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View Full Version : Hasbro does want to make a large Death Star playset



Tycho
08-06-2006, 02:32 PM
I read this in YodaNews' Q&A:

Yodasnews: Do you think it would be possible for you to bring out a huge half of a death star play set unlike the original vintage one? Sure we know play sets don't sell as well but if you produced it in a small quantity and made it exclusive to online retailers like the imperial shuttle I am sure the collectors would pay big money for this item. Heck even I would pay a couple of hundred dollars for a death star play set that actually seemed to be more accurate in size.



Hasbro: Good question and one which we are always looking at. You answered the question yourself, though, by saying that we'd produce small quantities and have to charge a lot for it. That by definition is a very risky niche product with a massive R&D burden and tooling budget. Quite simply we have to find mass-market solutions to massively intensive R&D challenges like play sets. By the way, we've got mocked up in the office three versions of the very play set you describe.

I'd love to see what they have as mock-ups, wouldn't you? Just a featurette on the Hasbro offices like Hyperspace's tour of Rancho Obi-Wan (Sansweet's place) would be awesome. They can state in picture captions over-and-over again that Hasbro has no plans to produce the Death Star at this time - but it is sweet that they are looking into various directions to test its feasability.

I wonder if in the end, Hasbro will opt to create its own high-end division, and make $2-500 "toys" like the Death Star, a Star Destroyer, etc (or charge even more for them) in light of the collector market and Gentle Giant, SideShow, and Master Replicas being very successful in that niche. I'm willing to bet that 90% or more of SS, GG, and MR's customers have a Hasbro action figure collection for Star Wars too. If they're willing to spend so much on FX Lightsabers and a nearly $400 Jabba diorama for 12" figures - they'll buy a (GOOD QUALITY) playset from Hasbro for its action figures at those high prices and Hasbro can do a limited amount, take the necessary steps to do a pre-sell, etc. All they are doing by not offering it, is short-changing themselves on the fun they'd have in selling it, let alone mentioning the revenue. Yeah, so they're an Ages 4 & Up toy company? Any company can expand their markets. Don't beer and cigarette companies offer clothing? Albeit it's advertising, but if Hasbro made a darn Death Star, wouldn't that be advertising an invitation for all of us to buy tons of Imperials to fill it with?

Change with the market and adapt. ROTS might have been ages 4 & Up, but in 2017 with a year left to go with the current license, the reality Hasbro will face is that Star Wars fans will be ages 35 & Up or something like that. - Perhaps the children of Hasbro's "current children" will want their first Luke Tatooine then, but Daddy will surely want to buy the Death Star and keep Junior's paws off of it! Hehe.

maatu
08-06-2006, 02:45 PM
tycho, that's cool that hasbro is listening. maybe they can break it down into 3 sections and have different toy websites sell it as an exclusive.

Tycho
08-06-2006, 02:51 PM
I don't think it's that "they are listening," but rather the SW team is composed of creative fanboys just like us in many ways, but they are not brilliant marketing strategists.

So they'd like to make things like a 9 foot Star Destroyer, and surely are capable of constructing a prototype for it - but they are limited by narrow-thinking that they must remain in the retail toy business for children.

I just said it before, that eventually Star Wars will be an "Age 35 & Up" property. Of course the kids' kids might get into it when Dad breaks out the "ancient technology of DVD players - you know before we had holodecks."

But a return to Galactic Heroes and Force Battlers might appease that interest right there.

TheDarthVader
08-07-2006, 10:48 AM
FOR SURE! I'd buy a really big expensive death star playset if it looked good. I am going to doubt that Hasbro will ever release a DS playset though. They don't seem too interested in producing it. :(

DarthQuack
08-07-2006, 11:10 AM
I think we'd all buy one, for the most part anyways.

Tycho
08-07-2006, 11:45 AM
I am going to doubt that Hasbro will ever release a DS playset though. They don't seem too interested in producing it. :(

Like I said:

1) they have the fanboy interest in producing it

2) they don't have a business plan that creates an interest for offering it - they're in business to make money for their share holders to a large extent

Once upon a time, someone (probably named Mr. Hasbro) decided they liked toys and wanted to open a toy company.

To raise money to start the business, they took out loans and sold stock when they could. The stock was a much cheaper way to accumulate capital for the young company, than paying interest on loans (bonds).

Well, Mr. Hasbro is probably dead. The company kept a life of its own, somewhat immortal.

To run the company, professionals with experience making profits were brought on board, or Mr. Hasbro's vision of making toys would never have survived through a bankruptcy (I don't know if it ever did, but it certainly avoided bankruptcy by being profitable).

To design, engineer, and paint the toys, enthusiasts were hired. These enthusiasts work on the Star Wars line, including Darrel, Brian, Mark, etc. I'm sure their enthusiastic about a giant Death Star Playset and would want to test their abilities making one, even (that's why there are 3 prototypes in the Hasbro office, no doubt. I know "X-wing Mark" probably wanted to see if he could build one. It would fit his personality.

The people hired as Darrel's, Mark's, and Brian's bosses however, want to see how this giant Death Star will make Hasbro more profitable. They may not be as into Star Wars and just see SW as a way for Hasbro to increase their stock-worth.

That's fine. But they are limiting their thinking in narrow-mindedly deciding that Hasbro is a children's toy company for approximately ages 3-12 or somewhere around there.

Master Replicas, SideShow, and Gentle Giant believe they are a "toy company" for ages 15-50 or somewhere around there.

Hasbro is sacraficing some profit they could claim by ignoring products for the older age group. I say with all compliments as my intention, that Steve Sansweet or Rebelscum's Phillip Wise are about 50-year old children. Hey, when I get that age, (if I live so long), I still plan on being a child.

Hasbro needs to do what it takes to have employs responsible for:

- a pre-order program like SideShow is doing - I mean do you really think 5-10,000 Jabba the Hutt 12" Collectibles are already made in a warehouse somewhere? Of course not. They'll put that in production probably only as early as October - if not more likely, later than that- as they will have had time to gauge the demand for him. Right now, they can probably still say "Nope. We're not making him. Not enough people wanted to pay $350+ for this item, so we can't do it. Your pre-orders will not be charged to your accounts." But Hasbro wants to only do the R&D for a product and so forth, if they are garaunteed Target and Wal-Mart will mass-order from them.

I call it lazy when they forgo the potential they could make by catering to their adult crowd. Yeah: I know very few kids, if any, will be allowed to have a Death Star as big as a computer desk (or bigger), let alone some 9ft. Star Destroyer - but people like us (and Steve Sansweet) would buy it. Why prevent the product from ever being made? Or give Code 3 or Attikus the money for making it, when the intention is for it to be used with Hasbro's figures, thereby increasing the figure sales for Hasbro anyway. (Not even JediMasterSal has enough stormtroopers to deal with Hasbro actually making a good Death Star Playset).

Is the principal of being a toy company for 3-12 year olds more important than being a profitable company? You'd think because of Hasbro's decisions in the past that it is not.

However, Derryl, Mark, & Brian and friends don't get to decide that I'm afraid.
Unfortunately, I think those 3 and a few others on the inside of the Star Wars team might be the only ones who read these boards. The CFO's etc. probably don't even know SSG exists.

