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jedi master sal
10-04-2008, 03:07 PM
First: NO new ships/vehicle suggestions will be accepted.

Please look over these lists. If I made an error in placement of an entry, let me know. If you feel a ship/vehicle should be moved from one list to another, please state why.

This is NOT the voting poll. This is only to check the lists as well as any broken links.

I've separated these into the 4 sub category lists. However, ALL ships on these 4 lists will be considered able to be voted on in the main poll when we get to that in a few weeks.

I further subdivided the OT and PT by movie for easier reference.

Here are the lists (due to size of lists I will have to post these in a few posts instead of one very big one):

PT:
TPM:
• MTT (Multi-Troop Transport) (TPM):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Multi-Troop_Transport
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/e/e8/MTT_Transport.jpg
• Gungan Bongo Submarine (TPM):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Tribubble_bongo
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Bongo.jpg
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/d/d8/Bongo.jpg
• Trade Federation Battleship (TPM/ROTS-as repaint):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Lucrehulk-class_battleship
• Neimoidian Shuttle (All PT movies):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Sheathipede_OS.jpg
• Coruscant airspeeder (TPM):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/f/fa/Easy_Ride.jpg
• Trade Federation troop carrier (TPM/ROTS):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/a/af/PAC.jpg
• Gian speeder (TPM):
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/2/2e/Gian.jpg
*****************
• Podracers:
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/5/51/Podracers-ics.jpg - TPM - refer to pic for each entry
-Ben Quadinaros
-Ratts Tyerell
-Boles Roor
-Dud Bolt
-Mars Guo
-Teemto Pagalies
-Aldar Beedo
-Neva Kee
-Gasgano
-Ark “Bumpy” Roose
-Ody Mandrell
-Elan Mak
-Ebe Endocott
-Mawhonic
-Wan Sandage
-Clegg Holdfast
******************
• Droid Starfighter (Transformable) (TPM):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Droid_starfighter

PT:
AOTC:
• LAAT/c (Republic Gunship AT-TE Carrier) (AOTC):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Low_Altitude_Assault_Transport/carrier
• Geonosis execution cart (with orray) (AOTC):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/5/50/Image.JPG - AOTC
• Gondola speeder (AOTC):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/38/Gondolaspeeder.jpg
• Padmé’s yacht (AOTC):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/f/fb/Nabooyacht.jpg
• Dooku’s solar sailer (AOTC):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/6/60/Solar_Sailer_Coruscant.jpg
• Rickshaw with Droid (AOTC):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:RIC-920.jpg
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:RIC-droid_negtd.jpg

jedi master sal
10-04-2008, 03:14 PM
PT:
ROTS:
• AT-OT (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/All_Terrain_Open_Transport
• UT-AT (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Unstable_Terrain_Artillery_Transport
• HAV6 Juggernaut/Clone Turbo Tank (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Heavy_Assault_Vehicle/wheeled_A6_Juggernaut
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/f/f7/JuggernautROTS.jpg
• Corporate Alliance Tank Droid (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/NR-N99_Persuader-class_droid_enforcer
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:NR-N99_Persuader-class.jpg
• Wookiee Catamaran Flyer (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Oevvaor_jet_catamaran
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/6/60/Wookieeflyingcat.jpg
• Droid Gunship (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Heavy_Missile_Platform
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/2/25/HMP_Sticker.jpg
• Clone Swamp Speeder (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Infantry_Support_Platform
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/2/23/Swamp_Speeder.jpg
• Stass Allie’s speeder bike (ROTS):
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/4/4b/Stass_Allie_on_Saleucami.jpg (we have her on an incorrect BARC speeder - repaint)
• Imperial V-wing fighter (ROTS):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/5/5b/Imperial_V-wing.png (repaint)
• Anakin’s airspeeder (ROTS):
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/4/46/Dc0052.jpg
• Obi-Wan’s airspeeder from ROTS (see above, in different colors)
• Wookiee escape pod (ROTS):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/f/fb/Wookpod.JPG
• Theta-class shuttle (Emperor Palpatine’s shuttle) (ROTS):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/0/05/Theta-class_Shuttle.jpg
• Bail Organa’s speeder (ROTS):
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/2/21/Narglatchxj2.jpg
• Techno Union Starfighter (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mankvim-814_light_interceptor
• Republic Assault Gunboat (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/High-Altitude_Entry_Transport-221
• Tri-Droid (Accurate size-LARGE) (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Octuptarra_combat_tri-droid
• Coruscant Fire Ship (ROTS) No link given but can plainly be seen putting out the fire on Greivous’s ship as it makes entry and crash lands on Coruscant.

PT:
Clone Wars Carton (Genddy Tartatovsky) CW-GT and the Clone Wars movie/new cartoon show TCW:
CW-GT:
• CR-20 Troop Carrier (CW-GT):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/CR20_troop_carrier
• Asajj Ventress’ starfighter (CW-GT):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/b/ba/Fanblade.jpg
• Mini-sub (CW-GT):
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/c/c4/Mini-Sub.jpg
• Republic Gunship with airtight doors (CW-GT/TCW):
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/6/6f/Lluckylekku.JPG - could be released with different nose art
• Seismic Tank (CW-GT/TCW):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Seismic_tank
• Manta Droid Subfighter (TCW):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Manta_droid_subfighter
• Nu-Class/Republic Attack Shuttle (TCW):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Nu-class_attack_shuttle
• Republic artillery gun (TCW):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/0/01/Artillerylr.JPG
• Twilight (TCW):
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/6/6e/Twilight.jpg
• Y-wing (TCW) Now with enclosed nacelles and other armor:
http://www.lightsabre.co.uk/photos/clonewars-y-wing_concept.jpg

jedi master sal
10-04-2008, 03:23 PM
EU:
• TX-130 Saber Class Fighter Tank (EU):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TX-130_Saber-class_fighter_tank
• MAAT (Multi Altitude Assault Transport) (TFU):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Multi_Altitude_Assault_Transport
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/38/Gunshipanddestroyertfu.png
• Yuuzhan Vong Corral Skipper Starfighter (NJO):
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=151629717&albumID=343233&imageID=2586654
• IG-2000:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/IG-2000
• Prince Xizor’s Virago (SOTE):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Virago
• Imperial Skipray Blastboat (stolen and used by Talon Karrde’s agents):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/GAT-12_Skipray_Blastboat
• TIE Defender:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Defender.jpg
• Uggernaught (TFU):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/7/7a/Uggernaught.jpg
• Rogue Shadow (TFU):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/5/5c/Rogue_Shadow.jpg
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rogue_Shadow
• White Witch (Droids cartoon):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/White_Witch
• Ewok Battle Wagon (Ewoks cartoon):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ewok_battlewagon
• Trigon-One (Droids cartoon):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Trigon_One
• Sand Sloth (Droids cartoon):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sand_Sloth
• Banking Clan Ground Armored Tank (From Star Wars: The Clone Wars video game.)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ground_Armored_Tank
• Trade Federation Gunboat (From the Battle for Naboo video game, and Starfighter: Crossbones comic)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ostracoda-class_gunboat
• Scorpenek Annihilator Droid (From movie concept art, and the Essential Guide to Droids):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Scorpenek_annihilator_droid
• Hyena Droid Bomber (From Star Wars: The Clone Wars)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/-chuckc-/2781793050/
• Coralskipper (NJO)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Yorik-et
• Bes’uliik - Legacy of the Force:Sacrifice/Revelation/Invicible
http://www.swagonline.net/files/images/Bes_02_02_02.preview.jpg
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c167/Dronetto/Besuiliik__04.jpg
• Ebon Hawk - Knights of the Old Republic:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ebon_Hawk
• Raven’s Claw - EU - Jedi Knight II:Jedi Outcast
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:RavensClaw.jpg
• Moldy Crow - Dark Forces video game
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Moldy_Crow
• TIE Phantom - EU - Rebel Assault II:The Hidden Empire
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Phantom
• Imperial Gunship/Dropship - Force Unleashed Non specific ship. Is this the AT-ST dropship that breaks open upon landing on planet?
• Chiss Clawcraft
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Nssis-class_Clawcraft
• Z-95 Headhunter - really cool ship - easy retool of FX X-Wing
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Z-95_Headhunter

jedi master sal
10-04-2008, 03:27 PM
Fantasy:
With exception to the last ship in this specific list, all others where placed on this list due to size. None of them can be done affordable at true size, with possible exception to the AT-AT. So this list was made to show Hasbro that there is an interest in very large ships and these are the suggestions of them.

• Republic Acclamator I Class Assault Ship (AOTC):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Acclamator_I-class_assault_ship
• Republic Venator Class Star Destroyer (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Venator-class_Star_Destroyer
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/e/ec/Venator_clonewars.jpg
• Imperial Star Destroyer (All OT movies):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Destroyer
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/9/9f/Image-Imperator-class_Mk._I_Star_Destroyer.jpg
• Death Star (ANH-completed/ROTJ-under construction):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Death_Star
• Invisible Hand Separatist Dreadnaught (ROTS):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Invisible_Hand
• Radiant VII (TPM):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/6/6f/Consular-class_Space_Cruiser.JPG
• Padmé’s barge (AOTC):
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/2/2b/Royalcruiser.jpg
• Padmé’s skiff (EU)
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/0/08/Nabooskiff2-chron.jpg
• Tantive IV (AKA Blockade Runner; Corellian Corvette)(ANH/ROTS-repaint):
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/b/b0/Corvette-CHRON.jpg
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Tantive_IV
• Super Star Destroyer Executor (ESB/ROTJ):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/5/51/Executor-CHRON.jpg
• Banking Clan Communications Frigate (Munificent-class Star Frigate)
Malevolence:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Malevolence_%28ship%29
• Commerce Guild Destroyer (Recusant-class Light Destroyer):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Recusant-class_light_destroyer
• Trade Federation Landing Ship:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/C-9979_landing_craft
• AT-AT (more correctly scaled-at least 3 feet tall)
• Sandcrawler UPDATED Fantasy (at least 2 feet tall)
• SPHA-T (AOTC)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Self-Propelled_Heavy_Artillery
• Imperial Assault Gunboat (Cygnus Spaceworks Xg5 Starwing) (very obscure ship, with no reference given as to it’s existence)
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars-exodus/images/thumb/b/b2/AssaultGunboat.jpg/300px-AssaultGunboat.jpg

jedi master sal
10-04-2008, 03:34 PM
OT:
ANH:
• Imperial Sentinel Class Landing Craft (ANH):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sentinel-class_landing_craft
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/33/Sentinel_negvv.jpg
• Lars Family Landspeeder (V-35 Courrier) (ANH):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/V-35_Courier
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/2/24/Lars_landspeeder.jpg
(Can also be a yellow repaint as seen in Mos Eisley)
• X-wing with callsign stripe stickers (All OT movies):
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/1/17/Xw1.jpg - (use current mold)
• Outrider (YT-2400) (ANH:SE)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Outrider (more well known from the video game than the Special Edition of ANH.)
• Y-Wing - new design - larger ship (more accurately scaled) with removable droid


OT:
ESB:
• Rescaled/Resculpted Slave I (both Jango and Boba versions) (ESB/AOTC):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Slave_I
• Rebel transport (ESB):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/e/eb/GR-75_Medium_Transport.jpg - (use vintage mold OR all new mold)
• Twin-pod cloud car (ESB):
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/3f/Cloudcar-front.jpg


OT:
ROTJ:
• Jabba The Hutt’s Sail Barge (ROTJ/TCW):
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sail_barge
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/b/b3/Sailbarge.jpg
• All-Terrain Scout Transport AKA AT-ST; Chicken walker ROTJ:
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/e/e9/At-st_large_pic.jpg (new larger mold based on ROTJ)
• Speeder Bike - use the AOTC Clone Speeder just updated for Jedi
• Jabba’s skiff - make larger (to comfortably fit all prisoners & skiff guards) and a better weathering details for a paint app.

jedi master sal
10-04-2008, 03:38 PM
So this brings to the total 119 ships/vehicles that have been submitted for vote.

The breakdown is like this:
PT total: 59
TPM-24
AOTC-6
ROTS-19

OT total: 12
ANH-6
ESB-3
ROTJ-3

EU: 31

Fantasy: 17

Again this is not the voting poll. Just the preliminary lists from suggestions. vehicles/ships may be moved to a different list if need be. All 119 ships are eligible for votes in the main poll when we get to that after the subcategory polls.

