Herme Odel, Jabba the Hutt’s Palace
Herme Odel, Jabba the Hutt’s Palace
More is more. Less is less, Twice as much is good too,
Too much is never enough except when it's just about right.
People who have helped me out: DarthChuckMc, msjedi, bobafett07728, jjreason, dr_evazan22
Thank you for saving her, now I can vote for the new Anakin, Jedi Apprentice, as long as it's like the Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon from TPM.Originally Posted by Tycho
[FONT=Book Antiqua]He passes to Moses - He shoots, he scores![/FONT]
Mummy of the raincoat is a gigantic trollop.
I'd hoped someone else would do this so I wouldn't have to, but I'll save:
Advoze, Bom Vimdim, Mos Eisley Cantina.
I certainly hope that someone bumps Owen, the Saurin, and the Nightlilly up the list. I worry about having to try and save them in the next round!
Funny how Beru now outranks Owen even though he already beat her in direct competition.
It is.Originally Posted by Rocketboy
They probably will save Owen at least for sure, but since everyone has "last chances" as write-ins, (like you just had with Bom Vimdim) people can get other characters they want more written in if they have to save those characters first. (Why you voted for Vimdim instead of Owen this round). But it forces one-person-sponsored figures off the list (like my Padmes I wanted so badly) if the group doesn't support them.Originally Posted by Droid
You'll have 3 characters "in danger" next round, and have to choose your favorite this way (or decide which one is least likely to get support from someone else). If another one of your characters has strong enough merit, somebody else will save them - thereby making our list more representative of everyone's demands, not just your personal favorites.
Yes, but when all unsupported figures fall off the list and we have just 50 in our Top 50, we can then vote for our favorite again, with no one falling off the list, and Owen might outrank Beru again. However, like I said, it doesn't really matter that much - the characters are all on the list and just because Yarna ranks first or something, doesn't mean Hasbro won't decide they need to pick on of our Luke's and get a Skywalker back on the pegs first.Originally Posted by Droid
However, the last 7 characters that can come in as challengers are pretty weak in my opinion (next is a strong one though: E2 Obi-Wan Kenobi - Jedi Robes), but after that, folks might be able to fight out their last write-ins and then get the list ranked pretty good as to preference. I mean it's happening as we go along - R2 Lightsaber has really climbed! And most of the bottom of the list now are write-ins that only 1-2 people supported before.
Remember, originally almost everyone supported individual round winners, representative of our Top 20 (twenty) and all the others that came on our list we gave to Hasbro had marginal amounts of votes behind them (Padme in the Yellow Dress by the Waterfalls - 4 votes total).
A final poll when no one can fall off will help decide last "rankings" when we get there.
See it all works out and Droid, you're even starting to see some wisdom in how this system is working.
I hope JediTricks and B'Omarr Monkey are reading these posts still, and realizing how stuff's coming together here.
In my final reports, I'll compare:
Presnt Top 50.................Hasbro's List
1) figure name (old rank)...old number 1) and new figure rank
We'll see how accurate we were before.
Who fell off.
Who added on.
I think this will work out amazingly well!
Last edited by Tycho; 08-11-2004 at 05:49 PM.
BAD Pts Need: R5-C7 lf leg (x2), , R4-P44 right leg BAD Pts Offered For Trade: PM me - I have lots of parts now including BG-J38!. New Kyle Katarn is also available.
Droid, Rocketboy, see post above.
El Chuxter (2 votes behind, see TOP of last page, Luke Jedi poll)
Choose the character you want to be kept on the figures-to-be-made list from:
Anakin Skywalker Jedi Apprentice ("Vader" robes)
12) Moff Jerjerrod, Death Star II Commander, Endor
13) General Tagge, Death Star Conference Table
14) Jango Fett out of armor, Kamino Apartment
15) Lando Calrissian Smugglers Gear, end of ESB
16) Slim Aloo, Imperial Dignitary
17) Queen Jamilla
18) Rep Teers
19) Captain Daultay Dofine, Niemodian
20) Herme Odel, Jabba the Hutt’s Palace
21) Ben Quadrinaros, Podracer
22) Rebel Flight Technician, Yavin Base
23) Major Bren Derlin, Hoth Echo Base
24) Sgt. Doallyn, Jabba’s Palace
25) Tonbuck Toora, Separatist Leader
26) Han Solo screaming in Bespin Torture Chair
27) Beru Whitesun, from AOTC
28) Tonnika Sister, Mos Eisley Cantina
29) Luke Skywalker Endor Gear
30) Padme in her Nightgown, Kohoun Attack
31) Treva Horme, Cloud City Alien
32) Keeolkeech, Ewok Warrior
33) Commander Tey How, Niemoidian with sensors in eyes and mouth
34) R2-D2 Lightsaber Launcher resculpt
35) Reegesk the Ranat, Mos Eisley Cantina
36) Klaatu, remake of vintage figure from Jabba's
37) Chief Chirpa, Ewok Leader
39) Givin, Elris Helrot, Mos Eisley Cantina
40) Gragga Chubba Vendor, catches JarJar in Mos Espa
41) General Veers, Imperial Officer w. removeable Hoth Armor
42) Colonel Wulf Yularen, Imperial Conference Table
43) Biggs Darklighter, Academy Uniform, ANH Lost Scenes
44) Torryn Farr, Hoth Echo Base
45) Clone Trooper in Red, out of armor
46) M'iiyoom Onith, Nightlily from Mos Eisley Cantina
47) Saurin, Hrcheck Kal Fas
48) Young Owen Lars
49) CZ-3 from Mos Eisley Spaceport
50) Luke Skywalker, Rebel Medical Frigate
Well I'd really like to see CZ-3 made so I'll cast a strategic vote to keep it from falling off later.
