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Tycho
12-18-2008, 04:01 AM
Episode 6: Return of the Jedi.

My favorite SW movie can varry, but right now I'd watch "Jedi" over and over again. It was a great movie with Jabba the Hutt, Ewoks, Luke facing the Sith in his father and the Emperor, and a land and space battle all going on at the same time!

Plus speederbikes! It was a great film.

Slicker
12-18-2008, 04:26 AM
I do indeed love Jedi. I haven't watched it in sometime either. It's got it's rather boring parts (Dagobah and most of the Ewok scenes spring to mind) but the space battles are amazing (I'd seriously have to say that they're better than the battles in TPM and ROTS) and I do like the forest battle.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
12-18-2008, 10:49 AM
I love all six but haven't seen them in quite some time. On break, though, I'll be doing another six-movie all-day marathon.

ROTJ was my favorite when I was younger (before the prequels, anyway), probably since it had the most cool aliens and ships and whatnot. I still love the emotional moments involving Luke and Vader, and pretty much this entire arc in ROTJ, but some of the staging during the fights and action sequences is distracting at times. It's probably not the best of the series; for me, that designation goes to either ROTS or ESB (with ROTS being my overall favorite).

sith_killer_99
12-18-2008, 01:44 PM
Jedi was my favorite when I was younger. Over time it bacame ESB.

I will have to sit down and watch them all again.:thumbsup:

DarkArtist
12-18-2008, 02:12 PM
Jedi was my favorite growing up as a kid and watching it over and over again. loved the look of Luke's green lightsaber. favorite scene is final lightsaber duel and the space battle, the score of the music always sends chills down my spine.

however for the best of all 6 will always be Episode V The Empire Strikes Back. just the battle on Hoth and the duel at Cloud City, for me that's the only movie i will really watch over and over and over and over again.

my order would go something like this:

Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
Episode VI : Return of the Jedi
Episode III : Revenge of the Sith - Execute Order 66 I still get emotional watching those scenes
Episode IV : A New Hope
Episode II : Attack of the Clones
Episode I : The Phantom Menace

bobafrett
12-18-2008, 02:29 PM
I'm a fan of Episode 4, has always been my favorite, My introduction to Stormtroopers, the droids, Jawas, Sandpeople, Obi Wan, Vader, Tarkin. Maybe it's because it was my first, and they say you'll never forget your first!

Droid
12-18-2008, 03:48 PM
Right on, Tycho. Jedi as always been my favorite. I think that ANH and TESB are probably "better" films, but Jedi has always been my favorite. Ewoks and all.

stillakid
12-18-2008, 10:34 PM
My favorite is TPM. I have this shaky end table and the TPM DVD helps it stop from wobbling.

I used AOTC and ROTS as toilet paper. They weren't very good in that capacity either. :ermm:

El Chuxter
12-19-2008, 10:29 AM
Jedi is a great film. I disagree with all the haters; the emotional impact of the final battle makes up for any of its supposed shortcomings.

Tycho
12-19-2008, 01:48 PM
Even when you watch the whole 6 movie saga, Return of the Jedi delivers the climatic finale that you'd expect from this sort of epic.

Darth Metalmute
12-19-2008, 01:53 PM
Empire Strikes Back
A New Hope
Revenge of the Sith
Return of the Jedi
Family Guy Blue Harvest
The Clone Wars series
Clone Wars
The Clone Wars Movie
The Phantom Menace
The Star Wars Christmas Special
The future Star Wars TV Show
Fan films
Spaceballs
A New Hope redone with vegetables http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doX2jVt0E1U
Attack of the Clones

In that order.

Devo
12-19-2008, 06:15 PM
I'm pretty sure ROTJ was my favourite at one point what with its space battle, AT-STs, Speeder bikes&biker scouts, the Emperor and Vader turning good. All these things make it edge out ANH in my opinion. This perhaps stems from the fact I had seen ESB and Jedi many times before I ever saw ANH and their superior battle sequences and effects impressed this child more.

However I've since realised the objective FACT that ESB is the best of the trilogy and one of the best films of-all-time-ever-the-end. Those other films with 'Star Wars' in the titles hardly count, being so far down the scale relatively speaking. But if I did count them my list would be thus:

1) ESB
2) ROTJ
3) ANH
4) TPM/AOTC
5) ROTS

Bel-Cam Jos
12-20-2008, 10:41 AM
It's been a couple (few?) years since my last all-6er viewing, but I've been catching them occasionally on Spike. But here's my "current" ranking:

1. The Empire Strikes Back (this has been my favorite since 1980, none has really come close to unseating its prominence, it shall never be Star Wars Episode IV: The Empire Strikes Back to me)
2. Revenge of the Sith (it just kept going, in a good way, and kept my excitement all throughout, and the saber duel at the end was awesome)
3. Star Wars (recently, after a viewing, I caught a good case of nostalgia, and it moved up a place; can't beat the original, it seems)
4. Attack of the Clones (sure, some have bashed it as the worst, but I liked the action [made up for what others call horrid dialogue - please, what SW film had stirring and smooth words spoken, hmm?])
5. Return of the Jedi (I loved this as a kid, as I ranked it as #2 when the Trilogy seemed that'd be it for SW films, and it's still cool)
6. The Phantom Menace (one has to be last, but not because it's bad, just least great)

stillakid
12-20-2008, 11:08 AM
In order:

A New Hope: Hands down, no matter what nonsensical emotion conjures up other reviews, the first movie in the saga is by far the best overall movie of the saga. It establishes a universe and gives us the classic hero tale in a new and exciting package that has yet to be replicated. There is NO WAY any other movie in the saga even comes close to EVERYTHING that ANH achieves.

Empire Strikes Back: A very worthy follow-up to perfection. ESB builds on the established universe in a way that isn't gratuitously derivative. The SFX improved as technology improved, but it still places second as the story relies on ANH for so much to make it work.

Return of the Jedi: Retreating a bit from the depth of ESB, ROTJ splits the difference b/n ANH and ESB by providing an action oriented story while still building on the characterizations from ANH and ESB. It is fun action with some of the most incredible character moments ever on screen (who else could show emotion through a Darth Vader mask?)


The Animated Clone Wars mini series (not the current one that looks like plastic): These two-minute episodes were worlds beyond the live-action Prequel films in showing us real characters who made sense as well as fun action that seemed to be more true to the Star Wars that was established in 1977.


Batman Begins: "What?! That's not a Star Wars film!?" Right. But in a fairly short first act, we saw Liam Neeson training his young padawan in a far more believable and effective way than TPM could do in two hours.

Life as a House: "What?! That's not a Star Wars film!?" Right. But in a few short scenes, we saw Hayden Christenson as the troubled teen that could go "evil" in a way that THREE Star Wars films failed at accomplishing.


It's difficult to put any of the Prequels into any order as they all were absolutely terrrible and very un-Star Wars. They had the name and the "stuff," but from the get-go, the story destroyed established continuity and just didn't "look" like Star Wars.

If we ignore story and characters, then Revenge of the Sith would take number 7 on the list. The character of Anakin is still laughable as his bipolar behavior is unforgivable and the "love triangle" that creates "Darth Vader" is unforgivable, but ROTS moves fast enough and is flashy enough to help distract most viewers from the tragic flaws. The character of Grievous is fun even though he is decidely very un-Star Wars.

The Phantom Menace takes 8th. Most of us were excited at first, mostly because it was the first glimpse of a new Star Wars story in nearly 20 years. But those of us who aren't distracted by bright shiny objects quickly saw the flaws in the story and character beneath. TPM has some cool "elements," but the story itself is tragically flawed. It illustrated again that Lucas can NOT write a story even though he has a grasp on the ELEMENTS that interest audiences.

Attack of the Clones: This takes a distant ninth mainly because of the laughable and insulting "love story" that is shoddly built b/n Anakin and Padme. Again, bright shiny objects distract as they were intended to, but for anyone paying attention, the story and characters render this movie entirely useless.

bigbarada
12-20-2008, 12:00 PM
it shall never be Star Wars Episode IV: The Empire Strikes Back to me)


I'm the same way, for about twenty years the Star Wars trilogy, to me, consisted of the films Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi. I grudgingly had to start referring to Star Wars as A New Hope or ANH on the internet, only because I got tired of explaining that I was talking about the original 1977 film and not the entire saga.

I also got tired of people trying to explain to me that "Episode IV: A New Hope" had been in the opening crawl of Star Wars since 1978, as if I was some idiot who had never seen the films before.

Anyways, my favorites in order:

1. Empire Strikes Back - technically this shouldn't be number 1, I know, but I find this the most watchable and enjoyable of the six films. If this was a "best of" list, then ANH would have to be #1, but it's a "favorites" list, so I'm free to choose based on whatever criteria I want. ESB is just the most fun of all the films, mainly because it doesn't need to establish anything and it doesn't need to resolve anything; so it's free to just take the audience on a fun ride. This is the film that reminds me of why I love Star Wars every time I see it.

2. Star Wars - the original 1977 film, again if we were talking about it's effect on filmmaking, history and other people, then this would be the number one film, hands down. However, this list is about me, not other people. That's not a slight against this film at all, in fact I was tempted to just give ESB and ANH a tie for the number one spot.

3. Return of the Jedi - with the way I campaign for Skiff Guards, Jabba's Palace figures and Ewoks, you would probably expect this one to be my number one. However, while this movie has some of my favorite scenes, production design and elements in the saga, I feel that it is just the weakest in terms of storytelling when you take the movie as a whole.

4. Clone Wars - the 3D animated film, again it doesn't need to establish anything or really resolve anything (in terms of the overall prequel story arc), so it's just a fun ride. Plus, I think the battle sequences are more well thought out than any SW film since ESB.

5. Revenge of the Sith - the best of the prequels and, honestly, the only one people need to watch. All of the essential information from the two previous films could be summed up in 30 seconds before watching Ep3.

