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jjreason
02-25-2006, 03:44 PM
Luke and Han look at each other and embrace on Endor. The looks on their faces... like they were truly scared for each other and are close to tears.... chokes me up every time. Great acting.

Anyone else still get choked up over this stuff, or am I a big baby? :D

El Chuxter
02-25-2006, 05:06 PM
Not that particular scene, but when Anakin says, "You already have," I get a little misty.

shammykenobi
02-25-2006, 05:24 PM
On endor when vader and luke are first talking in the corridor and vader says, "it's too late for me son." That always gets me. I think it's the first time we really see Anakin and not vader in the OT.

Speaking of that I have a question, or rather an observation and a question based of it....at the end of ESB when Chewie gets mad and starts throwing stormtroopers off the carbon platform, Boba Fett raises his gun and starts to fire...When Boba does this, vader immediately reaches over and points boba's rifle to the ground to discourage him from firing...now I don't know of any good reason for vader to have done this...the only think I keep thinking is that somehow he wanted to save leia...cause what difference would it have made if boba fett killed chewie?? or for that matter leia?? everyone at this point was pawns in a plot to trap luke, so maybe vader sensed something different about leia and didn't want her dead?? Anyone else ever thought of this or have any ideas?? That may have been the first time we saw Anakin in the OT. What do you guys think?

El Chuxter
02-25-2006, 05:52 PM
There was a story in Star Wars Tales about that a few years ago, with Vader finding C-3PO's remains in Leia's quarters and reminiscing about building him. It's certainly a possibility, but it's been the subject of much debate.

shammykenobi
02-25-2006, 06:28 PM
I remember that story...I didn't have that issue, but i glanced through it at a comic shop once...I would always try to start this conversation with friends, but they weren't really star wars fans and thought I was kinda crazy...I never really got to discuss it with real fans...I'll have to try to track down that issue of star wars tales...thanks.

Kidhuman
02-25-2006, 06:29 PM
Did Boba Fett even get a shot off? I thought he didnt.

jjreason
02-25-2006, 07:52 PM
He didn't, and that's the concern: why would Vader stop him? I think it's more because he didn't want any of them injured in the cross-fire, out of concern that Luke would sense what had happened and call off the rescue.

shammykenobi
02-25-2006, 08:16 PM
You're right boba didn't get a shot off cause vader wouldn't let him...but the reason behind this is what i'm getting at...Here's a list of what we know was happening at this point and my theory as to what could have been vaders motivation.

1) Vader set a trap for luke by capturing and torturing his friends. How vader knew who lukes friends were is anyone's guess, but with imperial intel and the force it shouldn't have been that hard to figure out who was who and who hung out with who in the rebel alliance

2) Vader DID NOT know that leia was his daughter or lukes sister. He doesn't figure this out until the end of ROTJ when he reads luke's mind. "Sister, so you have a twin sister, you're feeling have now betrayed her too."

3) Vader and the emperor most have felt luke was a huge threat or else they wouldn't have wanted him carbonited while in transport.

Now here's my theory: It seems that from what we know from the prequels that whenever a sith tries to seduce a jedi that they basically try to make them really mad and play on their emotions to get them to walk the path toward their anger...

Dooku did it with obi-wan by talking about qui-gon...and we know that the duel on Grievous ship with dooku and anakin was just a set up to cause anakin to go darkside...there's other numerous examples of this in the EU like with Quinlan Vos and Dooku etc.

I think that vader needed some extra insurance that luke would go darkside when he brought him before the emperor...he could have planned on having leia and chewie there with him to either kill or torture in front of luke...which would **** luke off and start him down the path to the darkside and make turning him more easy.

Or maybe he possibly felt some degree of force sensitivity in leia and thought maybe he could turn her too...

Of course some of the good that was left in him could have been shining through at this point and maybe he just didn't want anyone else to die.

Let me know what you guys think about these ideas.

shammykenobi
02-25-2006, 08:32 PM
While were on the subject of vader/anakin in the OT what do you guys think about the end of ROTJ when luke uses the force to snatch up his lightsaber to strike down the emperor...vader ignites his blade and blocks lukes blow...who was vader trying to save: himself, luke, or the emperor?

Again, here's what we know:

1) There can only be two sith at any given time. So either vader or the emperor or luke would have to die. We know that the idea was to turn luke, so both vader and the emperor wanted luke alive, so that possibility is out.

2) Vader said that palps had foreseen that luke would defet him. We also know that vader wanted luke alive so they could rule the galaxy as father and son...and we know from ROTS that anakin/vader had planned to defeat palpatine at some point and rule the galaxy the way he wanted to...considering the rule of two and all of this, vader protecting palpatine seems to be out as a possibility.

