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Val Da Car
06-03-2007, 01:06 AM
In reviewing Ep3 in HD (HBO HD) and Ep2 in Std Def.

I noted that Mace Windu dodged flame from Jango and lept updae and out of Poggle's box onto the Genosian arena.

Could he have survived the lightning from Palpatine and slowed himself down and escaped Corusacant?

stillakid
06-03-2007, 06:43 AM
In reviewing Ep3 in HD (HBO HD) and Ep2 in Std Def.

I noted that Mace Windu dodged flame from Jango and lept updae and out of Poggle's box onto the Genosian arena.

Could he have survived the lightning from Palpatine and slowed himself down and escaped Corusacant?

Maybe, that is, if he wasn't so busy hefting his lightsaber up high like it was a 50lb broadsword. That useless over-the-head action was entirely pointless as a lightsaber is going to pierce whatever it touches without additional momentum.

It's ridiculous nonsensical moments of story convenience like that that helped make the Prequels such a letdown.

CaptainSolo1138
06-03-2007, 08:26 AM
Maybe, that is, if he wasn't so busy hefting his lightsaber up high like it was a 50lb broadsword. That useless over-the-head action was entirely pointless as a lightsaber is going to pierce whatever it touches without additional momentum.

It's ridiculous nonsensical moments of story convenience like that that helped make the Prequels such a letdown.Kinda like when Vader took a Babe Ruthian swing at Obers when he killed him (or whatever) on the Death Star?

boshar kussc
06-03-2007, 08:40 AM
Maybe, that is, if he wasn't so busy hefting his lightsaber up high like it was a 50lb broadsword. That useless over-the-head action was entirely pointless as a lightsaber is going to pierce whatever it touches without additional momentum.

It's ridiculous nonsensical moments of story convenience like that that helped make the Prequels such a letdown.

YEAH! That part was SOOOO cool!

I think Mace Windo probably survived. Other than maybe Yoda and Obi-Wan, he's like, the coolest Jedi.

Devo
06-03-2007, 09:12 AM
I agree with Stillakid, the only reason Mace raised his arm that high was an 'outside SW universe' reason to allow Hayden to take his own stylish swing and cut it off. In-universe he should merely have stabbed Palpy in the face and it would have been sufficient. Mace deserved to die for such idiocy. As for Vader doing a dramatic and unnecessarily wide swing of his own in ANH it may be the case that he wanted to make it as brutal and ferocious as possible rather than taking a small swipe or stab motion. He had a lot of pent-up rage at Obi-wan. And he could afford to be so overdramatic as there was no one standing by to possibly cut him in half before he could strike Obi-wan down. Mace on the other hand had Haydakin standing there with a lightsaber of his own protesting that palpy shouldn't be killed. It ought to have been obvious to Mace that his movement would have to be small and quick so Anakin wouldn't have time to react.

jedi master sal
06-03-2007, 09:54 AM
I agree with Stillakid, the only reason Mace raised his arm that high was an 'outside SW universe' reason to allow Hayden to take his own stylish swing and cut it off. In-universe he should merely have stabbed Palpy in the face and it would have been sufficient. Mace deserved to die for such idiocy. As for Vader doing a dramatic and unnecessarily wide swing of his own in ANH it may be the case that he wanted to make it as brutal and ferocious as possible rather than taking a small swipe or stab motion. He had a lot of pent-up rage at Obi-wan. And he could afford to be so overdramatic as there was no one standing by to possibly cut him in half before he could strike Obi-wan down. Mace on the other hand had Haydakin standing there with a lightsaber of his own protesting that palpy shouldn't be killed. It ought to have been obvious to Mace that his movement would have to be small and quick so Anakin wouldn't have time to react.

You know thinking about these last few posts, makes me wonder then why Obi didn't just stick HIS lightsaber out when vader went for the long sweeping arc of a cut. That would have ended it quickly. Hmm, would make for a cool "what if" story.

jjreason
06-03-2007, 06:14 PM
God, to be arguing about the types of swings the Jedi were taking? Jesus.

It's a movie, and has to look good... the fighting styles were supposed to reflect the emotional turmoil of the scene. End of story.

My thoughts on Mace Windu surviving.... no way (at least not in my mind). The lightening would have injured him enough/caused him enough pain to stop him from using the force to control or break his fall.

JediTricks
06-04-2007, 05:27 AM
Mace I think might have been able to salvage his fall if he was near a building or vehicles, the loss of his arm and saber and being zapped might have affected that but I think they made the character enough of a badarse to get that in there. I also think it wouldn't be very rewarding for a 1-armed Mace to return to the saga though.

2-1B
06-05-2007, 06:58 PM
Maybe he fell onto a speeder like Obi-wan and Anakin did in the second movie.

darko666
06-05-2007, 07:28 PM
i doubt it, he did get blasted pretty far away from the building and was most likely in shock from being blasted with lighting and having his forearm severed. like someone else stated, he deserved to die from his idiocy by lifting his arm up and taking his sweet time to perform the fatal blow.

stillakid
06-05-2007, 07:34 PM
You know thinking about these last few posts, makes me wonder then why Obi didn't just stick HIS lightsaber out when vader went for the long sweeping arc of a cut. That would have ended it quickly. Hmm, would make for a cool "what if" story.

Obi wanted to "die" which is why he didn't really A) fight and B) defend himself. He knew he'd be more useful and "powerful" to Luke by being "one with the Force" instead of being flesh and blood.