Talk Show Host Interviewing Joker: “Your said to have only killed about 600 people Joker. Now don’t take this the wrong way but I think you’ve been holding out on us.”
Joker: “I don’t keep count. I’m going to kill everyone in this room.”
thanks Chux Turbo LBC Bobafrett Mtriv73 Rjarvis JF96 JT JMG FB Rogue2 Tycho Slicker Deoxy Caesar JontheJedi JJReason Brandon Solo JMS UK for great deals.
SSG Pro Football Pick em and Bowl Pick em Champ 2006. 2007 NCAA Bracket Champ
#24 - Gone but not forgotten
Exactly WRONG! I got why you were doing "new additions" to the ladder system and didn't question that, I questioned why you were encouraging strategic voting, why you were starting polls with slanted results before everybody had voted, why you were allowing write-ins to come back in at the top of the ladder, and why it only took 1 person to do a write-in save instead of 2. And your explanations ranged from woefully poor to non-existant to sprawling rants that were unfathomable - I think you let your arrogance and ego invested in this poll overshadow the issue at hand, you refuse to recognize and reflect upon the inherent flaws in this poll system, instead bashing anybody who doesn't agree with you.Originally Posted by Tycho
Remember when you posed a hypothetical poll about that in this thread and you got responses from several users who said this list was at best only 50% close? That's not very close. The order is important here, it determines who is in the top 50 characters that we're going to send to Hasbro because without rank in here we could not determine who are the top 50 figures out of these 200+ options.When JediTricks said we're not being representative of all SW collectors, I disagree and are probably close.
And my post-padding complaint is still a concern, you've posted 170 times in this thread, nearly double the next-closest post count from KH, dindae, and Droid who all have posts here in the 90s, and then 5 more users have between 50 and 70 posts here. That would be fine if I thought this thread were actually an accurate, fair poll, but it's clearly not.
And how many more have fallen off only to come back and fall off again? Don't get so holier-than-thou on this Tycho, I never claimed perfection from anything here in this poll. And keep this in mind, without Steve's help you won't be able to get an updated list to Hasbro - they have asked SSG not to allow you to talk to them anymore - and with matters of the forums Steve always comes to me for that type of advice. I've given you chance after chance to address these issues in a calm, clear manner, but each time you've made it impossible to follow your line of reasoning as you rant endlessly with exceedingly drawn-out and incomprehensible examples; if you want me to help support this thread when it comes time to take it to Hasbro, I need to have a reasonable believe in its fairness and accuracy, and currently I do not. Do you see my conundrum now? Or are you still convinced I'm just being petty, because let me assure you, I am NOT.Wow, we've finally and permanently cut out 5 characters from our "overflowing" list and 4 of them were from the original group given to Hasbro. My conclusion is that the original list wasn't as refined as those who preach it was perfect say it was.
That was one of my chief concerns as well, and like you Droid I also never said it was perfect or even remotely close. Please don't consider this thread indicative of the rest of the forums, it is NOT.Originally Posted by Droid
Darth Vader is becoming the Mickey Mouse of Star Wars.
"In Brooklyn, a castle, is where dwell I"
The use of a lightsaber does not make one a Jedi, it is the ability to not use it.
Let's bump Saurin, Hrcheck Kal Fas up the list.
JediTricks, I'm not going to comment too much right now, not because I want to be evasive, but because I like you, and I don't want to be in a anger-management session all throughout this thread with you.