3) As i said in a previous post when a sith seduces a jedi they try to bring them to the edge so they can give them the push over it. Luke in all his anger striking down palpatine would have definetly put him over the edge and on the path to the darkside which is what vader wanted...but considering that vader and palps must have considered luke really poweful then maybe vader was afraid that after luke killed palpatine he would kill him too.

4) Luke told vader that he could still feel the good in him and vader told him, "it's too late for me son." There seems to be some degree of remorse in that statement and from there on out we can see more of anakin in vaders actions...maybe the good that was left in him came through and he blocked luke to protect him from fully going over to the darkside.

So like before, let me know what you think about this.

jjreason
02-25-2006, 09:56 PM
I'm sticking with my theory that he needed them alive to draw Luke into the trap for situation #1. For situation #2, the time wasn't yet right for Vader and/or Luke to deal with the Emperor, even if they had turned on him in tandem they would have been destroyed. The question you're asking is this: at what point in the battle is Vader redeemed? In my mind, he's tottering on the brink of returning throughout the battle (and in fact throughout the entirety of his face to face dealings with Luke in ROTJ), but doesn't finally go to the light until he bucks up and graps Palpatine.

Rocketboy
02-25-2006, 10:11 PM
In ESB, Vader was saving the droid strapped to Chewie's back.

Kidhuman
02-26-2006, 12:07 AM
I believe he didnt want anyone injured or possibly damage the carbonite machine.

El Chuxter
02-26-2006, 12:50 AM
See, didn't I say this was the cause of much debate? :D

mabudonicus
02-26-2006, 08:35 AM
I have a hard time keeping me eyes dry at a few points in the OT...
A LOT of the first meeting with yoda (after the "funny" bit) really affects me for some reason..

And when Luke gives R2 the salute before being pushed into the Sarlacc... when I was young, I had been sorta led to believe that Luke may have turned evil, after having left with his training incomplete- I really wasn't sure, when he showed up all angry, "gave away" the droids, was wearing the black robes... to me, nothing had truly indicated that he hadn't maybe gone evil (or at least gotten careless and had somehow gotten himself in a jam, plus we didn't know the extent of his powers yet)
So the salute, for me, is a little signal that everything is FINE, and it always "gets" me


The aforementioned "it's too late for me ssson" also tugs a bit, at that point you're left with no "bad guys" and the character of vader is switched to a figure of pity SO effectively, how can ya not feel it??

Devo
02-26-2006, 10:20 AM
I like the 'it is too late for me son' bit as well. I also really like the closing pan-out from the rebel fleet at the end of Empire Strikes Back with Han&Leia's theme playing and the end credits coming on. It almost brings tears to my eyes knowing I've just (re)watched a truly beautiful film in every respect.

Why does Vader stop Fett from shooting Chewie? He could see Han was trying to calm him down and didn't think there was any need?? I certainly don't think it was anything to do with Threepio. I really think Lucas only made that particular story point up in 1997 or 1998 so that most likely was not in mind when they filmed this scene in Empire.

Rocketboy
02-26-2006, 10:53 AM
I certainly don't think it was anything to do with Threepio. I really think Lucas only made that particular story point up in 1997 or 1998 so that most likely was not in mind when they filmed this scene in Empire.I was only kidding about that part. :D

There are a few parts in Jedi that I really like. I wouldn't sat they tear me up, but they have more of an emotional impat now than they did when I was a kid.
First was when looks goes crazy and beats Vader to the ground, cutting Vader's hand off. Vader is supposed to be really powerful and seeing Luke, this kid who's only now finishing his training, take Vader down, you can't help but think "this kid is really p***ed!" Then after he cuts off Vader's hand, looks at his own hand and realizes what he's done and how he's becoming just like Vader, Luke has that great look of shock in his face.

The second is moments later as Palpatine is zapping Luke. Knowing what we now know about Vader/Anakin, and even though it's expressionless, you can almost see the turmoil in Vader's face and see Anakin returning behind the mask.

Ji'dai
02-26-2006, 10:54 AM
You're right boba didn't get a shot off cause vader wouldn't let him...I think that vader needed some extra insurance that luke would go darkside when he brought him before the emperor... I agree, Vader wanted Chewie and Leia alive for delivery to the Emperor. Both are enemies of the state and were involved in terrorist/insurrectionist activities against the Empire. The capture of Leia would be a major coup since she was a former Senator-turned-traitor. In the end, both would later be used as bait should Luke escape Vader's trap at Cloud City. Lando thought that Chewie and Leia would remain in the city but Vader altered the deal.

