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Qui-Long Gone
07-09-2006, 12:49 AM
Hasbro has been very good to us....sometimes:

1. After the success of the VOTC series, OTC Jedi Luke, ROTS Dooku, Super-articulated clone tropper and Red Leader Obi-Wan, why haven't all figures enjoyed super-articulation?:frus: :frus:

2. Is it just my loose figures or do the KNEES of many of these super-articulated figs (Sith Dooku, Secura and OTC Luke) suck? I can't get some of these figs to stand without buckling forward....

3. Will we ever see the type of articulation in future figures again? The new Naboo Obi-Wan seems to be a big dissapointment of potential (and besides Evolutions Anakin, will we ever have a chosen-one who can bend his freaking knees?).:sad:

4. If you could rate the top three articulated figures (including VOTC, Evolutions, OTC, etc.) What would they be? Here's my list (shoulders are a big plus):
1. OBI WAN ROTS RED-LEADER
2. (tie) VOTC STORMTROOPER and BIKER SCOUT
3. ROTS CLONE TROOPER

5. If you could rate the top 3 recent let-downs, what would they be?
1. NEW OBI WAN NABOO (thanks for the rehash with soft good cloak Hasbro)
2. NEW LUKE SKYWALKER ESCAPE MOS EISLEY (finally a potentially exciting NEW HOPE Luke who doesn't scare children but is stiffer than Hayden and Portman's 'love scenes' acting....)
3. Every recent MACE WINDU, EMPEROR, and the Battle of Hoth SNOWTROOPER....

Slicker
07-09-2006, 02:46 AM
Yet ANOTHER SA argument.

I'm gonna let this be know from the beginning. This little rant has NOTHING to do with you GLG.

I am utterly sick of this damn "why can't EVERY figure be SA BS". Hasbro made the biggest mistake of there life by introducing the SA Clone in the Clone Wars line. Now every damn figure just HAS to be SA.:rolleyes:

Let me ask a question to all of the SA proponents.

Do you play with said SA figures everyday? Do you put them in a different pose everyday? If you don't then you don't need every figure to have SA. I remember that I made a Dengar figure into a pose that I wanted (from ESB with him holding his rifle) for a specific scene. If you don't get the "SA figure of your dreams" just make him.

People constantly complain about Hasbros high prices yet they want EVERY figure to be SA. You've gotta make a comprimise somewhere people. Look back in the day in the POTF2 days. We had a whopping 6 POA and we were happy. So just be happy with what you've got for now and just remember that Hasbro has got the liscense for another 12 years so you'll no doubts get every figure in SA that you've ever wanted so JUST BE PATIENT.!!!

TheCivilCollector
07-09-2006, 04:06 AM
Personally, I don't like too much articulation. If the figs were a more rigid plastic like 3 3/4 Joes, it wouldn't be an issue, but SA makes Star Wars figs feel too flimsy. I like a "semi-action" pose for figs, and a neutral pose for pilots and the like so they fit into vehicles.

Knee bends are cool for some figs, but I thought some of the ROTS line went over the top. Aayla Secula can hardly stand up. I WAAAAYYYYY prefer the first version, even though the legs are spread a bit too wide (nothing pervy intended).

I don't care much for soft good cloaks, either. It makes sense for figures so they can fit better in vehicles, but that's it. On a display shelf, molded capes look so much nicer. I hate the flimsy fabric they're giving us with the new Vaders.

plasticfetish
07-09-2006, 05:31 AM
Do you play with said SA figures everyday? Do you put them in a different pose everyday? If you don't then you don't need every figure to have SA.You know, if your point is that people need to be reasonable when they're being critical of a figure, then you're right. Some figures don't need to be and probably can't be "super articulated." On the other hand, if we're looking at a figure and we're debating it's quality, then something we're bound to talk about is the articulation. It's part of the overall design and it effects the play value... which is what toys are all about. It's not that every figure "has to be" SA, it's just that if the option is there and it'll help to make for a better toy, then you kind of need to ask, why not?


People constantly complain about Hasbro's high prices yet they want EVERY figure to be SA. You've gotta make a compromise somewhere people.Balancing cost, design and quality is obviously the big challenge for Hasbro. It's not crazy for us to discuss whether or not they've done their best, and if we're getting the most for our money. It's pretty well known that Hasbro will try to cut corners whenever they can in order to make a bigger profit. There's nothing wrong with that, but there are smart ways to do it and dumb ways. I happen to think the reworked Battle of Hoth Snowtrooper that Qui-Long Gone mentioned wasn't terrible, but for the money, I'd sure have liked something better. (They tried to make up for past mistakes by making some new ones, which really messed it up.)