6. The Phantom Menace - the one film of the prequels that felt the most like Star Wars to me; but it suffers now because so much of it is meaningless and contradictory to the Darth Vader story.

7. Attack of the Clones - Just a terrible movie overall, aside from watching the Geonosis battle from time to time, I never even open the DVD case for this one anymore. Even when it's playing on TV for free, I usually look for something else to watch. When you'd rather watch a Spongebob marathon instead of a Star Wars film, then you know that Lucas seriously dropped the ball somewhere. I also hate how this film redefined Yoda, he used to be this symbol for peacefulness, serenity and ultimate wisdom. Now he's just a dancing frog with a lightsaber.

Devo
12-20-2008, 04:48 PM
Guess I went against the grain by putting ROTS last. For me it comes last because it rectified none of the flaws of the previous 2 films when it most desperately needed to considering its more serious subject matter.

stillakid
12-20-2008, 05:54 PM
Guess I went against the grain by putting ROTS last. For me it comes last because it rectified none of the flaws of the previous 2 films when it most desperately needed to considering its more serious subject matter.

True, but I didn't put it last because it was at the mercy of the previous two failures. As erroneous as the story was at that point, ROTS at least attempted to follow this new imagined Star Wars continuity with a story that didn't lag as badly as TPM and AOTC and ROTS had lots of great eye-candy. Putting ROTS would be like blaming the cheese for being moldy because someone else left it out all night. It's bad, but the blame goes somewhere else.

Devo
12-20-2008, 06:31 PM
Thats a fair point. My reasons aren't many but I still prefer TPM and AOTC. TPM because of the 'first new Star wars film in 16 years' nostalgia factor, and its few good points - Liam neeson, even though Qui-gon totally took away from Obi-wan's role, the 3-way lightsaber duel, and the best score of all the prequels. And AOTC because of some pretty good action sequences - the jango/Obi-wan battle, the asteroid chase, the geonosis battle and Christopher Lee. I can't think of as many reasons to like ROTS - Ian mcDiarmid was great, it was good to see the Emperor again......obi wans 'you were my brother anakin' speech which was emotional and well delivered by Ewan Mcgregor despite it having no basis on what we saw throughout the trilogy. Thats all that comes to mind.

Tycho
12-20-2008, 06:56 PM
ROTS is my favorite prequel and I don't think that will change. It is because of all the continuous action sequences that move the story along:

Opening spaceship battle
Lightsaber Duel with Dooku
Grievous and his IG-Magna Droids
Crash Landing
Kashyyyk Battle (too short of teaser IMO, but not really essential to the story)
Utopau Obi-Wan versus Grievous
Mace versus Palpatine
Order 66
Fight to enter the Jedi Temple (Yoda and Obi-Wan)
Palpatine vs Yoda
Anakin vs Obi-Wan

And I love the scene in the opera where Palpatine baits Anakin, the discussion Obi-Wan and Anakin have about what actions are right and wrong for the Jedi to take (like spying on the Chancellor) - it was all well-done.

The reason and way for Padme dying really spoils the movie, and the frame-work for how Palpatine knows Anakin's married, and that his wife is pregnant, and that Anakin fears her dying needed to be laid out. Also, they could have shown that Palpatine forced those nightmares upon Anakin or something. Also, Anakin might have discussed ALL his options with Obi-Wan and not liked the answers. Yoda was a good choice for him to try, but he's close to Obi-Wan and that would have further shown they were like brothers, best friends, or something.

Finally, Anakin could have had some further discussion with "Emperor Palpatine" about why all the Jedi had to die, including the children. He also could have had more of a discussion about how evil Palpatine was to control both sides of the Clone Wars since Anakin knew Dooku was a Sith. Thus it was logical for him to realize that the Separatists were under Palpatine's ultimate control and he, along with the other Jedi, were just being used until slaughtered - not to mention countless innocents. Nute Gunray was even being manipulated.

I understand that Anakin wanted to kill Palpatine right then: "Are you going to kill me?" - "I'd certainly like to." "Good. I can feel your anger. It gives you focus." If you're thoughtful, you can discern that Anakin is furious with Palpatine over this unforgiveable betrayal, but he wants the secret to keep Padme from dying. Lucas just didn't write dialogue that explained this all. He evidently is either oblivious, or he didn't think he needed to and would make more money off EU novelists who would better explain everything. So in a way, he might've respected his audience as being intelligent enough to figure this out. But there isn't better evidence of that.

TPM was very distracted by the Tatooine sequence and didn't explain the Trade Federation's position well enough - such as why the need for the huge droid army (Sith encouragement of piracy, etc. - all found in EU books). Was the silliness of JarJar totally necessary, too? Lucas tried to make a movie that was also appealing to not just us, but to include targeted elements for 5 year olds (literally - as many of SW adult fans today were 5-10 years old when they were first exposed to it). But we loved SW as a serious movie when we were 5 and didn't need cartoon-like characters such as JarJar.

My theory is that the book-end movies had more kiddie elements to them, Gungans or Ewoks, to really accentuate or obviate that these took place in happier times, before the Clone Wars or after a major defeat of the Empire. So Lucas said, "How can I make these films seem happier? I know: make them more cute and stupid."

Alright. If the whole thing is for 5 year olds with stuff like TPM's politics thrown in to appeal to adult fans (it worked in my case and I liked that element), then I guess it's all fine.

None of us are 5 though, and many of us wanted or imagined something different. If I get in touch with even my inner 10 year old, the whole saga is awesome and still the best thing ever done.

With regard to AOTC, I think a lot of people do forget that in the beginning of the movie, Anakin saves Padme's life from the kohouns (poisonous insects the assassin droid dropped in her room). That impacted her to begin searching her feelings about Anakin. The movie didn't convey that well enough unless it's in your head while you're watching the rest of the love story unfold. It's such a small incendental / annecdotal moment in terms of the whole film.

stillakid
12-20-2008, 09:51 PM
None of us are 5 though, and many of us wanted or imagined something different.

Two issues with that train of thought. First is that while most intelligent fans did want and "imagine" something different, it wasn't because our own preconceived concepts that we conjured up... we wanted and imagined something different because the original trilogy formed reasonable expectations.

As far as the age thing goes, to suggest that a movie is still "good" just because one assumes that it is written for children is an insult to children and a cop out for the filmmaker. Many excellent "children's" films are made in such a way that they are superficially fun and stimulating and also have a fundamentally sound "adult" story with elements that kids might not fully understand. In other words, a film like A New Hope had something for every age group. It wasn't "bad" for adults necessitating an excuse that it was only meant for children.

All of the movies have great elements ... but only the original trilogy ties those elements together into a cohesive and logical storyline. The Prequel trilogy also has some fun elements, but the stories are extremely poor, even as standalone films (not compared to the OT).

Tycho
12-20-2008, 10:31 PM
I agree with Stillakid (above) but wonder if A New Hope was also created by the 30-something Lucas to amuse himself at his age THEN, and thus it is more serious. As ROTJ came and he had years of experience "discovering" the hit he had with children and marketing to them, Star Wars got converted to more of a kiddie franchise (Ewoks) and Lucas started dumbing down the films.

Then in his 50's - 60's, he began to make the movies in light of this kiddie market - which he doesn't fully understand (per Stillakid's post). Lucas never was a 5 year old when making these movies.

Simply:

ANH was for a 30 year old kid, but little kids took to it as well.
ESB continued along with that pattern.
ROTJ started pandering to kiddie marketing as well as forcing "happiness" into a tragic storyline.
TPM tried very hard to be both a kiddie movie and have adult appeal.
AOTC had to move along with the groundwork TPM laid out.
ROTS had to tie up all the loose ends. It got more adult to match ANH, but fell short.*

* Padme's death was the key part where ROTS falls short. It is a good movie. But has that totally unbelieveable plot element.

AOTC is cool with me, but not a movie I can watch over and over again. Geonosis was done as a very impressive battle sequence though. One other thing that is cool is the movie shows how the galaxy was under the Old Republic and the original Jedi Order. That is good to see instead of just jumping immediately into the Clone Wars.

However, the Clone Wars is an important element of the storyline. As we're discussing this, I'm starting to appreciate the fact that the cartoon is giving us more.

El Chuxter
12-20-2008, 11:34 PM
Ranking them all? Okay.

1 ESB
2 ROTJ
3 ANH
4 Clone Wars
5 Ewoks: The Battle for Endor
6 TPM
7 Ewoks: Caravan of Courage
8 ROTS
9 AOTC
10 The Clone Wars
11 The Star Wars Holiday Special... though when it gets that bad, it's almost more fun than the prequels, in a masochistic way

Mr. JabbaJohnL
12-21-2008, 12:38 AM
it shall never be Star Wars Episode IV: The Empire Strikes Back to me
To be fair, I don't think ESB will ever be Episode IV to anyone. :p

bigbarada
12-21-2008, 02:43 AM
Ranking them all? Okay.

1 ESB
2 ROTJ
3 ANH
4 Clone Wars
5 Ewoks: The Battle for Endor
6 TPM
7 Ewoks: Caravan of Courage
8 ROTS
9 AOTC
10 The Clone Wars
11 The Star Wars Holiday Special... though when it gets that bad, it's almost more fun than the prequels, in a masochistic way

It didn't even occur to me to rank the Ewok movies or the Holiday Special, I guess I was just thinking of theatrical releases.

I still don't think I've watched more than 3 or 4 episodes of the original Clone Wars toon. The animation style just never appealed to me; so I can't really say how I feel about that series.

Slicker
12-21-2008, 05:08 AM
I agree with Stillakid...Is this one of the sings of the apacalypse?

Bel-Cam Jos
12-21-2008, 09:46 AM
To be fair, I don't think ESB will ever be Episode IV to anyone. :pWell, then I guess I didn't really make a mistake, right? :rolleyes: Unacceptable excuse, Bel-Cam.:whip: So here's my punishment:

"I guess nothin' can last forever, forever,
No! Yeah!"
[well, Bryan, which is it?]