No one shed a tear when that Ewok was killed and his younger friend or relative came back and started crying over his body? I was always uncomfortable while watching that scene.

shammykenobi
02-26-2006, 12:04 PM
When I was a kid, that scene with the ewok really got to me as well.

So we're discussing the scenes that tug at the 'ol heart strings from the OT, but what about the PT??? anyone have any that really gets em?? here are mine:

TPM: When qui-gon is dying and he reaches up to touch obi-wans' face. That one always gets me.

AOTC: There's a couple for this. When they're going into the club on coruscant and obi-wan says "this weapon is your life". Pure Alec Guiness.

Also in the club when obi-wan says,"why do i get the feeling you're going to be the death of me." In retrospect that's a really poignant line.

On tatooine theres one point where anaking and padme are talking outside the lars homestead and anakins shadow is a perfect silhouette of darth vader..alot of people missed this, but that completely blew me away when I first saw it.

Also on tatooine when shmi dies and anakin is crying and then goes darkside...that always literally makes me tear up.

ROTS: Pretty much the whole movie, but at the end when Obi-wan tells anakin that he loved him and that he had failed him...gets me more misty eyed than watching old yeller.

so what are everyone else's?

shammykenobi
02-26-2006, 12:06 PM
Oh yeah...also in ROTS when order 66 is executed and the look of confusion on Ki-adi's face when the clones draw on him and start to shoot...that's a really good one too.

shammykenobi
02-26-2006, 12:09 PM
And when yoda feels the death of all the jedi in the force and he drops his can and clutches his heart...another great moment.

El Chuxter
02-26-2006, 01:07 PM
The deaths of Qui-Gon and Shmi have always hit me more than the death of Obi-Wan. Maybe it's because I've known almost my entire life that Obi-Wan dies and comes back almost immediately.

The death of Padme wasn't handled as well as it should have been, but the close-up of the japor snippet at her funeral march makes up for it.

dr_evazan22
02-26-2006, 01:30 PM
In addition to some of the other scene's already mentioned...

For me, in ANH, when, after discovering the slaughtered jawa's Luke returns to the homestead to find the corpses of the only family he has (had).

Another from Jedi: The (as I see it) love and pride that DV/Ani expresses in / for Luke when he says "You were right. Tell your sister you were right."

Mr. JabbaJohnL
02-26-2006, 02:15 PM
There are several for me. It was more poignant when I watched all six in order, in one day.

TPM
*Japor snippet - it's not the greatest scene, but it's odd and very sad to see that scene after the funeral in ROTS, since now we know it's coming.
*Qui-Gon's death - particularly when he's talking to Obi-Wan and Obi-Wan starts to cry.

AOTC
*Shmi's death - I really like Hayden's acting in this scene, especially when he says "Stay with me, mom . . . mom . . ." and he realizes there's nothing he can do to stop it. When the psycho music starts up, that gives me chills.
*Clone troopers - when the Imperial March plays for the first time as the senators look at the clones. You know things will never be the same again.

ROTS
*Mace's death - when Anakin makes the wrong decision, leaves the Council chambers, and especially when he cuts off Mace's hand and Mace screams.
*Order 66 - when I saw it for the first time, I was caught off guard. How could this be happening? It's really, incredibly sad to see all the Jedi killed, even Obi-Wan (though we know he's fine later). The saddest part is definitely the younglings.
*Mustafar - pretty much everything after Padme and Obi-Wan arrive, especially the "You were the chosen one!" speech.
*Vader's birth/Padme's death - I thought it was great how these two scenes were intercut, since it adds emotional impact to both of them.
*The finale - the montage of the characters getting settled into their new environments. The Tatooine sequence is the saddest/most emotional, followed closely by the japor snippet.

ANH
*Owen and Beru's death - when Luke sees his dead relatives and realizes what he has to do.
*Death Star destruction - especially when Han returns and yells, "Yahoo!" I love that part.
*R2-D2's return - during the throne room scene, I always choke up when we see R2 in top form after his near-death experience.

ESB
*Yoda's words of wisdom - these are probably the best lines in the whole sage - "I don't believe it." "That is why you fail."
*"I am your father" - nuff said.
*Carbonite - it's all really emotional, particularly when Han says "I know."