Unfortunately, that means that the boys at Hasbro that we know are probably on our side with most things (perhaps not Wilrow and Yarna, hehe) but yelling at them, or criticizing them, just hurts them personally and does nothing to change Hasbro policy with the people who actually define Hasbro policy.

dindae
08-07-2006, 12:43 PM
Yeah that's pretty much the way I see things Tycho. The Hasbro juggernaut is not consernered with chasing the relatively small profit from mail order playsets even though the amount of goodwill that it would generate with collectors would be huge. I know that there are a lot of very cool things that could be done on a smaller more expensive scale. (Although given that my budget for starwars is going to be blown out of the water by the end of 2006 so I'm happy that they aren't in a way).

Darth Cruel
08-07-2006, 01:03 PM
Maybe I am reading it wrong, but the way I read it. Hasbro has no desire (as a company) to make it. Sounds to me like it is just some of the employees who want to see it made. But my opinion is only based on the one quote.

Edit - Oh yeah...and I would buy at least two at ANY price!

Dark Marble
08-07-2006, 01:34 PM
You know, I really have to say that if some other company like Gentle Giant or Sideshow made the playset, I would expect it to be a high end high priced display. But if Hasbro makes it the cost should be lower and kids should be the focus.

Sometimes it seems that we forget that Hasbro is making toys and not mini-statues or collectibles. When I am buying my toys, mostly for me and my kids, I have no desire to spend a few hundred dollars on a playset or pieces of a playset I have to track down.

Lately I am very pleased with Hasbro's decisions and the product they are releasing. We are getting a ton of toys that will be hefty enough on the wallet with out having to worry about the $200 to $300 Death Star playset. I say for high end pieces let sideshow have them. I just want my Star Wars toys with little ships that shoot little missles and lightsabers my kids can bang together.

Tycho
08-07-2006, 01:56 PM
Yeah, but if Hasbro made a $250+ Death Star Playset:

1) No one is forcing you to buy it. Be an enthusiast rather than a collector of everything. The recent re-cardings should have convinced you of that.

2) Buy it for yourself and keep your kids away from it unless they could be taught to respect it. Or don't buy one in its initial offering, and wait until your kids are older if you're concerned about the safety of something you spend too much on.

3) Hasbro does not have to abandon making kid-friendly toys - they can just make adult SW afficianado items as well - and only a few of them.

4) SideShows stuff need not be tracked down. You can go to SideShowToys.com and get whatever you need during its offering period. Hasbro can open pre-orders for something like a high end piece and keep it open until they have received enough orders to satisfy their forecasts for interest in an item, and/or until a previously announced time and date. You won't have trouble getting this if you want it. Pre-Orders are not charged either (by most companies). SideShow notifies you when they expect to authorize your account, when they expect to ship your item, and when you should expect to receive it. Whether modular or sold as one giant set, a large Death Star, Cloud City, Ewok Village, Endor Shield Generator, Jabba's Palace, Theed Palace, Kamino Clone Labs, Geonosis Droid Foundry, Galactic Senate, whatever - it would all be easy enough to come by if you wanted it.

joe-da
08-07-2006, 02:55 PM
Or a Wampa Cave playset!

JON9000
08-07-2006, 03:34 PM
What do you think you would get for $250? (which is realistically what it would have to be around for it to be feasible). Remember how much the Shuttle, AT-AT, and Queen's Starship cost, the Attackus hanger costs, and tell me what you think you can get and if it would satisfy you.

dindae
08-07-2006, 04:21 PM
I would say something about the same size and features of the vintage one but better detail. Would I be happy to spend $250? I wouldn't think it was the smartest buy but I would hope I would like the piece itself. If they cut corners and put out a big turd it wouldn't work. I would be more excited on what they would be able to do with ship. My list of playsets would be shorter than Tycho's. Jabba's Palace and Cantina would be the ones I could see being the largest. However there could be smaller more boring pieces like the Lars Homestead and Palpatine office could just be a table, a door, and maybe a breakout window and sell for $40. These are things that would tank in mass market but at a limit scale would be cool. Pride Displays can do it but since they can't produce "playsets" they have to merge scenes which ruin the pieces to me. They produced 3000 units and they sold on EE for $60.00 and that included 50 stands (cost 13 pounds). If that ditched the stands and increased the unit run to 5000 Hasbro could do them for $40. I'm probably in the minority but with a run of 5000 I don't that would be an issue.

Darth Cruel
08-07-2006, 04:44 PM
You know, I really have to say that if some other company like Gentle Giant or Sideshow made the playset, I would expect it to be a high end high priced display. But if Hasbro makes it the cost should be lower and kids should be the focus.

Sometimes it seems that we forget that Hasbro is making toys and not mini-statues or collectibles. When I am buying my toys, mostly for me and my kids, I have no desire to spend a few hundred dollars on a playset or pieces of a playset I have to track down.

Lately I am very pleased with Hasbro's decisions and the product they are releasing. We are getting a ton of toys that will be hefty enough on the wallet with out having to worry about the $200 to $300 Death Star playset. I say for high end pieces let sideshow have them. I just want my Star Wars toys with little ships that shoot little missles and lightsabers my kids can bang together.

Dark Marble - You can have all that AND we can have our 750-1250 dollar Death Star (200-300 dollars worth of Death Star could not possibly be big enough). And Hasbro is making toys alright, but toys that collectors have been collecting for a long enough time that the line is geared partially toward them.

That being said, it really is a moot point and senseless to even debate the pros and cons as Hasbro has no intention of making one for us. They are plenty smart enough to know that if they made it affordable...it would suck and not enough people would buy it. And if they made it well...it would be expensive and not enough people would buy it.

But if they do...I want 2 of the 1250.00 version.

DarthQuack
08-07-2006, 04:55 PM
Or a Wampa Cave playset!

Sign me up for one! :)

Tycho
08-07-2006, 05:08 PM
Then someone answer how Attikus is staying in business? SideShow with a massive Jabba the Hutt set? Master Replicas with a Falcon you need to buy a new house for?

I've seen this stuff in person (not the Attikus - was that at Comic Con somewhere?), and ordered the Jabba myself.

El Chuxter
08-07-2006, 05:16 PM
Sad thing is, I think it's too late. For those of us who've been collecting since the beginning, where would such a large piece go? I'm not looking forward to dropping triple-digit money on yet another large piece to sit in the box because there's no room for it.

Darth Cruel
08-07-2006, 05:37 PM
Sad thing is, I think it's too late. For those of us who've been collecting since the beginning, where would such a large piece go? I'm not looking forward to dropping triple-digit money on yet another large piece to sit in the box because there's no room for it.

I have a storage unit in case i run out of room I can move my family in to it.

Turbowars
08-07-2006, 06:16 PM
Face it guys, a large play set will not happen. Besides I wouldn't buy it anyways. I'm growing out of ships and I have never really cared for playset, well at least not Hasbros. They are so kid focused they look silly. Just look at the AOTC dog crap playset. Hey kid! have you even wanted to play with a huge pile of dog crap? Well now you can with our new AOTC arena!:thumbsup:

C5Jedi
08-07-2006, 06:24 PM
Like I said:



2) - they're in business to make money for their share holders to a large extent

But they are limiting their thinking in narrow-mindedly deciding that Hasbro is a children's toy company for approximately ages 3-12 or somewhere around there.
.