You have until next Saturday (Oct 11) to make your case for a ship to be moved to a different list. As well to point out any broken links given.

Thanks again.
-Sal

FundingMyAddiction
10-04-2008, 04:38 PM
EU:
[/URL]
• Rogue Shadow (TFU):
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/5/5c/Rogue_Shadow.jpg (http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/38/Gunshipanddestroyertfu.png)

(http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sand_Sloth)

• Rogue Shadow - Force Unleashed
[URL]http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rogue_Shadow


You have the Rogue Shadow listed twice. :)

Mr. JabbaJohnL
10-04-2008, 06:41 PM
There are problems with the links for:
*Gungan Bongo Submarine (TPM) - the second picture
*Trade Federation Battleship (TPM/ROTS-as repaint)
*Neimoidian Shuttle (All PT movies)
*Rickshaw with Droid (AOTC)
*Corporate Alliance Tank Droid (ROTS) - second link
*TIE Defender
*Bes’uliik - Legacy of the Force - the first link
*Raven’s Claw - EU - Jedi Knight II
*Chiss Clawcraft

The Multi Altitude Assault Transport, Rogue Shadow, Skipray Blasboat, and White Witch are listed twice.
The Hyena Droid Bomber should be in the PT section as it's from the CW show.
The Radiant VII is in the fantasy and PT lists.
The Rebel personnel carrier is coming in a Yavin Battle Pack and should be removed.

obi-dad
10-05-2008, 12:50 AM
Hey... did i just miss it or is there any reason a new Zam Wessel's speeder scaled so that she can fit in there properly wasn't on the TPM list?

Also, why is Jabba's skiff in EU instead of ROTJ? There were 2 in the movie, what EU source were they in?

Mr. JabbaJohnL
10-05-2008, 01:52 AM
Hey... did i just miss it or is there any reason a new Zam Wessel's speeder scaled so that she can fit in there properly wasn't on the TPM list?
Well, for one, it's not from TPM. ;)

Also, if someone didn't add it last time, it won't be added. Which seems kind of odd, but whatever.

jedi master sal
10-05-2008, 08:06 AM
You have the Rogue Shadow listed twice. :)

Fixed. Thanks.

jedi master sal
10-05-2008, 08:10 AM
Hey... did i just miss it or is there any reason a new Zam Wessel's speeder scaled so that she can fit in there properly wasn't on the TPM list?

Also, why is Jabba's skiff in EU instead of ROTJ? There were 2 in the movie, what EU source were they in?

I don't recall Zam's ship being listed. I copied and pasted all posts from the suggestion thread into another program so i could sort the ships. Her's was not one among them. So it didn't get listed.

I did fixed the placement of jabba's skiff.

Thanks.

jedi master sal
10-05-2008, 08:15 AM
Well, for one, it's not from TPM. ;)

Also, if someone didn't add it last time, it won't be added. Which seems kind of odd, but whatever.


Mr. JJL, it wasn't added because noone suggested it. There was ample time given. In fact an extra week compared to the last time the poll was ran.

There are plenty of ships/vehicles to chose from for now. When we do the next poll, if someone remembers or really wants to add it to that poll then it can be suggested.

From a certain point of view, it could be considered that this wasn't a popular choice by it's lack of being suggested.

I have to cut off suggestions at some point of I'll be editing this forever and I don't want to do that. As it is, it took me 4 hours to sort all the ships, list them, and code them add links that were not provided, etc. I'm not want to do that further for additional suggestions.

jedi master sal
10-05-2008, 08:32 AM
There are problems with the links for:
*Gungan Bongo Submarine (TPM) - the second picture
*Trade Federation Battleship (TPM/ROTS-as repaint)
*Neimoidian Shuttle (All PT movies)
*Rickshaw with Droid (AOTC)
*Corporate Alliance Tank Droid (ROTS) - second link
*TIE Defender
*Bes’uliik - Legacy of the Force - the first link
*Raven’s Claw - EU - Jedi Knight II
*Chiss Clawcraft

The Multi Altitude Assault Transport, Rogue Shadow, Skipray Blasboat, and White Witch are listed twice.
The Hyena Droid Bomber should be in the PT section as it's from the CW show.
The Radiant VII is in the fantasy and PT lists.
The Rebel personnel carrier is coming in a Yavin Battle Pack and should be removed.

All have now been fixed with exception to the Hyena Droid Bomber. I found no visual evidence of this other than LEGO sets. If you would provide a link that shows this is from the cartoon show I will gladly move it to that list.

Thanks for catching all of that and please check my work to make sure I got it right this time.

dr_evazan22
10-05-2008, 10:24 AM
Posted twice is the (Clone) Swamp Speeder in the ROTS post.

Blue2th
10-05-2008, 10:48 AM
The Trade Federation Troop Transport in the first TPM list looks like an EU vehicle. Don't think it ever appeared on film, or did I miss it?

Sure you don't mean the Trade Federation Landing Craft? (which would be too huge anyway though)

Anyways nice work Sal. :thumbsup:

Mr. JabbaJohnL
10-05-2008, 12:27 PM
The Trade Federation Troop Transport in the first TPM list looks like an EU vehicle. Don't think it ever appeared on film, or did I miss it?

Sure you don't mean the Trade Federation Landing Craft? (which would be too huge anyway though)

Anyways nice work Sal. :thumbsup:
It's seen briefly in TPM, I know, as OOM-9 is talking to the holographs of Nute Gunray and Rune Haako on Naboo. It's also on Kashyyyk in ROTS.


Mr. JJL, it wasn't added because noone suggested it. There was ample time given. In fact an extra week compared to the last time the poll was ran.

Yeah, I know, and I was fine with it. I remember in the figure poll, though, I kept thinking of figures that weren't on the list originally, and it was frustrating. So I know how obi-dad feels (even though I don't want another Zam Wesell speeder ;) ).

Devo
10-05-2008, 07:59 PM
How many ships will be on the final list put to Hasbro? Presumably not 119 as that would be utterly meaningless. Top 5, top 10? Sorry if I missed this.

cookiemonster
10-05-2008, 11:18 PM
Where is the EU Vintage Mini Rigs, I would like to see them released again and for under 20.00 dollars these would be ideal. Also I dont see the Imperial Troop Transport.

jedi master sal
10-06-2008, 03:10 PM
Posted twice is the (Clone) Swamp Speeder in the ROTS post.


Fixed. Good catch!

jedi master sal
10-06-2008, 03:21 PM
How many ships will be on the final list put to Hasbro? Presumably not 119 as that would be utterly meaningless. Top 5, top 10? Sorry if I missed this.

Actually, all the ships will be listed and given to Hasbro. However special recognition will be given to the top overall 10, then a set amount per the 4 subcategories.

The top amount per sub category will be different due to amount of ships suggested list. For instance, OT only had a dozen suggested vehicles. We'll highlight the top 3 form there. Whereas PT had about 2 dozen, so we'll highlight the top 7-8 of those, and about 10 of the top EU ships. Fantasy ships are just that so we'll just give them the straight up list of ships in that category and the order in which they received the most votes.

I'll also include suggested pricepoints for these even though Hasbro of course is free to sell them for as high or low as they want. The reason for the suggested pricepoints is to reflect the relative size we as collectors would tolerate for specific vehicles. In other words, no $20 Twilight as that would be WAY underscaled.

In the case of the fantasy ships, Hasbro can do with that as they please. We'll be asking for large ships, for example a 7 foot Star Destroyer. At this time it's not possible for Hasbro, but who knows. So the pricepoint would be determined by Hasbro. Something that large I'd venture to guess to be $300-500. That's a large enough margin and may still not be enough for Hasbro given the complexity and size of the craft and any playability features they decide to throw into it.

So to sum it up, we'll be giving them every bit of info we can. Most popular over all, most popular by era, ultimate fantasy ships, tolerable pricepoints, etc. The more we give them, the more they have to make a more informed decision. It's up to them how they want to disseminate the info. We can just provide it to them.

jedi master sal
10-06-2008, 03:23 PM
Where is the EU Vintage Mini Rigs, I would like to see them released again and for under 20.00 dollars these would be ideal. Also I dont see the Imperial Troop Transport.

Sorry, the time to suggest ships to be on the list has expired. That was on noon this past Saturday. Please feel free to suggest these in the next poll, next year.

While I agree there are some cool mini rigs I'd like to see rereleased, there are many good suggestions already in the lists given.

cookiemonster
10-06-2008, 08:31 PM
Sal just to point out something I did mention the Mini Rigs on the original list, but its ok, I can add them next year.:thumbsup:

jedi master sal
10-07-2008, 07:21 AM
Sal just to point out something I did mention the Mini Rigs on the original list, but its ok, I can add them next year.:thumbsup:

Not in the suggestion thread. I just checked. Any previous list from past years does not count. Any previous thread does not count.

Reasons for that are simple, collectors change their minds about what they want. I can't go scouring the site for old posts about what people want. I won't bring up old suggestions from another thread from another collector as they might not be interested in that ship anymore.

It's up to individual to suggest. In the case of the mini-rigs, they weren't in the suggestions thread. That's pretty cut and dry.

Again, keep them in mind for next year. Like I mentioned, I happen to like many of the mini-rigs and I'm sure they'd bring some nostalgia with them to capture votes.

Last time I did the poll we capped the list at about 75-80, IIRC. There was approx 40 more ships this time around, so there is plenty to choose from.

cookiemonster
10-07-2008, 01:01 PM
Oh I aint questioning your power/judgement I know I didnt list the Vehicles in the Post you took these from I listed them in the post before that which is the one I had thought you had used.

Like you said there is a lot of ships there, just would have liked the mini-rigs as part of that, however like you say theres always next year.:thumbsup:

jedi master sal
10-07-2008, 04:25 PM
Funny thing is I asked JT about using that previous thread for suggestions and he said no.

We'll hopefully catch it next year.

Ando
10-07-2008, 04:50 PM
In the case of the fantasy ships, Hasbro can do with that as they please. We'll be asking for large ships, for example a 7 foot Star Destroyer. At this time it's not possible for Hasbro, but who knows. So the pricepoint would be determined by Hasbro. Something that large I'd venture to guess to be $300-500. That's a large enough margin and may still not be enough for Hasbro given the complexity and size of the craft and any playability features they decide to throw into it.

I should hope that Hasbro would be open to at least considering the idea of large capital ships (or barring that, playsets of hangars and flight decks and control rooms), especially in light of products like this: http://www.hasbrotoyshop.com/ProductsByBrand.htm?BR=688&SBR=414&ID=17783 (http://www.hasbrotoyshop.com/ProductsByBrand.htm?BR=688&SBR=414&ID=17783)

Hey look, it's on sale!

JediTricks
10-09-2008, 03:08 AM
Funny thing is I asked JT about using that previous thread for suggestions and he said no.

We'll hopefully catch it next year.
What are you talking about? Where did I say "no" to that?




I should hope that Hasbro would be open to at least considering the idea of large capital ships (or barring that, playsets of hangars and flight decks and control rooms), especially in light of products like this: http://www.hasbrotoyshop.com/ProductsByBrand.htm?BR=688&SBR=414&ID=17783 (http://www.hasbrotoyshop.com/ProductsByBrand.htm?BR=688&SBR=414&ID=17783)

Hey look, it's on sale!Getting little girls to buy a pony isn't quite the marketing challenge that a SW capital ship would be. The success of Butterscotch (their first robot pony) helped pave the way for the Falcon & AT-TE, but by no means is it anywhere near the same level of success.

jedi master sal
10-09-2008, 07:48 AM
If I'm not mistaken it was a PM, though it may have been in one of the threads.

I distinctly remember it though and it's been evident that you don't approve of the way I'm running the poll now.

I don't know where this negativity has come from with you against me in this poll. While I ran the last one pretty fast and that bothered some, the point was it got done.

I sat back for awhile this time in hopes that someone would step up with suggestions on how to run the poll since PMs between you and I discussed about this clearly made me feel that you no longer wanted me running this poll.

When noone stepped up, I again took the reigns.

We WASTED MONTHS of time just talking about this subject in another thread instead of getting the poll done. Hasbro WAS interested. Now I fear due to our lack of action early on, they may think there really wasn't that much interest after all.

So I took it upon myself again to get this thing moving.

It is.

This thread will be closed early morning Saturday, and the first poll put up over the weekend. I'll be out of town Saturday afternoon and possible the first part of the day Sunday. So in all likelyhood the first poll will be put up on Sunday evening.