And since people're being editorial...


Is this one of the sings of the apacalypse? I believe such a song [sing?] could be REM's "It's the End of the World."

tagmac
12-23-2008, 10:21 AM
The Empire Strikes Back is still #1 for me.

stillakid
12-23-2008, 11:08 AM
Is this one of the sings of the apacalypse?


"For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ Lucas. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is not strange if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness." (2 Corinthians 11:13-15 RSV)

pbarnard
12-23-2008, 11:39 AM
"For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ Lucas. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is not strange if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness." (2 Corinthians 11:13-15 RSV)

So Rick McCallum is the anti-christ? I KNEW IT!!!

Darth Metalmute
12-23-2008, 12:06 PM
Ranking them all? Okay.

The only reason I ranked them all was because I didn't feel that ranking Attack of the Clones 6th explained just how I truely despise AOTC.

If I ever decide to sit down and watch the movies in one sitting, I will watch TPM, then read either the graphic novel or the novel for AOTC, then watch the rest.

bigbarada
12-23-2008, 04:05 PM
I'd rather watch the Holiday Special than AOTC again. At least the Holiday Special is so bad it's actually entertaining on a morbid level. AOTC is just too much of a chore to even sit through.

Devo
12-24-2008, 09:08 AM
Theres a lot of AOTC hate here. Who'd have thought after the dissappointment of TPM it'd get even worse in 2002 for a lot of people. At the time I remember finding it enjoyable enough - as I did all the prequels on first viewing - just because they were new. Soon enough it sank in how inferior they were.

Still I find AOTC has more redeeming sequences than ROTS so I rate it above.

Tycho
12-26-2008, 06:39 AM
ROTS would be almost a perfect movie except for Padme's lame, lame death.

She has kids to go on living with. Her medical droid was CGI, they didn't even have to lip sync it. At the worst, they could have had the droid say that her windpipe was crushed and she was just holding on for the sake of delivering her children. (This is not how I'd have had her die though - but we've already been through that.)

ROTS works on an action-level. The story moves and it is not boring. There are a lot of planets and exotic locations shown, new vehicles and beasts, that sort of thing. Order 66 was an awesome sequence. Not to forget that the movie opens during a major battle with lot of action, like ANH did, and even ESB and ROTJ did not do that.

I like AOTC from the standpoint that it showed how the galaxy was before war erupted everywhere, and then it demonstrated how the Sith Master and Apprentice set that all up. Just 2 guys! That's something! The whole part of Obi-Wan searching for clues as to what was going on was also very cool in a Jedi-detective sort of way.

I'm not going to compare the Holiday Speacial and other moving picture presentations (TV or theatrical) to the 6 basic movies. Those movies were all I was discussing here.

El Chuxter
12-26-2008, 06:34 PM
ROTS and AOTC are both hella mediocre. TPM was mediocre, but it was at least fun.

AOTC is simply two actors handing in embarassing jobs portraying people who fall so deeply in love in a matter of days that it seems perverse and twisted.

ROTS is the insanely forced follow-up to AOTC. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: the entire plot of ROTS is, "I'm so cool. I had a bad dream. My wife might die. You can save her? And all I have to do is kill a bunch of kids. Sounds cool. Wait, you can't save her? Can I still kill the kids?"

Mr. JabbaJohnL
12-26-2008, 07:03 PM
ROTS is the insanely forced follow-up to AOTC. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: the entire plot of ROTS is, "I'm so cool. I had a bad dream. My wife might die. You can save her? And all I have to do is kill a bunch of kids. Sounds cool. Wait, you can't save her? Can I still kill the kids?"
And now I'll say this: that explanation might work if you ignore the other 90% of the plot. :p

El Chuxter
12-26-2008, 07:04 PM
You mean the totally extraneous eye candy of General Grievous and Wookiees that takes up half of the movie? :)

I really don't think it's a flaw with the underlying story of either movie. Salvatore and Stover both gave us gold novelizing (is that a word?) the same exact stories.

stillakid
12-27-2008, 12:01 AM
ROTS would be almost a perfect movie except for Padme's lame, lame death.

Perfect? Really?

What about the ever bipolar nature of Anakin? He learns that Palps is the Sith Lord, reports him, and then minutes later, chooses to side with him because Palps promises to have the secret that will save Padme from death... only Palps admits that he doesn't, but Ani pledges himself anyway... wherein Palps pulls the name "Darth Vader" out of thin air ... and while we're at it, Palps also somehow manages to have an evil life-support suit just laying around to drop Special Olympics Anakin into at the end... AFTER Ani, who went Dark Side in order to save Padme from death, is the one who chokes her to kill her :confused: . Ani then fights Obi, blaming his mentor for something or other ("Jedi are the bad guys" :confused: where the F*** did THAT come from?)... Anakin then leaps OVER Obi where his limbs can be cut off instead of jumping onto shore to continue the fight... oh, this is after Obi tells Ani not to try it because he has the high ground, only Obi is the one who defeated Darth Maul by doing exactly the same thing...

Then there's the love triangle....

Do I really need to go on? And this movie is close to perfect? Really?! The entire Prequel Trilogy story and character development is a massive train wreck shrouded by flashy bright shiny objects, which are indeed fun to look at, but cover a foundation that has more holes than the Bush motivation to invade Iraq.

Slicker
12-27-2008, 12:49 AM
Stilla, could you PM me and tell me how you REALLY feel? :p

Tycho
12-27-2008, 03:16 AM
What about the ever bipolar nature of Anakin?
What if he's actually supposed to be bi-polar? What's wrong with that? Would that wreck Darth Vader for you? There could have been a dispensor for Prozac on Vader's utility belt all these years.


He learns that Palps is the Sith Lord, reports him, and then minutes later, chooses to side with him because Palps promises to have the secret that will save Padme from death... only Palps admits that he doesn't, but Ani pledges himself anyway

Yup. This is a flaw. However, Anakin struggles with the decision as to whether to kill Palpatine himself. But you see the conflict in him, because Palpatine has been his friend and father-figure. I think it was acted out alright.


... wherein Palps pulls the name "Darth Vader" out of thin air

Anakin was "in-Vading" the Jedi Temple, so maybe that's why Palpatine thought of it. I don't take their Sith names too seriously. It's kind of like getting your nickname at a fraternity initiation night to me.



... and while we're at it, Palps also somehow manages to have an evil life-support suit just laying around to drop Special Olympics Anakin into at the end...

Yeah. You have to wonder about that. But it's really just the helmet that's special. If I could use paratineal dialysis and needed a colostomy bag, these things could be assembled on a belt attached to my body. If I wanted to wear black leather around it, that would be my business. Meanwhile, Palpatine has access to armor molding shops and could pick out a war droid design and rush-order it. He's the Emperor after all. He doesn't have to wait in line for anything.


AFTER Ani, who went Dark Side in order to save Padme from death, is the one who chokes her to kill her :confused:

That could have been written better - as tragic irony.


Ani then fights Obi, blaming his mentor for something or other ("Jedi are the bad guys" :confused: where the F*** did THAT come from?)... Anakin then leaps OVER Obi where his limbs can be cut off instead of jumping onto shore to continue the fight... oh, this is after Obi tells Ani not to try it because he has the high ground,

The Jedi are defending the status quo - the slow process of change that happens with democracy as we might see it - but "the evil status quo" as Anakin sees it. He wants to make everything better overnight by tyrannical decree. In an Empire, with real power, I guess he can. He thinks that would be justice.



only Obi is the one who defeated Darth Maul by doing exactly the same thing...

Darth Maul just stood there too full of himself, thinking he'd unconditionally won. But you're right, that Obi-Wan essentially did the exact same thing he warned Anakin not to do, but it did work for Obi-Wan.



Then there's the love triangle....

There never was a love triangle. And I didn't gather that Anakin ever thought Padme was having an affair with Obi-Wan, or that Obi-Wan would even be interested. However, he did think that Obi-Wan convinced her to betray Anakin by leading him to Mustafar.

Rocketboy
12-27-2008, 11:01 AM
What about the ever bipolar nature of Anakin.Do you have any idea idea what bipolar disorder is? Show me examples of where Anakin has an extreme high followed immediately by extreme low. All I see is a kid that gets p*ssed off from time to time.


He learns that Palps is the Sith Lord, reports him, and then minutes later, chooses to side with him because Palps promises to have the secret that will save Padme from death... only Palps admits that he doesn't, but Ani pledges himself anyway... This is called the point of no return. What was he supposed to do, kill Palpatine, then go back to the Jedi, report that Palpatine was Sidious (whom Anakin killed) and oh, yeah assissted Palaptine in killing Windu? That would've gone over well.


wherein Palps pulls the name "Darth Vader" out of thin air ...Lucas reworked that scene. Originally, after Anakin pledges himself with the Sith, Palpatine and Anakin sit at the desk, pull out some paper and brainstorm for an hour or so until they figured out a name that "sounded pretty cool and menacing." Lucas really wanted to keep the scene in and it killed him to have to rework it, but in the end it really slowed the down the pacing and made the running time too long.


and while we're at it, Palps also somehow manages to have an evil life-support suit just laying around to drop Special Olympics Anakin into at the end... Where do they say in the movie that it was "just laying around?"


AFTER Ani, who went Dark Side in order to save Padme from death, is the one who chokes her to kill her :confused: . It ain't called The dark side because it makes you a nice, happy guy that tickles people.


Ani then fights Obi, blaming his mentor for something or other ("Jedi are the bad guys" :confused: where the F*** did THAT come from?)...It started back in Episode II, where Anakin feels he better than Obi-Wan and Yoda and feels like the Jedi are holding him back. Then in Episode III it continues when Anakin is convinced there are things the Jedi aren't telling him. Then there are the facts that Anakin feels betrayed by the Council for not giving the rank of Master or when he walks in on Windu about to assassinate Palpatine, who was suppposed to be there arresting him. These are the things you notice when you pay attention.


