View Full Version : "That boy was our last hope"

06-15-2005, 11:11 AM
Is Ben just having the first stages of Alzheimer's or did he just forget he was there in the birthing room for Leia..... surely he should have thought they would both be strong in the force....

Obi-Wan: "That boy is our last hope"
Yoda: "No, there is another"

When I first watched it, I thought that Ben didnt know Luke had a sister, but Yoda did, therefore it made it that more dramatic when Luke found out Leia was his sister. Yoda knew all along, but Ben didnt.

Now with EIII it seems both Ben & Yoda know, and that line in ESB makes no sense....

El Chuxter
06-15-2005, 11:24 AM
Maybe he knew Yoda wasn't long for this world? :confused:

06-15-2005, 11:24 AM
I can't make any sense out of that line now that we are shown that Obi Wan knows about Leia. The only thing I can think of would be based on the fact that she wasn't trained in the use of the force and before Luke leaves Endor he says she has the same ability and will learn to use like he has???

Jim Jam

06-15-2005, 11:47 AM
Well Luke did go to save Leia, maybe he thought if Luke died she would have too. But then why would Yoda say that there is another? Yeah, this adds to my lines in the old trilogy that don't make any sense.

Or maybe Yoda had to remind him about Leia cause he's senile, he didn't remember Artoo:)

Captain Spoon
06-15-2005, 11:50 AM
Or maybe Ben knew Bail took her to Alderann, well he also knew Alderran was blown up. Ben couldn't possibly have been strong enough in the Force to keep tabs on both. Only someone as strong as Yoda could sense both Leia and Luke. So Ben said this thinking that one had been destroyed. At least that is what I got from it

El Chuxter
06-15-2005, 11:58 AM
Keep in mind that Ben looks right at the others before he sacrifices himself. He would've recognized Leia from the hologram he'd seen earlier.

06-15-2005, 12:21 PM
From Return of the Jedi:

Luke: But I have no sister.

Ben: Hmm. To protect you both from the Emperor, you were hidden from your father when you were born. The Emperor knew, as I did, if Anakin were to have any offspring, they would be a threat to him. That is the reason why your sister remains safely anonymous.

I think Kenobi always knew about Leia; he just didn't consider her to be a viable option as a jedi, for whatever reason.

06-15-2005, 12:57 PM
I think Kenobi always knew about Leia; he just didn't consider her to be a viable option as a jedi, for whatever reason.

Well she is a girl and all...... :p

I am kidding of course!

Jim Jam

06-15-2005, 12:59 PM
Luke was already on his way to being a Jedi whereas Leia had not been introduced to the ways of the Force.

ROTS does not discredit the line in ESB because as Trandoshan posted above, ROTJ points out that Ben was quite possibly aware of Leia . . . unless you would argue that Ben made that speech AFTER learning (offscreen) about Leia from Yoda. I don't think so though, I think Ben knew of her all along.

06-15-2005, 01:00 PM
Well Luke was way too old to begin the training, i mean it worked out well, but maybe he didnt think lighting would strike twice.

06-15-2005, 01:39 PM
Yeah, this adds to my lines in the old trilogy that don't make any sense.

Uh, it would be far more accurate to say that "this adds to the events in the PT that don't make any sense." The OT established the benchmarks of continuity and it is the duty of the PT to uphold them. If something doesn't make sense between the two trilogies, it is always the fault of what came later, not sooner. :)

06-15-2005, 07:53 PM
I always figured Ben knew, but he figured Leia wouldn't be able to complete the training, with Yoda about to give up the ghost.

Afterall, it was Ben's spirit who told Luke about his sister. When Luke figured out it was Leia, Ben wasn't surprised.

Then there was Vader's line about "Obi-Wan was wise to hide her form me. His failure is now complete."

Mostly, the line was there to build foreshadowing, IMO. Either way it dosen't relly bother me. :D

06-15-2005, 11:02 PM
Well Luke did go to save Leia, maybe he thought if Luke died she would have too. But then why would Yoda say that there is another?

Yeah this only recently occured to me. They try to discourage Luke from going off to rescue the 'other' hope of the galaxy. So when Yoda says 'no there is another' he'd better hope Luke is successful otherwise both hopes are lost. The reason they seemed to express for Luke to stay on Dagobah was that Luke must avoid the risk of being tempted to the dark side by Vader when what they really should have been worried about was if both Luke and Leia were killed.