That's why Hasbro had it sales go down this past year. Not making what the consumer wants.

Would love to buy a death star playset but they won't make one.


Just got back from seeing the latest SW figure wave in the stores - The Greatest battles collection which is more old figures repackaged. Without steller new product rather than repackaged items, I'm about ready to stop collecting Hasbro period - that says a lot after collecting since the original early bird kit in the Kenner days...


Too bad they can't license out permission to someone like a Sideshow/Master Replicas to create Special Edition items like a Death Star Playset.

They just don't get it and I fear they never will.

Blue2th
08-07-2006, 06:26 PM
I would buy one. They just need to make the details better like they are doing with the figures lately. Market it to adult collectors as an exclusive online. They would have to charge more to make it feasable. Do a limited run with a pre-order like Sideshow with an exclusive figure for the first 2500 or something.

JON9000
08-08-2006, 03:51 AM
Honestly, part of the fun of action figure playing is using "stand-ins" for things as large as the death star or beggar's canyon. When I was little, dad's stereo system was the death star the space between the twin beds was my canyon. Endor was outside, as was hoth in the winter.

The needs of kids and adults are different. Kids want to play, adults want something that looks cool to set up their little men in. I can see Hasbro putting out a $1,000 piece, and the guys around here still deciding it sucks because of "crappy action features" or the scale being off on something, or them leaving out a particular room. Then Hasbro is stuck holding the bag.

Would you guys be willing to sign up for a $1000 limited run product sight unseen? This is why I don't purchase sideshow stuff. Until you see it in person, you just cannot tell. The 1:4 Leia looks great on the website, but unpack her and see it you can get the creases out of her gown.

JediTricks
08-08-2006, 02:10 PM
Once upon a time, someone (probably named Mr. Hasbro) decided they liked toys and wanted to open a toy company.

To raise money to start the business, they took out loans and sold stock when they could. The stock was a much cheaper way to accumulate capital for the young company, than paying interest on loans (bonds).

Well, Mr. Hasbro is probably dead. The company kept a life of its own, somewhat immortal.

To run the company, professionals with experience making profits were brought on board, or Mr. Hasbro's vision of making toys would never have survived through a bankruptcy (I don't know if it ever did, but it certainly avoided bankruptcy by being profitable).

To design, engineer, and paint the toys, enthusiasts were hired. These enthusiasts work on the Star Wars line, including Darrel, Brian, Mark, etc. I'm sure their enthusiastic about a giant Death Star Playset and would want to test their abilities making one, even (that's why there are 3 prototypes in the Hasbro office, no doubt. I know "X-wing Mark" probably wanted to see if he could build one. It would fit his personality.

The people hired as Darrel's, Mark's, and Brian's bosses however, want to see how this giant Death Star will make Hasbro more profitable. They may not be as into Star Wars and just see SW as a way for Hasbro to increase their stock-worth.

That's fine. But they are limiting their thinking in narrow-mindedly deciding that Hasbro is a children's toy company for approximately ages 3-12 or somewhere around there.

Master Replicas, SideShow, and Gentle Giant believe they are a "toy company" for ages 15-50 or somewhere around there.

Hasbro is sacraficing some profit they could claim by ignoring products for the older age group. I say with all compliments as my intention, that Steve Sansweet or Rebelscum's Phillip Wise are about 50-year old children. Hey, when I get that age, (if I live so long), I still plan on being a child.


Master Replicas, SideShow, and Gentle Giant believe they are a "toy company" for ages 15-50 or somewhere around there.

Hasbro is sacraficing some profit they could claim by ignoring products for the older age group. I say with all compliments as my intention, that Steve Sansweet or Rebelscum's Phillip Wise are about 50-year old children. Hey, when I get that age, (if I live so long), I still plan on being a child.

Hasbro needs to do what it takes to have employs responsible for:

- a pre-order program like SideShow is doing - I mean do you really think 5-10,000 Jabba the Hutt 12" Collectibles are already made in a warehouse somewhere? Of course not. They'll put that in production probably only as early as October - if not more likely, later than that- as they will have had time to gauge the demand for him. Right now, they can probably still say "Nope. We're not making him. Not enough people wanted to pay $350+ for this item, so we can't do it. Your pre-orders will not be charged to your accounts." But Hasbro wants to only do the R&D for a product and so forth, if they are garaunteed Target and Wal-Mart will mass-order from them.

I call it lazy when they forgo the potential they could make by catering to their adult crowd. Yeah: I know very few kids, if any, will be allowed to have a Death Star as big as a computer desk (or bigger), let alone some 9ft. Star Destroyer - but people like us (and Steve Sansweet) would buy it. Why prevent the product from ever being made? Or give Code 3 or Attikus the money for making it, when the intention is for it to be used with Hasbro's figures, thereby increasing the figure sales for Hasbro anyway. (Not even JediMasterSal has enough stormtroopers to deal with Hasbro actually making a good Death Star Playset).

Is the principal of being a toy company for 3-12 year olds more important than being a profitable company? You'd think because of Hasbro's decisions in the past that it is not.

However, Derryl, Mark, & Brian and friends don't get to decide that I'm afraid.
Unfortunately, I think those 3 and a few others on the inside of the Star Wars team might be the only ones who read these boards. The CFO's etc. probably don't even know SSG exists.

Unfortunately, that means that the boys at Hasbro that we know are probably on our side with most things (perhaps not Wilrow and Yarna, hehe) but yelling at them, or criticizing them, just hurts them personally and does nothing to change Hasbro policy with the people who actually define Hasbro policy.Helal and Henry Hassenfeld, the Hassenfeld brothers, started their company as a textiles manufacturing business, then moved on to school supplies. Henry's son Merrill eventually was made president of the company and expanded their product line to children's art supplies and make-believe doctor and nurse kits. George Lerner invented a toy around that time known as Mr Potato-Head and was sold to a breakfast cereal company who offered the various parts (kids supplied their own potatoes) in their cereal boxes, buy a bunch of boxes of cereal and get all the parts - this failed and the rights were then bought back by the owner and sold to Hasbro, who marketed it on the new television fad which made it a huge hit. Over a decade later, Hasbro finally invented GI Joe, a boy's doll (a phrase they knew wouldn't fly, so they came up with "action figure" instead) originally with the same doll market mentality, sell the kids a doll then sell them dozens of outfits and accessories. 4 years later, the company finally officially changed its name to Hasbro Industries and took the company public, trading on the American Stock Exchange.

As you can see, Hasbro started totally different than what you imagined, they did not sell stock originally, they did not manufacture toys for their first 20 years, did not really focus on toys for 40 years, the company was started to make the Hassenfeld family some coin, pure and simple, profits were more important to Hasbro than toys, always has been, there was no vision of making toys until the second generation of Hassenfelds took over, and even then it was a slim interest at best. Profits have always been the chief interest for Hasbro as a company, they've been very profitable at making toys so that's what they make now, but don't fool yourself, they still know where the real money is at and how to keep themselves in business. Being profitable is job 1, and Hasbro's business model makes the most money catering to that 3-to-12 age range, not the nickels and dimes the adult toy brands make.