Anakin then leaps OVER Obi where his limbs can be cut off instead of jumping onto shore to continue the fight... oh, this is after Obi tells Ani not to try it because he has the high ground, only Obi is the one who defeated Darth Maul by doing exactly the same thing...And just before he leaps Anakin says "Don't underestimate my power" but as we see it is Anakin that underestimates his own power. Besides, if it worked for Obi-Wan, why wouldn't it work of Anakin?


Then there's the love triangle....No there isn't.


The entire Prequel Trilogy story and character development is a massive train wreck shrouded by flashy bright shiny objects, which are indeed fun to look at, but cover a foundation that has more holes than the Bush motivation to invade Iraq.Politics belong in the Rancor Pit. Thanks.

stillakid
12-27-2008, 11:41 AM
Do you have any idea idea what bipolar disorder is? Show me examples of where Anakin has an extreme high followed immediately by extreme low. All I see is a kid that gets p*ssed off from time to time.

Duh. How about him killing Sandpeople then crying like a baby to Padme? Or the pinnacle of his "turn" when he runs in full of vigor, kills Mace, then drops to his knees to pledge his loyalty to a guy who he KNOWS is evil, to a guy who told him he had the secret to "eternal life" and then learns IMMEDIATELY that Palps was lying. These are just a couple of the things you notice when you pay attention.



This is called the point of no return. What was he supposed to do, kill Palpatine, then go back to the Jedi, report that Palpatine was Sidious (whom Anakin killed) and oh, yeah assissted Palaptine in killing Windu? That would've gone over well.

Well, you're manufacturing an alternative storypoint that wouldn't be necessary if the original plotline had been constructed more carefully. But yes, you are right, Anakin got himself into a corner and had few options. However, dropping to his knees to pledge himself to the bad guy isn't very plausible in any kind of logical discussion. These are the kinds of things you notice when you're paying attention.





Lucas reworked that scene. Originally, after Anakin pledges himself with the Sith, Palpatine and Anakin sit at the desk, pull out some paper and brainstorm for an hour or so until they figured out a name that "sounded pretty cool and menacing." Lucas really wanted to keep the scene in and it killed him to have to rework it, but in the end it really slowed the down the pacing and made the running time too long.

You should work at the Comedy Store on Sunset. Your attempt at deflecting the point by making light of it doesn't address the question at all. If anything, your attempt to distract just highlights the original issue that Palps pulling the name out of his a** comes off as nothing short of ludicrous. But that's standard "argumentative strategy" when you have no excuses or rationalizations for a point of view...distract and hope no one notices. Those are the kinds of things you notice when you pay attention.



Where do they say in the movie that it was "just laying around?"

Do you have your eyes open when you watch movies or do you just listen to them? THX is nice and all, but that's only half the movie.

Your comment really says a lot about all the people who say they enjoyed the Prequels. Those who enjoyed the movies NEED the story rammed down their throats... if it isn't SAID then it doesn't exist. There are things called subtlety and implication that most quality storytellers frequently employ. Children's pop-up books tend to spell things out, which is what the Star Wars Prequels were excelling at, even if the points were flawed.

We see Special Olympics Anakin whisked off to some mystery medical place where he is immediately placed into an evil looking life support suit. Where did it come from? Your comment above implies (a concept you're not familiar with, I understand) that Palps had it manufactured right then and there. Is that what you intend to imply (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/imply)?







It ain't called The dark side because it makes you a nice, happy guy that tickles people.

sigh.

Do I really have to explain this? Really?

Anakin's ENTIRE REASON for dropping to his knees to pledge himself to Palps... after he killed Mace....after Palps promised Ani the secret to saving Padme from death...after Palps said he doesn't really have the secret....

His ENTIRE REASON for going bad was to save Padme from death.... and then he chokes the girl he turned bad to save?!

Well, I and many others are capable of looking at the entire story and seeing how it does or doesn't fit together. These are the kinds of things you notice when you're paying attention.




It started back in Episode II, where Anakin feels he better than Obi-Wan and Yoda and feels like the Jedi are holding him back. Then in Episode III it continues when Anakin is convinced there are things the Jedi aren't telling him. Then there are the facts that Anakin feels betrayed by the Council for not giving the rank of Master or when he walks in on Windu about to assassinate Palpatine, who was suppposed to be there arresting him. These are the things you notice when you pay attention.

No no no. Anakin wasn't implying (there's that word again) that the Jedi were the "Bad guys" because they were holding him back. BiPolar Hayd-akin was telling Obi Wan that the Jedi were "bad" because of the politics and the things that Palps fed to him in the Cirque Du Soleil sequence.

If you want to discuss Anakin's nonsensical feelings of disenfranchisement, let's revisit his discussion with Padme in AOTC at her apartment when he goes off on Obi only to be scolded back by Padme about Obi's motivations...and then Ani says the words, "I know." He goes off about how unfair Obi and the Jedi are to him (because he's an arrogant juvenile baby), but he also understands that he is illogical and is being unfair.

This extends into ROTS when Ani is speaking with Palps and discovers that Palps is the Sith. It is a rare moment of "responsibility" that he shows as he rushes off to report this to the Jedi... illustrating that he knows which side is "right" and which is inherently "wrong." But then, two scenes later, Ani enters the office and becomes entirely illogical by killing Mace, saving Palps, only for the reason of getting the secret to saving Padme's life...which is IMMEDIATELY rendered moot as Palps says that he doesn't really know it .... AND Anakin later renders his own motivations moot by attempting to kill Padme himself.

These are the kinds of things you notice when you pay attention. But I understand when bright shiny objects are distracting.



And just before he leaps Anakin says "Don't underestimate my power" but as we see it is Anakin that underestimates his own power. Besides, if it worked for Obi-Wan, why wouldn't it work of Anakin?

Anakin didn't know about Obi's success in TPM. Is that what you're implying? That Ani knew and decided to take a shot at it too?




No there isn't.

Yeah, there is. In Anakin's eyes, anyway. It also fits Lucas's "style" wherein he pulls from our own classics and mythology, which he's good at, but he has no ability to piece it all together by himself.

These are the kinds of things you notice when you pay attention.




Politics belong in the Rancor Pit. Thanks.

It isn't politics. It's an example. It's the kind of thing you notice when you pay attention and look beyond the superficial.

You're welcome.

El Chuxter
12-27-2008, 02:16 PM
The way the scene plays out, Anakin could easily argue--whether it was his intention or not--that he tried to disarm Mace because he felt Mace was veering too close to the Dark Side. He cut off his arm. We've seen many times that cutting off an arm is the Star Wars equivalent of kicking someone in the shins; they get a cool robot hand and everything's hunky-dory.

We see Anakin arguing with Mace. Anakin is supporting the Jedi rule of law. Mace is advocating tossing this in favor of chaos. It's not clear to us if Anakin is just talking out of his butt, so it's not clear to Palpatine.

The only thing I think is clear in the scene is that Anakin didn't intend to kill Mace.

stillakid
12-27-2008, 02:35 PM
The way the scene plays out, Anakin could easily argue--whether it was his intention or not--that he tried to disarm Mace because he felt Mace was veering too close to the Dark Side. He cut off his arm. We've seen many times that cutting off an arm is the Star Wars equivalent of kicking someone in the shins; they get a cool robot hand and everything's hunky-dory.

We see Anakin arguing with Mace. Anakin is supporting the Jedi rule of law. Mace is advocating tossing this in favor of chaos. It's not clear to us if Anakin is just talking out of his butt, so it's not clear to Palpatine.

The only thing I think is clear in the scene is that Anakin didn't intend to kill Mace.


Well, it can be safely reasoned that Anakin did not intend Mace to die. He was listening to Palps promise him the secret of saving Padme's life... so if Mace killed Palps, the secret to saving Padme would die too. SO, Anakin stopped Mace from broadswording Palps to death. Period. Ani knows that Palps is the bad guy and that Mace was justified in fighting Palps as evidenced by the reason Mace was there in the first place.

It's what takes place AFTER Anakin stops Mace that is the nonsensical part. Of course Palps will kill Mace, but the way Anakin reacts makes no sense... so Mace flies out the window to his death. Anakin wants the secret that will save Padme, BUT Palps instantly says that he doesn't really have it. SO, instead of a rational Anakin saying, "Hey, I just saved you a&& so I could save Padme. WTF?!" Ani instead drops to his knees and pledges his support to the Dark Side. Huh? Where did that come from? Then LUCAS dumps a bunch of unmotivated political crap (Jedi's are the bad guys!) in order to help justify Anakin's rather sudden turn to the bad side.

Looking back through the entire Prequel Trilogy, as those of us who pay attention do, we see that Anakin has a history of acting out like a spoiled brat, but knowing that he is being irrational, but doing it anyway. He also has one moment in AOTC in the field when he spouts off some ill-reasoned political philosophy (in a Lucas attempt to telegraph what is to come). That's it as far as Anakin's reasons for going bad go. There are a few illogical "Jedi and the Republic doesn't work" moments but the primary "I'm going Dark Side" motivation is this need to save Padme from death. Palps claims to have the secret and in order to justify saving Palp's life, Anakin illogically spouts out some nonsense about the Jedi being the evil ones.... then he himself chokes Padme.

If this makes ANY sense to anyone at all, then I suggest that they immediately enroll in the nearest University that is studying quantum physics because they will clearly see logic where no one else is able.

So, the punchline is that ROTS isn't only not a great film in any way, it also ranks as one of the WORST of all time! Oh, it's got pretty blinky lights and shiny objects, but what lies beneath is ridiculous. It's an interesting turn on the "Emperor has no clothes" story. In this case, there are bright shiny clothes, but no Emperor.

Tycho
12-27-2008, 04:03 PM
It's what takes place AFTER Anakin stops Mace that is the nonsensical part. Of course Palps will kill Mace, but the way Anakin reacts makes no sense... so Mace flies out the window to his death. Anakin wants the secret that will save Padme, BUT Palps instantly says that he doesn't really have it. SO, instead of a rational Anakin saying, "Hey, I just saved you a&& so I could save Padme. WTF?!" Ani instead drops to his knees and pledges his support to the Dark Side. Huh? Where did that come from?