Look back in the day in the POTF2 days. We had a whopping 6 POA and we were happy. So just be happy with what you've got for now and just remember that Hasbro has got the license for another 12 years so......so all the more reason to let them know when we do or don't like something. I don't know that I'd say I was "happy" with a lot of the POTF2 stuff (mostly it sucked I think), but we didn't have anything other than the vintage stuff to compare it to. So yeah, Hasbro has raised their own bar by showing us that they're now capable of producing a really great looking, well built and fun to play with (possibly highly articulated) figure for a decent price. If they do otherwise, it's no surprise that they're gonna take some heat for either cutting corners or making bad choices.

If the figs were a more rigid plastic like 3 3/4 Joes, it wouldn't be an issue, but SA makes Star Wars figs feel too flimsy.That's always my biggest beef with these figures, and mostly it's that the plastic quality seems to fluctuate pretty wildly. I was just playing around with the Hem Dazon figure -- thinking about how bendy the plastic is and how other than that (and the crummy little blaster), I don't have much of a problem with it. He's got some really smart articulation I think, but again, looking at the figure as a whole he's not perfect.

I don't know that I expect "perfection" from Hasbro though. If they can manage to squeak out a few really good figures every year for the next 10 years or so, then they'll have done just fine by me.

Darth Cruel
07-09-2006, 07:35 AM
I want super articulation. And I have not seen one articulation opponent come up with a good argument for the figures' not having it. Yes, I play with mine...no not every day...but I do like to set them up in different ways VERY frequently. You anti-articulation collectors have every right to not care about having the articulation. And we proponents have every right to want it. But I wonder about the necessity for posting such angry messages in articulation threads. I don't care what it costs. If I want statues...I'll buy statues. I want ACTION figures. ACTION, to me, equals articulation.

I do understand how some people feel about things they don't find to be important. I don't care about things like the figure looking like Mark Hamill or Harrison Ford or Carrie Fisher...they are just actors, not the characters. So, to me, Hasbro could also save money by not needing to buy the actors' likenesses and they could still do the character justice. I also don't want the pack-ins that I have no use for like "holo" figuines, coins, and stands. But I am glad I don't get angry and attack the opponents of my opinion.

El Chuxter
07-09-2006, 11:08 AM
If you want to shut Slicker up, just insert the words "Slicker's mom" into any bad joke you can come up with.

dindae
07-09-2006, 11:41 AM
The only arguement againt articulation is money. It cost money to mold and assemble a figure. Every time there is a point of articulation that is another seperate piece that has to be manufactered seprately, painteed seperately and put together when the figure is finished. So when Hasbro is making a wave of figure they look at the wave and budget from there (they stated as much in one of the Q&A). So they have 12 figures in a case and have a set price they sell it for. So like a salary cap in football they have to figure where they are going to spend their money. If they include a SA clone thats 25 pieces of plastic that have to be made seperately, they save a little money on the mold since they already made one but it takes a lot of room/manpower/cost on the factory floor. So how do you balance that, you throw in a Holo Ki Adi Mundi but instead of the newer mold use the Episode one mold because he is after all a hologram and it isn't that important of a figure and it only has 9 pieces to make. And because I know its coming "But Marvel Legends can do it". Yes they do do it but they don't have as limited of runs as Hasbro does so they have more time to recoup the cost. They get in an average of 3 waves of figures a year. Hasbro passes that in April. But that's just my take on things any resemblance to reality is merely coincidental.

TheCivilCollector
07-09-2006, 01:24 PM
I don't care about things like the figure looking like Mark Hamill or Harrison Ford or Carrie Fisher...they are just actors, not the characters. So, to me, Hasbro could also save money by not needing to buy the actors' likenesses and they could still do the character justice.

Blasphemy!!! ;)

Qui-Long Gone
07-09-2006, 04:21 PM
Yet ANOTHER SA argument.

I'm gonna let this be know from the beginning. This little rant has NOTHING to do with you GLG.

I am utterly sick of this damn "why can't EVERY figure be SA BS". Hasbro made the biggest mistake of there life by introducing the SA Clone in the Clone Wars line. Now every damn figure just HAS to be SA.:rolleyes:


:whip: Chill bro....just answer the freaking questions, especially 2, 4 and 5 (see original thread).

[QUOTE] Let me ask a question to all of the SA proponents.

Do you play with said SA figures everyday? Do you put them in a different pose everyday?

Answer: Yes, except on Weekends...again, just answer the freaking questions, see 2, 4, and 5 of orignal thread..



People constantly complain about Hasbros high prices yet they want EVERY figure to be SA. You've gotta make a comprimise somewhere people. Look back in the day in the POTF2 days. We had a whopping 6 POA and we were happy. So just be happy with what you've got for now and just remember that Hasbro has got the liscense for another 12 years so you'll no doubts get every figure in SA that you've ever wanted so JUST BE PATIENT.!!!