Each poll will run approximately one week. Though some may spill over a little longer if there are not clear "winners".

The main poll will take 2 weeks because it will run in at least 2 phases if not more to pare down the top vote getters.

There are 5 polls total. At barest minimum that means 6 weeks of polls. I've already said as much previously. If that's not clear and concise enough as to the timing, then I don't know what is.

Ando
10-09-2008, 09:37 AM
Getting little girls to buy a pony isn't quite the marketing challenge that a SW capital ship would be. The success of Butterscotch (their first robot pony) helped pave the way for the Falcon & AT-TE, but by no means is it anywhere near the same level of success.

Little girls don't have money, their parents do.

The same parents who'd have to spring for the capital ships for their sons.

Assuming they have home space and cash for a animatronic pony, they would have it for a comparably priced and sized toy star ship.

DarthBrandon
10-09-2008, 09:42 AM
Little girls don't have money, their parents do.

The same parents who'd have to spring for the capital ships for their sons.

Assuming they have home space and cash for a animatronic pony, they would have it for a comparably priced and sized toy star ship.


Much agree here, I think we all need to step back take a deep breath, get a list of ships together & leave the ego's at the door sort a speak. We all want to achieve the same things here. (new vehicles small & large)

JediTricks
10-09-2008, 05:32 PM
If I'm not mistaken it was a PM, though it may have been in one of the threads. I have all of our PMs, and I haven't deleted any posts or threads, I cannot find it or anything suggesting it.


I distinctly remember it though and it's been evident that you don't approve of the way I'm running the poll now.

I don't know where this negativity has come from with you against me in this poll. While I ran the last one pretty fast and that bothered some, the point was it got done.For one thing, the fact that you see this as being about you and me is a big part of the problem. This should not be about ego and yet it is. The way I see it, the whole thing should be about good results that help properly shape the future of the line, it shouldn't be about who is running it or who gets credit for what ideas.


I sat back for awhile this time in hopes that someone would step up with suggestions on how to run the poll since PMs between you and I discussed about this clearly made me feel that you no longer wanted me running this poll.I don't care who runs it, I really don't, but it is very important I feel that we change the dynamic, make something that will have greater impact than forums polls of the past which haven't gotten us where this needs to be. Running it the same, as you have suggested and as some have supported, merely because that's how you did it in the past, will not change anything and will not send a positive message to Hasbro about what collectors want, it'll only undermine what's trying to be done with the poll.



When noone stepped up, I again took the reigns.

We WASTED MONTHS of time just talking about this subject in another thread instead of getting the poll done. Hasbro WAS interested. Now I fear due to our lack of action early on, they may think there really wasn't that much interest after all.

So I took it upon myself again to get this thing moving.

It is.We have no timeline right now, but at the very least we know we cannot give them the results properly until at least Februrary. We have time to waste, there is no need to rush or to lock in our answer. Doing it wrong just because it needs to be done is not useful, and I fear it could end up being a step backwards - this situation of "I thought I posted this idea in your thread, no you posted it in the other thread which I can't use even though nobody said I couldn't use it" is a fine example of how rushing to action only to do it wrong can hurt the results.


This thread will be closed early morning Saturday, and the first poll put up over the weekend. I'll be out of town Saturday afternoon and possible the first part of the day Sunday. So in all likelyhood the first poll will be put up on Sunday evening.

Each poll will run approximately one week. Though some may spill over a little longer if there are not clear "winners".

The main poll will take 2 weeks because it will run in at least 2 phases if not more to pare down the top vote getters.

There are 5 polls total. At barest minimum that means 6 weeks of polls. I've already said as much previously. If that's not clear and concise enough as to the timing, then I don't know what is.It's obviously not clear, you don't even know if a poll will have to run long or not - in my book, there's no way as a representative of the site I could support that. And once we have the results, then what, where's the timeline to deliver them? Why the rush to get it done week by week when there's no short-term goal anyway?

Ultimately, SSG will be sponsoring a vehicle poll because that's what we discussed with Hasbro when they saw what came out of the figure poll, so the question is will it be the one you're running or another one, and if the answer is "another one", which right now it seems to be, then it seems like we're spinning our wheels. I don't want to see anybody spinning their wheels on this, but I'm not willing to compromise the quality of the results just to get everybody to smile on the matter. So what to do?





Little girls don't have money, their parents do.

The same parents who'd have to spring for the capital ships for their sons.

Assuming they have home space and cash for a animatronic pony, they would have it for a comparably priced and sized toy star ship.Little girls who get these are very focused on ponies though, while boys really are more scattorshot with their wants in general. There's no comparison, girls who want ponies REAAAALLY want ponies; the boys who want a Star Destroyer just aren't as dedicated, and likely won't be as satiated if they got them.

Ando
10-09-2008, 06:17 PM
Little girls who get these are very focused on ponies though, while boys really are more scattorshot with their wants in general. There's no comparison, girls who want ponies REAAAALLY want ponies; the boys who want a Star Destroyer just aren't as dedicated, and likely won't be as satiated if they got them.

I won't argue with you on the whole girls love ponies thing. I don't get it, but it's completely true... My whole point is that if Hasbro makes something that will appeal to a very specific market (little girls who want an animatronic pony), I don't see why they couldn't at least make a run at something comparably sized and priced for a much BROADER market kids + collectors.

Collectors aren't all neccessarily rich, but they do spend what they can on their various collections. SW isn't my only hobby. Over the years I have spent large amounts of money on DVD's, Benchmade knives (automatics are legal here in OR!), books, electronics, etc. I am by no means rich, but I have a good income and can spend disproportionate amounts of money on my passions and hobbies.

Would I buy a not quite to scale large capital ship? Depends on the ship, really. As long as I have room to display or store it, I will always find the money for something SW that is effing awesome.

And I disagree with you about boys... If Hasbro made a 3-6 foot Star Destroyer, there's gonna be an essload of kids out there (boys and girls) who would **** themselves trying to get their folks to bring it home as a Christmas or Birthday present. They may not neccessarily care what kind of ship it is, but if it's big and it's Star Wars, they'll want it.

cookiemonster
10-10-2008, 07:15 AM
Sal and JT I am sorry I said anything I dont want this to turn into anotheR Site where people are arguing at each other over something someone else said, I am fine to go with whatever happens, but I dont want to be the cause of any upset, just beacuse I mentioned that a few plastic toys werent on a list, I feel bad now.

jedi master sal
10-10-2008, 08:20 AM
No worries Cookiee.

JT, I was going to post this above but didn't, but now I will.

Since when did Steve put you totally in charge of this site? If that's the case, then take charge. Create the polls and let's get moving. Just because "we have time to waste" doesn't mean we should.

From discussions with Tycho, it seems Hasbro will be fine with the info provided to them by these new polls that will be run over the course of the next several weeks.

You still give no clear answer on how the polls should be run, instead just being determined to knock my way of doing them down.

This time around, there is a lot more info that will be produced for Hasbro.

If what I and others have been contributing to for the last couple of weeks have been folly, then why didn't you stop it then and say we weren't going to use this poll? So you have in essence wasted all of the rest of our time by saying this. Again, has Steve given you this authority? I'd actually like to see Steve post as such, because in the mean time, you are actually undermining the wishes of many forumites, not just me.

You CLEARLY stated in a PM to me that you wanted the polls to run like Mad Slanted Powers ran his figure poll. A poll in which Tycho reminds me was NOT done with your permission but rather he (MSP) just ran with it. In fact you even said to me in a PM that you wanted him (MSP) in charge of the vehicle poll. Do I still have those PMs? No. Why? Because of the small 50 PM limit here. I have transactions and other discussions by PM that tend to put me at this limit so I have to clear out older messages. Regardless, that doesn't mean that the PMs I'm refering to didn't happen. I will NOT lie about this to pump myself up. What I am saying here is truthful.

So, if you want to shut down this vehicle poll, then do so right here and now. Don't further waste more of the rest of our time. But in the interim, if you are going to be the leader of this site that you are touting yourself to be, then YOU come up with the poll YOU want.

I spent four hours last Saturday organizing these lists and getting them ready for the polls. I started this whole shebang this time around at the urgence of Tycho since he has the confidence in my ability to run the vehicle poll. I happen to respect and like Tycho and call him a friend and confidant on this site. So I took his advice and went with it. Instead of the four hours spent on this last Saturday, I could have been doing several other things. Instead I did the behind the scenes legwork to get this moving to the next phase.

This for me was not at all or ever about ego. Rather it was about getting the info to Hasbro in a timely manner, with more detailing than we've had in the past.

For a living I am in Marketing. The old addage is Time is Money. In this respect we are wasting time, which in the broad spectrum of things is wasting money for Hasbro. While we could provide them with info before the end of the year which in turn could help them plan out the vehicle line sooner and with greater info, you are choosing to wait. For what reason? To have something better? What is better to you? With the utmost respect to our fellow forumites, had someone come up with a plan before I posted this new poll, I would have been fine to roll with it, even if it meant I wasn't running it. Me running this poll is not the concern for me, so don't charge me with that accusation.

Okay, now this all being said, I also do not want this site to turn into anotheR Site. So let's get this thing on track. Be that the current plans or something new. But I highly suggest we get moving on it.

Respectfully,
Sal

Tycho
10-10-2008, 02:05 PM
I don't want to flame the fires of a war here, but I can stand by what Sal just posted.

Now, "List your 10 most wanted yet-unmade vehicles:"

1. Sailbarge
2. Droid Gunship
3. Tank Droid
4. Wookiee Catamaran
5. Twin Pod Cloud Car
6. Turbotank
7. Virago
8. IG-2000
9. Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip
10. Gungan Bongo Submarine

(I don't know if these are really my final votes - but close to it.)

The point is: I'M DONE.

Someone tally how many of my votes are common to everyone else's. Send the top 10 out of everyone's vote to Hasbro.

Sal's method gathers a bit more actually valuable information.

The way I see what he's doing is:

Phase I

- List all the ships you want that you don't see anyone else has already listed: "Tycho: Jek Porkins Deep Space Flying Hamburger Stand"

Phase II

Everyone pick their top 5 prequel, sequel, and EU ships from these.

Now we have data such that if Hasbro wants to do Classic - they see we want the sailbarge, and next, a Cloud Car. If Hasbro doesn't want to do a $150 vehicle, they'll take our second pick, a $20 vehicle.

If Hasbro wants to do a prequel vehicle, then maybe the Bongo won...but the Tank Droid might be cheaper if that's what they're after. Let them pick the pricepoints.

Phase III

List your Top 10 from these 15 favorites from each genre. If no EU makes it, then we won't show a vote for Jek Porkins' Flying Hamburger Stand.

DarthBrandon
10-10-2008, 02:33 PM
I don't want to flame the fires of a war here, but I can stand by what Sal just posted.

Now, "List your 10 most wanted yet-unmade vehicles:"

1. Sailbarge
2. Droid Gunship
3. Tank Droid
4. Wookiee Catamaran
5. Twin Pod Cloud Car
6. Turbotank
7. Virago
8. IG-2000
9. Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip
10. Gungan Bongo Submarine

(I don't know if these are really my final votes - but close to it.)

The point is: I'M DONE.



On that note mine are:

1.) Tantive IV (Dreaming the big dream)
2.) Sailbarge
3.) TX 130 Saber Class Fighter Tank
3.) Imperial Landing Craft
4.) Rebel Transport
5.) Cloud Car (New One Please)
6.) Palpy's Shuttle ROTS
7.) Larger Sandcrawler
8.) Bail's Speeder
9.) Republic Assault Gunboat
10.)Bongo Sub

pegger
10-10-2008, 03:10 PM
"Tycho: Jek Porkins Deep Space Flying Hamburger Stand"


Do you have a link?

Jargo
10-10-2008, 03:17 PM
this whole idea of polling is a crock of turd. there aren't enough people voting in any poll on thos site to get any decent stats. waste of time completely.

JediTricks
10-10-2008, 04:29 PM
Sal and JT I am sorry I said anything I dont want this to turn into anotheR Site where people are arguing at each other over something someone else said, I am fine to go with whatever happens, but I dont want to be the cause of any upset, just beacuse I mentioned that a few plastic toys werent on a list, I feel bad now.Don't worry about it, you didn't, this was clearly an issue that wasn't getting resolved coming to a head, your issue just touched off what was already there.



JT, I was going to post this above but didn't, but now I will.