I'll touch on a couple things quickly:
Good. And I think you understand that I used the original vote counts to determine which characters got to challenge the lists' supremacy.Originally Posted by JediTricks
Go ahead and again define what you find ill about strategic voting if you care to.and didn't question that, I questioned why you were encouraging strategic voting,
The way I saw it is that if person A wants Han, Luke, and Leia, and person B wants Anakin, Obi-Wan, and Padme, and there are 4 slots, then by voting for their favorites, they'd sort of rank them (compounded with everyone else's vote). By allowing the write-ins, it'd get down to what person "C"s preference was because while A and B fight for everything they want, C can decide which has more merit as eventually A or B will have to choose only 1 out of 2 of their's that must drop, and C can decide if the remaining one has any more merit for the whole group - or if it finally drops.
Once no one can drop - after all the potential add-in challengers have had their shot, a new favorite-only voting thing can rank them correctly.
As to the characters coming in higher, they (like Han Yavin Ceremony) fall off if they can't be supported, and they stay (like your R2 Lightsaber) if they are widely wanted by the group.
I shouldn't have cut the corners on any regulars due to my impatience. Yet I made it so people could accurately back vote and I calculated that into how it effected the list. I used a color-code system in Word to track the votes on the list. It's worked out great. But you are right -I can't wait to see how the final list is going to turn out - partially because I want to compare new ranks with the old ones, as I think there will be some reordering, but logical ranking shown by our efforts. Don't get me wrong, doing this has been fun, but you've pointed to my higher amounts of posts - well the part where I'm explaining myself is not so fun. At the end, I think then will be the best time for you to comment or criticize (as well as everyone) when we see the final results and discuss them.why you were starting polls with slanted results before everybody had voted,
There were so few of us participating, it seemed right to let everyone get a character or 2 they were really supporting and let them keep them on the list. BattleDroid is heavily into Trade Federation figures - and though they haven't really been threatened, my Padme figures I'd liked have gone through the wringer. I've lost 2 of them now, perhaps rightly so. They made the list for their original votes, but they are obviously not as well supported over classic figures by the group. In spite of me writing them in at higher and higher ranks as we've moved up the poll, 2 of them have fallen off. How did the system fail? I didn't have the votes to keep them on - I had to choose between other figures I'd like or these Padmes. If others wanted her so bad, they could have written her in. Very democratic. Very fair. I put Padme Outland Peasant Disguise (an original list member) back in like 3 times I think. She fell off at last because I was her last line of support and I think I had to choose between her and some other character I wanted more. I'd like to have her back, but even I had my opportunity and made a choice.why you were allowing write-ins to come back in at the top of the ladder, and why it only took 1 person to do a write-in save instead of 2.
I have my personality flaws too.And your explanations ranged from woefully poor to non-existant to sprawling rants that were unfathomable - I think you let your arrogance and ego invested in this poll overshadow the issue at hand, you refuse to recognize and reflect upon the inherent flaws in this poll system, instead bashing anybody who doesn't agree with you.
People said this was how many figures they wanted were actually on the list. When my process is finished in another 9 votes, we'll re-evaluate how well the new lists represents everyone. But getting at least half of what you want is good. There are other people participating here. No one can expect to have it all their way and only their way.Remember when you posed a hypothetical poll about that in this thread and you got responses from several users who said this list was at best only 50% close? That's not very close.
I'd say a majority of the Top 100 vote-getters are all getting their chance to come back as challengers to see if they make the Top 50. We're going to also review all the characters that did NOT make it on the list, and I think this will have worked out well. When we review, I'll ask everyone if they agree.The order is important here, it determines who is in the top 50 characters that we're going to send to Hasbro because without rank in here we could not determine who are the top 50 figures out of these 200+ options.
Once we have a CLOSED Top 50, we can rank them inside of that. As far as the figures now falling off the bottom - the write-in allows them to be saved if at least one person thinks they have merit. Meanwhile, if they don't (like Han Yavin Ceremony) they won't last long no matter how high they come in.
The post-padding comment was one of 2 things you said that made me mad.And my post-padding complaint is still a concern, you've posted 170 times in this thread, nearly double the next-closest post count from KH, dindae, and Droid who all have posts here in the 90s, and then 5 more users have between 50 and 70 posts here. That would be fine if I thought this thread were actually an accurate, fair poll, but it's clearly not.
I could personally care less how many posts I have listed under my name. I think you ought to delete that feature anyway. I care about saying what I have to say in these forums, not how many times I get to say it. What is there some kind of prize for the most posts here? Like payment of your electric bill for living on the internet (at least I thought of a good idea). But I'd rather only post new rounds to vote in, not all these explanations. I've re-posted the current rounds on occasion so that people could even FIND them as we've gotten into debates here - but also some stuff about who Tonbuck Toora is, and other kinds of Q&A's - like Hasbro's Comic Con comments.