Of course we were happy with POTF2 days and Vintage days, but if we can make a kung-fu kicking Tatooine Ambush Anakin and other 'gimmick' figures, surely we can afford SA for all figs?

COMMANDERCODY2795
07-15-2006, 06:37 PM
i hated the rots mace and anakain. they should have taken the red leader obi-wan and added anakain and mace heads then repaint the robes. voila, you have 3 super articulated jedi, the standard obi-wan, anakain, and mace. all are reaady for some droid killin' action.

Devo
07-15-2006, 07:19 PM
Best articulated figures:

1) VTSC Biker Scout
2) VOTC Chewbacca
3) ROTS Count Dooku (better than pilot Obi-wan, amazed more people don't think so)

COMMANDERCODY2795
07-15-2006, 08:20 PM
not really, the count dooku is a great ffigure, dont get me wrong, its just the pilot obi-wan has more articuklation s its has more play value.

Qui-Long Gone
07-15-2006, 08:28 PM
i hated the rots mace and anakain. they should have taken the red leader obi-wan and added anakain and mace heads then repaint the robes. voila, you have 3 super articulated jedi, the standard obi-wan, anakain, and mace. all are reaady for some droid killin' action.

I also can't figure out why Palpatine's characters are so stiff? He's in two MAJOR fights with Mace and Yoda and yet his action figures do nothing but look creepy....Mace has been an especially wasted figure in all three film incarnations...Even though the new one with his purple clones has a robe, it's just a rework of the ROTS...

Devo
07-16-2006, 07:51 PM
The problem I have with Pilot Obi-wan is that although the ball-jointed shoulders are present and accounted for his tunic prevents them from being as effective as they are on ROTS Dooku. The only two-handed lightsaber pose he is capable of is one where he holds it close to his chest. Dooku can do just about anything with a lightsaber including defend, attack and pose neutrally. Better play value on Obi-wan? Nah. To my mind the only thing pilot Obi-wan has on Dooku is the waist - but its not something I miss terribly, not when its compensated for by such a great range of arm movement.

This is why I stress that Hasbro should study ROTS Dooku when planning future lightsaber duelling figures (like Bespin and DSII Luke). People keep mentioning pilot Obi-wan and I keep trying to remind them that, great as that figure is, its crap as a lightsaber fighting figure. Mainly it just looks pretty.

El Chuxter
07-16-2006, 07:53 PM
Personally, articulation or no, I think Pilot Obi-Wan's legs look like toothpicks. They're too skinny and lacking in detail.

General_Grievous
07-17-2006, 01:02 AM
I like articulation, but it's not a neccessity to me. But then again, I don't want pre-posed statues like the first AOTC figures. Remember how bad most of those were?

TheCivilCollector
07-17-2006, 01:23 AM
Gotta agree with you there-

I like some reasonable "action pose", but Luminari Unduli (sp?) and Eeth Koth (1st relase) wre pretty much statues. To be fair, they look pretty cool on the shelf, but that's it.

Qui-Long Gone
07-17-2006, 01:34 AM
I only have one problem with ROTS Dooku: Legs, no ankle articulation, and the knees give me fits...also his tunic creates some challenges....:rolleyes:

I like the arm action especially, the soft cape works well-enough and the likeness is stellar...I wish his left hand could interchange with another that can grip....sort of like the interchangable Sith Evolutions hands....he looks like he wants to send lighting but pauses....also, sometimes the saber doesn't want to stay in his right hand....:rolleyes:

Obi can't do too much saber action, and his legs are toothpicks...but it's still the best Kenobi ever....if there was one thing for me that made Dooku better than Kenobi it's the neck....the back of Obi's head looks funky with the loose head action....I only like that feature on Clones and Troopers....

Banthaholic
07-17-2006, 01:35 AM
Yet ANOTHER SA argument.

I'm gonna let this be know from the beginning. This little rant has NOTHING to do with you GLG.

I am utterly sick of this damn "why can't EVERY figure be SA BS". Hasbro made the biggest mistake of there life by introducing the SA Clone in the Clone Wars line. Now every damn figure just HAS to be SA.:rolleyes:

Let me ask a question to all of the SA proponents.

Do you play with said SA figures everyday? Do you put them in a different pose everyday? If you don't then you don't need every figure to have SA. I remember that I made a Dengar figure into a pose that I wanted (from ESB with him holding his rifle) for a specific scene. If you don't get the "SA figure of your dreams" just make him.