Since when did Steve put you totally in charge of this site? If that's the case, then take charge. Create the polls and let's get moving. Just because "we have time to waste" doesn't mean we should.He didn't put me in charge of the site, he put me in charge of the forums and it's my advice he goes with on situations like these because he and I communicate enough that he's made clear what is needed. I'm not trying to waste time for the sake of wasting time, I'm trying to spend the necessary amount of time to get it done RIGHT, there's a big difference. Haste makes waste.


From discussions with Tycho, it seems Hasbro will be fine with the info provided to them by these new polls that will be run over the course of the next several weeks. I was standing right there when they made the suggestion on the vehicles poll, "more like this" is what they said, Tycho just spins it into a generalization because that's how he is, he sees things through his lens. But they want harder data and stronger results that are well-organized and supported, not just a simple, unrefined list.


You still give no clear answer on how the polls should be run, instead just being determined to knock my way of doing them down.Because there is no clear answer, instead of finalizing ideas that had been thrown out, you merely made it all about how you've done it in the past, rush to action rather than ensuring there's a solid plan and foundation.


If what I and others have been contributing to for the last couple of weeks have been folly, then why didn't you stop it then and say we weren't going to use this poll? So you have in essence wasted all of the rest of our time by saying this. Again, has Steve given you this authority? I'd actually like to see Steve post as such, because in the mean time, you are actually undermining the wishes of many forumites, not just me.Which one of us rushed to action and wasted people's time? That would be you, not me. I was hoping we could work this out and get a workable plan before you took this to the point of no return, that's why I didn't want to shut it down. But you knew I had these issues, there was no question about that, you've made it abundantly clear.

And if you'd like to question my responsibility on anything on this site, go right ahead and ask Steve personally, but ultimately you'll find out what's already clear, Steve trusts my judgment on this stuff because he knows that I understand what he wants for the site and its community, what is in its best interest. When the figures poll went up and the site supported it in the news, that was all me, never heard a peep from Steve about it. When I told him SSG needed to bring the results to Hasbro at Comic-Con, he was totally on board with letting his site's reputation be carried by the work simply on my say-so, again, because he trusts my judgment.


You CLEARLY stated in a PM to me that you wanted the polls to run like Mad Slanted Powers ran his figure poll. A poll in which Tycho reminds me was NOT done with your permission but rather he (MSP) just ran with it. In fact you even said to me in a PM that you wanted him (MSP) in charge of the vehicle poll. Do I still have those PMs? No. Why? Because of the small 50 PM limit here. I have transactions and other discussions by PM that tend to put me at this limit so I have to clear out older messages. Regardless, that doesn't mean that the PMs I'm refering to didn't happen. I will NOT lie about this to pump myself up. What I am saying here is truthful.Tycho's interpretation is through his own lens again, as usual. Read this thread (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=36845) and you'll see that what happened was Tycho's original idea got cut down (by you, in fact), then we all made suggestions on what would make it a better poll that I felt I could support in news and throw the site's weight behind, we discussed the pros and cons of the concepts shown (you were a part of throwing out some of both T's and MSP's ideas, I might add). Then MSP made compelling arguments and backed them up in a simple, direct manner, but still we refined and refined his concept too. And then I was the one who kicked MSP to start the thread, see from here: 594209
And look on the next page, post 104, where I tell MSP that when he starts the thread I will move it to the new section - how is that me standing in the way? Oh, not at all, that's how. And then, after we discussed it some more, here's how MSP didn't have my permission, when I said to MSP before he started:

Well, let's see how it goes...
Yeah, that's really standing in his way. Oh wait, it was my post the page before which even started him working on it then and there, since Tycho wanted to wait until August '08 and have 40 polls, I said it should just get going. Discussion and then "let's see how it goes", right. Look at how many iterations of that poll concept were floated before MSP ultimately got to the one he did. If you keep reading that thread, you'll keep seeing me saying "it's your thing, here's my suggestion, concern, and constructive criticism, but keep going". So Tycho is just plain wrong on this one, and you are being misguided by his word.

By the way, you can export your existing PMs into your harddrive as a text file or XML or CSV, then delete them. That's what I always do, I have 6 years worth of PMs archived on my harddrive. But from what you said about me telling you I wanted a poll run as well and as scientifically as MSPs, there's no need to quote, that's absolutely true, I do want that. I did say I would prefer his expertise, but I didn't say it had to be run by him. What's wrong with that? This still seems to be the ego thing I was talking about Sal, why should striving for the best results possible be a bad thing? I won't and haven't hidden the fact that I don't think the way the past forums vehicle polls have been run are scientific enough and give good enough results or have a wide enough cross-section of votes. If that hurts your feelings, then your ego is too invested in the poll, but I assure you it wasn't meant to hurt your feelings or devalue your input, it was only meant to give the best results to Hasbro we can, that's all that matters to me. And nowhere in there did I say you couldn't use the other thread's existing vehicle suggestions, that's ludicrous.


So, if you want to shut down this vehicle poll, then do so right here and now. Don't further waste more of the rest of our time. But in the interim, if you are going to be the leader of this site that you are touting yourself to be, then YOU come up with the poll YOU want. Then you leave me no choice, you are the one wasting our time with a poll that is going off the rails which will end in poor results, so consider it shut down for now. The site is going to deliver a vehicle poll to Hasbro in '09, one that as site representative I'm confident in that the methodology and results will reflect the site and the collectors, and until we hammer out what's not working, there is no reason to go forward now only to have to redo it later. I am really busy, it's hard enough keeping the forums and Q&A together along with my real-life obligations.


I spent four hours last Saturday organizing these lists and getting them ready for the polls. I started this whole shebang this time around at the urgence of Tycho since he has the confidence in my ability to run the vehicle poll. I happen to respect and like Tycho and call him a friend and confidant on this site. So I took his advice and went with it. Instead of the four hours spent on this last Saturday, I could have been doing several other things. Instead I did the behind the scenes legwork to get this moving to the next phase.Funny, you didn't have confidence in Tycho's ability to run the figure poll before, you cut his ideas down left and right, had no problem waiting then, and yet you didn't see that as an attack on his person. Why is this different? I do appreciate the time you put in, but I don't appreciate the leaping to action without taking into consideration what the end result and foundation should be.


For a living I am in Marketing. The old addage is Time is Money. In this respect we are wasting time, which in the broad spectrum of things is wasting money for Hasbro. While we could provide them with info before the end of the year which in turn could help them plan out the vehicle line sooner and with greater info, you are choosing to wait. For what reason? To have something better? What is better to you? With the utmost respect to our fellow forumites, had someone come up with a plan before I posted this new poll, I would have been fine to roll with it, even if it meant I wasn't running it. Me running this poll is not the concern for me, so don't charge me with that accusation.We are not wasting time when we strive to make a better foundation for the poll, we are wasting time when we jump into a poll that won't provide good results and will have to be done over again. We're giving Hasbro free market research if we do it right, I'm sure they aren't losing anything there.

And how would we provide them with the info before the end of the year? Are you planning to fly to Rhode Island, go through the hassle of trying to set up an in-person meeting with the team, and talk with them about methodology and results? Because otherwise, we're not going to be able to provide them with any info until we next see them in person - February '09 - and even that may not get the right team members. I could try to work something out with my Q&A contacts to get it done via email sooner, but certainly I'd want to be extremely confident with the materials we gave them, and there's no guarantee they'd be receptive that way, I'd certainly have to go out on a limb there.


Okay, now this all being said, I also do not want this site to turn into anotheR Site. So let's get this thing on track. Be that the current plans or something new. But I highly suggest we get moving on it.Done. Let's take a step back and take a breath, feel free to respond to this without the looming deadline of starting a poll that may not make it to the end.

We have a list now. I would like to see methodology worked out a little better, and a clearer poll opening post. I already suggested a hybrid of MSP's tallying system and your breakdown of "PT, OT, EU, Fantasy" in the other thread. It seems like top 10 isn't enough though, I was thinking more top 20.



I don't want to flame the fires of a war here, but I can stand by what Sal just posted.

Now, "List your 10 most wanted yet-unmade vehicles:"

1. Sailbarge
2. Droid Gunship
3. Tank Droid
4. Wookiee Catamaran
5. Twin Pod Cloud Car
6. Turbotank
7. Virago
8. IG-2000
9. Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip
10. Gungan Bongo Submarine

(I don't know if these are really my final votes - but close to it.)

The point is: I'M DONE.
Well zippity doo dah! Tycho's done, the lord on high has spoken. Oh wait, this isn't the "Tycho's top 10" poll, this is about what EVERYBODY wants, not just you. You seemed content to participate in MSP's figure poll even though many of your entries didn't make the cut. The bottom line is that it's not enough to get a sampling of everybody's top choices and then just float the most common ones, you have to take that and find out which of those top results would get picked from the group even if it didn't make their original top list - that's how you get a good top list that holds up to scrutiny.

Tycho
10-10-2008, 09:57 PM
The bottom line is that it's not enough to get a sampling of everybody's top choices and then just float the most common ones, you have to take that and find out which of those top results would get picked from the group even if it didn't make their original top list - that's how you get a good top list that holds up to scrutiny.

Then do it.

Hey, I understand what it's like to be busy (I actually do). But if you can't run the poll, designate how you'd like it to be determined that we run the poll, and let JMS run with it. It's halfway to November now. Hasbro suggested they'd be interested in this last JULY. How busy can someone be - especially when they don't have to run this poll themselves? You see why this begs conspiracy theories.

DarthBrandon
10-11-2008, 10:59 AM
Well zippity doo dah! Tycho's done, the lord on high has spoken. Oh wait, this isn't the "Tycho's top 10" poll, this is about what EVERYBODY wants, not just you. You seemed content to participate in MSP's figure poll even though many of your entries didn't make the cut. The bottom line is that it's not enough to get a sampling of everybody's top choices and then just float the most common ones, you have to take that and find out which of those top results would get picked from the group even if it didn't make their original top list - that's how you get a good top list that holds up to scrutiny.


Well, here's the thing Tycho's made his top 10 list, I've made a top 10 list; if everyone makes a top 10 list then we can take that data & break it down into movies / EU/ Fantasy or what-ever the frack you want to call it. I for one would like to see this completed in the near future rather than sit around and wait to see who wants to take over the galaxy here.

Tycho's list has the following:

1. Sailbarge
2. Droid Gunship
3. Tank Droid
4. Wookiee Catamaran
5. Twin Pod Cloud Car
6. Turbotank
7. Virago
8. IG-2000
9. Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip
10. Gungan Bongo Submarine

I have the following:

1.) Tantive IV (Dreaming the big dream)
2.) Sailbarge
3.) TX 130 Saber Class Fighter Tank
3.) Imperial Landing Craft
4.) Rebel Transport
5.) Cloud Car (New One Please)
6.) Palpy's Shuttle ROTS
7.) Larger Sandcrawler
8.) Bail's Speeder
9.) Republic Assault Gunboat
10.)Bongo Sub

You can break them down like this:

(This is just a quick example)

ROTJ: Sailbarge (2 Votes so far)
ESB: Cloud Car (2 Votes so far)
ROTS: Droid Gunship (1 Vote so far)
ROTS: Palpy's Shuttle (1 Vote so far)
ROTS: Turbo Tank (1 Vote so far)
EU: TX 130 Saber Class Fighter Tank (1 Vote so far)
TPM: Bongo Sub (2 Votes so far)
ESB: Rebel Transport (1 Vote so far)
ANH: Larger Sandcrawler (1 Vote so far)
EU: Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip (1 Vote so far)
EU: Virago (1 Vote so far)
ANH/ROTS or Fantasy: Tantive IV (1 Vote so far)

Not too hard, & once the votes are all tallied we should see something similar as above & then submit it to Hasbro as soon as possible rather than later.

cookiemonster
10-11-2008, 11:23 AM
I am going to wait, as I have just looked at the list again, and its to top heavy in Favour of PT Vehicles and EU Vehicles, theres only 12 OT Vehicles and I know theres more than that I want. So I am going to have to agree with JT less haste more thought, as I wasnt even aware that there was a new list until Sal pointed it out, I was going of the original which wasnt used for whatever reason (I dont want to get into that), I say do a new list and this time in fairness take from that list, but give everyone enough time to look at the list and tell them this is the list Sal will be working from, so if they want anything to be put forward then to place the ships they want on that list, once we have that done then we can get the voting started, so delay it until the end of Nov, then start voting at the end of Nov through to the end of Dec, then tally the votes.