ROTJ
*Palpatine - everything between Palpatine, Luke, and Vader is fantastic. "So be it. Jedi." and "Your faith in your friends is yours" are great lines.
*Anakin's return - when Vader sees Palpatine killing his son, that's much more powerful after seeing the Mace ROTS scene, since he made the wrong choice last time and realized he needed to do the right thing this time.
*Anakin unmasked - all the dialogue makes me tear up.
*The celebration - everything about it, pretty much. When Luke torches Vader's armor, everything that has transpired the last 36 years comes down to this. It's really sad and touching, even moreso when the music starts up. Seeing the planets free from the Empire is great. The new music in the final scene really makes it more emotional than the stupid teddy bear song from the 1983 version. Seeing Anakin as a ghost is the most emotional for me, since he fulfilled the prophecy and everything is good once again.

scruffziller
02-26-2006, 04:13 PM
There are several for me. It was more poignant when I watched all six in order, in one day.

TPM
*Japor snippet - it's not the greatest scene, but it's odd and very sad to see that scene after the funeral in ROTS, since now we know it's coming.
*Qui-Gon's death - particularly when he's talking to Obi-Wan and Obi-Wan starts to cry.

AOTC
*Shmi's death - I really like Hayden's acting in this scene, especially when he says "Stay with me, mom . . . mom . . ." and he realizes there's nothing he can do to stop it. When the psycho music starts up, that gives me chills.
*Clone troopers - when the Imperial March plays for the first time as the senators look at the clones. You know things will never be the same again.

ROTS
*Mace's death - when Anakin makes the wrong decision, leaves the Council chambers, and especially when he cuts off Mace's hand and Mace screams.
*Order 66 - when I saw it for the first time, I was caught off guard. How could this be happening? It's really, incredibly sad to see all the Jedi killed, even Obi-Wan (though we know he's fine later). The saddest part is definitely the younglings.
*Mustafar - pretty much everything after Padme and Obi-Wan arrive, especially the "You were the chosen one!" speech.
*Vader's birth/Padme's death - I thought it was great how these two scenes were intercut, since it adds emotional impact to both of them.
*The finale - the montage of the characters getting settled into their new environments. The Tatooine sequence is the saddest/most emotional, followed closely by the japor snippet.

ANH
*Owen and Beru's death - when Luke sees his dead relatives and realizes what he has to do.
*Death Star destruction - especially when Han returns and yells, "Yahoo!" I love that part.
*R2-D2's return - during the throne room scene, I always choke up when we see R2 in top form after his near-death experience.

ESB
*Yoda's words of wisdom - these are probably the best lines in the whole sage - "I don't believe it." "That is why you fail."
*"I am your father" - nuff said.
*Carbonite - it's all really emotional, particularly when Han says "I know."

ROTJ
*Palpatine - everything between Palpatine, Luke, and Vader is fantastic. "So be it. Jedi." and "Your faith in your friends is yours" are great lines.
*Anakin's return - when Vader sees Palpatine killing his son, that's much more powerful after seeing the Mace ROTS scene, since he made the wrong choice last time and realized he needed to do the right thing this time.
*Anakin unmasked - all the dialogue makes me tear up.
*The celebration - everything about it, pretty much. When Luke torches Vader's armor, everything that has transpired the last 36 years comes down to this. It's really sad and touching, even moreso when the music starts up. Seeing the planets free from the Empire is great. The new music in the final scene really makes it more emotional than the stupid teddy bear song from the 1983 version. Seeing Anakin as a ghost is the most emotional for me, since he fulfilled the prophecy and everything is good once again.

{In Slim "Taggert" Pickins' voice} DITTO!!!

Slicker
02-26-2006, 04:26 PM
There aren't very many moments for me. The one that stands out is when the carbonite block hits the ground with that heavy THUD! and you see the look on Leia's face.

bobafrett
02-26-2006, 06:39 PM
Mine was near the end of ROTJ, when Luke is doing the burning of Vaders remains. It really brings fourth the tears, because Luke had just got to see his father, and turns him back to the good side and then loses him within moments. The burning of the remains is so final, there is no bringing him back to life from that point.

Rocketboy
02-26-2006, 11:15 PM
If we're also talkin' PT...
All are from ROTS.
Padme in her apartment and Anakin in the council room. I think the music is a BIG factor in it.
Anakin and the kids in the council room especially when the kid jumps when Anakin ignites his lightsaber.
Obi-Wan and Anakin's exchange on Mustafar just before Anakin burns. Ewan's finest moment of the PT.

2-1B
02-26-2006, 11:52 PM
When Malakili mourns the Rancor.

jjreason
02-27-2006, 01:06 PM
When Malakili mourns the Rancor.

That IS a touching sequence, C Dog. ;)

stillakid
02-27-2006, 01:14 PM
I'm almost 37 and I tear up when I realize how badly Lucas f'd up the saga with the prequels. :cry:

Rogue II
02-27-2006, 01:27 PM
The only scene that even gets me a little is when Anakin leaves his mother in TPM.