Logically, Stillakid is right (above). Anakin should be like "WTF?"

Now, let's look at what Anakin knows "logically."

1) Kit Fisto, SaeSee Tiin, and Agen Kolar left with Mace to arrest Palpatine.
2) They are no longer with him when Anakin found Mace and Palpatine.
3) Kit, SaeSee, and Agen must have stepped out for a beer, right?
4) Anakin could doubt his ability to handle Palpatine alone. We don't know.
5) Palpatine has been Anakin's friend, so Anakin is confused. He can't kill him.
6) Palpatine baits him along that "together" they can learn to cheat death.
7) Palpatine has seemed to support Padme in the past - they're from Naboo.
8) The Jedi will totally tear apart his motivations and "see through him."
9) Anakin will not be allowed to stay in the Order, and remain married.
10) Anakin might be tried by the Jedi for striking Mace.
11) As the Chancellor AND Sith Lord, Palpatine must have a plan it'd be wise to learn.


Then LUCAS dumps a bunch of unmotivated political crap (Jedi's are the bad guys!) in order to help justify Anakin's rather sudden turn to the bad side.

Well, Palpatine dumped that out on Anakin and the Republic Senate. It was the obvious move. I saw that coming before I saw TPM.



then he himself chokes Padme.

I think he meant to forcibly shut her up, not kill her.


Oh, it's got pretty blinky lights and shiny objects,

And I got to buy the toys they made out of those! :thumbsup: please

Rocketboy
12-28-2008, 03:09 AM
Do you have any idea idea what bipolar disorder is? Show me examples of where Anakin has an extreme high followed immediately by extreme low. All I see is a kid that gets p*ssed off from time to time.Duh. How about him killing Sandpeople then crying like a baby to Padme?Doing something really terrible in a moment of rage, like say, killing the individuals that just killed your mother, then later feeling regret and remorse for going overboard is not bipolar. Those are called realistic human emotions.


Or the pinnacle of his "turn" when he runs in full of vigor, kills Mace, then drops to his knees to pledge his loyalty to a guy who he KNOWS is evil, to a guy who told him he had the secret to "eternal life" and then learns IMMEDIATELY that Palps was lying. First of all Anakin didn't run in and kill Mace. He tried to talk him out of killing Palpatine first. Once Anakin realizes that Mace has no intention of simply arresting Palpatine (as Mace originally intended to do), Anakin, in desperation, cuts Mace's hands off, just stopping him from killing Palpatine (who did the actual killing). Once Mace is gone Anakin has his "What have I done?" realization. This is where Anakin realizes he's gone past the point of no return. Again, not bipolar. The kid just f*cked up big time.

Saying Luke has schizophrenia because he hears voices in his head is more reasonable than saying Anakin is bipolar.


These are just a couple of the things you notice when you pay attention.Ah, I see what you did there...
Cute.



This is called the point of no return. What was he supposed to do, kill Palpatine, then go back to the Jedi, report that Palpatine was Sidious (whom Anakin killed) and oh, yeah assisted Palaptine in killing Windu? That would've gone over well.Well, you're manufacturing an alternative storypoint that wouldn't be necessary if the original plotline had been constructed more carefully. But yes, you are right, Anakin got himself into a corner and had few options. However, dropping to his knees to pledge himself to the bad guy isn't very plausible in any kind of logical discussion.And that is your opinion, which I happen to disagree.


These are the kinds of things you notice when you're paying attention.There you go again...




Lucas reworked that scene. Originally, after Anakin pledges himself with the Sith, Palpatine and Anakin sit at the desk, pull out some paper and brainstorm for an hour or so until they figured out a name that "sounded pretty cool and menacing." Lucas really wanted to keep the scene in and it killed him to have to rework it, but in the end it really slowed the down the pacing and made the running time too long.You should work at the Comedy Store on Sunset.I would but the daily commute across the country would be hell.


Your attempt at deflecting the point by making light of it doesn't address the question at all. Silly arguments desrve silly answers.


If anything, your attempt to distract just highlights the original issue that Palps pulling the name out of his a** comes off as nothing short of ludicrous....because its pretty obvious that Palpatine somehow gets the name by using the dark side of the Force. So unless you can explain exactly how the dark side works, I'm going to say he doesn't just "pull the name out of his *ss."


But that's standard "argumentative strategy" when you have no excuses or rationalizations for a point of view...distract and hope no one notices. My attempt at humor is less an argumentative strategy and more of a ridicule of your so-called point.


Those are the kinds of things you notice when you pay attention....which apparently you don't.



Where do they say in the movie that it was "just laying around?"Do you have your eyes open when you watch movies or do you just listen to them? Apparently about as much as you do.


Your comment really says a lot about all the people who say they enjoyed the Prequels. Those who enjoyed the movies NEED the story rammed down their throats... if it isn't SAID then it doesn't exist. There are things called subtlety and implication that most quality storytellers frequently employ. Children's pop-up books tend to spell things out, which is what the Star Wars Prequels were excelling at, even if the points were flawed.I don't need any story aspects rammed my throat and I don't believe that if isn't said then it doesn't exist, but I do find it funny how you say all of this, then decide to pick and choose what aspects are (apparently) so clearly implied and others which need to spelled out for you.


We see Special Olympics Anakin whisked off to some mystery medical place where he is immediately placed into an evil looking life support suit. Where did it come from? Where else would you find everything you need to save a horribly burned and disfigured man on the verge of death but in what is probably one of the most advanced medical facilities on one of the most advanced planets in the galaxy? The only real mystery for me is the helmet, but I don't need that spelled out for me.
And the Special Olympics cracks are really uncalled for.


Your comment above implies (a concept you're not familiar with, I understand) that Palps had it manufactured right then and there. Is that what you intend to imply?Looks like I understand "Imply" better than you understand "Bipolar." I just answered the rest of the question in the comment above.



It ain't called The dark side because it makes you a nice, happy guy that tickles people.Do I really have to explain this? Really?Only if you insist.*sigh*


Anakin's ENTIRE REASON for dropping to his knees to pledge himself to Palps... after he killed Mace....after Palps promised Ani the secret to saving Padme from death...after Palps said he doesn't really have the secret....

His ENTIRE REASON for going bad was to save Padme from death.... and then he chokes the girl he turned bad to save?!Bad guys that hate themselves don't like feeling betrayed by the one person they thought they could trust, especially when the perceived betrayer is the one reason he turned evil. And I'll bet it especially p*sses him off when she tells him she doesn't want to be with him anymore.


Well, I and many others are capable of looking at the entire story and seeing how it does or doesn't fit together. ...based on things that aren't really there.


These are the kinds of things you notice when you're paying attention.Tee hee, you're funny. Keep it up and I might develop a crush on you.



It started back in Episode II, where Anakin feels he better than Obi-Wan and Yoda and feels like the Jedi are holding him back. Then in Episode III it continues when Anakin is convinced there are things the Jedi aren't telling him. Then there are the facts that Anakin feels betrayed by the Council for not giving the rank of Master or when he walks in on Windu about to assassinate Palpatine, who was suppposed to be there arresting him. These are the things you notice when you pay attention.No no no. Yes yes yes.


Anakin wasn't implying (there's that word again) that the Jedi were the "Bad guys" because they were holding him back. Where did I say Anakin thought the Jedi were bad guys? Oh that's right, I didn't. I said that the seeds of mistrust were there early in Episode II.


Anakin was telling Obi Wan that the Jedi were "bad" because of the politics and the things that Palps fed to him in the Cirque Du Soleil sequence.Thinking someone is bad and not trusting them are not the same thing.


If you want to discuss Anakin's nonsensical feelings of disenfranchisement, let's revisit his discussion with Padme in AOTC at her apartment when he goes off on Obi only to be scolded back by Padme about Obi's motivations...and then Ani says the words, "I know." He goes off about how unfair Obi and the Jedi are to him (because he's an arrogant juvenile baby), but he also understands that he is illogical and is being unfair.You really thought Anakin truly understood and agreed with Padme? I've always thought that Anakin's quick answers were pretty typical of someone (usually, but not always a teenager) who wants to drop a conversation/argument to avoid the unpleasantness, similar to a "I know. I'm sorry" response a young person will give to an adult.


This extends into ROTS when Ani is speaking with Palps and discovers that Palps is the Sith. It is a rare moment of "responsibility" that he shows as he rushes off to report this to the Jedi... illustrating that he knows which side is "right" and which is inherently "wrong." But then, two scenes later, Ani enters the office and becomes entirely illogical by killing Mace, saving Palps, only for the reason of getting the secret to saving Padme's life...which is IMMEDIATELY rendered moot as Palps says that he doesn't really know it .... AND Anakin later renders his own motivations moot by attempting to kill Padme himself.Anakin isn't being responsible, he's being selfish. He even tells Palpatine he should kill him right then and there. He doesn't so that the Jedi can arrest Palpatine and he will remain alive to help him save Padme. Despite Palpatine admitting he doesn't know how to save her (yet) Anakin really doesn't have a choice but to follow Palpatine if he wants any chance at all of saving Padme.
BTW, Did you even watch Episode III? That is the second time you've said Anakin killed Mace. He didn't. Sure, he was an accomplice, but it was actually Palpatine that did the killing.


These are the kinds of things you notice when you pay attention. So start paying attention, dreamboat.


But I understand when bright shiny objects are distracting.I'll bet you understand it all too well.



And just before he leaps Anakin says "Don't underestimate my power" but as we see it is Anakin that underestimates his own power. Besides, if it worked for Obi-Wan, why wouldn't it work of Anakin?Anakin didn't know about Obi's success in TPM. Is that what you're implying? That Ani knew and decided to take a shot at it too?It stands to reason that it probably came up between Anakin and Obi-Wan somewhere over the course of a decade, but I have no idea if Anakin knew what happened on Naboo or not. What I said was that Anakin was overconfident in his abilities and Obi-Wan used that overconfidence to his advantage.