People constantly complain about Hasbros high prices yet they want EVERY figure to be SA. You've gotta make a comprimise somewhere people. Look back in the day in the POTF2 days. We had a whopping 6 POA and we were happy. So just be happy with what you've got for now and just remember that Hasbro has got the liscense for another 12 years so you'll no doubts get every figure in SA that you've ever wanted so JUST BE PATIENT.!!!
I couldn't agree with you more.

I was a vintage kid, we had 5 POA. It seems that after the SA CW clone every wish list I see is flooded with SA requests for figures that don't even make sense.

I'm in favor of getting figures that provide the best amount of articulaion that money can produce, but I'm not going to rant on a figure for a lack of it.

Devo
07-17-2006, 02:26 PM
if there was one thing for me that made Dooku better than Kenobi it's the neck....the back of Obi's head looks funky with the loose head action....I only like that feature on Clones and Troopers....

!!!!!Thank you!!!!!!! Ball-jointed necks on figures who don't wear helmets suck! I agree that Obi's head is spoiled by this feature. Great likeness that is sadly almost botched with how silly the back of his head looks. VTSC X-wing Luke's head is likewise ruined by the balljoint neck. The hair looks so ridiculous its not funny and the facial likeness isn't good enough to redeem it.

VOTC Han is held by many as the definitive Han figure - not for me. Why? The ball-joint neck. His jawline is ruined and his hair is too short. Also the figure is stupidly skinny. I still prefer Commtech Han or Death star escape Han. The TSC tattoine wave Luke and Han figures were, ironically considering they are primarily rehashes, a breath of fresh air for me because they have normal swivel necks (although Hans hair is still too short and Lukes is too dark).

Darth Cruel
07-17-2006, 02:39 PM
Best articulated figures:

1) VTSC Biker Scout
2) VOTC Chewbacca
3) ROTS Count Dooku (better than pilot Obi-wan, amazed more people don't think so)

My own opinion is that any SA clone dogs ALL of these AND all other figures.


Look back in the day in the POTF2 days. We had a whopping 6 POA and we were happy.

I know it's not me, but who exactly are you speaking for when you say "we"? I know I have been complaining about articulation since 1977 when I put my Star Wars figures next to my Micronauts (and G.I. Joes, but not to the same extent) and wondered why Kenner thought it was OK to make it necessary to raise the Stormtroopers arm up so high just to level his blaster.

Devo
07-17-2006, 03:20 PM
In terms of the amounts of POA and the range of movement they allow the clones might be the best. Their wider spaced legs makes them a little better suited to action poses than VOTC stormtroopers. Beyond that though it comes down to ones preferance for whichever character.

I prefer OT troopers and OT characters in general. I had to give a vote to ROTS Dooku though. Such a cool figure and one of the best PT characters, wasted though he ended up being in ROTS.

Darth Cruel
07-17-2006, 03:43 PM
Dooku? One of the best PT characters?

EEEWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"It is obvious this contest will not be decided
by our knowledge of the Force, but by our skills with a
lightsaber."

This has to be the corniest line in the entire 6 movie saga (and the saga is replete with corny lines). But, this is a discussion for another thread.

Devo
07-17-2006, 03:55 PM
Huh. Funny, that line didn't stand out for me as being headslappingly bad or badly placed. My vote would go for 'From my point of view the jedi are evil' as delivered by Anakin....in the midst of a furious lightsaber fight over an ocean of lava...and Anakin, who should have been the best character in the saga ends up being the worst IMO. But as you say, another thread.

Articulation is lovely where Hasbro is willing to put it but I too don't go mental if Elis Helrot doesn't have balljointed shoulders, elbows and knees.

Darth Cruel
07-31-2006, 07:15 PM
I just want to drop a few examples of why I like articulation.

Darth Cruel
07-31-2006, 07:17 PM
And a couple more

Devo
08-01-2006, 02:15 PM
Cool. I ordered 2 501st Stormtroopers from r2dtoys. That flag looks really nifty. I'll probably display these either leading stormtrooper squads or flanking a Vader figure.

Darth Cruel
08-01-2006, 02:31 PM
Both cool ideas. After I got the Shadow Stormtrooper, he became my favorite Stormtrooper. Not because he is more articulated than the others, he, the 501st, and the VOTC Trooper are the same. But his legs were not knock-kneed. So he looks better standing. And I suppose you have to add in that black IS my favorite color.

Devo
08-01-2006, 02:45 PM
I haven't decided on the Shadow stormie just yet. Well it hasn't become available on r2dtoys. I may get it - put it this way if I decide to buy it I'll buy no fewer than 2. I'm not sure what context I'd put them in though. Maybe an EU segment of the Emperors arrival scene but I'd probably need more than 2 for that.