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View Full Version : Mother in Target said $30 was too much for kid to have Mustafar Playset



Tycho
06-21-2005, 07:39 PM
I just came from Target. This may be interesting.

There are 4 Mustafar Playsets on the shelf for $29.99.

Where are all the adult collectors who should be buying these?

There were 2 kids, approximately age 7 and another younger (but at least 4) and they were explaining to their mother:

"This is how Anakin falls into the lava."

"They have break away platforms to fight on just like in the movie."

"See mom? It's a volcano and it launches fireballs."


Mom's response was to say she thought it was $89 - the price of the Lego TurboTank which was sold out and that was too much.

The kid responded that it was the other tag and he read it to make sure "$29.99."

Mom said "Where do you think $30 is going to come from?"

A sign of the times I suppose.....

I really want a large Star Destroyer and Jabba the Hutt's sailbarge and I'd be willing to pay several hundred dollars for either, and then again for the other one.

Many of us here will.

Target and Wal-Mart and Toys R Us contend with this mother however, who will not spend $30 for Mustafar and the kids are way more impressed with it than the folks I've heard talking around here.

(By the way, $30 is also the price of the sold-out ARC 170, but the mother would respond "It's still $30" I'm sure.)

So the stores won't gamble on larger playsets, no doubt, except if you really really hope we get lucky and Hasbro can produce something really nice for say between $50 and $100 and it's good enough for all of us to buy them out.

(The original sale price of the 1998 AT-AT Walker was $79.99 and it sold out. Later TRU clearanced some they would get in fresh off the truck for $10 each. Why they had them for that low I don't know. I can only guess that other stores backed off of ordering something to take up shelf space for $79.99.)

Anyway, your thoughts?

VaderhitsJarjar
06-21-2005, 08:21 PM
I hear the same thing from parents - It is usually - "Pick One...No I said One....which one do you want? ...didnt you want a darth vader? Why don't you wait and find the vader...? No....I said Pick one..."

Now what Hasbro needs to understand is medium size playsets with a pricepoint no higher than $19.99 would sell fast.

Would be easy on the parents and collectors pockets.

Droid Factory - 19.99

Make it look like Jabba's droid room or the inside of the sandcrawler.

Or do both!!

For the sandcrawler throw in one of the droids seen on the film or a Jawa -

Then for the droids don't make them oversized or cheap looking but make a mix and match kit of maybe 4 differend colored r2 heads with different bodies and maybe r5 units - this would be awesome

For the jaba's droid room throw in a guard and the same.

Hoth Echo Base - $19.99 or make four sets at 9.99 each

Cantina bar - all we need is the tap or center part $19.99

add some of the booths with 2 figures later $9.99

Death Star Bridge Playset

Jabba's throne room


They will sell!!


If the price is higher than $19.99 sure they would sell but more would sit.

Soon Target and Walmart would have them for 14.99 and not order anymore.

In my area the Arc 170 sits and sits but the gunship has been gone for a month. I think 29.99 was a good price for the larger ships - I bought the gunship for 28.44 at walmart. Much better than the clone war toys - I remember the hellfire droid and tank going for 29.99 - that is why I still don;t have them...

I see the Sail barge going for about what the 12" speeder bike sets sold for

Ji'dai
06-21-2005, 09:42 PM
I agree with the mom, $30 is too much for the Mustafar playset. I've passed on that one and all vehicles.

Lucas should wait to release his movies around Thanksgiving. Late Spring and Summer are really slow sales periods for the toy industry. I'm sure Hasbro is making a lot of money but not as much had the movie/toy release been in late November or early December. People tend to open their wallets more freely around the holidays; the kids will enjoy a perfect christmas, credit-rating be damned! Large, expensive LEGO sets tend to sell better around the holiday season, so I'm sure large, expensive action figure playsets would move at that time of year too.

LTBasker
06-21-2005, 10:08 PM
Well really it's more like $20-25 for the playset, and then the extra $5 to $10 for the included figures. Much better than the ARC fighter actually, where you have to spend $20+ in order to get the three pilots and droid.

Kidhuman
06-22-2005, 01:13 AM
Seriuosly, I have seen a few parents tell there kids to pick one figure as well. PArents arent prepared to spend 30 bucks on a toy. Maybe, like I etll my kids, you cant get anything higher than X amount of dollars before they go into the store. If they go higher I tell them no, Perhaps this is the same situation

2-1B
06-22-2005, 01:26 AM
I won't pay $30 for it either . . . drop it to $20 and I very well might. :)

JediTricks
06-22-2005, 02:37 AM
Where are all the adult collectors who should be buying these?Saving their money instead of buying kiddified, undersized junk like this. This thing looks unusable for display purposes and doesn't have much in the way of interior play space. The outside parts are all inaccurate to the movie, right down to Ani's trip to lava central, and the figures look like pack-in quality junk, well beneath the quality of the pack-ins on the Battle Arenas.

The biggest problem facing Star Wars playsets isn't the price or the shelfspace issues or even the moms, it's the perceived quality of the playset for play-n-display purposes, Hasbro's playsets have not lived up to the quality of days gone by, and it's all their lines, not just SW. Playsets from the outset have to be more fun than a vehicle even to entice a perspective consumer, there are far less playsets and the playset is far more limited than a vehicle which can go anywhere in a kid's imagination. Hasbro's playsets unfortunately don't look much like their movie scenes so display-based collecting shows less interest, and don't look much like a lot of fun beyond "reenact what you saw on the screen" action. BTW, I don't mean "here's a missile to fire" action, that's what Hasbro's answer to everything is these days: jam a projectile-launcher into something and call this pointless inclusion a feature.

Another problem is that Hasbro is incredibly foolish with playsets (and vehicles too, in this department), they think they have to be chintzy and give only what they can be sure they'll make back in each playset, so each $30 playset is only designed to sell that amount of product. However, a playset's TRUE value lies in its ability to convince consumers to buy MORE figures! Hasbro used to recognize this truth with their GI Joe: A Real American Hero line (and even its converse, that back in the day figures sold vehicles and playsets) but somewhere in the early '90s they lost their way. Now, playsets don't even come with WALLS most of the time, much less opening doors and fun & imaginative features that encourage consumers to buy more figures to play with, and don't get me started on the miserable quality of the pack-ins they include which both negates the co-sell properties AND lessens the perceived quality of the set since the figures generally suck. If Hasbro wants to put out a $30 playset, they better make it a $50 value at least, and in return they'll get hundreds of dollars in figure sales per unit, sounds like a win to me rather than watching unpopular playsets continue to languish on shelves time after time.