Obi-wan could be sexist (remember, if you consider the prequels to be canon, Jar jar was a 'pathetic life form'). Or perhaps Obi-wan isn't aware at this point that Leia is force sensitive - having lived close to Luke he senses the force is strong in him but he may have little knowledge of how Leia is coming along. If Anakin was the first Jedi to break the celibacy rule it might not have been common knowledge that force power would be passed from a jedi to his/her offspring. Granted if I were Obers I would have assumed that if Luke had it Leia probably did too. The other option is that Ben doesn't hold out much hope that Leia will survive the Bespin ordeal, hence 'that boy is our last hope', while Yoda prefers to be an optimist 'no, there is another'.

06-16-2005, 03:06 AM
Before the prequels, Ben not knowing about Leia and then knowing she is Luke's sister in RotJ bugged me. I chalked it up to Ben's ghost being told about her by Yoda immediately following the "No. There is another." scene. Which essentially solved the problem.

With Obi-Wan being in the presence of the birth of Luke and Leia and even hearing their names spoken aloud once again makes a fool of the OT when it shouldn't have. Needless story revisions, and this certainly is a big one, seem to be what matters most to Lucas concerning his older works.

So now I have to reimagine the OT to assume that Ben just didn't think of Leia as being a viable Jedi candidate despite the fact that she was the one who got the ball rolling with the rebellion by racing to give Obi-Wan the Death Star plans. Unless Lucas has more changes in mind for the OT. Which could always be the case.

06-16-2005, 09:34 AM
I was reading an old Insider in which they answered this question with a reasonably plausable explaination. I'll dig it up when I get outta work and post it.

06-16-2005, 03:16 PM
Maybe it was lke the movie "Twins" and Luke got all the midiclorians and Leia got what was left...:D

Darth Spectre
06-17-2005, 10:49 AM
I never interpreted Obi-Wan's line about Luke to mean he didn't know about Leia. Obi-Wan was closer to Luke, and had known Luke, albeit from a distance mostly, all Luke's life. Plus, Luke was the one that had expressed an interest in becoming a Jedi and had taken the first steps down that path. Obi-Wan also probably felt a sense of deja vu with Luke, seeing Anakin in him and vice versa. Leia was a politician, as was her "father." We already know Obi-Wan doesn't think highly of them as a whole (though clearly he knew there were trustworthy ones from dealing with Padme & Bail), so maybe that influenced his thinking that Luke was the only one that could do what needed to be done. And it also could come down to nothing more than Obi-Wan seeking redemption for his perceived failure with Anakin. He failed with the father, but was determined not to fail with the son.

06-17-2005, 11:04 AM
OK, I don't really like the explaination Insider gave, but I guess it's "canon": Ben did know about both twins (obviously) but he only thought of Leia as a Senator and politician, not a Jedi.

06-21-2005, 02:29 PM
This problem bothered me quite a bit until I realized that even in Jedi, when Obi-wan tells Luke he has a sister, he still refers to Luke as his and Yoda's "only hope." Obi-wan always knew about Leia, but by the time of Empire and Jedi he did not consider her a viable option. In Empire, Obi-wan is dead and Yoda will be dead soon, not much time to train Leia. Especially by the time Jedi rolled around, Yoda and Obi-wan were dead with no one to train Leia.

Frankly the question for me is more why in Empire Yoda considered Leia a viable option as opposed to why Obi-wan didn't.

The Overlord Returns
06-21-2005, 07:10 PM
Ben didn't think she was strong in the force. Yoda knew otherwise. There, explanation done.

06-21-2005, 07:49 PM
The context is Ben talking to Yoda after Luke runs off against Yoda's advice.

Yoda and Ben are fully aware of how easy is will be for Vader to use Luke's fear, and anger as he is not fully trained.

With Luke Dead or turned, Ben does not see any future for the Jedi -

I don't believe Yoda is telling him there is another, but rather reminding him Leia is still alive and kicking.

Ben's thoughts are fully on Luke and possiblly failing yet another jedi in not preparing for confrontation with the dark side.

Another possibility is if Luke Fails Ben fully understands that Luke would be lost as well as Leia - seeing as Leia and friends were the subjects Luke was running off to save - Luke's fear of another loss - remember Aunt & Uncle

This time farmboy wont be too late.

Fear leads to anger