Because at the min this is just a cluster ****, and I dont think its anyones fault, not Sal's who was doing what he thought right, and not JT's which he thought he was doing what was right.

So I am all for starting over again with Sal at the controls, seeing he was the one who got of his *** and started doing it, just communication was poor between both parties it seems.

JediTricks
10-11-2008, 03:10 PM
Then do it.

Hey, I understand what it's like to be busy (I actually do). But if you can't run the poll, designate how you'd like it to be determined that we run the poll, and let JMS run with it. It's halfway to November now. Hasbro suggested they'd be interested in this last JULY. How busy can someone be - especially when they don't have to run this poll themselves? You see why this begs conspiracy theories.Aww, is my taking care of my elderly grandmother who has started suffering the ravages of Alzheimer's slightly slowing down a process that won't even matter until at least February of next year a burden for you, Tycho? Sure, I'll let her suffer in fear and loneliness and starvation so you can have your precious poll a few days early despite the fact that it'll clearly taint the final results and not create a rounded statistical report that would go a long way towards helping convince Hasbro of its results.

I'll say it again... WE CANNOT GIVE THEM RESULTS ANY SOONER THAN FEBRUARY OF NEXT YEAR, AND EVEN THAT IS AN UNLIKELY EARLY DATE. Rushing towards a goal of nothing is pointless. Which do you want, results that are done right and will impress upon Hasbro their importance, or results done slipshod and lacking statistical analysis that will impress nothing upon Hasbro? I can't see why anybody would want to rush to the latter when a little extra time and care will make the former happen.

I notice you didn't seem too particularly interested in helping with this poll, beyond pushing Sal with behind the scenes puppetstringing simply to suit your selfish "gotta have it now" ways. Where are you stepping up with the genius ideas this time, where are you saying you will tally the data and put in the time it takes to write and edit this poll? Oh, that's right, you enjoy good results but you don't really want to put in any time developing the system that creates them.



Well, here's the thing Tycho's made his top 10 list, I've made a top 10 list; if everyone makes a top 10 list then we can take that data & break it down into movies / EU/ Fantasy or what-ever the frack you want to call it. I for one would like to see this completed in the near future rather than sit around and wait to see who wants to take over the galaxy here.That doesn't deliver any statistical data beyond items that are on multiple lists. Cloud Car is #2 on your mixed list despite it not making past #5 on either of your lists; the Gungan Sub is even worse, #3 in votes despite the fact that both of you ranked it the lowest on your list. That is proof right there that the method you and Tycho are subscribing to won't work too well. Haste making waste.

Just be a little patient, you can vote whenever, your opinions won't change if we do it now or next week, and you don't have to worry about editing threads or linking all the entries or any of that heavy lifting, Sal and I will take care of that in each poll.

Tycho
10-11-2008, 07:44 PM
Oh, that's right, you enjoy good results but you don't really want to put in any time developing the system that creates them.

Actually, I put a lot of time and effort into doing just that for this site. Click on the POLLS section in these forums. You remember. I also did the big comprehensive "Most Wanted and Never Made Before" figure poll for delivery at Celebration 3. There was some considerable rebellion concerning my method, and Kidhuman did "a list 'em poll" and that was deemed very acceptable and less controversial to most people here. I delivered both results to Hasbro (with Dr.Evezan as my witness) and 36 out of 50 results were the same on both the lists. Now we've gotten approximately 60% of our winning figures made - with a lot more (like the Lars family) rumored for next year.

It was never really complicated.

I understand you taking care of your grandma. That's very good of you.

I am having a kidney transplant in almost exactly another week. As I recover, I have to work on a complete re-editing of my 500 page novel. I don't think I sound like the right guy to do a most-wanted-vehicle-poll, do you? And at the same time, I could, if mainly YOU, along with any others with some doubts, would just accept LIST POLLS.

Yes COOKIEEMONSTER, there are less OT vehicles left to be made. That's the obvious reason why this poll skews towards PT vehicles. And PT vehicles will undoubtedly beat OT in an open competition. That's why it's cool with me to first have an OT list poll along with the other categories, so Hasbro can see where to go if they want to specifically make an OT vehicle. And hey - my No.1 most-wanted vehicle is OT: Jabba's Sailbarge!!!

So I think I agree with you.



That doesn't deliver any statistical data beyond items that are on multiple lists. Cloud Car is #2 on your mixed list despite it not making past #5 on either of your lists; the Gungan Sub is even worse, #3 in votes despite the fact that both of you ranked it the lowest on your list.

That's what happens with statistics. But if Hasbro uses them, they'll see that maybe a Cloud Car or Gungan Sub is neither of our most-wanted, BUT WE WILL BOTH BUY THEM IF OFFERED. (I intend to buy THREE (3) Cloud Cars actually).


That is proof right there that the method you and Tycho are subscribing to won't work too well.

It works perfectly. Your example doesn't illustrate there being a problem in my eyes.


and you don't have to worry about editing threads or linking all the entries or any of that heavy lifting, Sal and I will take care of that in each poll.

Well, I'm glad I won't have to do the work (as I used to do plenty of it around here, including testing all the new plastic to make sure it was good for consumer sniffing. Do you know of any other website that has a resident lunatic on staff 24/7? Well do you?)

Meanwhile, I'm glad to see you being open to working with JediMasterSal on this matter of the polls. I know how much this matters to him. And along with being busy myself, and fully respecting the wonderful job MadSlantedPowers did with the much harder action figure poll, I don't want to see this project pulled away from Sal - a friend and the guy who is really enthusiastic about doing this.

I'll wait with building excitement to see what you guys come up with.

- Tycho

pegger
10-11-2008, 09:14 PM
Oh my God.

Guys - it's a freaking vehicle poll - over plastic, crappy toys.

Guess what - and the end of the day - the markets are still down, and life will still continue.

Star Wars collecting should be fun. Polling should be fun. If I wanted all this drama - I'd watch chick shows.

cookiemonster
10-11-2008, 09:16 PM
Can I ask why I am being shouted at Tycho, even you agreed with me at the end of what I said.

Tycho
10-11-2008, 10:30 PM
Can I ask why I am being shouted at Tycho, even you agreed with me at the end of what I said.

You're not being shouted at. ???

Sorry if you took it that way.

Oh, I see. I spelled your name in CAPS because I wanted to make sure you noticed I read and was responding to your post. I write so much, that sometimes people can just miss what might've been directed at them. I just didn't feel I needed to press the quote button on that one.

Anyway, I'll do it again...

PEGGER: you're absolutely right. I've said my part and now I'm out of this discussion (I hope). JT and JMS can settle this.

I'll wait and see what happens. But I had to dial back my excitement and enthusiasm. I am now about to go watch paint weather and peel.

JediTricks
10-11-2008, 11:29 PM
Actually, I put a lot of time and effort into doing just that for this site. Click on the POLLS section in these forums. You remember. I also did the big comprehensive "Most Wanted and Never Made Before" figure poll for delivery at Celebration 3.You quit how many years ago now? 5 years ago as of next January (your last poll (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=22656)). So here you are just instigating trouble and giving bad advice trying to pull Sal's strings from behind the scenes, causing trouble instead of helping. If you had been forthright from the beginning, just posted your concerns initially, this wouldn't have gone down as badly as it has.

Your polls were comprehensive in scope, but I'd argue not in results.


I am having a kidney transplant in almost exactly another week. As I recover, I have to work on a complete re-editing of my 500 page novel. I don't think I sound like the right guy to do a most-wanted-vehicle-poll, do you? And at the same time, I could, if mainly YOU, along with any others with some doubts, would just accept LIST POLLS. I'm never going to be OK with just blindly accepting list polls, ever, thanks to what MSP showed us when he put a halt to your scene-by-scene last year about how list order changes everything. These polls are not meant to represent just you, they're meant to represent everybody on the site. You don't seem to care about that first and foremost, and I guess that's your prerogative, you're busy with your own thing and looking out for your own interests and that's fine because you did quit; but for me, I give part of my very little precious free time to helping take care of this community's interests, not just my own.


That's what happens with statistics. But if Hasbro uses them, they'll see that maybe a Cloud Car or Gungan Sub is neither of our most-wanted, BUT WE WILL BOTH BUY THEM IF OFFERED. (I intend to buy THREE (3) Cloud Cars actually).Except it's not really statistical analysis, there's no depth to the results you guys just gave beyond simplistic commonality, no way to truly find out which are the most wanted...

It works perfectly. Your example doesn't illustrate there being a problem in my eyes.Works perfectly? Hardly. Let's look at it again then to illustrate this for the cheap seats. We have 2 ranked lists, 1-10, so each one has a specific value to you guys. Let's take your lists and break them down into those specific values, then display the common value between the 2 lists, that will be the true statistical analysis...

TYCHO:
1. Sailbarge - 10 points
2. Droid Gunship - 9 points
3. Tank Droid - 8 points
4. Wookiee Catamaran - 7 points
5. Twin Pod Cloud Car - 6 points
6. Turbotank - 5 points
7. Virago - 4 points
8. IG-2000 - 3 points
9. Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip - 2 points
10. Gungan Bongo Submarine - 1 point
BRANDON: (who actually had 11 vehicles on his top 10, he had #3 slot twice, but for this exercise we'll throw out a non-common vehicle to make this clearer)
1. Tantive IV - 10 points
2. Sailbarge - 9 points
3. TX 130 Saber Class Fighter Tank - 8 points
4. Rebel Transport - 7 points
5. Cloud Car - 6 points
6. Palpy's Shuttle ROTS - 5 points
7. Larger Sandcrawler - 4 points
8. Bail's Speeder - 3 points
9. Republic Assault Gunboat - 2 points
10. Bongo Sub - 1 pointNow we factor them together based on those values:


Sailbarge - 19 points
Cloud Car - 12 points
Tantive IV - 10 points
Droid Gunship - 9 points
Tank Droid - 8 points
TX-130 - 8 points
Rebel Transport - 7 points
Wookiee Catamaran - 7 points
Turbo Tank - 5 points
Palpy's ROTS Shuttle - 5 points
Virago - 4 points
Sandcrawler - 4 points
Bail's Speeder - 3 points
IG-2000 - 3 points
Corralskip - 2 points
Gungan Sub - 2 points
Republic Assault Gunboat - 2 points

From the small sampling of 2, you can see that your Gungan Sub is actually tied for 15th (last) place despite being common to both of your lists, it's nowhere near the top 10. Just because it's common to your lists doesn't mean it's highly ranked, the sampling shows that while it would have made your type of poll's top 10 results, our group of 2 actually feels it's not worth much to that group so it wouldn't make the list. The larger the cross-section, the more accurately we can tell what the group wants and how much they want it.


Well, I'm glad I won't have to do the work (as I used to do plenty of it around here, including testing all the new plastic to make sure it was good for consumer sniffing. Do you know of any other website that has a resident lunatic on staff 24/7? Well do you?)Yeah, I've heard the results of that plastic-sniffing you did, talking about getting surgery to transform Megatron and whatnot. :p


Meanwhile, I'm glad to see you being open to working with JediMasterSal on this matter of the polls. I know how much this matters to him. And along with being busy myself, and fully respecting the wonderful job MadSlantedPowers did with the much harder action figure poll, I don't want to see this project pulled away from Sal - a friend and the guy who is really enthusiastic about doing this.I never wasn't open to that, the issue has always been with presentation and execution, getting that right no matter who comes up with what. But I'm not going to automatically sign off on everything he does without consideration just because he's done polls in the past, that would be unfair to the group. Stop trying to make this about personalities when it's not, judge objectively what method will give the best sampling and what method will bring in the most voters, that's the only criteria anybody should be considering.



Star Wars collecting should be fun. Polling should be fun. Oh yeah, what could be more fun than POLLING??? ;) "Woo, let's go hit the town tonight and ask people questions, yeaaaah!!!!"

Be grateful there's at least people passionate enough to get worked up over Star Wars vehicle polling methods, most toy lines wouldn't have that, I'm sure. :p

Mad Slanted Powers
10-12-2008, 01:32 AM
Y'all been talking about me and I didn't even know it.

I haven't been following the vehicle polls too closely. What happened with the results of this poll (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=37621)? Did we throw that out and start over?

JT asked if I could take a look here and offer some help. I'm not looking to take over the thing as I did with the figure poll, but I will offer some suggestions. I'm also willing to tally votes and scores if needed.