The original sale price of the 1998 AT-AT Walker was $79.99 and it sold out. Later TRU clearanced some they would get in fresh off the truck for $10 each. Why they had them for that low I don't know.SOLD out? It did ok but never anything remotely that good, stores couldn't get rid of these things since they didn't have much room for them and the pricetag was so high, Hasbro's merchandise on these backed up and eventually they couldn't get rid of them at all, so they warehoused 'em until they closed all their warehouses and decided to get rid of old stock at super-slashed prices since warehoused product costs the company money AND extra taxes, so they sold the remainder cheap to TRU and KB and Big Lots (at the time KB was owned by Big Lots IIRC).



Well really it's more like $20-25 for the playset, and then the extra $5 to $10 for the included figures. Much better than the ARC fighter actually, where you have to spend $20+ in order to get the three pilots and droid. Funny you should mention that since nearly everybody here who owns the ARC-170 has bought at least that many figures to man it, yet most of us wouldn't look twice as the Mustyfart Playset - what should that tell Hasbro? That the packin quality is poor and should be raised? Perhaps, but that's not the REAL answer IMO, the real answer is that the quality and interactivity of the playset should be raised, as I mentioned above in this post.

ronhudy
06-22-2005, 11:02 AM
There hasn't been a decent playset since the likes of the Ewok Village and Castle Grayskull!

Although I have to say I find the mother's comments a little bit disheartening - parents have no problem spending $200 for a PS2 and $40-$50 a pop for a game. Maybe Mommy should think about how much a few 6-packs of beer or a couple of cartons of cigarettes cost...

stillakid
06-22-2005, 11:15 AM
Mustafar is pretty lame as playsets go. But then again, there really was never much about that "location" anyway. How could anyone really design a piece of plastic to "accurately" recreate a volcanic planet? It just isn't going to happen...

But ships are a whole different ball o' wax so comparing them is like comparing apples and footballs. The exterior of a ship can be easily sculpted to actually look like what it does in the film while the overall design can integrate some "playability" within. The TPM Queen's ship and the Millenium Falcon are excellent examples of this.

While some playsets over the years have been worthwhile, such as the Ewok Village and maybe even Dagobah, most have suffered from having to somehow integrate an entire location into something that fits into a box. Then to make it small enough to keep the price down to something reasonable is something else. This isn't to say that Mustafar isn't overpriced for what it is...it isn't worth $30 bucks even with pack in figures...but the point is that no matter what they did with it, it wouldn't have ever been a high quality piece.

JEDIpartner
06-22-2005, 11:32 AM
I think otherwise. I think it's a great playset and worth the price. If you stop to think that the original Death Star playset sold for $25-$30 in 1979-- that would cost practically double by today's inflated prices. So-- this actually would be akin to the similarly "undersized" Dagobah playset from 1981.

Ta.

Dark Marble
06-22-2005, 11:38 AM
I am also sure that some of the collectors here would pay hundreds for large scale ships and playsets and many that won't. I hate spending more than $30 for a ship or playset. It is a ripoff. A re-released sandcrawler for $60??? And look what we got for that $60. The ARC-170 is twice the toy for half the price.

I think that now things are starting to cool off for Star Wars, and with no more movies (for now) Hasbro will back off from big ships and playsets, and I don't see a problem with that. Maybe one a year or so, and at $50 or below. No big ships or playsets unless the price is right, and price should equal quality.

Jayspawn
06-22-2005, 12:15 PM
I have to agree with JT and stillakad on the Mustafar Playset. I'm sure its great for kids, it'd be loads of fun if I was one. Who knows, maybe those kids will someday take our place after we've all retired from the Collecting Biz.

But back to the playset. I think its junk. I think Hasbro's playsets have gotten worse. I had the opportunity to get the Battle Arena Playset back in the AOTC days for $5 on clearence at KMart, chump change! And I happily passed. Its WAY underscale and inaccurate. As JediTricks said, it lacks interior space for ships and figures. Plus the Obi-Wan and Anakin figures are a joke. They are what I call "One Pose Wonders"

Cheaper playsets that you can build up are the way to go. So a kid can maybe get a few for gifts or whatever, and we collectors can change a spare room into the Death Star or Cantina if we wish.

sith_killer_99
06-22-2005, 12:16 PM
I have no intention of buying one of these. I passed on the Arena play set during the SAGA days as well. I have seen the Mustafar set taking up shelf space in several local stores. They will probably end up in the discount bin before long. :crazed:

ROTJLuke
06-22-2005, 12:31 PM
thats why I never got into the playsets or vehicles, b/c my mom was always telling me "wait for your birthday" or "wait for Christmas"...

VaderhitsJarjar
06-22-2005, 02:25 PM
Cheaper playsets that you can build up are the way to go. So a kid can maybe get a few for gifts or whatever, and we collectors can change a spare room into the Death Star or Cantina if we wish.

That is what I have been saying/writing for Months!!

Maybe I should change my name to VaderyellsNOOOOOOO!!

ROTJLuke
06-22-2005, 03:29 PM
Im sorry but I agree with others, in reguards to why spend $30 on a playset that isnt worth $15 when (if when, since nobody seems to have jack s**t in) the newer figures come out, you use that $30 on that. It makes more sense imo, but to each his own. Happy Hunting :)

jedi master sal
06-22-2005, 03:46 PM
It was mentioned that a well designed playset or ship should make you want to buy more figures to go with that set. I completely agree. It was also posted that the ARC-170 draws you into this too. Again, I completely agree.

I bought 3 ARC-170s and each one is fully manned with 3 clone pilots+astro droid. So instead of seeing them as $30 ships, to realize their full potential it actually cost me $50+tax.

That was a VERY smart idea of Hasbro.

The Mustafar set is just plain craptacular. The figs suck, it's not in scale, etc., etc.

