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  1. #5641
    Nah, I knew it was the one who was once available in yellow and red. I think Rodimus would've carried more gravitas and emotional impact, and Prowl would've been better going forward, story-wise (as all his little schemes come to a head, but, whoops, he's dead and no one knows what's up).

    The only lamer cop-out would've been Magnus.
    Tommy, close your eyes.

  2. #5642
    Quote Originally Posted by JediTricks View Post
    The ending of RG1 really can't give way to Beast Wars despite the Botanica thing, because the end of RG1 has a dead Cybertron and no Cybertronians. Beast Wars is an evolution of G1, in that story the Autobots and Decepticons continue on until they eventually become the Maximals and Predacons, and the fight for Cybertron continues in the shadows until a new Megatron takes that fight to Earth's ancient past in order to find a long-lost tool to take over Cybertron - despite his defeat on ancient Earth, he actually succeeds in the goal on Cybertron which leads to Beast Machines where Cybertron is very alive and empty thanks to BW Megatron's actions, and the remaining Maximals must defeat him which brings about a new Cybertron that combines organic and mechanical, just as the Maximals including Botanica have become (it's philosophical). But without Cybertron and Autobots and Decepticons, there can be no Beast Wars, so it's impossible for RG1 to be that precursor.
    I'll come right out and admit my Beast knowledge is sketchy.

    Wasn't Botanica supposedly a pre-Maximal (maybe pre-Autobot) Cybertronian? I'm just thinking that, perhaps, in this universe, the Primordials evolved into whatever Botanica is, and her counterparts evolved into or gave rise to Maximals and later Predacons. Those factions don't have all the data, just Primus's Golden Disk (which presumably survived the Dark Matrix's rampage, since Primus's sword did) and legends from other worlds of the Transformers, so they assume a direct lineage. Factor in Ravage (IIRC, the only Predacon explicitly stated to be a former Decepticon) and his prose story that states he alone remains true to the Decepticon cause; let's say he outlasts Shockwave and Starscream, returns to Cybertron to find it again teeming with shape-changing mechanical life, also assumes a direct connection, is upgraded to a Predacon body, and fills in the blanks for the others (incorrectly). They start taking names like Optimus Primal and Megatron to honor their "ancestors" and things lead into the beginning of the show. Eventually some wind up on prehistoric Earth.

    As for Cybertron's organic past, well, we only know two things for sure: Primus stranded himself in a "barren" world and the Primordials were his first attempt at life. But they have an organic look to them. And the Transformers themselves didn't recognize organic life as such when they first encountered it. Perhaps Primus didn't either (or at least The Keeper, being presumably a Transformer himself and locked away in the core of the planet during the entire time the Transformers had had any contact with organics, didn't when he related the story). The Primordials themselves said way back in #76 something like "locked away by Primus, we forget ours before yours this world." Maybe the Primordials were organic before Primus became Cybertron. (It could actually explain in a sense the sort of bizarre way the Transformers seem so keen on integrating organic aspects into their selves at such a relatively short point after discovering it exists.)

    Unless I'm mistaken, the "future" time of Beast Wars isn't specifically stated. Would RG1 leading into it require more than several additional millennia and a big misunderstanding?

    (It could explain Starscream's ghost in a comic setting--not technically a ghost, but a non-corporeal "memory" courtesy of the Underbase... and still a devious Decepticon b*****d because it includes no data about his reformation in #99. And the Vok being descendants of the Swarm from G2, which in turn were formed as a by-product of budding (knowledge presumably lost to all but the Underbase), makes a lot more sense in a fully comic-based universe, where, otherwise, Starscream's ghost simply cannot exist.)

    All I know for absolutely certain is that the Primordials were the original Cybertronians, they formed cocoons of some sort when the Dark Matrix took over Cybertron and made its play for the entire Multiverse, the Transformers themselves died out, and when Rodimus (presuming himself to be the last) died on Cybertron, some sort of energy--his spark, or possibly residual Matrix energy--flowed into the cocoons and Botanica came out of one.
    Tommy, close your eyes.

  3. #5643
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    Citizen Stack looks nice, but ultimately a waste since its ostensibly meant for a Masterpiece collection and we're getting an official one.
    Yes, Citizen Stack

    The thing I like about it is that it is a true transformer and not even the G1 was with the cab just being a Prime repaint and the trailer becoming attachable armor.

    The G1 cartoon show demonstrated that Magnus was a transformer.

    That's why the Titanium remains my favorite Magnus thus far.

    Will the MP Magnus be one piece or two?


    Others I'd like at this scale are G1 Galvatron and Cyclonus, then Scourge. (Scourge could be reimagined as an EARTH hovercraft)

    Also a giant Astrotrain that really triple-changed would be cool.

    Right now, if I had the money, I'd buy 2 Citizen Stacks.

    Still considering Stunticon and Constructicon 3rd party sets.

    No money.

    Other oddities I'd want are Cyberverse Kup and Blurr figures.

