PDA

View Full Version : Classic Trilogy or Special Edition?



eliwankenobi
04-24-2002, 04:03 PM
I'm sure this one's been thrown out here before, but I was wondering how others feel about the 'classic' Trilogy versus the 'special edition' Trilogy; and what the consensus is regarding a possible 'ultimate edition'?

Here's my two cents:

I liked some of the elements of each of the 'special editions'. I loved the additional footage of the vehicles and ships in ANH. The Millennium Falcon takeoff scene is awesome. Greedo shooting first was just stupid! In ESB, the addition footage of Bespin gave the city alot more depth. The Vader's shuttle scene was too obviously cut and pasted in and interferes with the sequence of action. In ROTJ, can we say 'Little Shop of Horrors'? The new Sarlacc was lame, and the music number sucked. The new ending was ok, and the new music was definitely better.

My big concern about an 'ultimate edition' is how badly it will contrast with the original footage. Lucas is now so hell-bent on using as much digital material as possible that any further insertions into the originals would seem to be grossly out of place.

187-Maul
04-24-2002, 07:32 PM
I too think GL uses to much CGI in his movies - I just saw ESB the other day and thought of the scenes that would be totally different nowadays like the Probe Droid flying - it just looks more realistic when it's a miniature-made model than something animated

answering to the question, I too like some scenes of the SE better and some less than the OT

bigbarada
04-24-2002, 10:56 PM
For some reason the CGI stuff just looks better than props, models and rubber masks, IMO. I think it's because everything moves so much smoother.

As for the choice of SE or non-SE: I will pick non-SE for ANH since most of the added stuff is just cringe inducing. I pick SE for ESB since all the improvements really did improve the movie. For ROTJ it's sort of half and half, I didn't like the enhanced musical number but I really liked the improved Sarlacc and new ending theme music.

SithDroid
04-25-2002, 01:00 AM
The SE was definatley the best SE released. All the additions to it didn't detract from the story and they actually fit really well. ROTJ, there wasn't that much stuff he changed, so that is bearable. What I have problems with is ANH. Greedo shooting first was horrible, replacing CLASSIC cantina members with CGI characters was a bad move, the lightsaber colors NEED to be fixed, etc...

If I had to choose between SE and Original on DVD, I'd go with the original.

bigbarada
04-25-2002, 01:07 AM
I'm going to assume that you are referring to the ESB:SE when you talk about the best SE released.;) I know some people had a problem with Luke's scream; but I don't really even notice it. However, I do notice it missing from the original version of ESB when I watch it now.

Maybe Lucas should offer up Archival Edition DVDs through the Fan Club. This would make the original versions available to fans AND prevent confusion in the marketplace by releasing two versions of the same movies.

Megs 2
04-25-2002, 12:57 PM
In regards for the ANH SE I liked the new space battle scenes. The Greedo scene, I agree I hate it, & I thought the scene w/Jabba was just as bad. I didn't care for the Imperial shuttle scene in ESB because that was a different shot taken from ROTJ when Vader arrived on the DS 2 u could see Moff JerJerrod for a couple of seconds. In ROTJ SE I liked the new ending scene. Thanks.

Darth Ovori
04-25-2002, 04:26 PM
Special Edition

Bad additions

1. Greedo shoots first.
2. Jabba's scene with Han in ANH.
3. Changing Vaders words when he orders his shuttle in ESB.
4. Luke sceaming.
5. Ewok's having a victory party in ROTJ.
6. Jabba's palace music minute... What a load of SH**...

Good Additions

1. The Deathstar battle in ANH.
2. Tattione.
3. Bespin.
4. Scarlac pit.
5. Sound improvement in all 3 movies.

I always tend to vote for the good things, And I'm voting for the Special Edition

When the SE #2 comes out I hope they remove the 5 bad points I've mentioned.

SithDroid
04-25-2002, 05:08 PM
Originally posted by bigbarada
I'm going to assume that you are referring to the ESB:SE when you talk about the best SE released.

Yes, I meant ESB, I need to start proofreading more.

Also I do not like the Jabbas Palace Jedi Rocks new song, it was totally out of place and annoying.