Hell, we've been clamoring for a senate pod since TPM!!! They've been seen in each prequel and could easily be sold as a playset/small ship/whatever. You would need 2-4 figs each to fill them out. Those things would have sold figures for Hasbro like crazy! Imagine having those...you would buy three Meena Tills (and customize), or 3 Ask Aaks (again customize). You could have a Naboo one with, then Senator Palpatine from Naboo, Queen Amidala, Captain Panaka... There's also the Wookiee senate pod, Aqualish, Rodian, Twi' Lek (Senator Orn Free Taa!), etc...

Hasbro could still do these as they would be VERY cheap to produce. Sre some people might only get one or two of them, but then you have people like me and Tycho who would buy 20 or so. Man I'd love to have those to make a huge Senate scene. Besides, they'd make a great diorama for teh Yoda/Sidious Senate battle!

Whew, sorry I got a bit off topic, but man, Hasbro can sure drop the ball on somethings, while hitting the mark on others.

I think we ALL (not just we collecors, but kids and parents) as consumers could use with some consistency from Hasbro.

-Sal

aricajade
06-22-2005, 04:41 PM
Although I have to say I find the mother's comments a little bit disheartening - parents have no problem spending $200 for a PS2 and $40-$50 a pop for a game. Maybe Mommy should think about how much a few 6-packs of beer or a couple of cartons of cigarettes cost...
I find this statement disheartening. You obviously don't have children, do you? I have a 4-yr-old and I can tell you that if you bought them every $30 playset they wanted, you would have to be a PowerBall winner to afford it. I spoil my kid rotten. I'm talking he has 45 SW figures, AT-RT, deluxe figs, Gunship, 3 roleplaying lightsabers, 2 roleplaying guns and 2 X-Box games....and that's just since April....

You may very well see me having the same discussion with my son that I'm not going to spend $30 on Mustafar. But what you didn't see was the Grievous Electronic Gun he got the day before. Or the Clone Commander the day before that. Or the Purple Lightsaber the day before that.

Don't be so quick to judge and make accusations that a parent is spending their money on cigs and booze. Some days $30 is just too much.

Tycho
06-22-2005, 05:10 PM
A couple questions:

I'd like those who responded already to respond again:

1) Of those who are not buying this, how many of you are LOOSE figure afficianados (how many of you not buying this still DO open your figures)? What do you do with your open figures? What would you want to do to display them if you had options (playsets, versus say lining them up on shelves)?

2) Of those not buying these, do you or do you not spend $300 or thereabouts on Code 3 ships and Master Replicas items that have nothing to do with your Hasbro collection? Why spend on these (especially the vehicles that are incompatable with your Hasbro figures) but discount the idea of high-end Hasbro playsets in the ballpark of what they could do for $100+?
Would you buy pricey, high-end, high-quality Hasbro playsets if they aimded items compatible with their action figures for high end sales?

wedge1968
06-22-2005, 05:40 PM
I think that this set poses an interesting question for my family. I have never had a problem keeping my son from opening my Star Wars figures. He has known always that they are my toys and not his, and he has respected this. The Mustafar playset is the first toy he has ever asked me to open. All his life he has been surrounded by Star Wars toys, yet this is the first one that he has begged me to let him play with.

Will I spend $30 to get him one? His birthday is approaching, so I may. Was it too much for me when I knew that I needed those figures? No. Do I think it may be too much for a toy that he'll probably play with for a few weeks and then loose interest (especially given that he's not yet seen the films)? Maybe. We'll see.

Just thought I'd throw that out there as a point of interest.

wedge1968
06-22-2005, 07:07 PM
I guess I answered my own question: I just picked one up for my son. This conclusively means that $30 is not too much.

ronhudy
06-22-2005, 07:30 PM
I find this statement disheartening. You obviously don't have children, do you? I have a 4-yr-old and I can tell you that if you bought them every $30 playset they wanted, you would have to be a PowerBall winner to afford it. I spoil my kid rotten. I'm talking he has 45 SW figures, AT-RT, deluxe figs, Gunship, 3 roleplaying lightsabers, 2 roleplaying guns and 2 X-Box games....and that's just since April....

You may very well see me having the same discussion with my son that I'm not going to spend $30 on Mustafar. But what you didn't see was the Grievous Electronic Gun he got the day before. Or the Clone Commander the day before that. Or the Purple Lightsaber the day before that.

Don't be so quick to judge and make accusations that a parent is spending their money on cigs and booze. Some days $30 is just too much.

Actually, I do have kids. Two boys - a 9 and a 10 year old. My 10 year old is the SW fan/collector in the home. I collected up until the time AOTC came out. I've since given my son everything I had, and let him do the collecting. He doesn't buy playesets. Mostly 3-3/4" figures and some ships. He has a nice carded collection, and builds dioramas as well.

I wasn't trying to judge anybody, but think about it - the original statement said the kids were like 4 and 7. At that age, they really just want the playset for play value. And the way the Mom said "Where do you think $30 is going to come from?" is ridiculous. My kids know the value of money, and that things must be earned and deserved. But to say it that way to a 4 and 7 year old is silly. Her answer should have been more along the lines of "not right now, but if you really want it, lets talk about how you can earn or save for it".

Maybe she doesn't spend her money on cigs and booze, and that may not have been the best choice of words. But in my experience, I see kids all the time in the store getting reprimanded for wanting things, when Mommy has a cart full of junk. Not groceries or clothes, but JUNK. Kids shouln't be spoiled - but they shouldn't be lead to believe they're wrong for wanting a toy.

The Whills
06-22-2005, 07:40 PM
Well, I can identify with the "booze and cigarettes" thing because when I was a kid one of my friends moms was always making fun of my mom for buying me toys all of the time and thought it was ashame that I did'nt save my money, but when you looked in her fridge it was loaded with cigarettes and beer.

Anyway, I think that I would buy the mustafar playset, if it were the interior control room were the separatist commitee was sitting or somthing like that.
I agree that a playset must have display, and interior play value. That means rooms and walls and doors and elevators. Like the 77 death star, you could load the thing up with stormtroopers and all sorts of figures, and it was like the movie. Hell, if my kids asked for a mustafar playset, I would probably just go out in the yard and build a dirt mountain or somthing, but if they asked for a death star I would have a problem...that is where hasbro should come in.