I have no idea if Master Replicas or Sideshow Collectibles are profitable, I do know that they make great products that are very expensive and are certainly not "toys". Sideshow, in fact, is borrowing the original GI Joe business model - make a generic body and sell the heads and clothes and accessories to go around them, though they include the body too and pretend it's a unique action figure when it's less so (which is fine for the most part, though sometimes you end up with long-arms Luke) - they don't have to make tooling for a new body every time, a significant savings, so the money goes into the rest of the figure. But their edition numbers are ridiculously lower too, they sell 5,000 units of a Star Wars figure, Hasbro aims for 10 times that, Sideshow is a niche market while Hasbro is a global one. Sideshow takes bigger risks by pre-ordering figures and then making them, and sometimes it faulters like with Qui-Gon and Bib Fortuna not selling or Obi-Wan missing release dates, Hasbro's business model avoids such risks by selling to retailers rather than the riskier road.

Consider this, how many "mature collector" companies have come out in the past 15 years? Probably hundreds. How many have survived? Nearly none. Why would Hasbro want to take that risk when there's not much profit and not that many buyers anyway? They wouldn't. Our Star Wars line is as close to that balance as Hasbro wants to get, and it's already burned them pretty badly I might add (of which they're not blameless), but there's little incentive for them to push that balance further.



Then someone answer how Attikus is staying in business? SideShow with a massive Jabba the Hutt set? Master Replicas with a Falcon you need to buy a new house for?Niche sales, ultra-thin profit margins, smaller number of employees to pay, heavier focus on niche marketing, and putting out other, more profitable products to pay for the dream projects which may end up losing money.



Face it guys, a large play set will not happen. Besides I wouldn't buy it anyways. I'm growing out of ships and I have never really cared for playset, well at least not Hasbros. They are so kid focused they look silly. Just look at the AOTC dog crap playset. Hey kid! have you even wanted to play with a huge pile of dog crap? Well now you can with our new AOTC arena!:thumbsup:This unfortunately rings true to me, it's not gonna happen and it'd look bad if they tried. Hasbro isn't willing to risk putting out a playset that's high quality because they want to make PROFIT on that playset's sales, they aren't concerned with the fact that the higher quality playset that's a good value to the customer (aka not making profit on the playset) will end up selling more action figures in the long run, because that's its "potential" value and may never really come to fruition - it's a safer stance but a limited one when it comes to playsets and vehicles.

Kidhuman
08-08-2006, 03:24 PM
I agree with Chux, I have no room for a 300 dollar piece. Also I agree with Turbo about ships and playsets(especially the AOTC Arena, heres a cardboard back drop and instatnt arena). There are some that do spark my interest though, I aint gonna lie. I prefer to stay with the 3.75 line of figures and some others. If they re-released the original DS playset, I would get it.

Tycho
08-08-2006, 03:54 PM
I am saddened to, but must, agree with the logic JediTricks, Turbowars, and Kidhuman just presented in their posts. I'd like to argue with it, but that's my fantasy desire for large playsets talking, not my use of reason. That's really sad about Hasbro, however. We all have dreams and ideals. The company's CFO's are different than ours, however. (For those of us who would find a way to make room for those large items).



I want to thank JediTricks for the Hasbro history lesson. I'd further recommend that he alter his post slightly, and type it up as a special news report for SSG and AF.com. It was very interesting reading and I only know 4 people saw if (counting JT) at this time. A series of "Spotlights On Company X" might really work for AF.com - but whatever can be known about MR, SS, GG, C3, etc. would also be surely appreciated here.


sometimes it faulters like with Qui-Gon and Bib Fortuna not selling or Obi-Wan missing release dates, Hasbro's business model avoids such risks by selling to retailers rather than the riskier road.

I'd like to hear more about what you know: Qui-Gon and Bib are not selling? Those 2 are very different characters, from 2 separate trilogies too. Figuring out why they're moving slowly would be an interesting discussion. We know that Obi-Wan needed the creation of a more brown Jedi robe and having it be less "black/dark brown" such as the ones Qui-Gon, Mace, Anakin, and Luke wear. I didn't pay attention to what my Kit Fisto came with. He went straight to a storage location - here at my new place though. I just don't feel like getting him out. (I bought Kit to make a scene of the Jedi Council one day: Shaak-Ti, Ki-Adi Munndi, Mace, Yoda, Plo Koon, and Kit as of now - Hopefully Eeth / Agen, and SaeSae, and Adi / Stass are coming soon.)



Niche sales, ultra-thin profit margins, smaller number of employees to pay, heavier focus on niche marketing, and putting out other, more profitable products to pay for the dream projects which may end up losing money.

So you're saying that MR, SS, GG, and C3 are more "fan-owned, fan run?" That's probably true. But they do "give away" a heck of a lot of products just for the sake of their own good will, which gives me pause to wonder if they are so profitable that they are just swimming in the cash. However, I wonder how much it costs them to fashion a 12" or a little metal lightsaber replica, and then mark it for sale for over $60 at least, and often over $100? I know the per-product license fee for Star Wars can't be pleasant, else Hasbro's 3 3/4" figures would never have cost more than many other companies' 7" SA figures of even higher detail.


And yes, Hasbro's taking a safer stance by being a kids' toy company and focusing on kids and what Target stocks for them, but even if the profits are a bare minimal for doing niche stuff for us older collectors with the money, we are talking about PROFITS - not losing money. Hasbro already has the enthusiasts to work on such projects anyway. I'd see that the growth in employee costs would center around ordering and marketing versus product design and engineering. You KNOW that Mark Berdeaux (spelling) wants to see if he can come out with an awesome Death Star - and who better to do it?

JON9000
08-08-2006, 04:29 PM
I'd like to hear more about what you know: Qui-Gon and Bib are not selling? Those 2 are very different characters, from 2 separate trilogies too. Figuring out why they're moving slowly would be an interesting discussion.

Aren't those the newest figures? I would suggest perhaps the following:

1. The novelty of the entire Sideshow line is wearing off a little- collecotr fatigue.

2. $50 a pop wears people's wallets out.

3. Hasbro knows what Sideshow may be learning- it's easier to knock them out of the park when you are doing the iconic characters. If I had to get one, you bet I'd get Vader, not an Ugnaught.

DarkArtist
08-08-2006, 04:50 PM
If hasbro was to make a modular version of the Death Star where the fans could make the playset the way they wanted it to look then perhaps people would be more inclined to buy one. If the pieces were for say a throne room, hanger bay, conference room, trash compactor, detention cells, and maybe the chasm swing then perhaps they could get away with making a decent Death Star.
I think that if Hasbro is going to attempt something like this then they should include some high end figures for the fans to justify the cost. For instance: The Emperor's Throne Room would include a SA DSII Luke, SA DS II Vader (which could be a resculpt of either the Evolutions Vader or the recent Bespin Confession Vader), a retooled soft goods Emperor Palpatine and two of the ROTS Red Royal Guards.
I for one would love a modular set of the Death Star so Hasbro if you are listening, this could be something that you sell on your website and the fans are asking for it so do it.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
08-08-2006, 04:51 PM
If Hasbro were to revisit the Death Star in playset form, I'd rather see smaller playset modules than a super expensive, huge playset. Their DS playsets from 1996 were pretty good (the hallway moreso than the shaft), but I'd like to see more of that, but somewhat different.