No there isn't.Yeah, there is. In Anakin's eyes, anyway.Again, no, there isn't. Now there was rumored to be a love triangle in earlier drafts of the script, but that was dropped. Anakin clearly feels betrayed by Padme, not cheated on.


These are the kinds of things you notice when you pay attention.Will you go to prom with me?
:love:




Politics belong in the Rancor Pit. Thanks.It isn't politics. It's an example. It's the kind of thing you notice when you pay attention and look beyond the superficial.Stating Bush's motivations for the invasion of Iraq has holes in it is clearly an opinion and political opinions belong in the Rancor Pit.


You're welcome.For what?

CaptainSolo1138
12-29-2008, 01:48 AM
Will you go to prom with me?
Oh, we finna scrap ova that, girl.

Rocketboy
12-29-2008, 11:13 PM
Oh, we finna scrap ova that, girl.If I've told you once I've told you a thousand times: no glove, no love.

Mad Slanted Powers
01-06-2009, 02:21 AM
I don't need any story aspects rammed my throat and I don't believe that if isn't said then it doesn't exist, but I do find it funny how you say all of this, then decide to pick and choose what aspects are (apparently) so clearly implied and others which need to spelled out for you.Agreed. It can be frustrating trying to logically argue something when at one point he will talk about how some things are obviously being implied, but at another point will say that since it wasn't in the movie, we have no on-screen evidence to support it.

I've never done a marathon viewing. That would take all day. More likely I would do one a day for a week. I don't know which I would consider my favorite. I still feel TPM gets a bad rap. It is my favorite of the prequels.

Tycho
01-06-2009, 07:46 AM
I'm actually missing my JarJar action figure right now. (Most of my collection is in storage).

Devo
01-06-2009, 10:57 AM
Agreed. It can be frustrating trying to logically argue something when at one point he will talk about how some things are obviously being implied, but at another point will say that since it wasn't in the movie, we have no on-screen evidence to support it.

I've never done a marathon viewing. That would take all day. More likely I would do one a day for a week. I don't know which I would consider my favorite. I still feel TPM gets a bad rap. It is my favorite of the prequels.


I think the problem is that things that should have been rammed down our throats weren't while things that needn't have been rammed down our throats were - in fairness to Stillakid this is probably what hes getting at and I agree.

I also agree with you that TPM is the best prequel - in hindsight.

2-1B
01-11-2009, 04:36 AM
Batman Begins: "What?! That's not a Star Wars film!?" Right. But in a fairly short first act, we saw Liam Neeson training his young padawan in a far more believable and effective way than TPM could do in two hours.


Really? I thought Qui-Gonn had no business being in TPM...

TIE DEFENDER
01-12-2009, 04:13 PM
My favorite is ROTJ too, next ESB,then SW.....The prequels...They're fun, but the OT is another level of movie making,There`s nothing like the OT.

PREQUELS: Thre`s no doubt TPM is the best prequel, at least That`s the one I`m not being boring watching again and again.

Devo
01-13-2009, 09:32 AM
People tend to prefer ROTS just because it has the keynote events (or at least some of) that we were all expecting - the final duel culminating in anakin turning into darth vader, the battle between Palpatine and Yoda (we didn't know it'd be a lightsaber duel!). The fact that it was all handled with the very same ineptitude as the previous films gets less noticed by people. To be honest I'm surprised I don't feel the same - that I actually prefer TPM. The maths of my personal preferance don't add up. The maths should dictate that because all the prequels were 'handled poorly' then the best and most relevant story events, poorly handled though they were, should determine which is the best film.

I would think it ought to be:

TPM: worst film - because it achieved the least in terms of the story we were expecting based on OT referances to the time period. It introduced characters who ought not to have been there, taking up valuable screentime from other more relevant characters. And it was clumsily acted by most and badly scripted.

AOTC: 2nd worst - better than TPM because it began the clone wars, had a lot of cool sequences, Obi-wan was the teacher as he should have been in the first film, hints of Anakin's evil tendencies - and yet still clumsily acted and even more badly scripted than TPM.

ROTS: Best of the prequels because of aforementioned keynote events - and yet clumsily acted and still badly scripted.

However I still find myself preferring TPM - something I never would have predicted a while ago. It could ironically be down to Liam Neeson - whose character shouldn't have been there in the first place.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
01-14-2009, 12:13 AM
maths
Ha . . . Foreigner. ;)

Tycho
01-14-2009, 12:25 AM
I prefer ROTS amongst the prequels because it has a lot of action and the story really moves. That being said, Padme's death is the worst-handled element of all the prequels. However, I'm really entertained watching all the battles and General Grievous is a lot of fun.

El Chuxter
01-14-2009, 12:28 AM
Ha . . . Foreigner. ;)

Foreigner was pretty cool. They weren't Boston, but they were cool as far as generic arena rock goes.

Tycho
01-14-2009, 12:35 AM
One of THE best memories of mine from high school was set against Foreigner's "Juke Box Hero" and "Urgent." I'll never forget the course of those events!!! (and it was on my birthday, too!)

bobafrett
01-14-2009, 12:48 AM
I saw foreigner once in concert. They were pretty good. I remember working out in high school to Juke Box Hero. God I hated that song.

Mad Slanted Powers
01-14-2009, 01:42 AM
I guess it was appropriate that a band called Foreigner did a song called, "Long, Long Way From Home."


I think the problem is that things that should have been rammed down our throats weren't while things that needn't have been rammed down our throats were - in fairness to Stillakid this is probably what hes getting at and I agree.

I also agree with you that TPM is the best prequel - in hindsight.I guess the example that illustrates what I was trying to say was the debate we had about Jango clones "infecting" the OT. I logically argued that since we never saw helmet-less Stormtroopers in the OT, we don't know what they look like. The PT established the Jango clones, so it is not a huge leap to think that there could still be Jango clones in the Empire. In fact, many people here have admitted that long before the PT, they thought that the Stormtroopers were clones.

Stillakid's argument was that Commander Praji was obviously a Stormtrooper. Darth Vader told him to see to it personally, and then there are Stormtroopers on Tatooine. So, obviously, one of them must be Praji. I don't think that is something that you can conclude so easily. It had never even occurred to me that he could be a Stormtrooper. It is certainly possible, but there are many ways you could parse Vader's command. Plus, I think the EU said that he didn't go down there. If he did go down there, "seeing to it personally" could mean he is still dressed in black and coordinating the search from the landing craft. Even if he is a Stormtrooper, that doesn't prove that there are no Jango clones in the time of the OT.

My apologies for bringing this up again. I don't mean to debate it all over again. I just wanted to illustrate what I was trying to say in my agreement with Rocketboy's assessment of Stillakid's logic skills.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
01-14-2009, 01:58 AM
Well, stillakid has been banned, so hopefully we'll never have to hear from him again.

Mad Slanted Powers
01-14-2009, 02:17 AM
Well, stillakid has been banned, so hopefully we'll never have to hear from him again.

We wouldn't want our lives to become boring would we?

If he was banned because of this thread, it didn't seem all that ban-worthy. He doesn't need banning, just a basic course in logic. Then again, I could probably use a basic course about the art of plot and storytelling so that I could understand why everyone thinks TPM is lacking in those departments.

Devo
01-14-2009, 02:02 PM
I had no idea he'd been banned. I wondered why he hadn't responded to Rocketboy's post. I think thats a pity, perhaps just because I agree wholeheartedly with his opinions on the prequels - I know his tone sometimes was condescending, whether that was deliberate or not I don't know.

DarkArtist
01-14-2009, 02:11 PM
why was stillakid banned ? were his post's that bad ?

Rocketboy
01-15-2009, 02:18 AM
I know his tone sometimes was condescendingCondescending doesn't even begin to describe it.

neosapian77
01-17-2009, 01:38 PM
I had no idea he'd been banned. I wondered why he hadn't responded to Rocketboy's post. I think thats a pity, perhaps just because I agree wholeheartedly with his opinions on the prequels - I know his tone sometimes was condescending, whether that was deliberate or not I don't know.

When talking about the prequels you need to be condescending. They are THAT bad. Liking the toys or the action scenes is different than saying you like the actual movies.

I can't accept them as SW material. I just won't. But I will say this time and again: Tartakovsky's Clone Wars series is the only thing that came out of the prequels that captured the true spirit of SW and it 's great animation in general.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
01-19-2009, 05:59 PM
We finally watched all six in a row yesterday (which we did once before about three years ago). It took a long time due to having to do a few things in between the movies; it ran from about 9:30 a.m. to 2:30 a.m. or so, which is a little ridiculous, but so I was tired for much of the OT.

Anyway, ROTS is still, without a doubt, my favorite. For me, it just hits all the right notes. Watching the PT all at once really enhances it, in my opinion. For some reason, seeing Jar Jar and Boss Nass walk sadly at Padmé's funeral was really, really sad yesterday, maybe since we'd just seen them at the Battle of Naboo a few hours earlier. The "You were the chosen one" speech is still great and, I feel, becomes more poignant after seeing them together more in The Clone Wars series. I came close to crying (ahem) at the ends of both ROTS and ROTJ. I love how you can essentially see Vader turn back to Anakin before he kills Palpatine. For all its goofy bits, ROTJ is damn good. I also loved AOTC quite a bit; I don't really see why people give it so much crap. TPM and ANH both moved quite slowly at the beginning and seemed to take a long time to go anywhere story-wise, so now I'm inclined to rank them fairly low; the story of Anakin/Vader is my favorite part, and those movies have less of it than the others do.

As of right now, I would rank them:
1. Revenge of the Sith
2. The Empire Strikes Back
3. Return of the Jedi
4. Attack of the Clones
5. A New Hope
6. The Phantom Menace

Although I love them all.