Devo
06-22-2005, 08:44 PM
I'm actually having trouble with the 'playset' name. What I really want are authentically detailed dioramas with no stupid play features like projectiles and 'blow apart' pieces of plastic. The Millenium Falcon cockpit, I've said time and time again, cries out for this kind of proper scale treatment. I don't understand why Hasbro would think something like that wouldn't sell. A key section of a key, much-loved Star Wars vehicle capable of seating 4 figures (and realistically so - not with legs straight out in front) and also having full standing room - even at that it wouldn't be overly large. They can even forego any electronic features like light up consoles if it will keep the cost down and provide us with a context for our figures which looks accurate.

The above said I tend not to be impressed with stuff like this Mustufar playset. As Stillakid said it cannot possibly resemble what its trying to resemble - how can you compact an entire planetary location down into such a small assemblage of plastic? Maybe it'll do the just-above-36months age group but for collectors who want to display their toys it comes up way short. I'd love if Hasbro would be brave enough to take a gamble and aim a "playset" at collectors for a change. I'm pretty confident they'd find themselves surprised (I don't know why, it wouldn't surprise me) that not only the collectors they were targeting but also many kids lapped up such an item. Why do Hasbro have it in their heads that kids don't need something to look like what its supposed to be?

Tycho
06-22-2005, 09:14 PM
Then they need to do sectional environments at $20 a component - and also produce a majority of the components so they can ship up to 4 types at once, and show on the back of the box what they look like, all assembled.

The Death Star would be obvious.

The Blockade Runner

Mos Eisley cantina & connecting spaceport, including a docking bay.

The Lars Homestead

Yavin Base

The Millennium Falcon - only in this case it could complete the ship eventually

------------------------------------------------------------------

Echo Base, control center, wampa cave, medical triage

Star Destroyer

Dagobah -Yoda's hut, the swamp, the cave

Cloud City - another Death Star sized project

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Jabba's Palace

Jabba's Sailbarge

Home One

Ewok Village

Shield Generator Base

------------------------------------------------------------------

Trade Federation Droid Control Ship

Theed Palace

Otah Gunga

Mos Espa (Mos Eisley retooled) with new Watto's Shop and Slave Hovel added

Pod Race Arena / Pod Race Course

Galactic Senate / Chancellor's Office

Jedi Temple

---------------------------------------------------------------

Padme's Apartment

Club Outlander / Coruscant City Section / Dexter's Diner / Space port

Kamino - another big one including clone training grounds

Geonosis Droid Factory

Geonosis Arena

----------------------------------------------------------------

The Invisible Hand

Republic Cruiser (retool the Star Destroyer)

Utopau - a large one perhaps

Kashyyyk - a medium sized thing

Mustafar - a larger mid-size one perhaps

----------------------------------------------------------------

I just did some sketches trying to sectionalize the Blockade Runner down to small sized sets (like one half the cockpit and then you buy the other half and put them together if you're building the whole ship).

Doing it this way, you'd have 11 - 12 pieces you'd have to collect at $20, spending $160 in the end, (or more) - if you wanted to complete the whole ship.

Keeping all the pieces stocked and knowing how much of what piece to keep in production would be a challenge to say the least.

The Death Star, using the vintage mold and then a few similarly shaped variations on it that could fit all together in a circle or so, would be quite cool and might work easier than trying to build a ship, outside and inside.

JediTricks
06-22-2005, 09:18 PM
I think otherwise. I think it's a great playset and worth the price. If you stop to think that the original Death Star playset sold for $25-$30 in 1979-- that would cost practically double by today's inflated prices. So-- this actually would be akin to the similarly "undersized" Dagobah playset from 1981. Inflation is not the only factor at play though, otherwise we would be paying $50 for the B-wing. Prices for materials and manufacturing and even shipping have gone down when you factor in inflation.


Cheaper playsets that you can build up are the way to go. So a kid can maybe get a few for gifts or whatever, and we collectors can change a spare room into the Death Star or Cantina if we wish. Yeah, $15 modular playsets would be way better.


Of those who are not buying this, how many of you are LOOSE figure afficianados (how many of you not buying this still DO open your figures)? What do you do with your open figures? What would you want to do to display them if you had options (playsets, versus say lining them up on shelves)? I am not buying it and I am a loose figure fan, I open all my figures, I play with them, and I then put them on display on a shelf (or a vehicle, like my Republic Gunship full of figures). If there were modular playsets, I'd display my figures in them, but most of the playsets are not what I'm after and not fun-looking.


Of those not buying these, do you or do you not spend $300 or thereabouts on Code 3 ships and Master Replicas items that have nothing to do with your Hasbro collection? Why spend on these (especially the vehicles that are incompatable with your Hasbro figures) but discount the idea of high-end Hasbro playsets in the ballpark of what they could do for $100+?
Would you buy pricey, high-end, high-quality Hasbro playsets if they aimded items compatible with their action figures for high end sales? I don't buy $300 SW collectibles, the most I spend is $120 on Master Replicas Force FX Lightsabers, and that's because they're worth the money, they're high-quality and accurate and fun and great display items.

I likely wouldn't buy high-end Hasbro playsets unless they were very very very good looking AND fun, and even then I'd be hesitant to spend over $75 on even the most impressive playset (and keep in mind, I bought the GI Joe Defiant Space Launch Complex vehicle/playset back in the day, that thing was the size of a small couch).

sith_killer_99
06-22-2005, 09:25 PM
1) Of those who are not buying this, how many of you are LOOSE figure afficianados (how many of you not buying this still DO open your figures)? What do you do with your open figures? What would you want to do to display them if you had options (playsets, versus say lining them up on shelves)?

I collect loose and carded figures. I really don't have the room to display large playsets in diorama style. I prefer to display them lined up on shelves, though most of my stuff is packed up right now.


2) Of those not buying these, do you or do you not spend $300 or thereabouts on Code 3 ships and Master Replicas items that have nothing to do with your Hasbro collection? Why spend on these (especially the vehicles that are incompatable with your Hasbro figures) but discount the idea of high-end Hasbro playsets in the ballpark of what they could do for $100+?
Would you buy pricey, high-end, high-quality Hasbro playsets if they aimded items compatible with their action figures for high end sales?