You know those Ultarama setups? They should do something like that, and release one room with different backgrounds. If you buy multiples, you could stack them side-by-side or on top of each other and use the various backgrounds as walls, to have diversity in it.

But, really, is there that much left in the Death Star that they still have to do? We got the prison hallway and shaft as playsets ten years ago; the garbage masher as a pair of screen scenes in 2003; and the Obi-Wan/Vader duel as Force FX figures and the 25th Anniversary Sets. Is there that much of a pressing need for a Death Star playset? Maybe the guns, and a huge trench, but I don't really care if we ever get the officers' table or a generic hallway.

Tycho
08-08-2006, 05:31 PM
Yes, JabbaJohn, we got those "scene pieces," but I think people are clamoring for one (assembly required?) huge playset that incorporates all that with elevators and hallways that physically connect the rooms in question, with plastic you can pose more stormtroopers on. None of knows for sure where we'd have the room - but we'll make it. The concept is very cool.

pbarnard
08-08-2006, 08:18 PM
Yes, JabbaJohn, we got those "scene pieces," but I think people are clamoring for one (assembly required?) huge playset that incorporates all that with elevators and hallways that physically connect the rooms in question, with plastic you can pose more stormtroopers on. None of knows for sure where we'd have the room - but we'll make it. The concept is very cool.

Which is why I basically have "built" my own. I've build a detention block, and have dedicated 1 shelf on a six foot high, four foot wide, 2 foot deep case of MDF to house most of my collection. I can't have everything and the plans are already in motion to one day to build a case exclusively for just the Death Star. How I'm going to populate it is anyone's guess, but I'll do it. You can see pics in my collection gallery btw.

Also, I'm not keen on the modular aspect of things. What happens if you miss one wave due to bad distribution? Or if one piece is bundled with an excellent figure set and the rest are pegwarmers? You're screwed.

Course, same situation. I've built my own cantina, built a central room of a jabba's palace, the Detention Block, and now the mega case. With the sources out there for backdrops and the such, it's not hard now if you have a printer to make a shelf a decent dio or playset.

TheRealDubya
08-09-2006, 11:39 AM
All I know is that when I was 5, I loved my Death Star Playset. I used it ALL THE TIME, for years, until it was just broken down parts. Kids today have considerably more distractions and somewhat different play patterns than we did back then, but really, Hasbro could knock out a three story playset with existing molds and cardboard backdrops and probably do just fine. Do a 30 second TV spot with movie clips, put it into heavy rotation on Cartoon Network, Nickelodeon and Disney and I bet they'd fly. Course, it's not my nickel on the block.

What did the DS Playset retail for back then (1980) anyways? And did the ATOC Arena totally bomb for them?

DarthQuack
08-09-2006, 12:05 PM
I remembering have my cousins DS playset, didn't have all the pieces, I mostly remember the trash compactor and the dianoga, which was awesome.

Tycho
08-09-2006, 06:05 PM
What did the DS Playset retail for back then (1980) anyways?

I think it was $30 which is like $50 today. That's really not too pricey. Of course Hasbro would want to make a more limited run of it, and likely charge between MSRP $70-100, but that would probably be the most they'd try to get for that particular playset.


And did the ATOC Arena totally bomb for them?

I don't think so. I don't remember seeing that on clearance. I paid full price for 2 of them, $40 each I think, but my friend supposedly has 2 more I can have for $20 each - so KB must have cleared them or something at some point.

The Arena was hardly as cool as that Death Star. In fact, most Hasbro playsets weren't even half as good as the old KENNER ones from the 80's. And of those, the Death Star Playset was king for sure.

stad
08-09-2006, 07:34 PM
I don't think so. I don't remember seeing that on clearance. I paid full price for 2 of them, $40 each I think, but my friend supposedly has 2 more I can have for $20 each - so KB must have cleared them or something at some point.



I bought one on clearance at K-Mart for about $25, and K-B online had them down to $9.99, which is when I bought a second one.

DarthBrandon
08-09-2006, 10:30 PM
I bought one on clearance at K-Mart for about $25, and K-B online had them down to $9.99, which is when I bought a second one.

They never went on clearance here, they cleared out as fast as lightning.

Blue2th
08-09-2006, 10:49 PM
I bought the Arena Playset on eBay for like 9.00, then had to pay 15.00 shipping. Now that I neglected to get the Mustafar Playset, I'm going to have to get one somewhere, probably eBay. I need to check the prices of the Deathstar Playset. They're most likely pretty high. I would like to have one. :yes:

Tycho
08-10-2006, 12:00 AM
I bought my 2 vintage Death Star Playsets from dealer stores when they used to be prevalent: in malls or in strip-malls. I paid around $100 for each of them. They were complete with the rope swing and the foam garbage for the trash compactor, plus the trash monster. Those are the most common things missing. Oh yeah - the cardboard was kept mint.

One of the Death Stars was actually packed away in its original Kenner box! (I think that was the one I paid more like $125 for, and the other $100 for).

The pegs for vintage figures do not fit POTF2 and later modern figures, just so you know. In my experience, the new TIE Fighter Pilots were the most frustrating to stand in the playset, and the '97 Royal Guards Saltshakers were the easiest. Obi-Wan Kenobi was somewhere in between.

DarkArtist
08-10-2006, 02:47 PM
I still have mine and still have most of the parts with the exception of the rope swing. Love it then and still love it now. :yes:

JediTricks
08-10-2006, 05:46 PM
I'd like to argue with it, but that's my fantasy desire for large playsets talking, not my use of reason. That's really sad about Hasbro, however. We all have dreams and ideals. The company's CFO's are different than ours, however. (For those of us who would find a way to make room for those large items).Yeah, I know the feeling, I'd like it if the corporation was more interested in making great toys that also work to sell action figures, but their primary interests are 1) make money for investors; and 2) keep company afloat, otherwise no toys at all. The end result is that compromise keeps some of the best ideas out of our hands because they risk breaking rule #2, and rule #2 is what makes rule #1 possible.



I want to thank JediTricks for the Hasbro history lesson. I'd further recommend that he alter his post slightly, and type it up as a special news report for SSG and AF.com. It was very interesting reading and I only know 4 people saw if (counting JT) at this time. A series of "Spotlights On Company X" might really work for AF.com - but whatever can be known about MR, SS, GG, C3, etc. would also be surely appreciated here.Well, I used a few sources to put that together, but it helped that Hasbro is a large enough company that people are willing to put out stuff I can mine in the first place, they are probably the easiest to do that with. I'll do what I can, but it's hard when you only have official sources because they only want to spotlight certain positive aspects of their history.


I'd like to hear more about what you know: Qui-Gon and Bib are not selling? Those 2 are very different characters, from 2 separate trilogies too. Figuring out why they're moving slowly would be an interesting discussion.Well, we have a 12" forum for that discussion. ;) The short version is that they took a very long time to sell through, probably because they aren't as interesting characters as others and because there is a feeling of too much money spent too soon with SSC.