If we were to run this the way I did the figure poll, then it would work like this:

1. Create a list of vehicles from each movie.
2. For each movie, people will submit a ranked list of a set number of vehicles.
3. Scores will be tallied to create a ranked list from each movie.
4. Use some method of combining the lists into a single list (we used two different methods in the figure poll).

I wouldn't necessarily use that exact method for the vehicle poll though. In the figure poll, most figures are pretty much the same in terms of size. There are a few that would be better as deluxe figures, or something like Jabba. With vehicles we have all different kinds of scale of vehicles. Even if we get a vehicle we want, it may not be sized right. Also, since some vehicles are in multiple movies, they could be on multiple lists. It also doesn't leave room for the "Fantasy" category.

I'm in agreement that there is no rush to get this done if it won't get submitted until February. In the figure poll, phase 1 lasted 9 weeks, and phase 2 lasted 10 weeks. We then did the alternate method for phase 2 which was another 4 weeks. That took nearly 6 months. We don't have that much time before February, we may not need that much time for this. Even if we used the same method, phase 1 wouldn't need to last as long, and if we stuck to the alternate phase 2 method, that wouldn't take as long either. So, we could be done in 2 or 3 months.

So, now I guess I should ask what Sal's plan was for the polling at this point. The categories are quite different in size, so having people submit ranked lists from each group might not work. Also, given that some vehicles could fit in multiple categories, perhaps it would be better to create groups based on vehicle size. That would be at least four categories:

Small vehicles (landspeeders)
$20-$25 price point vehicles like the Jedi Starfighters
Larger vehicles in the Y-Wing and B-Wing price range
Huge vehicles like the big Falcon or AT-TE

Those middle two categories would probably be larger than the other two, so maybe you could further subdivide those somehow so that we end up with a total of 6 or 7 roughly equal groups. However it is broken down and however many groups we end up with, we could then proceed as we did with the figure poll. If we stick with the vehicles listed in this thread, it might even be easier since it is a small group to choose from. Voters would probably only need to rank a top 10 in each group, rather than 25 like we did in the figure poll. Once we get a top 10 from each group, we could then have people rank their top 10 overall from that.

Once again, these are just suggestions. Sal's already done a fair amount of work on this so he should be the one running it. However, since this is something we will present to Hasbro, then we should work together to come up with the best method we can.

cookiemonster
10-12-2008, 08:18 AM
Sorry Tycho it took me off guard, I am not used to seeing my name in caps, to me thats shouting at someone, but I understand now not for you, so if I see it again I wont be bothered if it comes from you.:thumbsup:

jedi master sal
10-12-2008, 09:33 AM
Y'all been talking about me and I didn't even know it.

I haven't been following the vehicle polls too closely. What happened with the results of this poll (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=37621)? Did we throw that out and start over?

JT asked if I could take a look here and offer some help. I'm not looking to take over the thing as I did with the figure poll, but I will offer some suggestions. I'm also willing to tally votes and scores if needed.

If we were to run this the way I did the figure poll, then it would work like this:

1. Create a list of vehicles from each movie.
2. For each movie, people will submit a ranked list of a set number of vehicles.
3. Scores will be tallied to create a ranked list from each movie.
4. Use some method of combining the lists into a single list (we used two different methods in the figure poll)...

So, now I guess I should ask what Sal's plan was for the polling at this point. The categories are quite different in size, so having people submit ranked lists from each group might not work. Also, given that some vehicles could fit in multiple categories, perhaps it would be better to create groups based on vehicle size. That would be at least four categories:

Small vehicles (landspeeders)
$20-$25 price point vehicles like the Jedi Starfighters
Larger vehicles in the Y-Wing and B-Wing price range
Huge vehicles like the big Falcon or AT-TE...

Once again, these are just suggestions. Sal's already done a fair amount of work on this so he should be the one running it. However, since this is something we will present to Hasbro, then we should work together to come up with the best method we can.

As to how you'd run this poll, the 4 things you listed are exactly what I'd be doing.
1. Create a list of vehicles from each movie. Done-this was from the suggestion thread. Not every vehicle needs to be redone, and not everyone wants them redone. So we asked for suggestions and only those would go on the list because there was at least some initial desire for them.
2. For each movie, people will submit a ranked list of a set number of vehicles. This was the plan, except instead of each movie, I was going with trilogies. There was a scant amount for OT, so they could easily be put into one poll. There wasn't that much more for PT, so again they would go into one poll. EU actually garnered more suggestions. While I personally feel most of them will never get done and probably shouldn't because it would take slots form more popular vehicles (read more recognizable to the everyday person, not hard core fans). The same can be said for the "fantasy" poll. However at the least it DOES give voice to those who DO want those ships made. In that I took myself out of the equation. Notes would be sent to Hasbro along with the full results of all of these polls. For instance we would mention that while we understand it may be impossible to give us a 7 foot long Super Star Destroyer, it would be possible to give this to us as a Titanium or rerelease the larger electronic Action Fleet one from years back. It satiates part of the desire. Also, with each listing notation would be added that gives scale, reasonable pricepoints and any other amenities, such as pack-in figure or electronics to help sell the vehicle. All of that I would do behind the scenes, since I felt it would have muddied up the process of the poll by posting all of that. The point was to get the polls done. Of course I'd be objective in the notes to Hasbro. For ships I don't know much about or wasn't that much interested in, I was planning on having a post poll discussion to ask those who did vote for those vehicles to make comments. such as what they would accept for size of ship/any extras, etc. Once we got through that post discussion thread, then the info would be brought together and all of it submitted.
3. Scores will be tallied to create a ranked list from each movie. Again this is what was going to happen, except in OT, PT, EU, Fantasy and then the overall poll. There just isn't as many ships to go around as there are figures. So this whole process does not need to be protracted or as complex as the figure polls where.
4. Use some method of combining the lists into a single list (we used two different methods in the figure poll)... Again, the main poll having all suggested vehicles would be one list. The further notation to that list would show how each ship fared in their respective sub-category poll.
Ex: Virago. Let's say it polls at the #2 position in EU with 50 points from voting. In the main all-inclusive poll it ranks #17 with 100 points. In the main poll list, I would include the stats that it ranked 2nd in it's respective poll and the points it got from that poll-though the points do NOT cross-over from poll to poll.
In this respect, Hasbro would then see that while it was #17 on the main poll, it was a HIGHLY desired EU ship. So should they (Hasbro) wish to make an EU ship, the Virago should be considered for one of the top spots.

There was only 12 ships suggested for the OT, so no need at all to rank by movie. Besides from the last several polls, it's handedly been Jabba's sailbarge. I'm not trying to skew the votes either. One only need look up the previous vehicle polls here to see the results.

Due to the varying size of ships, we would not conduct seperate polls based on that since there isn't that many to go around. Rather, again take the info from each of the 4 sub category polls and the main poll and show what placement small/medium/large ships fared. The fantasy poll is where those large ships will shine and where we would glean the most info regarding the larger ships, since that poll is mostly directed towards them.

So in essence MSP, everything you said you'd do, I already planned for, just slightly different based from the suggestion thread. Some of the info beyond the lists would come from the post discussion thread and some from compiling the results and cross referencing them with all 5 polls. That compiling I would do and would be completely based off the results and have NO personal input from me. Just the "facts" of the results of the polls.


So with respect to MSP, nothing new was offered, just slight modifications to what I had already come up with. Again based on the previous history of the vehicle polls and the latest suggestion thread, there just isn't a large amount of ships desired, so the complexity of these polls need not be as great.

The additional information regarding size/movie/pricepoint/pack-ins/other amenities, etc. would be compiled post polls based form the results and post discussion thread.

In this respect, not only would we be running these polls, we'd also be having a focus group in the post thread. Cross referencing all of this information and forwarding that on to Hasbro absolutely goes to the complexity and scientific nature of statistical information gathering.

Now with this all being said, are we prepared now to move forward with this? I personally would be willing to make the calls/e-mails/etc., necessary to Hasbro and talk with Mr. DePriest to get him this information sooner than Toyfair (Feb 20009) or SDCC (July? 2009).

In doing so they (Hasbro), may be able to formulate plans based in part form the information we send them and could possibly make an announcement as such at SDCC in 2009, instead of waiting til 2010-since the opposing theory here is to wait that long.

In this I am of the mindset that I'd want these vehicles sooner as in a year sooner, than later. At the very least, we give Hasbro that much more time to come up with a plan for vehicles if we give them more time, by producing our results to them sooner. It's their planning we should be more concerned with. Ultimately they are the ones who will decide this. We have to keep this in context that we are a fan site. Unless this vehicle poll is going to be recognized by all/most of the other major SW collecting sites and we bring their votes into the mix, then this whole argument is for not as we on our own do not have a ton of participation. There are varying factors contributing to that. One, not every collector buys vehicles, or has any more room left to purchase more, Two, we don't seem to have a poll system large enough to encompass anything more than 10 items in a poll. Three, they have not been promoted on our very own site, let alone others to draw in more potential information. While I love running the vehicle poll, I am bummed that we only ever seem to have a dozen or two people join in on the polls. That really isn't enough of a cross-section of fans to make the polls accurate. If hasbro is going to take our info for the vehicle polls, then I believe we should be contacting other websites and making this a joint venture with SSg leading the way and hosting the polls. Not only will this bring us some credibility it will allow for the polls to have more information from votes and be a much larger cross-section of the collecting fandom. I would be more than willing to contact these sites to get this started. As well, we would need to contact Hasbro to let them know we are doing this in conjunction with other sites. Then much as RS was holding the "official" fan figure poll, we would be the place for the "official" vehicle poll, endorsed by Hasbro.

What I feel we need to do is have the polls listed as a stickied news item or side bar item on the home page, that will take them to the threads in the forums. We SSGers of course know where to go for that, so we wouldn't need to go to the homepage first. This is more for other people from other sites.

Now with respect to all that's be said before in this thread, if what I've just posted in this specific post is not enough, not complex enough, not scientific enough, etc., then I'll just drop the whole matter and will no longer be associated with it in any respect.

DarthBrandon
10-12-2008, 10:31 AM
You quit how many years ago now? 5 years ago as of next January (your last poll (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=22656)). So here you are just instigating trouble and giving bad advice trying to pull Sal's strings from behind the scenes, causing trouble instead of helping. If you had been forthright from the beginning, just posted your concerns initially, this wouldn't have gone down as badly as it has.

Your polls were comprehensive in scope, but I'd argue not in results.

I'm never going to be OK with just blindly accepting list polls, ever, thanks to what MSP showed us when he put a halt to your scene-by-scene last year about how list order changes everything. These polls are not meant to represent just you, they're meant to represent everybody on the site. You don't seem to care about that first and foremost, and I guess that's your prerogative, you're busy with your own thing and looking out for your own interests and that's fine because you did quit; but for me, I give part of my very little precious free time to helping take care of this community's interests, not just my own.

Except it's not really statistical analysis, there's no depth to the results you guys just gave beyond simplistic commonality, no way to truly find out which are the most wanted...
Works perfectly? Hardly. Let's look at it again then to illustrate this for the cheap seats. We have 2 ranked lists, 1-10, so each one has a specific value to you guys. Let's take your lists and break them down into those specific values, then display the common value between the 2 lists, that will be the true statistical analysis...

TYCHO:
1. Sailbarge - 10 points
2. Droid Gunship - 9 points
3. Tank Droid - 8 points
4. Wookiee Catamaran - 7 points
5. Twin Pod Cloud Car - 6 points
6. Turbotank - 5 points
7. Virago - 4 points
8. IG-2000 - 3 points
9. Yuuzhan Vong Corralskip - 2 points
10. Gungan Bongo Submarine - 1 point
BRANDON: (who actually had 11 vehicles on his top 10, he had #3 slot twice, but for this exercise we'll throw out a non-common vehicle to make this clearer)
1. Tantive IV - 10 points
2. Sailbarge - 9 points
3. TX 130 Saber Class Fighter Tank - 8 points
4. Rebel Transport - 7 points
5. Cloud Car - 6 points
6. Palpy's Shuttle ROTS - 5 points
7. Larger Sandcrawler - 4 points
8. Bail's Speeder - 3 points
9. Republic Assault Gunboat - 2 points
10. Bongo Sub - 1 pointNow we factor them together based on those values:


Sailbarge - 19 points
Cloud Car - 12 points
Tantive IV - 10 points
Droid Gunship - 9 points
Tank Droid - 8 points
TX-130 - 8 points
Rebel Transport - 7 points
Wookiee Catamaran - 7 points
Turbo Tank - 5 points
Palpy's ROTS Shuttle - 5 points
Virago - 4 points
Sandcrawler - 4 points
Bail's Speeder - 3 points
IG-2000 - 3 points
Corralskip - 2 points
Gungan Sub - 2 points
Republic Assault Gunboat - 2 points

From the small sampling of 2, you can see that your Gungan Sub is actually tied for 15th (last) place despite being common to both of your lists, it's nowhere near the top 10. Just because it's common to your lists doesn't mean it's highly ranked, the sampling shows that while it would have made your type of poll's top 10 results, our group of 2 actually feels it's not worth much to that group so it wouldn't make the list. The larger the cross-section, the more accurately we can tell what the group wants and how much they want it.

