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View Full Version : Hayden in the suit...why?



stillakid
05-20-2005, 01:00 PM
Why? :confused:


Why bother using Hayden to be the body inside the Darth Vader suit? I mean, this is a fictional character with established presence and an established look. To my eye, coming off that table he just looked way too small. I know they gave him lifts to make him taller, but that didn't sell it for me. I could tell that this wasn't the "large" Darth Vader that we see in IV, V, and VI.

In the OT, Lucas didn't feel obliged to use Prowse's voice or to put James Earl into the costume. There was no hesitation to use a stunt performer for the lightsaber battles. When the time came to reveal his identity in ROTJ, Lucas didn't feel obliged to reveal Prowse. Lucas did what was necessary then to create the illusion of an imposing supervillian.

So what exactly was the point of creating a whole new downsized suit to fit Hayden into? Why not bring back Prowse or somebody equally large to fill those shoes for those scenes? I mean, he invited James Earl back. Why not somebody actually suitable to be the man behind the mask?

Lobito
05-20-2005, 01:23 PM
I didnt notice until now, but its true, he does look smaller. But the only one who can give us an answer about that one is GL himself. Still, he was not adviced properly.

Bantha274
05-20-2005, 01:32 PM
Seemed fine to me. I thought it was pretty cool that Hayden was allowed to wear the suit. No matter what you think of him, Hayden Christensen truly IS the chosen one. Lucas chose HIM out of all the other possible actors. I will forever think that it's Hayden's face under the mask whenever I see Darth Vader from now on.
And I don't think that's such a bad thing.

stillakid
05-20-2005, 01:42 PM
Seemed fine to me. I thought it was pretty cool that Hayden was allowed to wear the suit. No matter what you think of him, Hayden Christensen truly IS the chosen one. Lucas chose HIM out of all the other possible actors. I will forever think that it's Hayden's face under the mask whenever I see Darth Vader from now on.
And I don't think that's such a bad thing.

That's fine. You're SUPPOSED to think about it that way. But I'm talking about the filmmaking process, not the fictional suspension of disbelief thing. To portray Vader correctly, it should have been a large Prowse-like actor inside the costume, not a scrawny kid.

Bantha274
05-20-2005, 01:48 PM
Well, he only stands next to Palpy and Tarkin for a few minutes. Didn't seem like his size comparison was that big a deal.

What bothered me more was Vader yelling "Nooooooooooo!!" after learning about Padme's death. That was right out of the original Frankenstein movie. Seemed pretty cheesy to me. I think just having him yell incoherently and destroying more with the force would have been more powerful as a scene.

vadersvette
05-20-2005, 02:20 PM
I think hes shorter because he is, afterall, 19 years younger in this movie! :stupid: Most everyone gets taller over the years. It's called GROWING UP! :rolleyes:
Sorry, after reading all these threads ripping the movie apart, I'm really shaken up! THE MOVIE WAS F-----G GREAT!!!

Exhaust Port
05-20-2005, 02:27 PM
"Aren't you a bit short for Darth Vader?" - Leia

2-1B
05-20-2005, 02:35 PM
When I heard he was going into the suit I was worried because he is indeed shorter but since his legs got cut off the problem was solved.

He didn't seem to scrawny to me, it might have been but we didn't really see him doing too much so I didn't notice that. For me, the height was the big issue.

I was already cool with seeing young Ani as a ghost in ROTJ but now that I've actually seen ROTS I'd say Lucas was brilliant to put him in there. Well done.

Master Elessar
05-20-2005, 02:36 PM
I think hes shorter because he is, afterall, 19 years younger in this movie! :stupid: Most everyone gets taller over the years. It's called GROWING UP! :rolleyes:
Sorry, after reading all these threads ripping the movie apart, I'm really shaken up! THE MOVIE WAS F-----G GREAT!!!
Well,when growing up the part of your body that extends is the legs and,Anakin doesnt have much of those now does he?

Droid
05-20-2005, 02:40 PM
I am going to guess that Episode III Vader was the same height as original trilogy Vader. Lifts in the shoes, whatever it took.