My wife would kill me if I spent $300.00 on anything "Star Wars" related. I do collect Kotobukiya and Gentle Giannt Mini Busts.

I guess it really comes down to a few things for me:

1. Space! I have precious little space to display my stuff. Indee most of it is in a Climate Controlled storage shed. :(

2. Value. Some of these play sets look too hokey for me. They seem like cheap plastic and the pack-in figures are aweful, as always. I am just too cheap to drop coin on something like this.

3. Film. Due to the first reason, I have decided to stick with OT stuff for products that fall outside the Basic/Deluxe figures. In other words I will buy a re-hashed Y-Wing (OTC style baby) but have passed over the ARC 170 several times. I find myself doing this more and more. Admittedly, if Hasbro were to develop a new "Death Star" playset I would likely be all over it.

I also find myself gravitating away from loose PT figures all the while building up my OT army! I have gone insane with selling off my PT stuff and some older POTF2 figures. Then I seem to take it all and spend it on Army Builders from the OT. Maybe it's just a fad I am going through. Maybe I just got tired on trying to keep up with building Clone Armies.

Devo
06-22-2005, 11:39 PM
A pertinent point, relavant in the case of this Mustufar playset, is that collectors are constantly alienated in Hasbros attempts to pander to 8 year olds whereas 8 year olds would not necessarily be alienated if we were the ones being 'pandered' to.

Can you imagine a kid not wanting the complete Millenium Falcon cockpit for his figures? Are kids really happy with that cramped 2 seater we have right now or are they, like us, just settling for it in the absence of something that would be far far better? Do kids need action features on figures? Or would they, like us, just rather have a well articulated, well sculpted figure? I really think the 'wants' of kids are terribly misjudged by Hasbro. Sure their attention spans are short but while they're in it they want quality just like us. And maybe its precisely because of crap like action features and inadequate playsets that they have short attention spans. I certainly can't blame them for moving onto other things when after 3 years you still have to create a custom of an AOTC Obi-wan from about 4 crappy, action feature-blighted figures. The same may prove true for ROTS.

I would be happy to have a disembodied Falcon cockpit resting on some kind of display stand - as long as it is correctly in scale with the figures, has no cheap 'play value' nonsense like firing missiles, is accurately detailed and has an appropriate exterior paintjob. Could you really create the entire ship out of composite playsets? I don't think so to be honest. There is only one part of the ship - the cockpit - which would be instantly recogniseable and which would look good as a standalone piece. If you were to create the rest of the ship it would raise the questions of which interiors for which part of the exterior? How many interiors in total? Only the ones seen in the films or also rooms from the technical manual? Could these be accurately scaled? Could these be attractive on their own? If anything I can only see the cockpit being made and even that is doubtful when you consider that Hasbro still harbour the belief that kids are the dominant star wars audience and have (I believe) ill-informed opinions on what kids want.

Hexagram520
06-23-2005, 12:54 AM
If anything I can only see the cockpit being made.It would be cool to have a scale size version of the room where the droids and chewie are playing sabaac or whatever, and luke is practicing his lightsaber while obi wan and han are watching. That would be sweeeet.

Kidhuman
06-23-2005, 02:36 AM
I have a 7 year old that love SW toys and myself, so thats two people that require stuff. I can easily drop 50 bucks on myslef and 50 on him in a given day for figures alone. WOuld I buy him a playset? No. Why? Because he doesnt take care of them. He has gotten plenty of playsets through the years, HW, SW and others and all were ruined with in weeks. To me it would be a waste of money. That is a factor that could also be taken into consideration.

Kids have active imaginations. He uses everything in his room to play with, uses them as playsets. Not only is Mustafar out of scale, but it isnt worth it. 30 bucks for a small arsed set is outrageous. If it was 70 bucks and in scale I might buy it for my self.

I am with the majority, modular playsets is the way to go. They are more in scale and can be used for different set ups.

Tycho, I dont open my stuff as of yet becuase of lack of room. ALl the stuff I have now is kept MOC or MIB until the day I can display them in the fashion I want. Until then I cant fully answer your question.

plasticfetish
06-23-2005, 02:54 AM
I've yet to buy one of these, and I'll probably wait until I see it on clearance to buy it for my son. Why?
I have a 4-yr-old and I can tell you that if you bought them every $30 playset they wanted, you would have to be a PowerBall winner to afford it. I spoil my kid rotten. I'm talking he has 45 SW figures, AT-RT, deluxe figs, Gunship, 3 roleplaying lightsabers, 2 roleplaying guns and 2 X-Box games....and that's just since April....In my case it's always a matter of money (though my kid has tons of stuff) but it's also an issue of having somewhere for him to put a nice new big plastic playset. I have a feeling that a lot of parents (myself included) look at that sort of thing and say, "Jeez! That'll be fun to move every time I need to vacuum or dust." So they think of it like a special purchase and hold off, waiting to see if the kid still really wants it after that initial excitement wears off. If the kid keeps asking for it after a few weeks, then the parent may grab it and hold onto it for the birthday, etc.

That's what I'll do anyway.

It looks like a fun set, and he'll really enjoy it, though he mentioned that he didn't care about the included figures -- something about "the wrong lightsaber handles." ;)

abell748
06-23-2005, 05:41 AM
I bought for my 4 and 5 year old sons before I got one for me. They play with it constantly. They do hate the pack-ins however... They use it for all of their Galactic Heroes figures, which work well with this set. As far as children with active imaginations, my sons have all the Little People playsets and have made them into one big Death Star for their GH figures and Mustafar is now part of said Death Star.

jedi master sal
06-23-2005, 11:45 AM
I think I've said this before so bear with me if I'm repeating myself here, but...

Kids just don't have teh attention span that we did as kids. With Video/Comupter games, the internet, iPods, and all other sort of technilogical devices; kids don't need to sit down for hours to play with something.

I remember all to well NOT having these types things. It was years before I had a video game console.

However, I could just sit down and play with my figures, ships AND playsets for HOURS on end, day after day. We didn't have as many choices back then. I think it's that kids have too MANY choices nowadays and can't sit still long enough to enjoy one of them.