Yeah, I've heard the results of that plastic-sniffing you did, talking about getting surgery to transform Megatron and whatnot. :p

I never wasn't open to that, the issue has always been with presentation and execution, getting that right no matter who comes up with what. But I'm not going to automatically sign off on everything he does without consideration just because he's done polls in the past, that would be unfair to the group. Stop trying to make this about personalities when it's not, judge objectively what method will give the best sampling and what method will bring in the most voters, that's the only criteria anybody should be considering.


Oh yeah, what could be more fun than POLLING??? ;) "Woo, let's go hit the town tonight and ask people questions, yeaaaah!!!!"

Be grateful there's at least people passionate enough to get worked up over Star Wars vehicle polling methods, most toy lines wouldn't have that, I'm sure. :p

Yeah, what he said & Pegger too.

Good catch on the 2nd (3) Tycho, & thank's for fixing it. I really hope this gets going soon guys & lets make it fun shall we.:D

JediTricks
10-13-2008, 02:39 AM
Y'all been talking about me and I didn't even know it.Someone made a name for himself. :p

I haven't been following the vehicle polls too closely. What happened with the results of this poll (http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=37621)? Did we throw that out and start over? You know, in all our discussions, it never came up that I can remember. Remember how you had "method 2" on your final results for the figure poll? I think we could include that poll similarly to the vehicle poll results, despite it taking place 7 months ago and before Comic-Con.


I'm also willing to tally votes and scores if needed.I appreciate the help with tally and scoring, that's what I most need help with whenever I do stuff like this.


If we were to run this the way I did the figure poll, then it would work like this:

1. Create a list of vehicles from each movie.
2. For each movie, people will submit a ranked list of a set number of vehicles.
3. Scores will be tallied to create a ranked list from each movie.
4. Use some method of combining the lists into a single list (we used two different methods in the figure poll).

I wouldn't necessarily use that exact method for the vehicle poll though. In the figure poll, most figures are pretty much the same in terms of size. There are a few that would be better as deluxe figures, or something like Jabba. With vehicles we have all different kinds of scale of vehicles. Even if we get a vehicle we want, it may not be sized right. Also, since some vehicles are in multiple movies, they could be on multiple lists. It also doesn't leave room for the "Fantasy" category.I like PT/OT/EU/Fantasy (I really categorize this in my head as unrealistic, like a Tantive IV or Star Destroyer, though cookie just asked about a new AT-AT and Jabba's Skiff, and I don't know where I'd put them on Sal's system).


I'm in agreement that there is no rush to get this done if it won't get submitted until February. In the figure poll, phase 1 lasted 9 weeks, and phase 2 lasted 10 weeks. We then did the alternate method for phase 2 which was another 4 weeks. That took nearly 6 months. We don't have that much time before February, we may not need that much time for this. Even if we used the same method, phase 1 wouldn't need to last as long, and if we stuck to the alternate phase 2 method, that wouldn't take as long either. So, we could be done in 2 or 3 months.We staggered phase 1 before, didn't we? I think if we do staggered 2-week-long polls for each of the 4 in phase 1 (so, a new poll every week), then for phase 2 we have 5 separate 2-week non-staggered rounds, that'd get us to mid-January.

Alternately, if we didn't stagger phase 1 or 2, that wound take us to February 11th, but that would be cutting it unbelievably close since Toy Fair is just 4 days later on the 15th.



So, now I guess I should ask what Sal's plan was for the polling at this point. The categories are quite different in size, so having people submit ranked lists from each group might not work. Also, given that some vehicles could fit in multiple categories, perhaps it would be better to create groups based on vehicle size. That would be at least four categories:

Small vehicles (landspeeders)
$20-$25 price point vehicles like the Jedi Starfighters
Larger vehicles in the Y-Wing and B-Wing price range
Huge vehicles like the big Falcon or AT-TE

Those middle two categories would probably be larger than the other two, so maybe you could further subdivide those somehow so that we end up with a total of 6 or 7 roughly equal groups. However it is broken down and however many groups we end up with, we could then proceed as we did with the figure poll. If we stick with the vehicles listed in this thread, it might even be easier since it is a small group to choose from. Voters would probably only need to rank a top 10 in each group, rather than 25 like we did in the figure poll. Once we get a top 10 from each group, we could then have people rank their top 10 overall from that.That was something that came up before, and my thought was that I felt maybe we shouldn't hamstring Hasbro's choices by limiting the scale (though the risk of letting them choose is that we could have another Sith Infiltrator situation on our hands).



Create a list of vehicles from each movie. Done-this was from the suggestion thread. Not every vehicle needs to be redone, and not everyone wants them redone. So we asked for suggestions and only those would go on the list because there was at least some initial desire for them.I'm adamant that we not shut down new write-in entries until that scale's round is over in phase 1, that's something I feel very strongly about. I want to leave it open to the users, you decide where they go but they can come up with ideas. There's just no reason to say "no more entries" that I can see. It's very easy for you and me to edit the opening posts to add new entries, and MSP has shown a great ability to roll with changed votes (something I am very bad at in my low-tech tallying method).


Notes would be sent to Hasbro along with the full results of all of these polls. For instance we would mention that while we understand it may be impossible to give us a 7 foot long Super Star Destroyer, it would be possible to give this to us as a Titanium or rerelease the larger electronic Action Fleet one from years back.Hmm, I don't know about this. We could talk to them in person about this, but I am concerned that it wouldn't come through conceptually on the page and they'd just re-release Titanium 3"ers (they seem totally unwilling to re-release the Action Fleet and Collectors Fleet ships despite some massive quality).

Ultimately, I'd rather see the "fantasy" poll and phase 2 section prefaced with a warning like "ships in this category are very unlikely to be made, and would have to be compromised in some significant fashion" because ultimately that's what voters for that stuff seem to want, big ships their figures can interact with. Do we think they'll get made? No, but that's what the voters seem to want - how badly is the ultimate question.


Also, with each listing notation would be added that gives scale, reasonable pricepoints and any other amenities, such as pack-in figure or electronics to help sell the vehicle.This is something else that I believe has to be done in person rather than on page, they don't respond well to "how to make toys" lessons in Q&A and such, they sent us that comment via Q&A last year about going to college and getting degrees and working one's way up.


Use some method of combining the lists into a single list (we used two different methods in the figure poll)... Again, the main poll having all suggested vehicles would be one list. The further notation to that list would show how each ship fared in their respective sub-category poll.If we have 5 rounds of what MSP calls "phase 2" combination, then we could have maybe the top 10 or top 15 for each section displayed per round (for 40 or 60 poll choices total), and skim 4 from each round to make a final result of a top 20.

Why multiple rounds of phase 2? Because having a single poll of 120 ships will hamper voting, folks don't like choosing from large lists; and it'll also lower statistical sampling which we'd want to ensure an entry's overall standing.



So with respect to MSP, nothing new was offered, just slight modifications to what I had already come up with. Again based on the previous history of the vehicle polls and the latest suggestion thread, there just isn't a large amount of ships desired, so the complexity of these polls need not be as great.I disagree, his suggestion for multiple polls in the second phase is a significant difference, and his tallying and statistical breakdown skills are proven commodities. Hasbro responded to that presentation strongly, it's what set them off for the vehicles idea, so it's what the site will support.


Now with this all being said, are we prepared now to move forward with this? I personally would be willing to make the calls/e-mails/etc., necessary to Hasbro and talk with Mr. DePriest to get him this information sooner than Toyfair (Feb 20009) or SDCC (July? 2009).You may be personally willing to make those calls, but on behalf of the site, it'll be me and Steve making that contact, and barring a miracle, you're not going to be getting traction with that line of communication soon enough to actually GET this poll into their hands before February anyway. Hasbro is a very tough company to get through to that sort of thing, with or without an outlet. I am not willing to rush the poll results simply to have it done by an arbitrary early date that won't matter anyway. Since the site is going to support apoll that could be done by February Toy Fair no matter what since that's the best opportunity to get it into their hands before the convention season, it seems like folly to shoot for earlier.


In doing so they (Hasbro), may be able to formulate plans based in part form the information we send them and could possibly make an announcement as such at SDCC in 2009, instead of waiting til 2010-since the opposing theory here is to wait that long.Wishful thinking. The turnaround is generally 18 months for product, if we get them a list by December it won't get vetted until January (they get a lot of holiday vacation time and so does Lucasfilm Licensing), they won't be able to deal with results until March (they get very busy around Toy Fair), and they seem to like to protect in-progress designs until they're over halfway done and solid on schedule which would be after Comic-Con either way.

I am eager to get a good list in their hands ASAP as well, but I don't want haste to make waste just because we could hand them another list in a year, the quality of the list should take precedence over the quantity of lists.


we don't seem to have a poll system large enough to encompass anything more than 10 items in a poll.There is zero chance we'll be using any poll system, we want these ranked and the polls are either "choose 1" or "choose as many as you like without consideration of order". These will be forums polls that I'll be using the news to support.


they have not been promoted on our very own site, let alone others to draw in more potential information.If we don't lock out write-ins, the promotion of the poll will supply the more potential information, that's why I don't want to lock in a list, especially since MSP's tallying can roll with those punches with ease.


If hasbro is going to take our info for the vehicle polls, then I believe we should be contacting other websites and making this a joint venture with SSg leading the way and hosting the polls. Not only will this bring us some credibility it will allow for the polls to have more information from votes and be a much larger cross-section of the collecting fandom.Tycho tried that before, it was not a smooth ride for the entities running the poll, there was a lot of pushing and pulling. Steve and I have a few contacts with other sites, but ultimately other sites don't want to send their traffic here, have them register with our forums, and then post in them. In this area, word of mouth can be more powerful. I guarantee you this, if you want to start this poll soon, there is NO way we're getting cross-site activity that soon. I was looking at starting the phase 1 vehicle poll this Wednesday the 15th, but coordinating TheJawa and Yoda's and Yak and JD and GH and RS and others on board would push this back a month or more (assuming they don't just pass altogether).


I would be more than willing to contact these sites to get this started.That would be exceeding your authority as moderator, that is something Steve has to be way on-board with first, I wouldn't try this on my authority alone and I'm the head moderator and an editor. Inter-site communication is a "no" without Steve's direct approval.


As well, we would need to contact Hasbro to let them know we are doing this in conjunction with other sites.Once you start talking about representing the site to Hasbro, you need to go through Steve or me depending on the severity.


Then much as RS was holding the "official" fan figure poll, we would be the place for the "official" vehicle poll, endorsed by Hasbro. Not likely to happen, and never going to happen in just 2 months. If we get Hasbro involved for giving us an "official" badging, you can rest assured it'll take several MONTHS just to hammer out clearance with Hasbro and then with Lucasfilm, and the amount of changes they'll want us to make will likely be astounding. That one is just not going to happen anytime soon.


Sal, I appreciate your help and your drive in this, I definitely will be using the info collected already, and I want to rely on your continued help, but there are some things that for site support do need compromises on, not everything but some things. We could have this running by Wednesday the 15th.

JediTricks
10-13-2008, 03:34 AM
I'm on the phone with Tycho, and while we were talking about the poll, he mentioned pricepoint polls (not in favor or against) and it got me thinking, we could do polls based on pricepoints where a vehicle could be in multiple polls - something like the Sith Infiltrator could be in a $20 poll, a $40 poll, even a $75 poll.

Tycho feels that any entry in that poll would have to state VERY clearly that it's also available in the other poll.

Neither of us even like the idea, but it's probably worth floating to see if anybody can make a better argument.

jedi master sal
10-13-2008, 07:35 AM
JT, once again you're knocking every point I made. Did I not say we would hold a phase 2 poll to further reduce the amount of ships to vote on to get the top contenders in the main poll? You KNOW I did.