Mace, on the other hand, was bent on killing Palpatine. He got caught sort of "monologuing" instead of just killing Palps immediately. It was a lame story convenience so that Bipolar-akin would have the opportunity to "save" Palpatine and go from being against Palps in one scene to declaring his allegiance in the next. Lame.

JediTricks
06-06-2007, 09:36 PM
Mace has his saber an inch from Palpatine's face, all he has to do is lean forward slightly and the Galaxy is saved, Anakin never completes his journey to the Dark Side, and the Separatists soon fall without Palps' secret leadership. Really, Lucas should never have put his characters in such a situation that this could be the alternate outcome, but I suppose once you've rewritten a scene 4 times and have to then rewrite it more to reshoot it to fit better with your convoluted plot, you're already in trouble.

Dominic Guglieme
06-07-2007, 06:14 PM
No way Mace could have lived. Lets be really optimistic here though.....


We know that lightsabers cauterize the wounds they inflict. Anakin managed to survive losing an arm in Episode 2 with no visible blood. In Episode 3, Anakin survives for an indeterminate amount of time, having lost 3 limbs, and under less than favorable conditions. A clone trooper can be seen losing an arm when Yoda and Kenobi storm the temple, with no blood visible on armor that would provide contrast.

So, bleeding out is not a problem.

Force lightning really is not that bad. Really. Aside from Vader in Episode 6, who had many cyborg parts, nobody really suffers for being hit with it. Within a minute or so, often less, characters hit with force lightning are up and about as if nothing had happened. Even the Emperor, for all of the external injuries he took in Episode III was up and about pretty quickly.


Now, the fall.....Luke managed to use the force to slow a great fall in Episode 5. Windu had more training than Luke, and would have been more focused than the more addled Luke.


Now, lets assume Windu manages to slow his fall, and land either on the building or away from it. He is going to to go.....where? Lets assume Order 66 was issued ~30 minutes after Windu's fall. He either has to secure transport back to the Temple, or a hospital, or make his way there. (Remember, the Senate building likely had all manner of security. And, we *know* that there were plenty of troops at the Temple, even before Vader and the 501 showed.

Best case scenario, Windu is smart enough to avoid the Temple and hospitals, and either dies of his injuries, or is cornered by patroling troops after Order 66 is given. (Remember, even you the lightsaber seals the wound it causes, that involves terrible burns. Left untreated, burns will kill, meaning Windu would need medical attention, or he would die.)


Nope. He may not have been killed by the fall, but he would not have made it far after the fact.

JediTricks
06-07-2007, 08:43 PM
Now, the fall.....Luke managed to use the force to slow a great fall in Episode 5. Windu had more training than Luke, and would have been more focused than the more addled Luke.I'm not sure Luke slowed his fall, I think he directed it but it was windy and I always felt that was what slowed his descent. Let's go to the script:
VADER: Luke. You can destroy the Emperor. He has foreseen this. It is
your destiny. Join me, and we can rule the galaxy as father and son.
Come with me. It's the only way.

Vader puts away his sword and holds his hand out to Luke.
A calm comes over Luke, and he makes a decision. In the
next instant he steps off the gantry platform into space. The
Dark Lord looks over the platform and sees Luke falling far
below. The wind begins to blow at Vader's cape and the torrent
finally forces him back, away from the edge. The wind soon
fades and the wounded Jedi begins to drop fast, unable to grab
onto anything to break his fall.

INTERIOR: REACTOR SHAFT

Suddenly Luke is sucked into an exhaust pipe in the side of
the shaft. When Vader sees this, he turns and hurries off the
platform.

INTERIOR: EXHAUST PIPE

Luke tumbles through the exhaust pipe.
He slides to the end of the slickly polished pipe and stops
as his feet hit a circular grill and knock it open. Luke claws
at the surface of the pipe, trying to keep from sliding out
into space.

EXTERIOR: BOTTOM OF CLOUD CITY -- WEATHER VANE -- DUSK

Unable to hang onto the pipe, Luke tumbles out, emerging at
the undermost part of Cloud City. Reaching out desperately, he
manages to grab onto on electronic weather vane.

Now, lets assume Windu manages to slow his fall, and land either on the building or away from it. He is going to to go.....where? Lets assume Order 66 was issued ~30 minutes after Windu's fall. He either has to secure transport back to the Temple, or a hospital, or make his way there. (Remember, the Senate building likely had all manner of security. And, we *know* that there were plenty of troops at the Temple, even before Vader and the 501 showed.First off, Windu, provided he doesn't splat before he regains command of his senses, could shift his fall until he lands on the hood of an airspeeder a la Anakin's chase with Zam Wesell.

Now, where is he going to go? He could go into hiding anywhere on the lower levels of Coruscant, to plot and plan and avoid detection.



Best case scenario, Windu is smart enough to avoid the Temple and hospitals, and either dies of his injuries, or is cornered by patroling troops after Order 66 is given. (Remember, even you the lightsaber seals the wound it causes, that involves terrible burns. Left untreated, burns will kill, meaning Windu would need medical attention, or he would die.)I'm not buying this, they have medkits on their belts I believe and Anakin survived for a long time with his right arm removed in AOTC and his limbs removed and flesh set aflame in ROTS. Luke's stump hurts but he survives on that Cloud City vane for a while before Leia turns the ship around and rescues him. Once the wound is cauterized, it's not going to bleed, it's not going to infect, if he can avoid shock he could be fine on his own even without further treatment. I dunno where you get the idea that the burns are so terrible, you can see Anakin's arm isn't severely burned after it's cut off in AOTC.