DarthBrandon
05-20-2005, 02:54 PM
I didn't really notice this & neither did my son, but just for arguments sake, Vader would not be the exact same size (mass & weight) as he was in the O.T. The man in the suit at the time he was re-born was smaller in size, he hadn't had time to grow in size, but over the course of 19 years I'm sure he had his share of Twinkies or whatever the equivalent is in the S.W. universe. :D I also believe that he had many changes to his outfit over the years to let out a stitch here & there for said Twinkies, itís not like this was the only outfit he had. The scene didnít hurt anything with Hayden in the suit & I liked it more this way than what was suggested. IMHO

stillakid
05-20-2005, 04:55 PM
I didn't really notice this & neither did my son, but just for arguments sake, Vader would not be the exact same size (mass & weight) as he was in the O.T. The man in the suit at the time he was re-born was smaller in size, he hadn't had time to grow in size, but over the course of 19 years I'm sure he had his share of Twinkies or whatever the equivalent is in the S.W. universe. :D I also believe that he had many changes to his outfit over the years to let out a stitch here & there for said Twinkies, itís not like this was the only outfit he had. The scene didnít hurt anything with Hayden in the suit & I liked it more this way than what was suggested. IMHO


Hmm, maybe these? :sur:

stillakid
05-20-2005, 04:58 PM
I think hes shorter because he is, afterall, 19 years younger in this movie! :stupid: Most everyone gets taller over the years. It's called GROWING UP! :rolleyes:


Hmm, perhaps you might try that sometime. :rolleyes:

But anyway, most people actually stop the majority of their growth by the time they hit their late teens to early twenties. Steroids or serious working out excluded, most people retain their general "look" that they have at that point throughout their lives until old age begins of course. It's called GROWING UP! Look it up. :)

Sith Lord 0498
05-20-2005, 06:26 PM
I also think it was to give the impression that this is a young Darth Vader. Yes, it's true that Anakin's growth was likely done by this time, but I feel it was done for a visual purpose to show a progression of time as well as a growth in Dark Side power (i.e. - more menacing, stronger, etc.).

stillakid
05-20-2005, 07:57 PM
I also think it was to give the impression that this is a young Darth Vader. Yes, it's true that Anakin's growth was likely done by this time, but I feel it was done for a visual purpose to show a progression of time as well as a growth in Dark Side power (i.e. - more menacing, stronger, etc.).

Well, my question was really rhetorical. :D Because I think that Lucas dropped Hayden in the suit for purely marketing purposes. He's spent all this time trying to convince us that Hayden IS the new Darth Vader, that to put somebody else in the suit for filming purposes would undermine all that crappy work he's done so far.

Slicker
05-20-2005, 09:45 PM
I didn't like the fact at all that Hayden was in the suit. It was almost blasphemy. And on the height thing I heard that they both gave him lifts and shrunk the sets down slightly to make him look bigger.

darthvyn
05-20-2005, 10:20 PM
to me, putting hayden in the suit was a good move, because this is when anakin BECAME darth vader. he still has mannerisms of anakin, he still has the speech pattern of anakin. (yes, i know JEJ did the voice-over, but he did a voice-over of hayden. imagine if he had to do a voice-over of prowse doing an impression of hayden???) prowse is vader in the OT, just like alec guinness is kenobi in the OT. they didn't dig up alec and make him play a younger version of himself did they?

Veers
05-20-2005, 10:41 PM
He looked like the old Darth Vader to me.

JediTricks
05-21-2005, 12:41 AM
I think hes shorter because he is, afterall, 19 years younger in this movie! :stupid: Most everyone gets taller over the years. It's called GROWING UP! :rolleyes: Almost nobody keeps growing after age 21, especially not an additional half-foot in height.



When I heard he was going into the suit I was worried because he is indeed shorter but since his legs got cut off the problem was solved. That doesn't make sense, taller people don't just gain half a foot in height all in their legs, they'd look like circus freaks, "stilt-man!". Tall people are proportionally taller, Vader didn't have a short torso and elbows that started too far up his arms in the OT, so just having the legs cut off wouldn't work, he'd have to have his entire torso stretched out and his biceps lengthened as well.



they didn't dig up alec and make him play a younger version of himself did they? No, but Ewan was trying to do an imitation of Guinness while playing young Obi-Wan, Hayden wasn't imitating JEJ in terms of Vader's speech styles.

2-1B
05-21-2005, 01:02 AM
JT, what statistics are you using for height ?

If you're saying Prowse is a half foot taller than Christensen, I'm not buying that because the helmet itself probably adds a few inches . . . I just pulled out 6 inches on my Stanley Leverlock, I'm looking at it right now and if you aren't counting the helmet then that's gotta be what, maybe 3 inches right there ? So theoretically I could be arguing that 2-1B gave Anakin an extra 3 inches to his legs and I'm not bothered by that.

Correct me if I'm wrong though, because you might mean that there is a 6 inch difference between the helmeted Prowse and helmeted Christensen ? :confused:

And What About Bob ( :p ) Anderson, was his height comparable ? I never noticed the difference in ESB. :)

JediTricks
05-21-2005, 01:40 AM
Hayden is reportedly 6'1", Prowse is 6'7", that's the actual actor's heights, not the characters', I think you can do the math there. BTW, I'm 6' and my mother's fiance is 6'7" and I can tell you it's a significant difference in height, there's no way I could "fudge" it with lifts.