    I'd still like more Human Alliance Decepticons like Rampage (bulldozer) and Sideways.
    BAD Pts Need: R5-C7 lf leg (x2), , R4-P44 right leg BAD Pts Offered For Trade: PM me - I have lots of parts now including BG-J38!. New Kyle Katarn is also available.

  4. #5644
    Is it just me, or is he waaaay too tall?
    Nowhere in your incoherent ramblings did you come anywhere close to the answer. Thanks to you, everyone in this room is now stupider having heard you. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul. -Billy Madison-

  5. #5645
    Citizen Stack, too tall?

    Ultra Magnus would be larger than Optimus Prime. He was in their 1996 cartoon movie appearance together.

    He is larger than Rodimus Prime, too.

    I hope I get the money together for 2 of him if it's that good. One to display in each mode. That's like $600 but I'm not buying other toys during the meanwhile. (Partly because I don't have any money for toys right now anyway.)

    But which Constructicon 3rd Party set is better? Yellow or Green? (one is Hercules - don't remember which).

    That and the Stunticon 3rd Party set - I'm thinking of getting.

    Then there are sort of 3rd Party MP Cyclonus and Galvatron figures. How big are they? I want something at least the size of MP-01 Prime (my favorite toy I own to this date!)
    BAD Pts Need: R5-C7 lf leg (x2), , R4-P44 right leg BAD Pts Offered For Trade: PM me - I have lots of parts now including BG-J38!. New Kyle Katarn is also available.

  6. #5646
    Quote Originally Posted by Tycho View Post
    The thing I like about it is that it is a true transformer and not even the G1 was with the cab just being a Prime repaint and the trailer becoming attachable armor.

    The G1 cartoon show demonstrated that Magnus was a transformer.
    Having the trailer armor means he's not a transformer how? That doesn't make any sense. They're both valid ways to represent the character.

    Back when MP-10 came out, the designer stated that there are aspects incorporated into the design to potentially allow the Magnus armor to be used with it. So its possible that it could be G1 toy accurate but we don't know yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tycho View Post

    But which Constructicon 3rd Party set is better? Yellow or Green? (one is Hercules - don't remember which).


    Then there are sort of 3rd Party MP Cyclonus and Galvatron figures. How big are they? I want something at least the size of MP-01 Prime (my favorite toy I own to this date!)
    There isn't really a conclusive answer to which of the two Devastators are better. And honestly, I'm pretty sure we talked about it already so I'm not going to go into it again.

    There is no 3rd Party Cyclonus figure and the Galvatron is not MP scaled, or MP quality.

  7. #5647
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    Citizen Stack looks nice, but ultimately a waste since its ostensibly meant for a Masterpiece collection and we're getting an official one.
    It's a waste because it is an upscaled Titanium Series Ultra Magnus.

    Quote Originally Posted by El Chuxter View Post
    Nah, I knew it was the one who was once available in yellow and red. I think Rodimus would've carried more gravitas and emotional impact, and Prowl would've been better going forward, story-wise (as all his little schemes come to a head, but, whoops, he's dead and no one knows what's up).

    The only lamer cop-out would've been Magnus.
    Your points are all apt, but it's not like he was vital to the overarching story, they MADE him vital. I think Roddy would have been better as a kill too.

    And Magnus they really don't have the room to think about because there's a question of philosophy - Magnus has become The Dread Pirate Roberts, so once you get rid of the driving force for that change, what happens next? That's an interesting conversation but the "event" comic series would have sold it short.

    Quote Originally Posted by El Chuxter View Post
    I'll come right out and admit my Beast knowledge is sketchy.

    Wasn't Botanica supposedly a pre-Maximal (maybe pre-Autobot) Cybertronian? I'm just thinking that, perhaps, in this universe, the Primordials evolved into whatever Botanica is, and her counterparts evolved into or gave rise to Maximals and later Predacons. Those factions don't have all the data, just Primus's Golden Disk (which presumably survived the Dark Matrix's rampage, since Primus's sword did) and legends from other worlds of the Transformers, so they assume a direct lineage. Factor in Ravage (IIRC, the only Predacon explicitly stated to be a former Decepticon) and his prose story that states he alone remains true to the Decepticon cause; let's say he outlasts Shockwave and Starscream, returns to Cybertron to find it again teeming with shape-changing mechanical life, also assumes a direct connection, is upgraded to a Predacon body, and fills in the blanks for the others (incorrectly). They start taking names like Optimus Primal and Megatron to honor their "ancestors" and things lead into the beginning of the show. Eventually some wind up on prehistoric Earth.