At this point, I'm done. You just don't want me in charge of this period. That much is certain.

I'll have you know that in past ventures I've contacted Steve Sansweet personally, Mary Franklin as well and even the guy in charge of GenCon for CIII. I can't recall his name at the moment.

Regardless, what I'm trying to say here is that I'm fully capable of getting to the people who need to know. I've got my contacts as well, you just don't want to acknowledge that.

Once again you cite that we have to go through YOU for most of this. Where is Steve in all of this? His hands off approach in the forums has really hurt us as can be seen with what is happening here. You mean to say from your previous post that Steve has confidence in you, but not any of the rest of us?? So you're the only one who can come up with good ideas? That is preposterous.

As far as the written information goes that I would have sent to Hasbro, it would have been CRYSTAL clear regarding the "fantasy" ships, as well as suggestions to scale, pricepoints, etc. I have a professional proofreader here at work handy and she would have corrected any of my errors and changed things around to make them sound professional.

It's your complete lack of confidence that anyone else (read ME) can do anything positive for this site that is ruining this poll. Either that or maybe you're just afraid that in "allowing" someone else to be in charge of something you are diminishing your "power" on the site.

Forget it, I'm done. You want to run this poll, do it. But without other collecting sites input and votes, the paltry amount of votes from a couple of dozen members here really means this poll is worthless. The previous ones I did were fun. DId I think Hasbro would take them seriously? I was hopeful, but knew in reality we couldn't make that huge of an impact because we just didn't have the numbers to do so.

So go ahead and run YOUR site how you want, JT. I'll just be the lowly little minor moderator from now on, since that's all it seems I'll ever be able to do to help this site and the community at large through this site.

JediTricks
10-13-2008, 02:32 PM
Okay, thanks for that. Good to know exactly where you stand, at least. I am sorry we cannot count on your support for this.


Once again you cite that we have to go through YOU for most of this. Where is Steve in all of this? His hands off approach in the forums has really hurt us as can be seen with what is happening here. You mean to say from your previous post that Steve has confidence in you, but not any of the rest of us?? So you're the only one who can come up with good ideas? That is preposterous.Steve is taking care of matters that keep the site going, that's why he leaves this sort of thing to me, so I can help him keep the site going. Look at your post, it is full of venom, why should that be something he trusts the site name he's worked over a decade to make with? This is not something to give away lightly, and without that resource, giving Hasbro a poll with any weight from our guys wouldn't be possible. He trusts me to make good choices, and despite your claim to the contrary, I've been able to allow others to run stuff their way and still garner site support, just not someone who is so inflexible and rude.

You didn't seem to have a problem my role in things when you first asked me to intervene on the site's behalf in the matter of the polls:
From : jedi master sal
To : JediTricks
Date : 2008-07-28 11:24
Title : Hasbro ships/vehicles poll.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hopefully Tycho has caught up with you by now and let you know about Hasbro's interest in our polls from a few months ago. They'd like us to do a new set of polls (according to Tycho, IIRC). So I'm PMing you to ask about getting this on the homepage to direct more traffic to them. I'll write-up the polls tonight. For now it will be a suggestions thread in the main forum. Then once we parse it down, we can make them true polls in the polling section.

Sound good to you?

I'm very happy that Hasbro would consider our polls and to WANT to work with us is an honor. That's something we should JUMP at the chance of doing.

-Sal
================================================== ===========
By the way, here's the rest of that conversation, I don't know where you felt I was disrespectful to you in any of this simply because I wanted to see other things:
From : JediTricks
To : jedi master sal
Date : 2008-07-29 14:09
Title : Re: Hasbro ships/vehicles poll.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, I was there for part of the poll conversation that brought up the vehicles, so by next week I should be ready to go forward with that. I'd like to get together with you, Tycho, and Mad Slanted Powers (who did a great job compiling the info) and start a discussion thread for it. I'm too busy this week doing catchup to give it my attention, but I do want to go forward with this - I just want to make sure we have a solid plan like we did with the figure poll we just gave them.

Don't get too locked down into a single style, discussing it may bring up new ideas and I really want to feel fluid enough to use whatever works. I'd like this one to really nail it and send a strong message. If you don't have one yet, compile a list of all the candidates you'd want to see.

-JT
================================================== ===========

From : jedi master sal
To : JediTricks
Date : 2008-07-31 11:58
Title : Re: Hasbro ships/vehicles poll.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...If you don't have one yet, compile a list of all the candidates you'd want to see.

-JT

Much as in previous polls, we can start a thread for suggestions from forumites. I would like to specifically point out to everyone that far flung EU ships without reference material (ie Pictures) will most likely never be done, so don't clog up the list with those suggestions even if they are that specific forumites wants. I realize that seems to step on toes, but we have to consider the reality and/or viability of some of these ships being made. First and foremost, any ship SEEN in the movies should be preferred of those not in the movies because that's what the overwhelming majority of ALL fans (not just collectors) identify with. Then sources from other imaging can be brought forth, namely comics and video games. Basically if a ship has just been talked about but never seen then it wouldn't qualify. Regarding Comic and video game vehicles, there should be a relatively strong presence of the ship for it to be regarded as again it would have a broader appeal. Some niche vehicles can be considered given there specific importance, be that to a scene or more importantly character. For example, Bossk's Hound's Tooth. It's not iconic, but it is specific to one of the iconic "super six" bounty hunters seen on the ESB bridge. IG-88's IG2000 would therefore be considered. An example of a ship barely if ever seen that wouldn't be considered is the Moldy Crow. While some people know it's Kyle Katarn's ship (and honestly I had to look this up myself), many don't. Therefore while it's a character's ship, it's 1) not a movie character's ship, 2) unfamiliar relation to character itself outside of those who know the character/ship.

With regards to scale of ships, I'd recommend that ships such as the Star Destroyer and Blockade Runner NOT be onl the list. While they are indeed iconic, there is no reasonable way for them to be done complete and certainly never to scale. Anything we would get would be so underscaled and unappreciated by the masses. I'm very much aware that the Blockade Runner had a mock-up from the vintage days that never made it to manufacture. Wonder why?? Because it was deemed not to be successful, due in part to it's small action sequence in the film as well as it's grossly undersizing. Case in point, the vintage Sandcrawler was underscaled. When Hasbro rereleased it, it didn't do all that well and sold at discount at many places. (I know, I got one like that.)

Basically we need to think it terms of what's already been produced with say the speederbike as the model for the smallest vehicle and the BMF (ship)/AT-TE (vehicle) as the examples for the largest size. This does mean that large ships such as the Sailbarge, Turbo Tank, Sandcrawler can be voted on, but understood that they would NEVER match true scale to the figures.

I understand if you don't like to put restrictions out there. But, I do suggest that since this is something that would be more official that not only we staff but all forumites take this seriously and consider what are the most viable ships/vehicles to make.

Now again getting back to the polls, people make their suggestions, no more than 10 and if it's already been listed, they can EDIT their list to make 10 entries (again given any restrictions imposed). Set a time to do this, not to exceed more than 2-3 weeks. From there we have a master list. Ultimately this list shouldn't exceed more than 50-60 ships. My poll at this stage was approx 70-80 and it was getting well out of hand with the very obscure suggestions that I very well knew from previous polls I've conducted here would never see it through to the next round or if it was lucky the round after that. TOO many suggestions detracts from the ships that are the most viable to do and ones that have broad appeal rather than niche appeal.

From that master list of 50-60, we have people vote on their top 10 only. From those results we bring in the top 20 to the second round. People vote on their top 10 again, given 2-3 weeks to do so. The top ten go through to the final round. Now at this point we could submit the poll to them, but to get a better idea of the specific order of those ten we have the last poll asking people to rank them in order of most to least wanted. This does allow for people not to list all 10 (if they don't like all of the ones that made it through), which shows a clearer pattern of ships that would/would not sell as well. That list would then reorganize the ten to reflect the order in which we voted on for most wanted to least. Special note to Hasbro for the top 5 could be given depending on the variance of votes and how far spread apart the votes are at the end of this poll.

Paring the list down to 10 then 5, makes it very easy for Hasbro to understand what our wants are.

That's my suggestion.
-Sal
================================================== ===========

From : JediTricks
To : jedi master sal
Date : 2008-08-04 19:03
Title : Re: Hasbro ships/vehicles poll.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok Captain Lotsowords. ;) I've posted a discussion thread to take in all ideas and let them soak. I'm not ready to cut any ideas yet, even the wacky EU stuff - if we break down the polls right, they can fail on their own and we don't need to take the heat.

There's no way we're cutting the Moldy Crow, it's got a very strong presence in 2 of the most popular SW video games of all time: Dark Forces and Jedi Knight (the latter of which is the first to have new Star Wars live-action video shot for a game). The Crow has tons of visual reference, and neither you nor I would make good arbiters of its viability because we each have our own slants.

So we need to open everything up to discussion before we proceed, that's my take on it. I may think the Star Destroyer is impossible and a waste of a vote, but this is a poll of what fans want, not what Hasbro can make - let Hasbro worry about how to do it if they think they can pull it off. None of us ever expected a $150 Millennium Falcon was realistically going to be made a year ago, and now here it is. And the next big vehicle being Slave I? Not what most would call "realistic" yet it appears to be happening.

Scale is thrown out the window with every vehicle, it just can't be an issue here because otherwise we'd have never owned an AT-ST or AT-AT or X-wing or almost anything.

Did you participate in MSP's figure polls? Those went over pretty well and they were largely non-restrictive, he was able to tally votes and keep running changes so users could change their votes and he could keep up. I'd like to use him for this task again, that level of data collection came in very handy when Tycho and I showed Hasbro the figures results.

Anyway, PM seems unnecessary now that we've got a discussion thread for this.

-JT
And that's all there was until now. You did not continue the conversation in the discussion thread for months. I don't see anything in PM that was disrespectful or trying to exclude you, certainly nothing warranting the increasingly erratic behavior you've returned in the matter.

The bottom line is that some of the ideas you've floated are ones I don't think are in the best interest of the group, and since I have to be comfortable in supporting this poll in my role as an editor on the site as you originally requested, I can't simply leave it all up to you to be in charge and hope for the best when you've been inflexible and taken so much of this personally.

Ando
10-13-2008, 03:40 PM
Soooooo is this thing dead?

DarthBrandon
10-13-2008, 03:52 PM
Soooooo is this thing dead?

No not yet, I hope.

All this bickering though should be done through private message so that it does not tarnish what we are trying to do.

Ando
10-13-2008, 03:55 PM
I agree. I thought JMS had a good thing going here.

JediTricks
10-13-2008, 04:46 PM
Here's the first poll of SSG's most wanted vehicle poll series: http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=39097

Battle Droid
10-14-2008, 08:50 AM
Why isn't the Malevolence listed in the Fantasy list? It was on my list.:razz:

JediTricks
10-16-2008, 01:50 AM
I'll make sure it gets included.

Banthaholic
10-16-2008, 09:50 PM
I always wanted Jedi Master Saesee Tiin's Green E3 style jedi starfighter as seen in the original Clone Wars cartoon seen here http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Tiin_fighter.jpg. It's on the episode where he goes wears his spacesuit and kicks some tale

Lord Malakite
10-17-2008, 04:26 AM
Shame you aren't taken any more suggestions for the EU section Sal (I must of missed that part). Because I would of suggested the following additions. :p

TIE Oppressor (from Star Wars Galaxies: Jump to Lightspeed expansion)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Oppressor
TIE Interdictor (from Star Wars: Galactic Battlegrounds)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Interdictor
TIE Hunter (from Star Wars: Rogue Squadron III: Rebel Strike)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Hunter
Naboo Bomber (from Star Wars: Battle for Naboo and Star Wars: Galactic Battlegrounds)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/NB-1S_Royal_Bomber
N-X Police Cruiser (from The Starfighter Trap, Star Wars: Battle for Naboo & Star Wars: Starfighter
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/N-X_Police_Cruiser
All Terrain Personal Transport (AT-PT) (from Star Wars: Rogue Squadron, Star Wars: Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader, Star Wars: Rogue Squadron III: Rebel Strike, etc.)
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/All_Terrain_Personal_Transport

JediTricks
10-17-2008, 05:18 AM
Ok, it's getting too difficult to juggle 2 threads on this matter. Please address all further discussions to the discussion thread for the poll:
http://forums.sirstevesguide.com/showthread.php?t=38605

And LM, those will all be included in the EU poll, thank you for the suggestions.