So while it may be disheartening to hear a mother deny her child a toy, I understand it. Of the note mentioned about cigarettes and beer, I goota agree there too, from personal experieces. I lived with my grandmother fro a time when I was a kids and she and her husband (her second husband not my grandfather) smoked up at least a carton a day combined, but if I wanted an action figure once in awhile, they'd belly ache like I was asking for the world. So I see this from both sides of the fence.

As to Tycho's questions, all I can say is that I'm not getting this load of crap playset because it just looks horrid. The figures are of a poor quality and I can't justify making room for this when I don't like it to begin with and it would replace something I display that I actually like.

BTW, I buy some high end collectibles too. That's why they are claled high end. You are for the most part getting what you pay for it.

If Hasbro did a better job at playsets, they MIGHT sell better. But again with the little attention span that kids have nowadays (and yes, I realize I'm generalizing here and that not all kids are this way), they know parents aren't that apt to buying them. And they don't want to pander to us collectors on this point.

They lost they're butts on the Queen's ship and before that the AT-AT.

Granted there is a renewed and bigger collector interest now along with at least for the near time a kid interest, but that's not enough for Hasbro's long term goal for this line. (IMHO or course)

-Sal

VaderhitsJarjar
06-23-2005, 01:06 PM
I
They lost they're butts on the Queen's ship and before that the AT-AT.

-Sal

Good Points!!

Hasbro lost them due to price!!

Intelligent people learn from Mistakes. hasbro appears to continue to make the same ones over and over. The playsets could have been priced lower to begin with - getting rid of all the electronic additions wold have helped. Kids are pretty good at creating their own explosions and laser sounds.

When the queens ship went down to $19.99 I had to pass because I was in college and broke. I finally had some money and went back but the two left were open and missing the droids.

I never bought the AtAt because I found a cinema scene with Veers and ATAT Driver exchanged for the Ponda and Ben - One of my favorite finds.

Hasbro should be calling me for a job. My email is listed in the forums if hasbro wants help.

Bren2d2
06-23-2005, 01:10 PM
I have yet to pick up this playset, but I will probably wait. I still have to buy an ARC-170 and other vehicles.

DarkArtist
06-24-2005, 12:13 PM
I too think that the price is high but I still want one, simply beacuse I have the Mustafar Anakin and I need a place to place him. I will most likely make my own, but it will be easier to take certain parts from the playset and incorporate them into the finished display piece. :)

Dark Marble
06-27-2005, 01:49 PM
I am a loose collector that hopes to one day be able to display all of my figures. I will probably pick up the mustafar playset...probably.

I don't collect any of the higher end stuff. No minibusts, no lightsabers, no code 3 or what ever. I am straight across the board Hasbro figures and vehicles.

I use vehicles and sometimes playsets to display my figures with, and that is it. I don't really care about size or something being out of scale because I don't play with the stuff. My pilots are standing next to my ships so I don't care if they fit in them or not. I buy my stuff to display and probably most of it will go to my kids when they are older, I wouldn't be suprised.

I guess the point of my rant is, I don't want to pay $100 plus for vehicles and playsets, and dont' need huge vehicles and playsets because simply having the representation is enough for me. I have an AT-AT and I love it, but it is no where near scale for the figures we have, and I don't want one that is. Was it worth the $90 I paid...not really.

$30-$50 is perfect for vehicles and playsets because they can be of good size, fit figures, and serve the purpose. I don't need an AT-TE or a Turbo Tank that will fit 100's of troops. I need one that some troops will fit in and some can stand around. That is my preference as a longtime collector and a collector that collects in bulk.

Honestly, I think that as far as large vehicles go, we have the most important ones covered, and when I say that I mean ones that actually did something in the movie. I paid out the nose for the AT-AT and shuttle so let the insanity stop. Playsets, well, how big do they need to be? If Hasbro updates and re-releases the old Death Star playset or Star Destroyer I will buy them. But do I need an actual death star or star destroyer in my collection? Not a chance.

Luuuuuuke
07-03-2005, 02:21 AM
I'm not going to get this set unless the price goes down a lot. Not because I think it's overpriced per se. I'm just not enthusiastic enough about it to pay $30 for it. Anakin looks pretty crappola too.

VaderhitsJarjar
07-04-2005, 10:27 PM
If Hasbro updates and re-releases the old Death Star playset or Star Destroyer I will buy them. But do I need an actual death star or star destroyer in my collection? Not a chance.

You will buy the Star destroyer bridge playset when it comes out.......

waves hand









oh and death star conference table with all them officers would be awesome....

looks at hasbro - waves hand

nomad
07-04-2005, 11:56 PM
Another problem is that Hasbro is incredibly foolish with playsets (and vehicles too, in this department), they think they have to be chintzy and give only what they can be sure they'll make back in each playset, so each $30 playset is only designed to sell that amount of product. However, a playset's TRUE value lies in its ability to convince consumers to buy MORE figures! Hasbro used to recognize this truth with their GI Joe: A Real American Hero line (and even its converse, that back in the day figures sold vehicles and playsets) but somewhere in the early '90s they lost their way. Now, playsets don't even come with WALLS most of the time, much less opening doors and fun & imaginative features that encourage consumers to buy more figures to play with, and don't get me started on the miserable quality of the pack-ins they include which both negates the co-sell properties AND lessens the perceived quality of the set since the figures generally suck. If Hasbro wants to put out a $30 playset, they better make it a $50 value at least, and in return they'll get hundreds of dollars in figure sales per unit, sounds like a win to me rather than watching unpopular playsets continue to languish on shelves time after time.

Those are just excellent points!
That is the exact difference in playsets of old and playsets of today.

The problem is, no companies think like that anymore.

Everything is about max money for each product.
No one seems to think long-term or look at the bigger picture... and of course everything is based on maximizing proffits as opposed to building a loyal customer base through quality products and happy customers.

Companies are happier charging too much money for crappy products (A lousy pizza or awful pack-in figures) as opposed to offering a good product (tasty pizza or a well-made action figure) for a reasonable price.

Heh, I believe in old fashion good service and loyal customers.
I think people want to pad their wallet more quickly than slow and steady allows.



May the force be with you.