So you're saying that MR, SS, GG, and C3 are more "fan-owned, fan run?" That's probably true. But they do "give away" a heck of a lot of products just for the sake of their own good will, which gives me pause to wonder if they are so profitable that they are just swimming in the cash. However, I wonder how much it costs them to fashion a 12" or a little metal lightsaber replica, and then mark it for sale for over $60 at least, and often over $100? I know the per-product license fee for Star Wars can't be pleasant, else Hasbro's 3 3/4" figures would never have cost more than many other companies' 7" SA figures of even higher detail.I dunno if they're fan own/run, but they are more willing to back their moves directly and take bigger risks. And those giveaways aren't entirely out of the goodness of their hearts, it is a marketing cost meant to spread the word about their brand, they get a tax break on that because it's a business expense. And Hasbro's unit prices are MUCH slimmer than SSC or GG or MR's because Hasbro has to make profit for their retail partners where those other companies rely more on direct sales.


And yes, Hasbro's taking a safer stance by being a kids' toy company and focusing on kids and what Target stocks for them, but even if the profits are a bare minimal for doing niche stuff for us older collectors with the money, we are talking about PROFITS - not losing money. Hasbro already has the enthusiasts to work on such projects anyway. I'd see that the growth in employee costs would center around ordering and marketing versus product design and engineering. You KNOW that Mark Berdeaux (spelling) wants to see if he can come out with an awesome Death Star - and who better to do it?No, it's not PROFITS, it's "potential" profits, a mold is not money in the bank until its paid for itself, a poorly-selling toy may never pay for its tooling and will eat into the profits or budgets of other items in the line. The slimmer the profits, the greater the risks - GG and MR and SSC are willing to take more risks than Hasbro. And once someone starts taking money for preorders, they can't turn around and say "well, not enough of you ordered, so it's cancelled and here's your money back", that would be destructive to their public image - Sideshow commits to its customers that they'll be getting that product, any delay hurts the image, look at the delay with Obi-Wan, people were starting to get antsy. This is another reason Hasbro works through retail partners instead, they can safely cancel a toy if not enough orders come in and it won't hurt the overall line's public opinion (as much).


I think Hasbro could certainly try making modular playsets like we've been suggesting though, these are smaller cost risks that let collectors build the huge environments of their dreams.


You know those Ultarama setups? They should do something like that, and release one room with different backgrounds. If you buy multiples, you could stack them side-by-side or on top of each other and use the various backgrounds as walls, to have diversity in it.This is a good idea, I wonder if Hasbro would be willing to take the risk. It's basically a small-footprint playset that kids can make multiple playsets from a single box, and collectors can buy multiples of to make each set - the only reason I think Hasbro might not want to do it is because it is the opposite of Pokemon-factor, instead of collecting them all a buyer can get 1 and HAVE them all at once (I still argue that the more playset and vehicle you give a buyer for their money, the more action figures they will get to go with it, the profits aren't the sales of the vehicles and playsets themselves but in the sales they create in the action figures). Plus, stackable means you can have the cell block actually have a slide into the garbage masher, and elevators that really elevate.

However, the 1996 POTF2 Death Star playsets are pretty lame, the wobbly chasm is junk and the prison block hallway is very short and has only 1 wall and a giant missile launcher (it's halfway to being a decent small playset), they absolutely need to redo this.



Also, I'm not keen on the modular aspect of things. What happens if you miss one wave due to bad distribution? Or if one piece is bundled with an excellent figure set and the rest are pegwarmers? You're screwed.That risk is inherent in everything Hasbro does, they continue to package 1 army builder and hot figure per case that has multiple lamer figs. The ideal is to figure out which ones sell best and make more of them in a single case, continue to offer them over waves (Hasbro tries to do both with the figures, but it quickly becomes a mess). And the argument could be made for anything, even non-modular playsets, what if you're in a coma like Tycho was?



(re: Death Star Playset price) I think it was $30 which is like $50 today. That's really not too pricey. Of course Hasbro would want to make a more limited run of it, and likely charge between MSRP $70-100, but that would probably be the most they'd try to get for that particular playset.It was $18 MSRP, and $30 then would not be $50 today, inflation makes $30 into $90 today, while inflation on that $18 would make it $55 today, but the good thing is that today it wouldn't cost $90 or $55 because the price and quality of materials and tooling and manufacturing has gone down considerably, which is why figures don't go up much above how much they were 20 years ago (it also helps that $5 seems to be the most the market will bear for 4" figures no matter what year it is). Still, Kenner had ridiculously less licensing fees and were willing to take greater risks in committing to new tooling, and while stores had a lot less space for toys, there was a lot less competition for shelf space. And the thing was just a big skeleton of a playset anyway:
http://www.12back.com/playsets/deathstar.php3
http://www.toysrgus.com/images-toys/figuretoys/deathstar.html
Hasbro's biggest risks making something like that would be tooling costs and packaging it so it took up the right amount of space without looking too small - I could see them cranking something like that out at $35, but they wouldn't.



And did the ATOC Arena totally bomb for them?
I don't think so. I don't remember seeing that on clearance. I paid full price for 2 of them, $40 each I think, but my friend supposedly has 2 more I can have for $20 each - so KB must have cleared them or something at some point.It did indeed, it didn't sell very well at all, there were a lot on clearance around here, I remember they went on clearance with the Republic Gunship at WM (when the gunship was $40 and people refused to pay that) but the gunships sold out on clearance very quickly and WM was stuck with a lot of $22 Arenas for many months.

Hasbro got money back on the Saga Arena by retooling it as a GI Joe playset, but I bet they barely broke even on that one.

Tycho
08-10-2006, 06:36 PM
I wonder how Mustafar sold for them? I only saw that carried at Toys R Us.

IMO, Mustafar was better quality than the Arena playset or Theed's Hanger, but not by too much.

El Chuxter
08-10-2006, 07:47 PM
I saw Mustafar at WM. I planned to get it when it hit clearance but, somewhat surprisingly, it never did. It merely got swiped up.

Banthaholic
08-10-2006, 10:42 PM
I didn't see Mustafar around too much. I got the regular and the Sam's version. Even thoguht they are crap, I think the inclussion of the figures might have helped it a bit.

If done well the Death Star will sell. At least my house will buy 1 or 2. For an item like this and the Sailbarge I honestly could care less about what the final cost will be, I want both bad enough I would pay for it. It's worth it to me.

JediTricks
08-11-2006, 06:10 PM
I wonder how Mustafar sold for them? I only saw that carried at Toys R Us.

IMO, Mustafar was better quality than the Arena playset or Theed's Hanger, but not by too much.I think they sold a little better, but that wouldn't be surprising since the Mustafar playset was $10 less and had 2 exclusive figures, the Geonosis Battle Arena had 0 figures and cost $40. Of course, the Mustafar one also looked cooler with lava pieces in red and orange and black (both toy and box); Geonosis looked boring in brown and tan with a blue box. It's been well documented that red is a selling color and blue is a non-selling color, customers respond much more favorably to red than blue, blue is apparently off-putting. And Geonosis was a facade while Mustafar was a full mountain.