Tycho
01-20-2009, 08:22 AM
Good post JabbaJohnL.

After my surgery when I'm stuck at home, I'll probably finally have time to watch all 6 back-to-back. (The last time I viewed them all over the course of a week).

Right now I like the speederbikes in ROTJ.

I get what you're saying though - about the emotion one can draw out of the whole experience.

ROTS is my favorite prequel, but I still hate the way Padme just gives up and dies. It's just not logical.

I'm not sure how I'd rank all the films right now, but I'm still loving ROTJ.

JetsAndHeels
01-20-2009, 11:41 AM
ESB will always be my favorite, hands down. Out of the prequels, ROTS reigns supreme for me. I am in agreement with Tycho about the Padme death..I have said it here before, but damn that was a lame way to kill her off. Just have Anakin choke her to near-death and then do emergency surgery to save the twins. It just adds to the tragedy of Anakin's fall.

So, my rankings for the 6 films would be as follows:

1. ESB
2.ROTJ
3.ANH
4.ROTS
6.AOTC
7.TPM

Mr. JabbaJohnL
01-20-2009, 01:20 PM
As to Padmé's death - I know it's being discussed in another thread but I wanted to touch on it here - I think it's overall fine. You have to make some things dramatic and romantic in order for a better movie. If she had lived to spend a few years with Leia, as some have suggested, it would have taken away from the emotional impact of the film. The fact that Anakin killed her not by crushing her windpipe but by breaking her heart is more romantic as well. Is it realistic? No, not necessarily, though you do occasionally hear of someone dying of a broken heart. And I figure she knew the kids would be safer without her around, since otherwise, Vader would likely have come looking for her.

neosapian77
01-20-2009, 06:26 PM
I think I've been outspoken on how much I despise the prequels but as a film buff and SW fan I have to accept them in the SW canon. Here it goes w/ number 1 being my favorite:

1. ESB
2. ROTJ
3.ANH
4. ROTS
5.TPM
6.AOTC

And Tartakovsky's Clone Wars series was better than all the movies in my opinion.

bobafrett
01-20-2009, 07:53 PM
The fact that Anakin killed her not by crushing her windpipe but by breaking her heart is more romantic as well. Is it realistic? No, not necessarily, though you do occasionally hear of someone dying of a broken heart. And I figure she knew the kids would be safer without her around, since otherwise, Vader would likely have come looking for her.

I look at it this way, she was spared years of diaper changes by just giving up.

bigbarada
01-28-2009, 05:57 PM
As to Padmé's death - I know it's being discussed in another thread but I wanted to touch on it here - I think it's overall fine. You have to make some things dramatic and romantic in order for a better movie. If she had lived to spend a few years with Leia, as some have suggested, it would have taken away from the emotional impact of the film. The fact that Anakin killed her not by crushing her windpipe but by breaking her heart is more romantic as well. Is it realistic? No, not necessarily, though you do occasionally hear of someone dying of a broken heart. And I figure she knew the kids would be safer without her around, since otherwise, Vader would likely have come looking for her.

Yeah, because soooo many other love stories end with one of the partners dying of a broken heart. Look at Romeo and Juliet... oh wait, that was a vial of poison. Well, there's the classic 1970 film Love Story.... no, okay, that was leukemia. What about Titanic? Didn't Leo die of a broken heart? Nope, I forgot, he froze to death.

Even the best (and/or most notorious) romantic stories require something more than "a broken heart" if they are going to kill off a love interest.

El Chuxter
01-28-2009, 06:01 PM
If they were going to have a melodramatic 19th century ending, she could've at least have died of "consumption." :)

bigbarada
01-28-2009, 06:43 PM
If they were going to have a melodramatic 19th century ending, she could've at least have died of "consumption." :)

Or the plague. The plague is romantic isn't it?;)

Tycho
02-15-2009, 11:48 AM
I had a substitute nurse for Michelle's 2 days off. An older lady, Debbie - age 48, who was very interested in how Star Wars and this website brought out the best in people (BobaFrett) and brought me a new kidney.

Actually a Star Trek fan (TOS, some TNG), she had never seen the Star Wars movies (except for possibly Ep. 4). So she asked me to play them for her.

I decided to try an experiment and show her the movies in episode order (versus how almost all of us saw 4-5-6 first).

Debbie's comments were very interesting.

We couldn't see all the movies during the time she was here, but we watched TPM, AOTC, ROTS, and ANH.

She will definitely rent ESB and ROTJ. She got WAY into it!

Her favorite of the 4 we watched was ROTS.

She really liked Anakin, but was shocked by his turn to the Dark Side and saw it foreshadowed when his mom died and he slaughtered the Tuskens, then recklessly charged Dooku back on Geonosis - which almost ended with his own death and the end of Obi-Wan. By ROTS, Obi-Wan was her favorite character and she mourned his loss in ANH on the Death Star.

She also loved Yoda of course, which is a testament to how his character is presented, even though she's never seen ESB yet - when most of the rest of us were first introduced to him.

She saw the same flaws with ROTS as the rest of us:

Padme's death was way too cheap - to die of a broken heart when she was a strong character in the previous two movies, and she had twin children to live and care for.

Also, by ANH, especially with her interest in Obi-Wan Kenobi, Debbie did not like that they really only explained his ability to vanish into the Force with a throw-away line or two of Yoda's. Having liked Qui-Gon the most in TPM - and even saddened by his death, she would have liked to have seen his ghost in AOTC and / or ROTS and said it was a mistake to not have done this if Lucas knew he'd be the key to Obi-Wan's power beyond death in the OT.

She also liked JarJar and wished she could've seen more of him, but she commented that every consecutive movie got better and better as it became more adult. The love affair between Anakin and Padme was one of her favorite parts and she never thought the dialogue was badly written.

ROTS remained her favorite movie, after having seen 1, 2, 3, 4.

She does like Luke and wants to see what happens to him as he learns Darth Vader really is his father, and Princess Leia is his sister.

She thought the banter between Han and Leia once the cast all came together on the Death Star was great and she laughed at "the big walking carpet (in Princess Leia's) way."

She also thought the relationship between Anakin and Obi-Wan was well done by ROTS, and she was saddened to see that friendship fall apart when the two took to fighting. And she was shocked when she thought Anakin killed Padme on Mustafar with that Force-choke. I think most of us think he almost should have - or done something to physically cause her death (instead of that broken heart crap Lucas put into the final script).

I would have to agree with Debbie that ROTS is the most exciting and fun between 1-4. ESB and ROTJ really give it a run for the money though.

Oh, she did like the detective story for Obi-Wan in AOTC when he traced Zam Wessel's employer to Kamino to learn of Jango Fett, and then followed him to Geonosis only to discover the founding of the CIS and the battle droid army that the Separatists had readied!

Rocketboy
02-15-2009, 05:40 PM
Very cool. It's always interesting to see/hear a Star Wars virgin's take on the saga.

Bel-Cam Jos
02-16-2009, 11:35 AM
I could make a comment... :rolleyes:

I have the E1 teaser poster on my classroom wall, and I have several students who ask, "why is there a shadow behind the little boy?" When they see the actual silouette [sp?], they often say, "oh, that's like Anakin in that suit at the end of the movie." Those are adolecents who've been raised on The Matrix, LOTR, Harry Potter, or various Marvel and DC superhero movies, so the "old" Star Wars movies aren't as common to them.

But to find an adult in that point of view, seems rare to me.

Tycho
02-16-2009, 11:48 AM
Women usually have a different perpective than men, else the genders here on SSG might reflect a greater balance.

While Debbie liked TOS and TNG Star Treks, she said she was more prone to choosing chic flick dramas and romantic comedies when going to the movies.

This was her first exposure to Star Wars. From her perspective, the Anakin-Padme relationship was the most intriguing part. I'd guess she'll really love Han and Leia, but that doesn't really blossum until ESB and in the prequels, I don't really count a 9 year old Anakin's fascination with Padme as part of the love story anyway.

Liking comedy, I can see how she enjoyed JarJar Binks. The preference here amongst the male audience, myself included, is for tragedy amongst strong battle action and I (as well as most here I imagine) dig a militant approach to Star Wars. But it is nice to add to our ranks of fans with women and children who appreciate romance and comedy. However, I agree with many here that it wasn't even close to the best romance and comedy ever written. And what Star Wars is to a lot of us longtime fans, could not have been improved even if Will Smith or Jim Carey signed on as JarJar Binks (Smith is turning to more dramatic, serious roles anyway - and I'd think we can expect him to play President Obama in a movie in the near future. He might be the right age. I'm not sure if Denzel Washington is the right man for that role.)

Mr. JabbaJohnL
03-09-2009, 11:27 PM
My roommate and his girlfriend (who's always here, so I refer to them as my roommates) watched TPM today. She's seen all six and likes them, and he saw TPM once when it was in theaters but was turned off of the saga due to the "I am your father" jokes (his name is Luke). I watched most of it and answered questions and whatnot.

Anyway, he has NO idea that Anakin becomes Vader. They've seen Clone Wars when I've had it on but not really paid attention, so he knows Anakin grows up and becomes a Jedi. He was asking about the paternity issue and asked if Darth Vader was Anakin's father, which I thought was strange. He also seems to have no idea that Palpatine is Sidious. He did, however, get the Padmé/Sabé thing pretty much right away when he knew Natalie Portman was one of the actors (they were quite surprised to hear that Keira Knightley was the other). He recognized R2-D2 and Yoda and asked where "the gold guy" was, surprised to see that he was far from gold here. :D

They'll be watching the others soon. I'm really interested in seeing how he reacts . . . I honestly think he's the first person who didn't know Anakin and Vader were the same.

JetsAndHeels
03-10-2009, 12:01 AM
I honestly think he's the first person who didn't know Anakin and Vader were the same.