Clonetrooper1131
07-06-2005, 12:31 AM
I've heard that conversation, or atleast a similar one around here. I dunno, if you break it down, the two figures that come with it are about five to 6 bucks a piece. So that means the playset would be in the 20 dollar range. It maybe a wierd way to look at it, but that's always how I've seen it. It could be worse, they could make you buy the playset with no figures....

The Whills
07-06-2005, 03:20 AM
I hate mustafar. I think the keyword for us "adult collectors" is environment rather than playset, in product we are looking to buy for our collection.

plasticfetish
07-06-2005, 03:58 AM
No, I'm looking for a good "playset."

I'm a toy collector, not a miniature environment builder. If I want some kind of a realistic mini-set, then I'll go and build one, but that's not what turns-me-on about all of this.

I like toys. I like fun toys that are made well and that function on different levels. I like toys that manage to inspire and entertain kids. That's the quality that, as an adult collector, I find most charming and valuable when I look to add a toy to my collection.

To me it's a hobby rooted deeply in a kind of juvenile sensibility. I have no problem with that. There's nothing wrong with maintaining your appreciation for fun and play for your entire life. (And if you ever have kids of your own, they'll appreciate that you never lost touch with it also.) :)

if you break it down, the two figures that come with it are about five to 6 bucks a piece. So that means the playset would be in the 20 dollar range. It maybe a wierd way to look at it, but that's always how I've seen it. It could be worse, they could make you buy the playset with no figures....Yeah, but there's no way that those two cheap, ugly figures are worth more than $2 or $3. I'd rather pay $25 and skip the crummy pack-in figures. (Or they could have given us some of those droids that worked and buzzed around the lava.)

I'll buy that set when it goes on sale, and I'm certain that my son will toss those two figures in a tote and use his other Anakin and Obi-Wan figures instead.

The Whills
07-07-2005, 04:19 AM
Well, all I can say is this. When you look at the quality of toylines declining over the years, it's no wonder all these toy companies whine that kids have low attention spans. When I was a child, we had death stars, star destroyers and such with environmental qualities rather than "stupid action features and out of scale retardedness." We had superpowers, which was loaded with every cool superhero imaginable. Now we have mustafar, Yawn, and batman with lazer scope copter wing ta ta's. I think rather than blaming kids for having short attention spans, we should blame toy executives for being cokeheads and not knowing what kids nor collectors would like, which is the same thing. I can't count how many times I have seen a kid wanting a sue storm from fantastic four, and all they can find is some stupid thing with a lame crunching toddler car. Is it any wonder kids think toys are lame these days? They have been marketed to by cokehead executives with their crap since the early nineties!
Hell most of the time whatever cool product that is out there is unavailable 90% of the time due to scalping or other factors. Now can't you see why kids would get tired of going time and time again and seeing the same old junk that the scalpers leave behind? I think toy companies need to change their marketing to reflect teh older days, and hasbro has done a good job of this with figures to this day, but not with playsets. I know what I wanted as a child, and I still want the same thing now, and I am still not getting it.

plasticfetish
07-07-2005, 05:01 AM
I think rather than blaming kids for having short attention spans, we should blame toy executives...You could have simply edited your post down to that. ;) I think you hit the nail on the head there, (but I don't think most of those guys can afford the particular "habit" you mentioned. They're not selling Deloreans.)

And again, you made another good point. The shortage of Invisible Girl figures from the Fantastic Four line (not to mention Doctor Doom!!!) and the similar shortage of villains (vs. Batmans) in the Batman Begins line (I've only seen one Ras al-Ghoul, and only the "fake" one since the toys came out) must suck for kids.

I think you're right, there is a need for better marketing, and the people in charge of marketing need to be more directly involved in the toy design process. Just the same, yes... those people also need to be genuinely in-touch with the wants and needs of their potential customers. Yeah, they need to know what people "would like" and they need to know why they'd like it--which means they need to simply have a better understanding of what makes a great, fun toy.

I'm always curious about just how much objective kid based product testing goes on these days.

Val Da Car
07-07-2005, 10:34 PM
Today I saw a MILF buy and ship without flinching an eye lash.

it was a good day...

Veers
07-08-2005, 12:54 AM
It is too much.

Luuuuuuke
07-08-2005, 12:54 AM
I'm not buying this set. No way no how... unless it goes on clearance for like $15. It's not that I think it's a bad set per se. I'm just not that excited about it, certainly not enough to pay $30. It's a shelf warmer around here.

JediTricks
07-08-2005, 05:25 AM
PF, be fair, John Delorean sold coke to keep his company afloat, not to support his coke habit.

I think executives rely too much on testing, using it as a crutch whenever they risk actually saying "yes" to anything so they don't lose their jobs over bad decisions.

Cirielle
08-04-2005, 05:30 PM
Well I am a mother of a little girl and trust me we go into a store and she wants tons - but she knows 2 things -

1. she has to ask
2. she may have to wait till her birthday or Christmas

I would agree that the woman should use better tact with her kids. But at the same point unfortunately it was probably a woman who doesn't know the first thing about Star Wars at all. I mean there are tons of them out there and it makes not a lick of sense to me.

Now as far as the Hasbro quality - yeah it has been lacking for a long while and really it is just isn't Hasbro - It is all toy companies. I don't have the answers to why or even the solutions at all. I doubt it is overall money though - b/c I am pretty sure it was more expensive back in the day to produce stuff on a smaller scale.

As far as the set itself. It looks gimmicky on the box itself. I mean the box itself says a lot. If it was packaged more classically like OTC line - then I think a lot of older collectors would find it interesting. As far as kids finding it interesting - well I don't think that the second trilogy really captivated kids like the first trilogy did with most of us. I think that there is just a difference.

Now back to the set and buying it for a kid - Would I? Yeah! I don't feel that $30 is too terribly expensive for something that would make them happy! I mean I look at it this way - I would much rather have a kid playing with that than watching TV or I would much rather a kid have that than going out to dinner at a restaurant which costs way more for 2 adults and 1 kid (and this is like TGIFridays). I think it has to do with the fact that I can still relate to a kid and wanting toys. I also understand that it isn't cheap to get unfortunately and I also think it has to do with the fact that when I look at the price of grown up toys versus kids toys - well then the price really doesn't seem as horrible.
Examples - kitchen devices like a good blender, toaster, what not are about the same price or go up a notch into other kitchen stuff or home stuff for that matter like throw pillows. Those things are like $10 for cheap and $100 for nice and they do nothing but asthetically make a person think their home is styled. Or take a look at grown up toys that are generally looked at as being men-specific - Laser measurer, car equiment, lawn equipment and more. I mean the prices of things are all over the place and it is what you value that seems to make it worth the price.