JediTricks
04-25-2002, 07:45 PM
If I had to choose, I mean REALLY choose, between the 2 of 'em, I'd go with the originals. However, I like some of what was done with the SEs, mostly in the effects shots like the Falcon lifting out of the docking bay, so I'd prefer to simply edit together the elements I love from the classics with the good parts of the SEs. Obviously, that's different for each person, so hopefully Lucas will make versions of both on DVD or HD-DVD when it comes along.

Any future edition changes should be very careful not to make any more "Greedo Fires First" or "Luke Screams during the fall" mistakes. Since Lucas seems totally incapable of avoiding those pitfalls, he should not bother doing another version.

Taichi
04-25-2002, 09:24 PM
am I the only one who absolutely LOVED the Special Editions?

there's nothing that they added/changed, that I didn't like.......nothing......

stillakid
04-26-2002, 01:07 AM
When wanting to view the films, as I will shortly before EP II comes out, I generally choose the SE. For the most part, I like many of the changes, although there are a few too many that shouldn't be there.

ANH- I like the additional shots of the Sandcrawler. Greedo shoots first, ah, do I really have to say it? The Jabba scene can go. It was pointless and not executed well to boot. The additional Falcon shot was awesome. The added shot of Stormies in the TIE bay is cool. The improved space battle shots were much needed. The added Biggs stuff was too abrupt and interrupted the established flow. It can go.

ESB - The additional Cloud City shots are cool. Changing Vader's lines was not. Luke screaming was not. The additional shuttle shots were useless and poorly cut in. The added Wampa shots are cool (and probably cold too!)

ROTJ - the added elements to the Sarlacc were poorly executed. The new song and added band members/singers I liked, although that new lead singer looked like a cartoon character out there. I liked the new ending better, as it wraps up the entire 6 parter much more elegantly than the old Ewok music.

If he would just release a DVD with options to "create your own cut" we'd all be happy. Just provide all the scenes, then on a menu page, you could click off the scenes you want to see and which ones you don't (original versions, SE versions, completely new shots and scenes). Then, with the push of a button, the best version of Star Wars custom made by you.

But how do we cut Qui Gon and Midichlorians out of TPM?:confused:

bigbarada
04-26-2002, 02:17 AM
It seems the only thing we can agree upon with the SEs is that Greedo firing first was a bad idea. Which makes me realize something: just like the rest of us, George Lucas watches the OT and sees little things here and there that he would like to change. The only difference is that he actually has the ability to do something about it.

Darkross
04-26-2002, 11:42 AM
Originally posted by Darth Ovori
Special Edition

Bad additions

1. Greedo shoots first.
2. Jabba's scene with Han in ANH.
3. Changing Vaders words when he orders his shuttle in ESB.
4. Luke sceaming.
5. Ewok's having a victory party in ROTJ.
6. Jabba's palace music minute... What a load of SH**...

Good Additions

1. The Deathstar battle in ANH.
2. Tattione.
3. Bespin.
4. Scarlac pit.
5. Sound improvement in all 3 movies.

I always tend to vote for the good things, And I'm voting for the Special Edition

When the SE #2 comes out I hope they remove the 5 bad points I've mentioned.

I agree...I've always hated them adding Luke screaming, Vader's dialogue "Bring my shuttle!" was a cool line...why did they change it?

What about when Luke says to R2D2 on Dagobah just after R2 is spit out of the monster:

Original Release:
Luke: "You're lucky you don't taste very good!" (I love this line!)

Special Edition:
Luke: "You were lucky to get out of there!"

They also changed the stormtrooper's voice when C3P0 gets blasted in ESB. The new voice sounds stupid.

Darkross
04-26-2002, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by stillakid
If he would just release a DVD with options to "create your own cut" we'd all be happy. Just provide all the scenes, then on a menu page, you could click off the scenes you want to see and which ones you don't (original versions, SE versions, completely new shots and scenes). Then, with the push of a button, the best version of Star Wars custom made by you.

But how do we cut Qui Gon and Midichlorians out of TPM?:confused:

Great idea...I too have thought about a create-your-own-cut. That would be a cool feature...but I really doubt Lucas will ever include such a feature on the DVDs since he wants a complete story the way he wants to tell it.

As far as the midichlorians...I think that there are only two scenes where Midichlorians are mentioned....Qui-Gon takes Anakin's midichlorian count and when Anakin asks Qui-Gon about midichlorians. Easy to delete.

eliwankenobi
04-26-2002, 01:08 PM
Speaking of changing lines, I just watched ESB-SE last nite and (even though I noticed this right away) the lines that were changed in the movie are rather obvious, yet don't do anything to add to the film; e.i:
Han: "This will keep you warm while I get the shelter built" - the original sounded natural, the new one sounds so forced, bored.
Luke: "You were lucky to get out of there" - lame. GL what were you thinking? don't remove the humor we all so much appreciate.
Stormtrooper: "Who are you?" - this doesn't sound like a ST, it sounds like a ****ed off Yoda.
Vader: "Alert my Star Destroyer..." - bad line, and so obvious it's not JEJ (equally as bad as the cut in shuttle scenes from ROTJ)
Lando: "Luke, we're ready for takeoff" another one that didn't need any improvement.
Luke, Leia screams: GL do you want us to think they're wimps? These characters are supposed to be the strength of the Alliance, and making them whine and scream degrades their character.

I like the suggested idea of 'make your own cut' where we could insert and delete our fave and not-so-faved new scenes, but as many of you have agreed I don't think this would be something GL would concede to since this is his story.

I am wondering though what could possibly be added to the OT to make it consistant with the Episodes 1-3. My first inclination is that GL is getting a little to ambitious with his new movies and creating so much new material not covered in the OT that he feels the need to go back and 'fix' them. IMHO, if GL stuck to what's known instead of trying to overcomplicate things, then 'fixing' the OT wouldn't be necessary.
And while I'm split on my appreciation of the additional footage/scenes in the SE, my biggest question is why wasn't the lightsaber duel from ANH fixed. It still looks horrible! Maybe this will get some attention in version 3. I also wonder if even more will be added to the end of ROTJ to show celebrations on Naboo and some of the other worlds we'll be seeing in E2 and 3?

Deoxyribonucleic
06-25-2004, 01:23 AM
Bringing some stuff back from the vaults...

I recently got the "orginal" orginal trilogy on dvd, and I'm so GLAD! Most of the stuff that was changed for the SE to this day does not make sense to me.

Some of my fav scenes after watching the orginal:

1. Lapti Nek...they shoulda never changed it and I much prefer puppet Sy to cgi Sy plus the entire scene for that matter.

2. Greedo shooting first of course...'tis the way of things, the way of the force that it be like that, that's why it was done first. ;)

3. No stupid ASP droid or those stupid little annoying "floater" droids who are in there for what reason? Ya got me!

4. Ohhhhhh how sweet IT IS to not hear that absolutely ridiculous scream from Luke when he falls down the shaft at Cloud City. It doesn't even sound like him :confused:

5. A return back to a "modest" Mos Eisley. I like Mos Eisley much better not being a huge "metropolis" as in the SE. I even like the orange underneath the landspeeder.

6. I happened to like the "broken" Dewback in the background in both scenes. I never noticed it was broken until GL mentioned it.


What I do like about the SE:

1. Cloud City

2. Effects enhancements ie: lightsaber, falcon engine, lasershots, sounds, etc.

:)

plo koon 200
06-25-2004, 01:26 AM
The SE is all that I watched since it came out. But, I think the Jabba's Palace scene needs to once again be revisited. Speaking of the SE, the changes that are to occur to the DVD's sound very interesting.

JON9000
06-27-2004, 08:01 PM
I like the suggested idea of 'make your own cut' where we could insert and delete our fave and not-so-faved new scenes, but as many of you have agreed I don't think this would be something GL would concede to since this is his story.


I have championed that idea for some time and I always post this link.

http://dir.salon.com/ent/movies/feature/2001/11/05/phantom_edit/index.html?sid=1045651

Actually, the technology exists for an enterprising fan to cobble together his own version of the OT if he has the time and materials. :Pirate:

scruffziller
07-07-2004, 11:36 AM
What I hate the most about the SE is that it removed things in order to make the changes. Like the Ewok celebaration. I hate the fact that they removed the white R2 unit and dark yellow R5 unit in order to add the dewback walking by. I don't hate that the SE was done but I want to have the original version elements to be preserved. And in which I do now.(OR-OT on DVD) Take that GL.:p I like Vader's new line, to "prepare for his arrival" sounds more sinister, cold, and sugests "look out here I come." The best of all additions to the SE has to be the Wampa eating the Taun Taun.

Veers
07-14-2004, 09:24 PM
I like Special Editions.