I have had the same experience with some people I know. When TPM came out 10 years ago, I remember having to "set the record straight" with one friend of mine who was convinced that Anakin was really Luke. :)

As far as the Anakin/Vader issue, when I have had to explain that they are one in the same, I get the strangest looks...it's almost as if some of them do not believe me.

Too bad for them if they do not though, they are missing out on one of the most important, if not the most important storyline of the saga.

Tycho
03-10-2009, 12:26 PM
Maybe if Darth Vader had ever jumped up and down in the OT and said in his deep, rumbling voice: "That is sooooo wizard!" it would have helped.

George Lucas can correct this oversight though when he makes the Extra-Special Special Editions.

JetsAndHeels
03-10-2009, 05:09 PM
Maybe if Darth Vader had ever jumped up and down in the OT and said in his deep, rumbling voice: "That is sooooo wizard!" it would have helped.

George Lucas can correct this oversight though when he makes the Extra-Special Special Editions.


And I can take comfort in knowing that I will not have to waste one single dollar on any of those. :)

Tycho
03-10-2009, 08:57 PM
And I can take comfort in knowing that I will not have to waste one single dollar on any of those. :)

Yippeeee!!

Actually, playing the Lego Star Wars Complete Saga video game has made me want to watch the Complete Saga over again.

This could be the last time in a while. I swear! (probably not)

JEDIpartner
03-11-2009, 01:19 PM
I still hate Return of the Jedi the most of all the films.

Tycho
03-11-2009, 03:24 PM
I still hate Return of the Jedi the most of all the films.


Why? I can really love that movie.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
03-11-2009, 04:22 PM
I really appreciated ROTJ more the most recent time I saw it. I think it has something to do with how well all the films connect to each other and enrichen each other.

Watching TPM the other day, I realized that many of the parts I love in there are just foreshadowing upcoming events; so I do believe that the more you watch and rewatch them, the better they get. Many of these bits (dialogue, the japor snippet, seeing Palpatine after Mace and Yoda discuss the Sith) only really become apparent after you know the whole story, so to someone who doesn't know the full story (like my roommate) they would just seem like unimportant things. I thought that was pretty cool.

JEDIpartner
03-11-2009, 04:42 PM
Why? I can really love that movie.

It was beyond loud and chaotic; The fact that there was a SECOND Death Star (only due to the fact that they had to blow up the first one to give the original film closure in the event there were no sequels); the doofy tone of the whole thing. The only good part was the confrontation between Luke and Vader. That part had gravity. The rest of it was like watching a puppet show on speed/LSD.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
03-17-2009, 02:06 PM
We watched AOTC yesterday. He seemed really surprised that Anakin and Padmé got married, but guessed that Luke is their son. He still has no idea about Palpatine/Sidious or Anakin/Vader. He said he liked this one better than TPM, but it seemed like he didn't like Anakin (or thought he was throwing "hissy fits").

Tycho
03-17-2009, 03:58 PM
Well, Luke threw hissy fits in ANH and ESB (But I was going into Toshe Station.... -and- I don't know what I'm doing here. We're wasting our time!)

It illustrated that having Jedi discipline was tough and that (at least) the Skywalkers lacked it.

Also I don't think it was ever intended for the audience to really (really) like Anakin, but it happens as people can relate to him (as my nurse did, as well as myself when I was watching the prequels - I'd want the girl and I also wouldn't just blindly follow the Jedi Council's orders to the letter and not interpret my orders to find out who wanted to kill Padme. Not to mention that Obi-Wan did not always follow the rules when he was younger - he pledged to train Anakin in the first place - didn't he?)

Mr. JabbaJohnL
03-17-2009, 04:52 PM
Well, Luke threw hissy fits in ANH and ESB (But I was going into Toshe Station.... -and- I don't know what I'm doing here. We're wasting our time!)
Exactly. I was going to bring this up to him but I didn't want to outright say that Luke was Anakin's son (even though he guessed it after the wedding scene, but he's guessed a ton of incorrect things).

I think Anakin's impatience and so-called hissy fits (and the way he handles his relationship with Padmé) can be chalked up in part to his age. He's got a lot of raw power but feels like the Jedi are holding him back and intentionally withholding information (seen in AOTC and ROTS) and he wants more. Same thing with Luke - he wants to get going.

Going back to the relationship thing, which is why this movie doesn't work for a lot of people, is that Anakin has no experience in this field so he comes off as awkward at times. I think people expected him to be more suave like Han Solo, but he's just following his heart and occasionally stumbling. I think Padmé sees the good, honest person in him through all this.

Mad Slanted Powers
03-17-2009, 08:01 PM
Going back to the relationship thing, which is why this movie doesn't work for a lot of people, is that Anakin has no experience in this field so he comes off as awkward at times. I think people expected him to be more suave like Han Solo, but he's just following his heart and occasionally stumbling. I think Padmé sees the good, honest person in him through all this.That's what I've always thought. Anakin was a bit of an outsider even on Tatooine, and then went to the Jedi Temple, not exactly a place where you are going to learn to hone your romance skills. I like to think of Anakin being like Martin from the Simpsons. They are both gifted, and don't seem to have a problem speaking up. They just come across as awkward or dorky.

JEDIpartner
03-18-2009, 12:50 PM
Another thing, too... Anakin is younger than Panty Padmé and 1) he figures she is more sophisticated than he is due to the age difference and 2) he's trying too hard to impress as most young men tend to do-- they try to sound older by being more verbose. What ends up happening is they illustrate they haven't the command of the language that they think they have!

They sound like idiots at the end of the day!!! LOL

Tycho
03-18-2009, 08:51 PM
I had that experience happen to me today. I am just recovering from my surgery and I went to BlockBuster Video on my way to the grocery store and I picked out some movies. I will have my 2nd surgery in 6 more weeks that will reduce my stomach when my old kidneys are taken out. But there was this girl I was very attracted to hanging out by me in the video store. Ultimately she winds up looking at posters near where I'm standing by the New Releases (posters? - like people really go to BlockBuster for these?). I can only hope that maybe she liked me.

I only smiled and wasn't prepared with anything to say (such as just asking "what kind of movies (do you [to her]) like? Or "Have you seen any of these?" [referring to the stack of 4 in my hand - and the possible follow-up being whether she'd like to come over and watch any with me, of course!]

I thought of what to say after the fact. That's so retarded of me! :mad:

Anyway, then I saw her at the grocery store a little while later. I only said "Hi" and she said "Hi" back, but I wasn't guessing I'd see her again either or I might have gone along with my original conversation starter I thought of just now - like 2 hours after the fact. :mad:

It is a "Josh Policy" to initiate something with every girl I see who I may be attracted to. And if there is any indicator that the girl might like me, it would figure that might help.

Coming home in my building elevator I said "Hi" again to another girl and made small talk with her in the elevator. I was going down to the parking garage with my house cart to help me get all the groceries I bought upstairs the easy way. She drove by, honked her horn and waved, as she passed my parking stall and I was loading up. Maybe I'll see that one again instead?

What does that have to do with Anakin? Nothing other than I can relate - but he's begging Padme way too much and has never had a human male role model to teach him not to. "I will do anything that you ask." No Anakin, No! It goes "I am in charge here. You will do exactly as I say! Now Padme, you'll be safer if you sleep with me. Trust me. I'm a Jedi." [start the porno music as performed by the Gungan Band].

Mr. JabbaJohnL
03-20-2009, 02:58 AM
We watched ROTS tonight. My roommate's jaw dropped a few times, but he never really seemed floored by anything. He asked if Palpatine was bad right around the time that Palpatine asked Anakin to be his representative on the Council, but he didn't guess that he was Sidious. When Anakin became Vader, he said something like, "Oh, now the dots are connecting," because he was unsure how Vader and Luke fit into everything. He also said something about how he thought Anakin fell into the lava, but it was before Anakin actually burned. He also seemed surprised that Luke and Leia were siblings (and that Padmé had twins); I think he thought that Luke and Leia were a couple.

The strangest thing was that he smiled or laughed whenever Yoda came on the screen - even during the intense parts - since he thought Yoda was cute.

His girlfriend mentioned to me before the movie that Luke kind of got the raw end of the deal, having to go live on Tatooine while Leia gets to be a princess. I agreed at the time but I think Luke was fine as he was in the hands of good people who loved him.

Mr. JabbaJohnL
04-08-2009, 06:44 PM
Double post, double post, double post, double post.

We've since watched the OT, finishing with ROTJ last night. He always preferred the most recent one we watched, so I'm not sure how to completely gauge his reactions. He continually nodded off during ANH and ROTJ but that was more to his being tired than being bored with the movies, I think. After seeing ANH, he remarked that the old ones just looked different; in what way, I do not know, if he meant film stock, special effects, set design, or what.

His girlfriend hadn't seen the Special Editions or the DVDs, and she was asking about new stuff during ROTJ more than the other two and not even noticing many of the changes (meaning, perhaps Greedo shooting first isn't such a big damn deal as some people make it out to be :p ). She liked seeing Hayden at the end and didn't realize until I mentioned it that Anakin was indeed the Chosen One and fulfilled his destiny by destroying the Sith. When Palpatine told Luke to strike him down as he was unarmed, my roommate pointed out that this was like what Anakin did to Dooku in ROTS.

We watched them on my computer, and I saw it from an angle that made the screen look brighter than it was supposed to. This revealed a lot of the garbage mattes during TIE fighter scenes in all three films; there's also a pretty bad one over the Death Star II when you see it in front of Endor. I also noticed that there's a wrecked astromech droid in R2-D2's colors in Jabba's dungeon, seen both on the floor and on the wall near EV-9D9, and an aqualish (likely Ponda Baba's mask) sleeping when Leia comes in to rescue Han. Also, Machook (the pink/purple-hooded Ewok from the new comic pack) is seen in the scene when the rebels get captured by the Ewoks, but he switches from behind C-3PO to behind Han and back and forth when they have their discussion about C-3PO being seen as a god; they likely wanted to move them around to fill out both shot setups and didn't think anyone would notice. He's also in there a few other times as well.