Ok, fine, maybe a little when the Ewok dies.

JimJamBonds
02-27-2006, 02:17 PM
Ok, fine, maybe a little when the Ewok dies.

I'd agree with that one, very sad.

JEDIpartner
02-27-2006, 04:41 PM
I just cry at the end of ROTJ because I think it's the crappiest of all the films and I can't believe I sat through it again!! :D

2-1B
02-28-2006, 01:18 AM
I'm almost 37 and I tear up when I realize how badly Lucas f'd up the saga with the prequels. :cry:

I'm surprised you could see through all those tears to the computer screen where you've composed your litany of posts on the matter all these years. lol lol lol

stillakid
02-28-2006, 01:24 AM
I'm surprised you could see through all those tears to the computer screen where you've composed your litany of posts on the matter all these years. lol lol lol

The alcohol helps clear me up long enough to type. :lipsrseal

Devo
02-28-2006, 02:50 PM
Theres a guy over on Spawn.com called GuruAskew who I'd love to see Stillakid take on about the Star Wars prequels. He takes the view that the original's are just as s**t. He's the most competent debater on those boards although he can get a bit abusive. I've engaged him in battle and even thought I may have swayed him when he failed to respond to one of my posts...the old 'my computer crashed' excuse...but I saw him taking another jab at prequel haters a few weeks later.

Incidentally there are some prequel moments which are good IMO. Such as the 'you were the chosen one' bit (although I felt the whole chosen one prophecy was superfluous). It played out well and carries as much oomph as it could considering how crappily developed the Anakin/obi relationship was.

stillakid
02-28-2006, 03:20 PM
Theres a guy over on Spawn.com called GuruAskew who I'd love to see Stillakid take on about the Star Wars prequels. He takes the view that the original's are just as s**t. He's the most competent debater on those boards although he can get a bit abusive. I've engaged him in battle and even thought I may have swayed him when he failed to respond to one of my posts...the old 'my computer crashed' excuse...but I saw him taking another jab at prequel haters a few weeks later.

Incidentally there are some prequel moments which are good IMO. Such as the 'you were the chosen one' bit (although I felt the whole chosen one prophecy was superfluous). It played out well and carries as much oomph as it could considering how crappily developed the Anakin/obi relationship was.\

Because I'm avoiding work I should be doing, I went over to sample GuruAskew's posts. He seems like a reasonable fellow and in the modest random posts I read (in the Lucas is a bad director thread), I tend to agree with him in general. I do disagree with some of his conclusions, but they generally come from a sound foundation. For instance, because he explains it so well I can understand his bias against ROTJ, but his basic assertion that AOTC and ROTS are actually well told stories is bunk. One can argue all day long about details like Jar Jar and Ewoks, but at the end of that day it's the story that matters most. For better or worse, the original films had rock solid stories which didn't conflict with one another. Without exception, the Prequels not only conflicted with the established continuity, but also conflicted with themselves at times. Storywise, the Prequels were a distasterous mess.

That isn't to say that there aren't moments within each of the six films worth getting excited about in some way. But a movie is far more than cool elements. It is the sum of those elements which create a worthy piece of art or not. That GuruAskew guy basically gets it, but his argument peters out when his own prejudice against not-cool-stuff (ie Ewoks) gets in the way.

Devo
02-28-2006, 04:28 PM
I had another look at that thread. I thought I remember exchanging more posts with him on the matter than I actually did...and in fact theres a number of posts of his in the early pages I can't remember reading at all. I'm sure theres maybe 2 or 3 points I made in my last post that he probably did have a decent comeback for. I'm not sure I would have brought up the extent of Lucas's role in Empire Strikes Back had I read his post on that particular issue on page 2. He's more confident in his knowledge of those kind of details than I am. Pity he didn't post again after the calamitous deletion of his huge response as he claimed. He is a good debater like I said, though he does at times come across terribly condescending verging on flaming. I wouldn't be surprised if every other of his posts gets edited by a mod.

El Chuxter
08-12-2010, 01:20 AM
When Inspector Detector asks Racer X if keeping his identity secret is a mistake, and Racer X thinks back on his transformation from Rex Racer and responds, "...it's a mistake I'll have to live with."

JimJamBonds
08-12-2010, 02:55 PM
In less then two weeks I'll be able to comment in this thread.

Bel-Cam Jos
08-13-2010, 09:54 PM
... the purple Smurf bites the tail of the last "regular" one and you wonder if they're gone. :cry: