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  1. #231

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    Target refused to buy figures after the Nemesis / Borg waves.

    They sat in vast quantities here.

    Enterprise sold horribly for Toys R Us and Target. Wal-Mart never bought any.

    The Deluxe (Bridge Sections) did even worse.

    AA got the license from Paramount who insisted they start by promoting the new show.

    The pattern was to do the series in Chron Order (Ent. TOS, TNG, DS9, Voy).

    They started that way: Ent., Nemesis-TNG, TOS, and Worf would be cross-over.

    Ent. Series 1 moved slow. Too bad. They were great figures. But the base of fans out there were into traditional Trek. I liked Enterprise, but maybe 1/4 of original Trek fans (now inc. TOS and TNG, possibly DS9) did.

    Series 2 was Ent. Away Teams - somewhat to finish crew members that hadn't then been made (Trip, Phlox, Hoshi). Perhaps that should have been the TOS wave right then and there - though many collectors had Playmates figures of these characters, so AA might've thought that would be a gamble since naturally, the first TOS figures should be the crew.

    Series 3 was Nemesis due to the movie promo - Picard, Data, Shinzon, Viceroy. Worf and Riker were also anticipated, but the line could have used a Romulan and Reman in generic soldiers, let alone more of the characters like the Romulan female commander, Troi, Crusher, LaForge, etc.

    Nemesis was a great movie. It was dark. Perhaps DS9 fans liked that, but general Trek-fluff fans (TNG-sterility) didn't appreciate it (though from sales for First Contact, you'd have thought otherwise). In any case, the figure line was small (4 figures) and more or a follow-up wave would have gotten folks more motivated for it.

    Then Target and Toys R Us pulled the funding. They wanted no more to do with Star Trek properties.

    To say that it's Trek alone would understate it. In a recent article about Toys R Us and Hasbro posted by SirSteve, it said the chain struggled with Star WARS sales and that one exec said he wouldn't hold all of Hasbro's hopes on the Episode 3 license because he still considered SW a gamble rather than a sure thing (based on E1 sales/overstock problems).

    But we'd all agree that from a toy collecting pov, SW is more popular than ST. One of the reasons is the size of the 3 3/4" line. Playmates rocked with ST because they could do so many in the 5 1/4" size and they could make ships and accessories to go with them. I still truly regret the Playmates line ending, as I envisioned getting toys like a BoP for Klingon Figures (way off scale, but so are SW ships like the Falcon). Modern sculpting techniques could have improved the facial detail on Playmates, but the line size was great. A Whole Voyager that had a removeable top to expose a bridge playset (seen in the M. Falcon toy style) would have been great, as would have been the "top half" of a DS9 Station done like the GI Joe Terror Dome, with the lower pylons being cut off but representing "the toy's landing stands."

    Trek is not "war-based" as much as DS9 was in general, and totally not as much as SW-CW and then-on is.

    However, that is not to say that a bunch of us who like the show and were never as much of a pacifist as Gene Roddenberry wouldn't appreciate army-building war dioramas. I have 11 Jem Hadar and nearly 20 Borgs attacking my Playmates figures. I also used "Kruge" as a generic Klingon and put Gowron in command of an attack squad of them with Worf in armor at his side.

    People who collect action figures can be sort of like the Pentagon collecting for an arms race.

    Star Trek should have gone there and might be successful if they do, combined with after-school hours syndication - as we all think Trek is better than 3pm cartoons - so why wouldn't other kids watching the Jem Hadar duke it out with the Federation and all that high-tech stuff in Star Trek? TNG held me at that age! I remember, perhaps in error, that when the show started, it was not broadcast at primetime, but came on at like 7pm or earlier, as I had to often tape it because I could still have a baseball game.

    Anyway, I wouldn't change Trek. I'd change the marketing and the toy line approach. Perhaps I'd give it a break now, and let Star Wars wind down or attract a TV audience back to sci-fi stuff. But 05 SW stuff is going to be hard to compete with since it's Darth Vader's rise and Anakin's fall.

  2. #232

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    Well said Tycho. Classic Trek did very well in sales this year though with the release of all 3 Original Seasons. It would have been good for AA to have the figures out by the time of their release. Would have been better for sales -but cant change that now.
    "Maybe I can help you. I am Boba Fett. The ship you seek is nearby." -Boba Fett

  3. #233

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    Ok, scared me with that Ent-E thing, be more careful.


    Tycho, the Nemesis figures came out well before the Away Team ENT figures.

    On a less-concrete issue, I'd say that Nemesis is tied with Insurrection as the worst Trek film of all time, it's awful, and it had nothing to do with it being dark, it was just sloppy pap that felt poorly ported from a crappy horror film. It was nothing like DS9 except it too had a ridiculous deus-ex-machina ending.

    The reason TRU and Target pulled out of AA's Trek lines was because they were buried with ENT junk, and Target also was stuck with unselling Trek Minimates to boot. Obviously the retailers aren't totally afraid of Trek, TRU and WM are currently stocking Johnny Lightning's (weakly-sculpted) line of Trek vehicles (Target seems to have no relationship with Johnny Lightning, possibly since JL's parent company Playing Mantis screwed them over on the Charlie Brown line).


    I think the ultimate problem is Art Asylum, they are a lost company making a lot of bad decisions and it keeps hurting the line with every misstep they make. Having the wrong Kirk in the main TOS line before it even came out was a miniature disaster since Kirk is the keystone to the series.
    Darth Vader is becoming the Mickey Mouse of Star Wars.

    "In Brooklyn, a castle, is where dwell I"
    The use of a lightsaber does not make one a Jedi, it is the ability to not use it.

  4. #234

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    Wow, thats harsh JediTricks!

    I really liked Nemesis. Not as good as Wrath Of Kahn or First Contact. But not terrible either.
    "Maybe I can help you. I am Boba Fett. The ship you seek is nearby." -Boba Fett

  5. #235

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by JediTricks
    Having the wrong Kirk in the main TOS line before it even came out was a miniature disaster since Kirk is the keystone to the series.
    I never did understand that...exclusives are supposed to be "special versions", sometimes because they can't do well at retail right? That was the biggest flop ever, IMO.

    How long have they been promising TOS Series 3? Didn't they promise it all through 2004? Hasbro says it's about 8 months or something along those lines for Star Wars figures to go from development to production and shipping... with a line with less quantities like the TOS line, you'd figure they would be out definitely by now.

    AA promises then delivers too late.
    Last edited by LTBasker; 02-14-2005 at 01:40 AM.
    "Hokey packaging and ancient gimmicks are no match for good detail on your figure, kid."
    "I am a Klingot from Oklahoma in human boy form."
    "We came, we saw, we conquered... We, woke up!"

  6. #236

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    I seemed to hear that Classic Series 3 was supposed to be out Fall of '04. And here we are approaching Spring '05.

    This is interesting, AA seems to have NO promlem releasing numerous versions and amounts of Marvel Mini-Mates. The LOTR Mini-Mates are still being released as well. At least they show up on time. So something has to be going on over at AA.
    "Maybe I can help you. I am Boba Fett. The ship you seek is nearby." -Boba Fett

  7. #237

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    As a side note, I have the complete seasons of every Star Trek show save for Enterprise (which begins coming out with Sn 1 in May) .

    I am re-watching my TOS shows now...

    The Cage (Playmates should have made No. 1, several more crew members, the Gorilla beast the Keeper changed into, perhaps Vina as a SS Columbia survivor). Don't think I'd be interested in AA revisting this episode.

    Where No Man Has Gone Before - Playmates essentially covered it, but never made Gary Mitchell or Elizabeth Daner. Again AA shouldn't go there.

    Mudd's Women - too anecdotal as an episode. Figures of Mudd's Women? Nah. They can do sexy Star Trek babes with more to them (like special roles, special powers) than these girls. They made Mudd. Playmates might've done more, but AA doesn't need to either.

    The Corbomite Manuever - Playmates did a great job! The screen-scene box set was just fine.

    The Man Trap
    - Playmates never did this - but here we have Art Asylum poised with a really cool figure of the M-113 Salt Vampire and I hope it sees release. I'd really want this figure and hope we do get it someday. If it's truly going to be a legacy assortment next, with Worf and possibly re-releases from Nemesis and variations on that theme, they can stick a TOS figure in there as well. The Salt Vampire looked like it rocked as a figure. Grrr. I wanted this one!

  8. #238

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    I think it would be great if AA made a Red Shirt figure w/ 4-5 extra heads and a phaser and communicator so you could have different officers. It would be a great Exclusive!
    "Maybe I can help you. I am Boba Fett. The ship you seek is nearby." -Boba Fett

  9. #239

    Re: Star Trek figures (merged)

    Well it looks like Art Asylum had quite a setup at Toy Fair NY this last weekend! Looks like we're getting....

    - DS9 Captain Sisko, Dax, O'Brien, and Brashir figures from the episode "Trials and Tribbleations"

    - The Enterprise E!!

    - Klingon Statue!


    Personally I'm excited as hell over the "Trials and Tribbleations" figures. Its a great episode! And because the Playmates version of O'Brien was sooo hard to get -I never got one. Of course I'll get the Enterprise E!
    "Maybe I can help you. I am Boba Fett. The ship you seek is nearby." -Boba Fett

  10. #240
    I'm a Niner and I should be happy, but I guess I'm not.

    1) They needed to make up cash they're behind in, so OK, I'm sure this is a winner on their balance sheets (reusing old bodies from the TOS waves with new heads no doubt)

    2) They can play this same trick again (and I'd prefer it) using the TNG "Nemesis" bodies from Picard and Data, to make Sisko, Bashir, O'Brien in their DS9 5th Season-on uniforms. Except, Sisko is very tall if it'd be accurate, which may mean the Trials-Tribulations figure is off scale and crap. Bashir is slight of build, and a Picard or Data body could be gotten away with. O'Brien is bigger than either of those two, more developed, so his figure (in either line) could be a sham.

    3) In TOS, mabye Spock's body could lend itself to Sisko. Dax and Uhura? I'd buy that works. Bashir's smaller than any TOS character I think. O'Brien and Scotty might work, but O'Brien's beer-belly wouldn't be authentically large enough then

    4) Worf could join a DS9 regular show crew. Dax would have to be resculpted from scratch, so they might as well do Kira

    5) I have Playmates Trials and Tribulation figures...I will have to make up my mind whether I need to buy these....

    TOS "scenes" I'm doing....

    -Kirk (Comic Con exclusive yellow-shirt) vs. Khan
    -Spock (supposed to be with McCoy which I need to get) vs. Salt Vampire (right...)
    -Chekov and Scotty vs. Klingon Cmdr. Kor (when he finally comes out)
    -Mirror Kirk & Mirror Scotty vs. Mirror Spock

    Sulu - doing basically nothing. I need them to come out with something for him to fight...

    So maybe I could mix in the DS9 crew in a Trials and Tribulations scene and rework these:

    Chekov and Scotty vs. Klingon Cmdr. Kor (when he finally comes out) with Bashir and O'Brien looking on...

    Sisko and Dax meeting or watching Kirk and Spock. I'll buy that green-shirt Kirk then I guess....

    Oh...

    Vina the Orion Slave girl will be mingling with Archer and Trip trying to save T'Pol.

    I wished they'd release the Salt Vampire!
    BAD Pts Need: R5-C7 lf leg (x2), , R4-P44 right leg BAD Pts Offered For Trade: PM me - I have lots of parts now including BG-J38!. New Kyle Katarn is also available.

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