I just intend to walk up to them at Celebration 3 with the list in hand, just like at ComicCon. I don't do any more regular reporting here. I'm no longer on staff - I just did special assignments like Comic Con. But I NEVER did Toy Reporting in the first place.And how many more have fallen off only to come back and fall off again? Don't get so holier-than-thou on this Tycho, I never claimed perfection from anything here in this poll. And keep this in mind, without Steve's help you won't be able to get an updated list to Hasbro
Anyways, Hasbro is there to talk to everybody at events, and any one of us can walk up to them and hand them their list of "crash-test-dummy-StarWars figures they want" if that's their thing. I either have some report with Jeff, Brian, Andy (who's not on SW anymore) or they just patronize me. I think it's the former. In any case, they took an interest in our efforts here and I was given contact information to reach one of the SW Team members, though I don't think bothering the company on marketing decisions is the right way to go about it. If I wanted to make marketing decisions personally, I should apply for a job.
So you'd be sure to tell Steve or folks at Hasbro how much you loathe me. And that would accomplish what?- they have asked SSG not to allow you to talk to them anymore - and with matters of the forums Steve always comes to me for that type of advice.
And anyone here (on staff) controls who I talk to exactly how? I don't claim to represent the site except when I'm on assignment for Steve at Comic Con or other events I cover - but again I don't cover TOYS and Hasbro knows this. If I find out any toy news, I tell it to Steve or give him my notes, because that's his thing - and what HIS site is all about. I don't forget that.
All I can tell Hasbro is that a bunch of us on these forums made THIS list, and here is the link to the discussion as to how we came about it (with all this fun philosophical stuff we argue over added for their entertainment )
When I finish doing what I'm doing, and the majority here seem fine with it the way it's going, I'll let everyone else speak up and tell you what they think of the final results, the means getting there, and what they want you to do with the results.I've given you chance after chance to address these issues in a calm, clear manner, but each time you've made it impossible to follow your line of reasoning as you rant endlessly with exceedingly drawn-out and incomprehensible examples; if you want me to help support this thread when it comes time to take it to Hasbro, I need to have a reasonable believe in its fairness and accuracy, and currently I do not.
I started the thread, and I think it's fun doing this, not knowing how it's all going to turn out, competing in some ways for my own less-popular favorites (and my popular ones - like we all want the black Bespin Security Guard) but I don't need the glory of taking the list to Hasbro - there's no reward in that. They'll say "oh - this guy has a lot of time to waste on the internet thinking about our products." But they might say "a lot of people want these figures," and "this one, and that one, etc. go along with our marketing plans. These'll be ok - let's make this Luke Endor instead of Luke Tatooine again."
As to starting the thread? Look at El Chuxter's Most-Wanted Unleashed thread - I don't need to start the thread, but if I want to participate in the discussion and the thread doesn't exist, well of course I'll start it if it seems like a good idea. I don't sit around and pat myself on the back and say "ooo- look, I started a 1000-post-plus thread around here." It's something to do and a lot of us have become sort of like a little forum family posting our votes in here, stratagizing how others will vote, etc. etc.
I see that I need to finish this poll up and then show you the results and between myself, and hopefully the majority here, we need to convince you that your concerns have been answered.Do you see my conundrum now? Or are you still convinced I'm just being petty, because let me assure you, I am NOT.
If you trust me that I want to do this, I want to demonstrate to you that your fairness criteria has been met, I hope you'll come back and vote with the rest of us in these final polls that help prioritize the list. I'm guessing that Obi-Wan Kenobi (Jedi Robes, AOTC) will be the last add-in considering the final group that qualified. I'll run the polls as they can sort the order out while the fall-offs are eliminated and eventually, the write-ins as well.
I didn't understand what "was indicative of the rest of the forums." Maybe it's not important except to you and Droid (inside thing) but I didn't get that part.That was one of my chief concerns as well, and like you Droid I also never said it was perfect or even remotely close. Please don't consider this thread indicative of the rest of the forums, it is NOT.
vote on - the Anakin Skywalker (Vader robes) poll is at the top of the page. Once at least 2 more of you have voted, I'll post the next poll. No - I don't wait forever for everyone, but my method will make it so your late votes count in case you don't have time to check this thread every day.
In fact, since one or more of you might've posted while I answered these concerns, I'll just post the next poll.
Nevermind - none of the 4 of you have been online, so we'll wait a little longer for at least 2 of you.
Last edited by Tycho; 08-12-2004 at 03:13 AM.