2005, 10:51 PM
Ben says in Episode 4, "Your father wanted you to have this when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it."

Now with everything we know about ROTS, and what is in the novel and graphic novel, not one time does Anakin say to Obi-Wan that he wants his son to have his light saber. Which leads me to wonder about some things.

1. Does Obi-Wan confess to anybody that he left Anakin for dead?

2. Do Owen and Obi-Wan have a disagreement, and that is why Obi-Wan hold on to the light saber until he meets Luke several years later?

3. Does Obi-Wan say the above quote to Luke, because Obi-Wan doesn't want to say that he is the one that Killed Luke's father?

4. Or is this just one of those lines that will get cut out from the next release of the Star Wars Trilogy Super Special Addition?

5. Or is this just one of those lines that Uncle George totally forgot about?

Thoughts, comments.

Sith Lord 0498
05-03-2005, 10:59 PM
I think Obi-Wan was speculating what Anakin would have wanted if he hadn't turned to the Dark Side but instead lay dying from battle much like Qui-Gon's dying wishes.

Kidhuman
05-03-2005, 11:01 PM
I think Ben was leading Luke on. Ben knew for all purposes Anakin was Vader. Luke was the last hope. He needed to "sucker" him into being a jedi. What better way than telling him his dad was one and left him his saber

DarthAngel
05-03-2005, 11:04 PM
I think Ben was leading Luke on. Ben knew for all purposes Anakin was Vader. Luke was the last hope. He needed to "sucker" him into being a jedi. What better way than telling him his dad was one and left him his saber

You know I never thought of it that way KH. That is definately one way old Ben could get Luke to join the fight. Very interesting...

chewie
05-04-2005, 01:49 AM
I noticed Anakin didn't mention anything about giving his lightsaber to his son as well.

So Obi-Wan's statement in A New Hope is yet another lie to pull Luke in. Though I assumed as much since 1980 when Obi-Wan became the liar that he is.

drsidious
05-04-2005, 02:07 AM
oh he didnt recognize r2 an 3-p0?
obi-wan manipulated luke
obi-wans a bad man

sevboot
05-04-2005, 09:32 AM
No, Obi is not really bad. The way he explains it in ROTJ, he really saw Anakin Skywalker and Darth Vader as two seperate people. It was his point of view. From this point of view Anakin would have wanted his son to have the lightsaber. Even Vader backs this up a little when Luke calls him Anakin and he snaps back "that name no longer has any meaning for me". I think both Ben and Anakin were in denial of the truth that a even a decent person is capable of very bad things if they are not carefull. Anakin had good intentions. He wanted to save his mom. He loved Padme. He wanted to find a way to save the ones he loved from dying. Palpatine took those good intentions and twisted them. He was so afraid of losing everything he loved that he threw it all away himself. Of course, Ben and Anakin were wrong about Anakin and Vader being seperate people, and Luke knew this when he made the decision to try and turn his father back to the light. Anakin Skywalker was still there, he had just made some very horrible, horrible decisions with his life, and he paid for it with his death in the end.
But he died knowing he had done wrong and he died saving his son from the evil that he had helped inflict on the world.

DarkArtist
05-04-2005, 12:58 PM
There are going to be alot of unanswered question from the OT. Look at ESB for instance when ben tells Luke that Yoda trained him. If he was Qui Gon's Apprentice should there have been mention of him in the movie. True yoda does instruct obi wan as well but I was under the impression that the master is the trainer ???? after all luke calls yoda "master' and Obi wan "ben" ?

Kidhuman
05-04-2005, 01:07 PM
Luke knew Ben for awhile. Remember the dinner scen with Uncle Owen. Luke did not know Ben was a Jedi I think. After all, he was a crazy hermit tothe family. Luke was in awe when he saw the lightsaber, like a kid getting a new bike. He simply knew Ben as Ben and not a Jedi Master. A common friendship was between them it seemed.

Luke went to Dagobah to be trained by a master Jedi.

Who is to say Yoda did not train Ben for awhile? We see Yoda training the Younglings. And Obi-Wan always turns to Yoda for knowledge and guidance in AOTC. He could have meant that.

sevboot
05-04-2005, 01:43 PM
I've thought about this one too. But when Ben appears to Luke on Hoth says Yoda was the Jedi Master that "insructed" him. He could have meant that this was Yoda's plan. Course, if that was true why would he give Luke a hard time once he got there? Anyway, the reason Ben never mentions Qui-gon is because George had not thought him up at that point. When Lucus was starting to write the new Prequels a few years ago it started out with just Obi-wan as a young Jedi Knight that finds Anakin. All the stuff that he and Qui-gon do in the begining of TPM Ben did by himself in the first few drafts, including finding JarJar and Anakin. I don't know why he added Qui-gon on. Although I liked the character I think it would have made more sense without him, really. Without him Obi-won was a Young Jedi who was Yoda's Padawon and it was Obi-won's choice to train Anakin, thus a better reason for him to fell the guilt he does.

Bantha274
05-04-2005, 02:03 PM
This simple answer to most of these questions is this:

When GL made the first SW movie, he had no idea it would become as popular as it did. He had no intentions early on to even make a sequel for the simple fact that he assumed ANH would bomb at the theaters.
(He even went to Hawaii the day SW was released and didn't know how well it was doing until a friend called him and said "George, the movie is selling out theaters everywhere. Maybe you should come back to California sooner than later.")
So because of all this, Lucas made SW with the minimal budget Fox Studios would give him, a script that even he felt wasn't complete, and had to tell as much of his story as he could with what he had at the time. So of course there are going to be alot of in-consistencies between the OT and the prequels. Maybe he could have written the prequels differently, but GL does things how he feels they should be done. Oh well.
I believe there are some things he would like to have changed (to make all six parts make more sense), but you have to be realistic and realize that some things just won't get cleared up. Love it or hate it, that's just how it's going to be, I think.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
05-04-2005, 02:58 PM
I don't think he was trying to be mean to Luke or anything. Saying that his father wanted to give Luke his saber was probably a lot nicer than saying, "Well, your father is Darth Vader, and I took his saber from him right before I left him for dead. Here ya go!"

Darth Spectre
05-04-2005, 04:34 PM
It bothers me a great deal that the line in question isn't touched upon at all in the novel, and we can assume at this point, in the movie itself. It really needed to be addressed somehow. If Anakin had been made a master when he joined the council, then he could have given his old saber to Obi-Wan and asked him as a favor to give it to his next padawan when that time came. It would also have been ironic since neither one knew at the time Obi's next padawan would actually be Anakin's son. I really find it hard to believe Lucas won't address this at all.

As far as Obi-Wan being a liar, even taking the "certain point of view" thing into consideration, I don't think it is fair to come down hard on him. For those who remember, in the novel of ROTJ, it was stated that it was Yoda, not Obi-Wan, who decided to keep the truth about Luke's father from him. That Obi-Wan wanted to tell him sooner, but Yoda wouldn't let him. Yes, it never made it into the movie. But neither did the discussion about the light saber duel near lava that became Mustafar. Obi-Wan had a pretty big burden to carry, so I think it is unfair when some just label him as a liar or a manipulator.