    As for Cybertron's organic past, well, we only know two things for sure: Primus stranded himself in a "barren" world and the Primordials were his first attempt at life. But they have an organic look to them. And the Transformers themselves didn't recognize organic life as such when they first encountered it. Perhaps Primus didn't either (or at least The Keeper, being presumably a Transformer himself and locked away in the core of the planet during the entire time the Transformers had had any contact with organics, didn't when he related the story). The Primordials themselves said way back in #76 something like "locked away by Primus, we forget ours before yours this world." Maybe the Primordials were organic before Primus became Cybertron. (It could actually explain in a sense the sort of bizarre way the Transformers seem so keen on integrating organic aspects into their selves at such a relatively short point after discovering it exists.)

    Unless I'm mistaken, the "future" time of Beast Wars isn't specifically stated. Would RG1 leading into it require more than several additional millennia and a big misunderstanding?

    (It could explain Starscream's ghost in a comic setting--not technically a ghost, but a non-corporeal "memory" courtesy of the Underbase... and still a devious Decepticon b*****d because it includes no data about his reformation in #99. And the Vok being descendants of the Swarm from G2, which in turn were formed as a by-product of budding (knowledge presumably lost to all but the Underbase), makes a lot more sense in a fully comic-based universe, where, otherwise, Starscream's ghost simply cannot exist.)

    All I know for absolutely certain is that the Primordials were the original Cybertronians, they formed cocoons of some sort when the Dark Matrix took over Cybertron and made its play for the entire Multiverse, the Transformers themselves died out, and when Rodimus (presuming himself to be the last) died on Cybertron, some sort of energy--his spark, or possibly residual Matrix energy--flowed into the cocoons and Botanica came out of one.
    Wow, you really went off on a tangent. No, Maximals use a technology evolved from pretenders, they are smaller and incorporate organic disguises to conserve energy. There is direct lineage between Autobots and Maximals, there's no "and then it got lost and then it got found" about it.

    Botanica is a Maximal who simply landed on a planet with only plant organics, not animal.

    There is just 300 years between end of the war seen in the G1 cartoon and the pre-Earth Beast Wars days, and Cybertron's Maximal capitol is built on top of Iacon City.

    Starscream's ghost is his unkillable spark which was loosed from his physical form when Galvatron destroyed it upon returning from Unicron in TF:TM.

    The Vok are a tough one because the two editors in charge of the story had vastly different opinions of what the Vok were supposed to be, one of them did think they were from the Swarm who were trying to atone for destroying all of humanity by changing humanity's past and advancing it; the other pictured the Vok as the end-level evolution of all living beings and tampered with Earth by putting in Energon and tampered with Cybertronians by giving them life in the first place or something. The bottom line is that the driving force behind the Vok went unspoken so there's no real connection or direct lineage, the Vok are energy beings while the Swarm are physical.

    The ending of RG1 would be impossible for Beast Wars to come about in that universe though, and the Botanica connection really was nothing more than a wink.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Metalmute View Post
    Is it just me, or is he waaaay too tall?
    Yeah, like stupidly tall. He's depicted as half a head taller than Optimus, not this.
    Darth Vader is becoming the Mickey Mouse of Star Wars.

    "In Brooklyn, a castle, is where dwell I"
    The use of a lightsaber does not make one a Jedi, it is the ability to not use it.

  8. #5648
    Okay, like I said, I know very, very little about Beast Wars and your pesky facts shot holes all through my conjecture. I guess this leads into a parallel universe Beast Wars or something.
    Tommy, close your eyes.

  9. #5649
    Yeah, sorry about that. And if Botanica is the future of that universe, then its doooooomed.


    Just finished X-Files Conspiracy, the crossover series. What a waste of time! Also, it ends the Hearts of Steel universe, which may or may not be a bad thing.


    Also just finished Windblade #1, and I'm not sure how I feel there. The art is sloppy, I don't think the artist should have acted as the trio - there's a sense of shallowness and mess to it, and the bordering-on-chibi feel crosses that border a couple times. I also didn't care for the color palette or the way backgrounds were used in some panels. This is why comics have inkers. But it's expressive and mostly engaging art.

    The writing though... well, this is someone who has taken comic book decompression too far. It's all setup, very little happens, not a single shot is fired or a conflict really delved into, the whole issue feels ultimately like 4 pages of a comic book padded out. Considering this is supposed to be a 4-parter, I really don't see why more script couldn't have been shown here. Also, Nautica is missing without word.

    My advice is: if you plan on following the entire story, get it now; otherwise, if you're going to buy the figure, just wait for that pack-in copy.
    Darth Vader is becoming the Mickey Mouse of Star Wars.

    "In Brooklyn, a castle, is where dwell I"
    The use of a lightsaber does not make one a Jedi, it is the ability to not use it.

  10. #5650
    I really dug the art in the preview. Wouldn't want it on every book, but a nice change of pace. (Then again, I love that dude who did Syndromica, and I'm supposed to hate him, so what do I know?)

    Too bad about the decompression. I'll give it a chance, but I'm already annoyed by her rant against Furman and Spotlight: Arcee (because of course robots should have girls and anyone who thinks otherwise is a hateful misogynist ).

    Also I too have the unvincible one now, thanks to the Redlands Target.
    Tommy, close your eyes.

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