I saw Mustafar at WM. I planned to get it when it hit clearance but, somewhat surprisingly, it never did. It merely got swiped up.It got bought here, I saw a few make it to clearance but that was pretty rare and most of the time the figs were missing.

Let's face it, which is more exciting, Lava Mountain or Dookie Fence?
http://www.rebelscum.com/photo.asp?image=/ROTS/rots05mustafarboxfr.jpg&text=Canadian%20packaging
http://www.rebelscum.com/photo.asp?image=/swsaga/swsaga02geoarenaboxfr.jpg

Mr. JabbaJohnL
08-12-2006, 12:21 PM
The Mustafar playset is as much of a facade as the Geonosis one is . . . have you seen the backside? Apart from the connector for the deluxe Vader (which is more useful as an area for Vader to kill the Separatists), there's nothing back there. At least the Arena had the Droid Factory conveyor belt and detailing from the hangar. Due to sheer size, I think I like the Arena playset more, and it's also able to house more figures whereas the Mustafar set is only good for a few (as there weren't many characters on the planet anyway). Also, the giant lava balls are a little unnecessary and goofy-looking.

Blue2th
08-12-2006, 12:49 PM
I plan on opening my Genosis Arena and making a big diorama. I've got most all of the figures and beasts from that scene already loose. I'm just lacking enough shelf space for such a huge scene. Nobody sells wide enough shelves for playsets, or Gunships for that matter in furniture, but I found those wide industrial metal shelves at Home Depot for like 60 bucks. I'm going to buy one, and on one tier on the shelf I'm going to paint the same color as the Genosis red sand, so the Arena will match it. Put some light blue poster board behind it for the sky. It might be wide enough to hang a Gunship in the air above it, or on the ground with clones jumping out. The same thing could be done with the Mustafar Playset (I don't have that one yet), The Naboo Battle (easy with just green grass and sky) The Death Star Hanger and an Imperial Shuttle w/ half of it for the Death Star Playset.

Tycho
08-12-2006, 03:29 PM
Dust is your enemy then. Only you can learn how to defeat dust. And knowing is half the battle!

Now here will be your Dust Defense Training Course (DDTC), as provided by Jedi Drill Instructor Tycho, the warrior who's been fighting dust in the Southern California Sector in the San Diego System.

I recommend buying from a retail store display fixture supplier (who often will provide a delivery service you'll usually have to pay an additional $50 for) and purchase those glass jewel cases (white on the outside) that comic book stores and convention dealer-room sellers often display their bounties in. They are perfect for dioramas, and they fully enclose them, eliminating the advancement of your enemy: dust!

The standard brand new ones cost about $200, and the glass top can be popped off if you put them against a wall, and leave just enough room against the back for your wrist to bend behind the fixture (through it's back doors) and push up on the lid. After your scene is set up, replace the lid. These cases can have lighting kits put in them, but that usually costs an additional $50 per fixture (though it's worth it).

The Republic Gunship requires a custom made fixture due to its wingspan (and I imagine the ARC-170 might as well - though I have plans to hang mine rather than put it in a fixture - I can fight dust on a few loose items, espeically ones that don't have figures posed specifically in action, such as an Arena Battle). Anyway, the thing that sucks here is the fixtures are generally 18 inches wide - and just fine for placing against walls in your home as if they were terraniums (thing other people display plants and reptiles in - though one of yours WILL have Gungans - but they just won't require cleaning and feeding should you use an aquarium's fake plants instead of anything actually alive - plant or animal). However, the wingspan on a Gunship needs more like 23 inches of width for a display environment. The best defense against dust there (for say like a ground battle of Geonosis display), is to spend up to $500 having a custom display case made. Within you can have a clear (and hollow) plexiglass stand for your gunship - it seems to heavy a ship to hang by fishing wire and plexiglass cross beams (though this works for snowspeeders in a Hoth diorama). Anyway, a hollow clear stand for the gunship allows you to display advancing clones within it, only marginally sacraficing the look like your clones wouldn't be able to get out of the box (pretend it's not actually there - you can see through it, right?) In any event, now your Gunship is flying and avoiding contact by enemy Dust!

Shelving as you propose can be used, though here are some suggestions:

have a plexiglass company form custom sized enclosures for your scenes, or at least upside down "U-form" covers. Lightweight scenes (such as the Star Destroyer Bridge when Vader meets with the bounty hunters) can be hung on the wall (or placed on these wall shelves). Depending on the size of the scene, they can range from $10 to $100. A cover for a shelf with 12-15" figures (VOTC 15" Chewbacca) might be considerably more - I haven't done this myself yet, but plan on it one day.

If you leave your collection in your dioramas exposed, you will be defeated by dust, or you will grow tired of dusting them, and with that, you will consequently grow tired of your collection - take Endor for example, where you can add a handful of new figures lately, but for how long will it be (after Endor Luke gets released) until you can revisit anything to do with that scene?

Anyway, since my dioramas were all (very inconsiderately) packed up when I was hospitalized, I'm thinking about bringing one planet at a time, home from storage for temporary display, while I'm inventorizing my scenes against my collection inventory lists. I have no idea how long it will be until I can purchase a large enough house for all this stuff to go on final display at. (When I do, you all will be invited!)

But meanwhile, only you can defeat Dust and its evil master, Dust Vapor, the scourge of any Star Wars collection!

dindae
08-12-2006, 08:28 PM
Currently I'm defeating dust by using large white supply closets. They were only $100 but they are not clear so I have to open them to appreciate them. My choice was made since we have a dog that stays in the garage during times of bad weather and I wanted something sturdy and didn't have a lot to spend. Currently I have 6 of them 1 for each movie. I'm don't have much done with the Episode 3 cabinet since I haven't decided on what should be the main battle scene. The cabinets top shelf is 4 feet wide and for the other movies I have done the Cantina, Hoth, Jabba's Palace, Theed Plains battle, and Arena. But for ROTS I don't have one scene that has tons of figure or a large ship to use as a centerpiece. The Mustaphar playset is ok but there are only 12 figures to go with it so it isn't enough to fill up the area. I will probably go with Utapau or Kashyyyk, either way I will need to go back and bulk up some armies.

Tycho
08-12-2006, 08:51 PM
Those are cool choices Dindae (Kashyyyk and Utopau). You can put the Republic Gunship into Utopau - and Boga and Grievous' wheelbike and a BARC speeder.

For Kashyyyk, I'm wondering like the rest of us, will there ever be a Turbo Tank, Swamp Speeder, Wookiee Catamaran, Droid Gunship, Corporate Alliance Tank Droid, and so forth. You can use the small spider droids (originally seen on Geonosis) and the Wookiee helicopter and AT-RT, but the scene needs more - especially something to bulk up the Separatist Army.

There's also "Darth Vader" storming the Jedi Temple with the 501st, as well as the 5-way duel in Palpatine's office.

12 on Mustafar you say? Hmmm.