Again for me - the look on a kid's face while playing pretend is so much worth more than having a throw pillow to make my neighbors think we have it all.

DarthHarv
08-04-2005, 07:11 PM
I wish you were my mum!!:D

jaxx
08-04-2005, 07:44 PM
The Mustafar playset looks like crap. It doesn't look fun at all. It looks generic, and I think that any kid could do a better job making the playset when they make their "volcano science project." I't not interesting, and the play factor looks horrible.

I agree that toys in the "olden days" just seemed to be better. They were constructed better. You could really play with them and toss them around... they wouldn't break! So of course we could play with them longer. Playsets had more "secret doors" and features to take make believe to another level. Keep in mind though... we didn't have as much technology then either. There was no internet, the video games were remedial, there weren't as many TV shows that catered to kids... so we really had no choice other than use our imagination. Kids now get disenchanted with toys easier because they expect them to have artificial intelligence or something. It's "more fun" for the little tykes to play a video game or go online and play games, watch movies, or sneek onto porn sites when mommy and daddy aren't around. Also, now, you go to pose your figures, and the ball jointed arm falls off in your hand. The construction sucks, so why would a kid play with something that keeps breaking? The only thing about toys now-a-days is that the detail is better. Look at Todd McFarlane's toys. There really aren't many issues with the toy not looking like it's intended to look like (unlike 90% of the OB1 head sculpts out there). There's just no play value with the McFarlane line because it's focused towards the older collector. There seems to be a trade off between detail, quality, and play value.
My question is... were toys really better back then, or were we just more encouraged to use our imagination and creativity?
Look at He-Man figures. All of the figs had the exact same bodies, arms, and legs... their heads were the only different parts (besides the paint app). But we didn't care then. We didn't care about articulation. We had something better... our imaginative little minds.

THE CHOSENONE
08-04-2005, 11:24 PM
I can remeber vividly as a child playing with my toys. I don't recall giving a rats *** if it really looked like the character it was supposed to be or if the scale was all wrong. I just knew I would have fun and that's all that mattered. Now as an adult I do not "play" with my toys. I do open them and fiddle around with them a little. Then I pose them in a cool looking way and walk away. This is where the toy companies probably have their biggest problem. As an adult I want my Obi-Wan to look like Ewan McGregor where as most kids still don't really care but, Hasbro's Star Wars toys have the unique situation of appealing to kids and adults. So who do you please? As much as us older collectors like to think we drive the market on these toys were probably wrong. I think now more than ever the ratio of kids to adults collecting Star Wars toys is getting less skewed. Kids are interested in Star Wars again. Which is a good thing because that makes the market stronger and we will keep getting more toys. Basically if you don't like what you see don't buy it, don't ***** about it, and just deal with the fact that toys are generally for kids and not adults. Of course this is just my opinion.

Devo
08-06-2005, 05:57 PM
There's just no play value with the McFarlane line because it's focused towards the older collector.

And ironically if you happen to visit the forums at the McFarlane site you'll observe that they're all teens over there. Star Wars toy buyers seem far more mature to me - and these are the kids toys apparently.


We didn't care about articulation.

Well I beg to differ on this point. There was nothing I hated more as a child than a figure who couldn't do a kick because the legs weren't ball jointed - female figures mostly. I did want articulation.


I don't recall giving a rats *** if it really looked like the character it was supposed to be or if the scale was all wrong

Hmm - I differed here as well. I definitely have always wanted accuracy in toys. Batman and Terminator 2 are examples of film licenses from my 'play' era that often come to mind where we were never given definitive movie accurate figures (or if we did they were impossible to find) - it was always 'Aqua-suit Batman' or 'hyper battle damage Terminator' - was I alone as a 10 year old hoping for a Terminator figure that actually looked like Arnie in his biker outfit? Of course we didn't actually get that till McFarlane took on the Terminator license a few years ago (albeit with the cop-out of making his face unrecogniseable because Arnie hadn't given the go-ahead for his facial likeness)

DarthQuack
08-06-2005, 06:03 PM
I still need to pick up a Mustafar set.

plasticfetish
08-06-2005, 11:41 PM
was I alone as a 10 year old hoping for a Terminator figure that actually looked like Arnie in his biker outfit?I was 16 when that movie came out. So, not only did I not care about the likeness, I honestly didn't care about the (or any) toys either. It took some more "maturity" before I started caring again. ;)

This idea of detail and accuracy is really a relative one. When the first Star Wars figures came out, there wasn't much that you could compare them to in that scale and subject matter. I remember being amazed the first time that I saw a Micronaut because of the articulation and detail for something that small. When SW figures came out, we were mostly just thrilled to have any kind of toy from the film. It was a new idea at the time. Likeness and detail was really secondary to play value. I was more concerned with putting Luke in that Landspeeder and tossing it off my roof, than I was with how much the figure looked like Mark Hamill. (There's a joke in there, but I'm not gonna make it.)

I think the uniqueness of the line was what brought most people to collecting also. Things like detail and accurate likeness came later.

jimmymiro12
08-07-2005, 07:03 PM
It's funny someone starts a topic like this. On Friday they had the Build your own lightsaber set for 30 at Target. The kid loved it but the mom was saying that it is a waste of money and thatt he only had 25 dollars. The poor kid. The mom couldn't even give him 5 bucks. I did feel like giving him the money just to see what the mom would do.:D :p

jimmym

plasticfetish
08-07-2005, 07:47 PM
Wow. If anything's worth the money, it's that set. That thing has "play value" written all over it. I'm just trying to hold off until my kid's b-day in October to buy him one. (Doubt I'll make it.)

Kidhuman
08-08-2005, 11:35 PM
Funny thing, I was in three different stores over the weekned, and in each store a kid grabbed tis set and their mom was like how much is it? When I said thirty dollars they all had the same response of wait til your b-day.