1) Anakin
2) Obi-Wan
3) Padme
4) R2D2
5) C-3PO
6) Nute Gunray (down)
7) Passel Argente (down)
8) Poggle the Lesser (down)
9) Shu Mai (down)
10) San Hill (down)
11) Kat Min (if you bought him, down)
12) Passel's aide (if you bought that one, down)
13) Wat Tambor (down)
14) Niemoidian Guard (down - and likely 2 of them)
15) Niemoidian Guare captain (down)
16) Security Droid (x2 and both down)
17) Mustafar Sentry (at least two)
18) Upcoming Mustafar Lava Miner (at least two)

So I get at least 25 figures, but the playset is too small for all of these. I cut back on dead Separatists and Security Droids and Niemoidian Warriors. I don't feature all of them in my scene to keep it simple. They're just going to be lying face down anyway.

Hey - you can launch the lava balls at them to get them to fall down, hehe. But you really can only hit figures in FRONT of the playset, and the Dead Separatists belong behind / underneath it.

JediTricks
08-12-2006, 11:58 PM
The Mustafar playset is as much of a facade as the Geonosis one is . . . have you seen the backside? Apart from the connector for the deluxe Vader (which is more useful as an area for Vader to kill the Separatists), there's nothing back there.But the top half is the back of the mountain plus the collection vanes, so it's not as much a facade in that respect, and the packaging makes it look like there's a lot more there unlike the dookie fence which looks like there's nothing there.


My answer to dust - never dust. ;)

Mad Slanted Powers
08-13-2006, 12:57 AM
I too, liked the Geonosis playset better than the Mustafar one. The figures didn't seem to stay on the little platforms, the vanes keep falling off, and there really isn't much space to do anything with the figures. The Geonosis set doesn't have huge amounts of space, but more than the Mustafar set. Also many of the figures at the time came with accessories that helped them fit in with the set better - Deluxe C-3PO, Coleman Trebor, Aayla and Barriss to name a few. That's what inspired me to get the set. I had passed on it in the stores and by the time I wanted it, I couldn't find it anymore. I had to buy it online.

I got my Vintage Death Star Playset for Christmas back when it was new. I have it set up now. The gun doesn't work right anymore, and one of the support columns has the top tab broken off. Also, the cardboard is kind of worn and the white levels are a bit yellowed. I still have the box the set came in. I didn't see a price, but we must have got it from Sears. There is some sort of form still attached to the back of the box.

JediTricks
08-13-2006, 01:21 AM
I wasn't saying which playset WAS better, just which one would have more in-store appeal to cause it to get purchased.

Mad Slanted Powers
08-13-2006, 11:00 AM
I wasn't saying which playset WAS better, just which one would have more in-store appeal to cause it to get purchased.
Yeah, I guess the lava would look cool and it comes with two figures. Plus, these are the features listed on the front of the box with exclamation point - Blasting Magma!, Breakaway Platform!, Lava Flips Over!, and Includes Obi-Wan Kenobi and Darth Vader. The Arena set just says "Two Playsets in One" and "BONUS Roleplaying Game Inside". However, you look at the back of the box and you see many more features on the Arena set. The Mustafar set has places for attaching Battle Arenas, but they don't have anything to do with that scene. Plus, once you open the box, you realize that exciting features on the front of the box aren't all that great. The Arena set is more likely to get people to buy more figures to use with the set. In my case, I decided to get the set after I saw all the figures they were making that tied in with it well.

dindae
08-13-2006, 11:26 AM
The biggest difference is that the arena makes use of the space not in the toy because it is assumed the space in front is the arena floor. With the Mustaphar set the assumption is that the space around it is molten lava and thus forcing the play to be contained in the playset.

JediTricks
08-13-2006, 07:03 PM
The biggest difference is that the arena makes use of the space not in the toy because it is assumed the space in front is the arena floor. With the Mustaphar set the assumption is that the space around it is molten lava and thus forcing the play to be contained in the playset.
Right, the Arena looks merely like a backdrop, not a true playset environment. A $40 backdrop or a $30 playset, that's what I suspect casual collectors faced with when thinking about the 2.

Blue2th
08-13-2006, 10:10 PM
Dust is your enemy then. Only you can learn how to defeat dust. And knowing is half the battle!

But meanwhile, only you can defeat Dust and its evil master, Dust Vapor, the scourge of any Star Wars collection!
Dang it! should have kept that girlfriend around to do the dishes, I mean the figures...... No really New Mwxico is the land of dust! Im working on the glass case thing, and the store fixture is a good idea. Especially for Sideshow stuff. Best thing I can do right now is keep that room (nothing but figures) sealed up good till then...... I have fit a Clone Wars Gunship (first one) on a 18" wide shelf by tilting it sideways slightly. With the nose dipping. It actually looks cooler like that. Like it's coming in for a landing and close enough to the ground to have Clones piling out of it, with a clear VOTC case underneath the fuselage to give it the in-air hovering look.

Tycho
08-14-2006, 02:54 PM
I have fit a Clone Wars Gunship (first one) on a 18" wide shelf by tilting it sideways slightly. With the nose dipping. It actually looks cooler like that. Like it's coming in for a landing and close enough to the ground to have Clones piling out of it, with a clear VOTC case underneath the fuselage to give it the in-air hovering look.

That could look very cool. I'd weclome seeing a picture if you've got one.

Blue2th
08-14-2006, 06:11 PM
That could look very cool. I'd weclome seeing a picture if you've got one.
Here ya go Tycho......

pic (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=14394&d=1155596836)


edit, added link for you. KH

DarthQuack
08-15-2006, 10:47 AM
Here ya go Tycho......

pic (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=14394&d=1155596836)


edit, added link for you. KH

Sweet setup.:pleased:

LTBasker
08-15-2006, 01:34 PM
The Republic Gunship requires a custom made fixture due to its wingspan

Have you thought of displaying the Gunship with only one wing attached? If you plan on displaying it sideways even with both wings you wouldn't really notice the second one, so displaying one with the wingless side up against the wall (or just the side you'll look from least often) will be about the same.

This brings about one of the downsides of the Gunship, if you want to do this but you've already attached both wings you'd have to tear it apart to get the wing off.

Tycho
08-15-2006, 04:28 PM
Looks really cool Blue2th. I like how you have your clones set up and the red captain in position. That is a Clone Wars issue gunship - I can tell from the black cockpit as opposed to a red one.

LtBasker: you are correct - I don't want to chance damaging the wings by taking them off a gunship I've assembled. Plus I love that vehicle and really would like to view it from every angle (in a fixture, that would mean top and one side basically - but from the top is a legit angle).

Eventually, I will use 4 gunships on Geonosis - 2 for the arean rescue scene which is self-explanatory and 2 as follows:

2 Gunships
Adi Gallia in a Jedi Starfighter (filler)
Clone army
Jedi commanders

vs.

mini Spider Droids
Droid Army
Super Battle Droid Army
2 Geonosian fighters
3 Droid starfighters (hey - it's filler)
Hailfire Droid
Dooku on speeder "getting away"

I wish I had for this scene:

AT-TE
Homing Spider Droid (the big ones)

timmae
08-15-2006, 09:26 PM
Sweet setup.:pleased:
not too much of a displayer, only have clones on display. this makes me feel like opening one of my gunships though. very nice!